[OB] Kaladin's love life ?

[Karger]

I would like to point out that Hesina will likely be a character in book 4.  Won't she play matchmaker if anyone does?

Edited April 29, 2019 by Karger

[Guest]

Kaladin doesn't need a matchmaker.

[Karger]

2 hours ago, SLNC said:

Kaladin doesn't need a matchmaker.

I don't think he needs a love interest.  The statement was hypothetical. 

[luluzulu]

On 11/19/2017 at 9:10 AM, SLNC said:

Maybe Brandon will introduce a nice female Windrunner, though that would seem a bit boring.

Give Jasnah A Cute Shadesmar GF 2k19

[luluzulu]

On 11/19/2017 at 10:17 AM, aemetha said:

^ This.

Honestly, I don't see a great deal of character growth for Kaladin in having a romantic partner. I'd be much happier if he didn't find one. I don't think he is a fit to having a commitment to any one person. He has already taken on huge commitments. What is left for a partner?

Syl wants him to have a partner, I think that is because she doesn't understand that she IS his partner. Her relationship with Kaladin is more intimate than any other spren with their radiant. Pattern is a tool, and comic relief, and curious. Syl is a genuine moral compass and partner in Kaladins decision making. Kaladin looks for her constantly if she isn't there. He was heartbroken when he lost her. I really don't see what a human partner adds to that except sex, and Brandon really doesn't emphasise sex much at all in most of his books (With the exception of Warbreaker where it is a major part of the plot).

lbr the whole thing with Stormfather not wanting Syl to go to Kaladin, and all the "He's mine I chose him" type things definitely sounds like a father who by the end of the book has reached a begrudging acceptance of his daughter's marriage

[luluzulu]

Honestly believe Kaladin's gonna get a romantic partner and then is gonna blow it because he's going to prioritize some Radiant business one too many times. Unfortunately Syladin is unlikely to happen  (althoooouuuggghhh we have seen that Syl is probably the most important person in his life right now, and we have seen that they're able to interact on an equal basis in Shadesmar, and at times in the Physical Realm)

[Calyx]

17 hours ago, luluzulu said:

Honestly believe Kaladin's gonna get a romantic partner and then is gonna blow it because he's going to prioritize some Radiant business one too many times. Unfortunately Syladin is unlikely to happen  (althoooouuuggghhh we have seen that Syl is probably the most important person in his life right now, and we have seen that they're able to interact on an equal basis in Shadesmar, and at times in the Physical Realm)

Yeah, Kaladin is very likely to blow it - which will be even more depressing, as a reader. 

[Use the Falchion]

The question I have today about this is: What do we want for Kaladin out of this relationship? Happiness, of course, but beyond that I think there might be a trend:

Character development - those who want to see Kaladin grow in ways that may or may not push him towards the Fourth Ideal or just acceptance of his new status tend towards Jasnah.

Work-life balance - Those who want to see Kaladin become...not less of a soldier/protector, but more than that - someone who gets to live the lives of those he protects - seem to drift towards Tarah. It makes sense, given that she's a big mystery in terms of Kaladin's army time.

Companionship (in the sense that they will ALWAYS be with him) - Those who want Kaladin to just be happy with who he is and can complement his new life in all its stages might gravitate towards Syl. Due to how the KR work, Syl seemingly has to be within a certain radius of Kaladin in the physical realm (although there's a high chance I'm wrong here) and she's Kaladin's #1 cheerleader when it comes to him and happiness.

"Opposites Attract" or the Zutara* Effect - Those who like the intimacy of the chasm scene, the great chemistry between the two, and the overall feelingness of their relationship choose Shallan. 

 

As stated before, I'm a Jasnadin fan. Kaladin's character growth is something we all want to see, and experiencing it with Jasnah is probably one of the least tragic ways to go about it (since if it is the whole "you can't save everyone" theme, the other major popular theory is that Lirin dies). It also gives us more Jasnah without explaining too much of her backstory. Granted, Jasnah learning to rule does that too, but learning about a more non-family-related...softer? warmer? side to our favorite Alethi queen could work as well. It lets us see more facets of Jasnah without having to explore her headspace too much and without the adoration or familial bonds from characters like Shallan or Dalinar. 

 

Tarah is an interesting case as I too would like to see a Kaladin who has a better, shall I say rhythm of life. But I don't think that'll be Kaladin's lot in life. Kaladin reminds me a little of the MCU's Captain America around the time of Age of Ultron and beyond. He's a soldier who gave up that chance of living a normal happy life; it doesn't mean he doesn't have friends or people to protect. It's just that he's focused on the big picture.

 

Syl is the least likely of the currently potential three to happen, but might be the most rewarding if at the end Kaladin sacrifices himself and becomes a cognitive shadow. Actually, if the Heralds are like cognitive shadows, does that mean they can...form...bonds...with spren? I'm not saying I WANT to see human-spren relationships, but it would be a fun area to explore. Okay, maybe I am curious about it. Either way, assuming Kaladin doesn't somehow fly to Braise or lead an exodus to another planet or something, him taking the place of a Herald or becoming one and getting a happy ending with Syl would feel like a nice book-ends.

