teknopathetic

[OB] Who do you think the other Bondsmiths will be?

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So we currently have 3 Bondsmith Spren:

Stormfather: Dalinar

Night Watcher: She is associated with trade and deals  

The Sibling: associated with the growing and protection of a city.

Something Else: ? The Stormfather didn't fully confirm that the Nightwatcher was the 2nd Bondspren, so maybe not. 

 

Sibling Candidate:

1) Navani =

I am leaning toward Navani. She has shown remarkable leadership in holding together the factions, and her leadership wouldn't conflict with Dalinar any any obvious or mandatory way. She is in love with fabrials, and the sibling appears to run the biggest ones.

2) Nohadon:

We know that the Sibling pulled away from humanity, and the storm father claims that humanity has "hurt them enough" causing the sibling to slumber. But we also have the Gem Memory claiming that the sibling slinking away may have been more forced than something the sibling wanted to do. What if Nohadon is still bonded to the sibling, and they are slumbering together, waiting for a time to reemerge and defeat Odium. It would also be an interesting conflict between Dalinar's leadership and the leadership Nohadon would demand.

 

Edited by teknopathetic
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If the Sibling is the greatspren of Uritharu, I think the most obvious candidate has to be Navani.  I mean, its a living city powered by a giant fabrial..Sounds like Navani-Alley, to me:P. If its not going to be Navani, I almost feel it has to be a currently unknown character, as I can't think of any other known characters who would make more sense than her. I think it would be really strange to see one of the other characters ascend to the Bondsmith of the giant fabrial city...Wouldn't Navani just spend the whole book brooding? Like, 'seriously Sibling, you didn't pick me? Fabrial Queen?...Seriously? Boo on you.'

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And I have zero clue about the Nightwatcher..I don't even know what she's the spren of. The other 2 are sprens of something definite(if we are assuming that the Sibling is the spren of Uritharu). Greatsprens for the Highstorm, Uritharu, and...??? I feel like it can't be a general 'spren of nature' type situation...I think she has to be the spren of some definitive thing. Until we know that, I find it hard to fathom more than just an outright guess. Maybe when we get more of an idea what exactly she is the spren of, we'll be able to identify with some characters that will fit.

     Although, I will say that I think whomever ends up bonding the Nightwatcher, they will be more of a wildcard, character wise, whether they are known to us now or not. Nightwatcher just seems less straightforward with more of an edge than Stormfather, due to the nature of the Shards they were born of, and that leads me to think that whomever bonds her is going to be more ambiguous, morality/character wise. She be a crafty spren, that Nightwatcher;)

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Tarivangian is a real possibility. 

Yes, he is a bit evil, but it is his goal to unite.

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I also think Navani will bond the Sibling.  Having her and Dalinar both serve as Bondsmiths would make for a really strong Surgebinder power couple, and would help them in their task of uniting Roshar.  When Dalinar was depressed and inebriated after remembering what he did to his wife, and Navani took over for him in uniting the monarchs, I started to feel like she had a lot of Bondsmith potential.  

As far as the Nightwatcher (if she is indeed one of the Bondsmith spren), I have thought that maybe Taravangian will bond her.  I've noticed it's a popular theory that Taravangian is possibly being influenced by Cultivation, and I wonder if he will eventually become aware of this and start trying to communicate with Cultivation/the Nightwatcher.  The Nightwatcher seems like a different creature altogether than other spren or the Stormfather, and it seems likely that her bond with Taravangian would be very unorthodox and different from other Nahel bonds we've seen so far.  Perhaps Taravangian's shifts in intelligence are a reflection of a bond with the Nightwatcher, as if she's choosing when he'll be intelligent in order for him to best fulfill Cultivation's purposes.

Before I had read Oathbringer I thought that it was possible that Cusicesh from the Way of Kings could be one of the Bondsmith spren, although I think this is unlikely now since it doesn't really fit in with the Stormfather and the Sibling. 

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May Aladar will bond with the Sibli... JK I really like the idea of Navani bonding the Sibling. It just fits. No idea on the Nightwatcher. 

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I would only allow Mr.T to bond the NightWatcher if Mr.T was somehow tricking Odium this whole time
(Maybe Smart Mr.T made a plan to trick Odium and Renarin is the key) 

Edited by teknopathetic
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We know that Urithiru was intentionally made and positioned. Perhaps the Sibling has some other purpose outside powering Urithiru? Or perhaps it was created alongside the city.

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Going to throw out a couple of obscure possibilities.

Longshadow - the other world leading expert on fabrials.

Geranid - Who better to awaken a slumbering superspren?

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16 minutes ago, aemetha said:

Geranid - Who better to awaken a slumbering superspren?

