ghajan monk

[OB] the many ways awakening can be used on roshar

7 posts in this topic

As I thought about Zahel, Azure, and Nightblood and their future roles in the stormlight archive it became increasingly obvious to me that Awakening would eventually take a bigger role in the story. Zahel is also known as Kalad the usurper former God-King of Hallandren and creator of an army of corpses encased in stone. Given that in roshar the dead are transformed into various metals it seems inevitable that Zahel will create another army. 

Ever since Nightblood appeared at the end of WoR the question of whether it would grant any abilities to it's weilder 

Has tantalized my mind.

Azure came into Oathbringer wielding an awakened blade searching for Nightblood and let us know that Awakening was here to stay. So I set out to make a list of all the possible ways Awakening could interact with Rosharan magic.

With awakening you take a piece of your soul called Breath and put it into an object with the right command giving it life. This Breath can be compared to spren, some of which are described as pieces of the gods. The eighth heightening of Breath has the ability of "Command breaking" I am speculating that this would allow you to alter the Intent on certain lesser spren similarly to San-want. In the cosmere it is hard to know for certain because only the God-kings have reached that heightening.

So number 1.

Creation of more shardblades. This is the easiest to speculate because the spren do express an interest awakened blades in Oathbringer.

Number 2.

Using breath instead of spren in fabrials. 

Number 3. 

Use of the eighth heightening to corrupt a spren possibly resulting in the ability to convert stormlight into breath. Similarly as Sja-anat corrupting Glys gave Renarin access to visions of the future and possibly voidbinding.

Number 4. Using the eighth heightening to convert stormlight into breath. 

Number 5.

Nightblood spren. This might be the most terrifying concept in the cosmere, spren who imitate the Ideal of Destroy Evil.

Number 6. New forms for the Singers. I saw another thread mention this one, basically you put breath in a gemheart to create a new form or alter existing ones.

It is worth noting that any magic system that replicates another will have some differences an example being the fused and the knights radiant. I feel there is more that can be done with Awakening and Surgebinding so If you think of anything I would be glad to read it.

 

Edited by ghajan monk
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I'm confused as to how the 8th heightening would allow you to convert stormlight? I get changing the command of invested objects, but not investeture itself. As for the spren, maybe lesser spren? I feel like sentient spren would be difficult to mess with. 

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As a potential alternate to number 1, reviving dead blades.  If via awakening you can poor enough Investiture into the dead blades, you could potnetially, at worst make them lifeless, at best return them to life.  But seeing as the deadeyes already seem to behave like lifeless, an awakener may be able to return them to life.

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2 hours ago, Melovespie said:

I'm confused as to how the 8th heightening would allow you to convert stormlight? I get changing the command of invested objects, but not investeture itself. As for the spren, maybe lesser spren? I feel like sentient spren would be difficult to mess with. 

My thoughts on the Eighth Heightening is you would be putting your investure into an already invested object to override the original command or intent. And this is what I think sja-anat does in Oathbringer.

I do agree that it would be more difficult to alter sentient spren given that vasher never broke Nightblood's command.

As for converting stormlight, since all investure is tied to the specific shards and we know it is possible for the shards to mingle, it follows that under the right circumstances you can fuse two types of investure together. We know breath and stormlight have similarities or Zahel would not be able to stay on Roshar, so a fused form could act more like breath.

Basically by combining stormlight and breath you create watered down breaths. And I think you would need the Eighth Heightening to do this.

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On 12/15/2017 at 11:37 PM, ghajan monk said:

Using breath instead of spren in fabrials. 

Wouldn't really work the way you think. The specific type of Spren seems just as relevant to Fabrial powers as the type of gemstone, so breath would be like a specific type of Spren. Assuming your idea even works, you'd get a singular power from Breath Fabrials.

You could probably use breath instead of Stormlight to power Fabrials though, so that's something.

On 12/15/2017 at 11:37 PM, ghajan monk said:

The eighth heightening of Breath has the ability of "Command breaking" I am speculating that this would allow you to alter the Intent on certain lesser spren similarly to San-want. In the cosmere it is hard to know for certain because only the God-kings have reached that heightening.