 

I'm not gonna talk about Shallan because 1. There is nothing I can add to this discussion, and 2. She's married. Let's let her explore that life. 

 

Overall, Jasnah gives the most room for character development and characterization; Tarah has had the most foreshadowing (unless that Death Rattle about the tower, the crown, and the spear actually reflects Kaladin and Jasnah) and is the most likely; Syl gives the most...Cosmere-related answers? She gives a lot of book-ends IMO. 

[Calyx]

On 5/4/2019 at 6:01 PM, Use the Falchion said:

Overall, Jasnah gives the most room for character development and characterization; Tarah has had the most foreshadowing (unless that Death Rattle about the tower, the crown, and the spear actually reflects Kaladin and Jasnah) and is the most likely; Syl gives the most...Cosmere-related answers? She gives a lot of book-ends IMO. 

Can we really say that Tarah has been foreshadowed? Given that she is a girl mentioned only once or twice, as far as I remember, and Kaladin clearly didn't feel that strongly about her, I'm not sure why people talk about her. Just because we know that at some point she existed and found Kaladin attractive? 

I'm sure there are tons of people who now find Kaladin attractive.

Edited May 7, 2019 by Calyx

[Calderis]

@Calyx I don't necessarily disagree with you here on her need to be brought back, but Tarah was more than just "attracted to" Kaladin.

The few times that she is brought up make it seem clear that they had a relationship, and the reason that it failed is because of the very problems that Kaladin continues to struggle with. 

Some people wish to see her come back because the context in which things have been presented show that to make that work would also require him getting past his issues. 

It's a conflation of correlation and causation in my opinion, but it's also something people repeatedly do in real life. Get back together with an ex to try and prove to themselves they've changed, even when that's a bad idea. 

Not saying that that specifically is what people want here, but the fact that she recognized the issues Kaladin has and they are why she left is the reason people think she'd also be able to help him grow past them. 

We also have enough of a description Tarah that there is a woman who Shallan sees in one of the bars in part one that is theorized to be Tarah in Urithiru... Which if correct means we'll be seeing her again. 

Multiple reasons people come to different conclusions, and absolutely no proof any of them are in any way correct. It's all guesswork and feelings for now. 

Edited May 7, 2019 by Calderis

[Use the Falchion]

2 hours ago, Calyx said:

Can we really say that Tarah has been foreshadowed? Given that she is a girl mentioned only once or twice, as far as I remember, and Kaladin clearly didn't feel that strongly about her, I'm not sure why people talk about her. Just because we know that at some point she existed and found Kaladin attractive? 

I'm sure there are tons of people who now find Kaladin attractive.

Indeed there are! But I think you answered your own question. Tarah's relationship with Kaladin has been hinted at since WoK before a snippet of it was shown in OB. Sanderson's doing that for a reason. Besides, she's an incredibly easy character to miss, and little things like that make spotting them in re-reads more fun. As for the strength of the relationship, I never saw it as Kaladin not caring, simply he couldn't compromise at the time and they both knew it. Is Sanderson bringing her back so Kaladin can get closure on a part of his past like at the beginning of OB with Hearthstone? Is it so that they can restart their relationship? I can hope one way or another, but I can't see what Sanderson is planning.

10 minutes ago, Truthless of Shinovar said:

Why... Why is this thread 19 pages long

Because it's fun! ...at least that's why I keep coming back. And we all want to see Kaladin happy and well adjusted. A relationship is one of the easiest and best ways to do so! ...we just happen to disagree on who...

[Tiberius Gracchus]

12 minutes ago, Use the Falchion said:

As for the strength of the relationship, I never saw it as Kaladin not caring, simply he couldn't compromise at the time and they both knew it. Is Sanderson bringing her back so Kaladin can get closure on a part of his past like at the beginning of OB with Hearthstone?

I agree with a lot of this. I never saw Kaladin and Tarah's relationship as a failure. She left him to pursue a work opportunity, and while it is implied that if they had a stronger relationship with greater investment on both of their parts, there were ways for them to stay together. (Either her staying in Amaram's army or more likely him following her to her new job.) 

Kal and Tarah remind me of many of my family members who married their highschool sweethearts in their mid 30s, after first moving away and growing up a bit before finally coming back. 

4 hours ago, Calderis said:

We also have enough of a description Tarah that there is a woman who Shallan sees in one of the bars in part one that is theorized to be Tarah in Urithiru... Which if correct means we'll be seeing her again. 

I think it is more likely that she will pop up with the refugees/resistance fighters near the Alethkar-Herdaz border where Kaladin's parents and this Herdazian general that is supposed to be important will be.

[Karger]

On 5/7/2019 at 7:14 PM, Tiberius Gracchus said:

I agree with a lot of this. I never saw Kaladin and Tarah's relationship as a failure. She left him to pursue a work opportunity, and while it is implied that if they had a stronger relationship with greater investment on both of their parts, there were ways for them to stay together

Their relationship was not what it could have been though.  Kaladin was still, is still, working through a lot.  Romance does not seem like a priority for him at the moment until he figures some stuff out.  (Maybe immediately after swearing the 4th ideal he will finally decide to start making his move with the girl who has been into him throughout stormlight 4.)