I had to look up the name, but that is an interesting suggestion! We haven't heard from those two adorable ardents in a while and it seems entirely plausible to me that one or the other would be of interest to true spren at least, if not the Sibling.

But... how are they broken? And how do their goals and personality align with Bondsmith ideologies? 

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2 hours ago, ZenBossanova said:

Tarivangian is a real possibility. 

Yes, he is a bit evil, but it is his goal to unite.

I agree with this.  He's thinking of the bigger picture more than anymore besides Dalinar (and maybe Navani).  As much as this would be terrible, the Nightwatcher (who probably influenced the DIagram) might be willing to bond with him.  The key factor with Taravangian is if the Nightwatcher or the Sibling is if they're knowledgeable of his deal with Odium.

I don't want Navani to become a Radiant.  I think at least one of the main POV characters needs to not be a Radiant to ground the others and show that it's special to be a Radiant.

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4 minutes ago, Vianki said:

But... how are they broken? And how do their goals and personality align with Bondsmith ideologies? 

It's hard to say, we don't have much background on them, but if I recall correctly they were pretty antisocial and there could be something in that. As to the bondsmith ideology, that could be something to do with uniting spren and men in their case.

I'm not sure we will actually see a whole lot of explanation of the ways new radiants are broken or embody the ideals outside the POV characters. The POV characters show us how radiants are created, but the others will likely just have it implied unless they are very prominent characters.

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I think it’s going to be Fen.  She was able to adapt remarkably to a Bondsmith Vision. When she was in Dalinar’s vision she not only saved the young girl but also was able to unite the people of the village and form a cohesive force to battle the midnight essence creatures. I don’t know which of the siblings she would bond though. 

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There is the theory that the other sibling is of stone, and created Urithuru, the Kholinar windblades and other things. It is a fitting theory! Can't remember the thread, if I find it I'll post it. :)

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I like the ideas of Navani and Taravangian. I guess Thaidakar or Restares are possible as well. Or Ishar, if he wants to do a Nale.

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I think it will be queen Fen. She organized the villagers in the vision Dalinar threw her into quite fast and well, too, even if she did sacrifice the mother. She's a good ruler from what we know and balances between factions skillfully.

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I thought Gawx might be a good choice as a Bondsmith, but maybe a bit far fetched. Him coming into his own as Prime and ruling one of the larger nations on Roshar could make him a candidate to bond the Sibling. I think it'd be an interesting arc. 

I've had the thought in the back of my head ever since I read that Syl use to be bonded to a Radiant, but the Radiant died. The 2nd or 3rd Bondsmith could be a current KR who's spren dies in battle with Odium, then they go on a path of redemption using their experience to become a Bondsmith. Definitely a tin foil hat theory, though. 

Playing into the "Radiant from another order becoming a Bondsmith" bit, I think Taln may be in consideration to be a good candidate to be a Bondsmith. With Brandon's tid bits about "The man who calls himself the Herald Taln" it could be assumed that he's an entirely different person after 4,500 years of torture. Or at the least his spirit web has been "scrubbed clean". I think Taln as a Bondsmith and being a real leader among the Roshar forces would make for an excellent turn of events. 

 

EDIT: Those are all ideas on who might bond the Sibling. I haven't the slightest who is going to bond the Nightwatcher if she even is a Bondsmith spren. I think Navani is going to die, so I don't see her as a candidate. I don't think Fen either, because I think there need's to be a great "normal" leader in the series. Someone who is the typical excellent ruler without the aid of spren or surges.  

Edited by Kered
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I think that if Taravangian became a KR, that he would be a Bondsmith, and if he was a Bondsmith, then the Nightwatcher would be his spren, and that Cultivation is probably playing him like a fiddle, but he has a ways to go before saying the Oaths.  This doesn't mean he won't, just that it will take some character development.  We can discuss all we want if he is really putting the Destination before the Journey, but someone who sold out the entire world to their opponent just to save his own city doesn't seem to honourable, but that could just be me.  If he does become one, I think the conversation between him and Dalinar about that would be pretty entertaining.  

Navani? Another Kholin Radiant? I know that this point has become a zombie horse at this point, but you'd think that the spren would diversify a little bit.  And if the Bondsmiths are about bringing men together, it would make sense for the three of them to be form very different parts of Roshar, to cover ground.

 

 

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2 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

I would only allow Mr.T to bond the NightWatcher if Mr.T was somehow tricking Odium this whole time
(Maybe Smart Mr.T made a plan to trick Odium and Renarin is the key) 

It may be foolish for Mr T to make a deal with the devil, but I strongly suspect, it was unwise of the devil to make a deal with him. And yes, Renarin is a key. I wonder if Odium can see any of the half-void Radiants.