So.. the Eighth Heightening doesn't actually grant a power, per se. Breaking Commands can be done by anyone with lots of patience, a little breath, and torture implements.

Quote

"Quite right," Lightsong said, sighing. He handed over the box with its furious Lifeless rodent. "Here. You think my Awakeners can break it's security phrase?"
"Eventually," Llarimar said. "Though it's an animal, Your Grace. It won't be able to tell us anything directly."
"Have them do it anyway," Lightsong said.


"Do you know anything about breaking Lifeless, my dear?"
She shrugged.
"I didn't either," Lightsong said. "Not until I required my priests to break this one. Apparently, it require weeks to take control of a Lifeless for which you do not have the right security phrases. I'm not even sure how the process goes—has something to do with Breath and torture, apparently."
"Torture?" she said. "Lifeless can't feel."
Lightsong shrugged. "Anyway, my servants broke this one for me. The stronger and more skilled the Awakener who created the Lifeless, the more difficult it is to break it."

Spoilers for size:

Spoiler
On 10/14/2016 at 10:18 AM, The One Who Connects said:

I personally don't see Lightsong's priests being able to just go to someone of the 8th Heightening to break Lifeless for a couple reasons.

  1. How rare people past the 5th Heightening are. A non Returned is gonna have to pay a very hefty fortune over the years to amass that much Breath.
  2. Heightening 8. This would make him a fair but shinier than the Returned, and I doubt someone who paid out enough to get there is going to be willingly bound working for the Returned.
  3. The Coppermind claims that the only known people to reach the 8th Heightening are Vasher, Shashara and the God Kings.

Perhaps it works the same way prevention of aging works. Each Heightening makes it easier, but it plateaus out at the 5th(age) and the 8th(command breaking). It would fit with what we know of other abilities, since even a 1st Heightening person gains better discernment of color, while perfect color recognition is 3rd.

On 12/22/2016 at 10:56 AM, The One Who Connects said:

The Eighth Heightening grants instinctive Command Breaking, yet there are people in Hallandren who Lightsong goes to for that very thing.

The Fifth Heightening gives us the answer. You gain some resistance to aging as you gain breath. You don't just suddenly "become ageless" when you hit 2,000 Breaths. It stands to reason that you gain some small modicum of instinctual understanding as you go and it plateaus at the respective Heightening.

Edit: Is it a surefire explanation of how they figured it out? No. Is it more likely than pure trial and error? Yes.

All the Eighth Heightening grants you is instinctive knowledge, which would bypass the patience requirement. So I doubt Vasher could use the Eighth Heightening for anything on Roshar unless it's an ability we haven't heard about yet.

On 12/15/2017 at 11:37 PM, ghajan monk said:

Number 6. New forms for the Singers.

This one is legit. Not sure if it'll actually be done, but it's doable.

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Spoiler

“We’re old friends,” she said. “Notum, have your sailors been cutting those bales of cloth into the shapes I requested?”

“Yes,” the captain said. “But I don’t understand—”

“You soon will.” She gave Kaladin a lazy salute. He returned it, sharper. Then she nodded to them and walked up toward the main deck. 

I say make little stick man to awaken and attack the fused.

Edited by Thanatos
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2 hours ago, The One Who Connects said:

Wouldn't really work the way you think. The specific type of Spren seems just as relevant to Fabrial powers as the type of gemstone, so breath would be like a specific type of Spren. Assuming your idea even works, you'd get a singular power from Breath Fabrials.

 

But would all breaths be the same spren or would different commands become like different spren? Breath appears to be much more flexible than surgebinding or fabials as it takes a specific type of spren to do a specific task, while you can shape breath into a multitude of forms for many different tasks.

Now that I think on it, unlike most forms of magic in the cosmere anyone on Nalthis can become an Awakener, and what you can do with your breath is as diverse as animating a corpse or editing your own memory.

This is a vast difference to roshar where every type of magic requires a different type of spren.

Edited by ghajan monk
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