[ShardShaper]

On 4/29/2019 at 11:56 AM, SLNC said:

Kaladin doesn't need a matchmaker.

Tell that to Syl.

Quote

"I know you've been busy Kaladin, but I've studied up on this, and if you have any questions..." 

          -Syl

 

[Karger]

17 hours ago, ShardShaper said:

Tell that to Syl.

Quote

“...stop spying on people when they’re being intimate. It’s creepy.”

-Kaladin + Me

 

[Everstorm Entropy]

I've realized that I'm entirely behind Kaladin + Jasnah because I honestly think they'd have the most interesting interactions.  They're probably my two favorite characters in the series, and we haven't really gotten to see either in a true romantic setting before.  Jasnah has always put academia first, and Kaladin has always put being a soldier first.  If they were drawn together, I think there'd be a mutual understanding that their oaths and duties come first.

Besides, I think that the two could learn a lot from one another.

[Karger]

3 minutes ago, Everstorm Entropy said:

I've realized that I'm entirely behind Kaladin + Jasnah because I honestly think they'd have the most interesting interactions.  They're probably my two favorite characters in the series, and we haven't really gotten to see either in a true romantic setting before.  Jasnah has always put academia first, and Kaladin has always put being a soldier first.  If they were drawn together, I think there'd be a mutual understanding that their oaths and duties come first.

I also would like to see them interact I think their relationship could be extremely interesting.  At the same time I kinda hate how people assume that any complex relationship between a male and female character must be romantic.  I do not think that a romantic relationship between the two of them could be anything other then dismal.

[Everstorm Entropy]

44 minutes ago, Karger said:

I also would like to see them interact I think their relationship could be extremely interesting.  At the same time I kinda hate how people assume that any complex relationship between a male and female character must be romantic.  I do not think that a romantic relationship between the two of them could be anything other then dismal.

It certainly doesn't have to be romantic.  But, the softie in me just wants to see them grow in that area.  And a romantic relationship wouldn't have to be dismal.  I think the characters are both on a path to change, and they could certainly surprise us by making it work.

[Karger]

I kinda want to start a poll and see if more people believe that their relationship would work or would end with the death of one or the other.

[Calyx]

From the recent excerpt Brandon read, it looks like Kaladin and Laral will be in the same place once more. If Roshone is dead - and for some reason I assume he is - there is the potential for eventual romance.

Kaladin will likely try to protect Laral when he sees that she is now a servant, and I think she is unlikely to put up with that. Laral has clearly matured into a fairly strong person; in Oathbringer, it was clear she held the respect of both Roshone's soldiers and the townspeople, and now it looks like she is helping Kaladin's father.

Maybe she can help Kaladin realize that he doesn't need to protect everyone?

Edited May 29, 2019 by Calyx

[Karger]

3 hours ago, Calyx said:

From the recent excerpt Brandon read, it looks like Kaladin and Laral will be in the same place once more. If Roshone is dead - and for some reason I assume he is - there is the potential for eventual romance.

From that excerpt I got that Laral is all business now.  I don't think she is going to take the time to have a fling now that she has been recently widowed(a fact I am not convinced of).

[Calyx]

2 hours ago, Karger said:

From that excerpt I got that Laral is all business now.  I don't think she is going to take the time to have a fling now that she has been recently widowed(a fact I am not convinced of).

Yeah, I assume it would have to be a pretty slow building thing. But I could imagine them rebuilding their friendship while working together protecting people of their town.

At any rate, we know that Kaladin and Laral will be interacting, and their past has been far more fleshed out than another character (Tarah) that gets continuously mentioned in these discussions.

[Karger]

54 minutes ago, Calyx said:

Yeah, I assume it would have to be a pretty slow building thing. But I could imagine them rebuilding their friendship while working together protecting people of their town.

I do not think that Hearthstone is going to be liberated any time soon.  It is currently in the middle of Odium's territory.  How can Kaladin do anything to protect it?

[Calyx]

17 hours ago, Karger said:

I do not think that Hearthstone is going to be liberated any time soon.  It is currently in the middle of Odium's territory.  How can Kaladin do anything to protect it?

By convincing people to leave and helping them evacuate? I know his father opposed this previously, but things are worse now.

Alternatively he could try to get them supplies, temporarily assist his father in his clinic, or help out in any number of ways, even if he isn't directly removing them from their situation.

Edited May 30, 2019 by Calyx

[jjreeder]

I think Kalladin still likes Laral, but she totally went a different direction in her thought process than he did, which made him unwilling to actually say something about it (not to mention she's married to that ugly old guy) and even make him more hostile toward her. All this is just guesswork, and I've always been terrible with guessing love relationships, but that would be my guess. Otherwise, I think he'll be a loner, despite multiple girl's attempts.