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I still believe that Rysn will bond the Sibling. It seems like an obvious place for her character to progress, and it would be a new type of character archetype for Brandon to explore.

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Is there any discussion on where exactly the sibling is slumbering?  This may affect who even has the opportunity to bond it.

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8 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

So we currently have 3 Bondsmith Spren:

Stormfather: Dalinar

Night Watcher: Though, on a careful read I am not actually sure the night watcher can bond a human.

The Sibling: associated with the growing and protection of a city.

Something Else: ? The Stormfather didn't fully confirm that the Nightwatcher was the 2nd Bondspren, so maybe not. 

 

Sibling Candidate:

1) Navani =

I am leaning toward Navani. She has shown remarkable leadership in holding together the factions, and her leadership wouldn't conflict with Dalinar any any obvious or mandatory way. She is in love with fabrials, and the sibling appears to run the biggest ones.

2) Nohadon:

We know that the Sibling pulled away from humanity, and the storm father claims that humanity has "hurt them enough" causing the sibling to slumber. But we also have the Gem Memory claiming that the sibling slinking away may have been more forced than something the sibling wanted to do. What if Nohadon is still bonded to the sibling, and they are slumbering together, waiting for a time to reemerge and defeat Odium. It would also be an interesting conflict between Dalinar's leadership and the leadership Nohadon would demand.

 

Why would Nohadon have anything to do with Odium? Was he even present during a desolation? Was he even a radiant? The final vision could not have been actually Nohadon, it was "something" appearing to Dalinar as Nohadon.

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To be honest I really do think that Navani is the best candidate but then I deeply think about it and I remember how the plot goes so far off the predicted rails and we all get confused...RIP Elhoker and his Almost-Bond...and so my theory is:

The sibling bonds with Graves

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I am on board with Navani --> Sibling.

  • She attracts gloryspren in huge numbers when she marries Dalinar (likely associated with Bondsmith as the "lesser spren")
  • She is hugely invested (pun intended) in "civic planning" like sewers - and the Sibling will make Urithiru work (eg the plumbing etc will work properly again)
  • She takes her oaths seriously - she admits to having broken some, but from what we know, she was faithful to Gavilar (for example) despite suggesting that she had reason not to be. We don't know what oaths she broke but the Stormfather doesn't seem to be too annoyed about it.
  • She is knowledgable about fbrials and their uses - and as already pointed out, Urithiru will likely be powered by the Sibling and the associated stormlight.
  • She is likely to stay in permanent residence in Urithiru anyway - as one Bondsmith always did previously. 
  • She may have been sufficiently broken by Elhokar's death
  • You are more likely to become Radiant if you are near other Radiants (WoB iirc states this) 
  • She has probably read the Way of Kings (inworld book) to Dalinar looads of times by now - which prompted both him and Gavilar to be proto-Bondsmiths
  • She generally seems to be moving more towards being a uniting figure. Particularly since uniting herself with Dalinar
  • Despite an implication in tWoK that Jasnah and Navani didn't get on that well, we see no evidence of this in OB - so they are getting closer too (uniting....)
  • She genuinely wants to unite Roshar - a likely requirement for a Bondsmith in this current era.

Ok, so I can see why Mr T may be a candidate but I think his inherent division (being in the alliance at Urithiru and an Agent of Odium) makes it difficult for him to be a proper contender - at least at the moment. I don't think his politics would matter to a spren per se, but he is in conflict with the rest of humanity and that is inherently divisive in my opinion.

With regards to the Nightwatcher - I am sure this is the 3rd spren for the Bondmiths. Remember that the SF had more autonomy and awareness after he received extra investiture from Honor so it is reasonable that the NW would be less coherent and understand less of humans. On top of that, the SF has had a few months being bonded to Dalinar which has made him even more articulate. We know the NW is linked to Cultivation so it makes sense that this  is her spren like the SF was Honor's. 

With regards to who could bond it, I am much less sure. I am not convinced we've seen the right person yet. Or perhaps, not seen enough of them yet - people who say Queen Fen, I am not disagreeing so much as wanting more evidence to sway my opinion. Cultivation is about growth - and perhaps order from chaos. I think we'd want to see someone who represents this. To me, Mr T fits it the best but as I said, I am not sure that his internal conflict will let him bond a spren. On top of that, can he be said to be "broken" when he isn't "broken" on his clever days and has no compassion?

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16 hours ago, Cenanin said:

Why would Nohadon have anything to do with Odium? Was he even present during a desolation? Was he even a radiant? The final vision could not have been actually Nohadon, it was "something" appearing to Dalinar as Nohadon.

Nohadon was the King of Alethkar at the time of the last true desolation. 

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