[OB] Adolin-Shallan-Kaladin Discussion

[PhineasGage]

7 minutes ago, SLNC said:

Especially if Ba-Ado-Mishram is back

OOh good point. Do we know if he/she/it is back yet? I got the impression that it isn't? Its probably the one where Gavilar got the void spheres right? I've lost track of all the Unmade in my head - this one was the one that was kinda like a windrunner right? Maybe it getting unleashed is the trigger for starting SA4?

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, PhineasGage said:

I've lost track of all the Unmade in my head - this one was the one that was kinda like a windrunner right?

 

Quote

She is one of the most intelligent Unmade. She has not been seen recently in the Era of Solitude, but was likely responsible for the False Desolation. She has the ability to grant Voidlight to the singers and often served as one of Odium's generals during the Desolations.

She's a leader, yes. So, yeah. Maybe like a Windrunner, but with the ability to grant Voidlight...

Quote

Ba-Ado-Mishram has somehow Connected with the parsh people, as Odium once did. She provides Voidlight and facilitates forms of power. Our strike team is going to imprison her.

—Drawer 30-20, fourth emerald

I think, that 'forms of power' means new forms for the singers...

Edited December 4, 2017 by SLNC

[Varenus]

1 minute ago, SLNC said:

 

She's a leader, yes. So, yeah. Maybe like a Windrunner, but with the ability to grant Voidlight...

And facilitate forms of power. What the exact details of that are though, I have no clue. 

I agree with @PhineasGage's original assessment though, the knights seem to have the edge in raw magical power per person. Unless Odium and the Fused are hiding something big, In don't see how the old radiants, with all their numbers, experience, hearalds, and storming Honor ever had an issue handeling the Fused. 

Sorry for derailing. 

[insert_anagram_here]

3 hours ago, PhineasGage said:

Quote

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW]

They would be seen as an individual

So to me this is really important. It means that OSDD is still the best fit for Shallan

@PhineasGage I like how you have given us the professional's opinion on Shallan's disorder and I find it quite interesting on how it explains it in detail. But have in mind that OSDD is not of general knowledge, so even if there is a logical, scientific explanation on a par with her behavior, it doesn't mean that the solution is clear to the average reader. BS will need to "do a good job" and build up this narrative, in order to "get people on board with it" (referencing cheesy ending WoB). And that will be the big challenge now since he has convinced people that she is "happily ever after" with Adolin.

 

2 hours ago, PhineasGage said:

I meant during the time-skip specifically - sorry - I'll add that in - my point was that we have an in-world year where from our point of view very little of importance will happen. I don't see us opening up SA4 to a divorce. 

I don't think the fact that a time-skip should direct our conclusions one way or another. On one side, as you are stating, it can be used as 'a time of calm', before the issues start developing, but on the other hand he might as well describe the state of things a year later having a huge contrast to OB's ending, then flashback into the interesting bits that happened in the last year, that lead to that outcome. He can wiggle out his way either one way or another really.

 

2 hours ago, SLNC said:

I think, that Adolin might get annoyed, but say nothing, because, like I said, I think, that he'll handle Shallan with silk gloves

I'm still not certainly sure if there will be a divorce at some point yet, but I'd like it if there was a realistic view into marriage. The 'happy marriage' isn't something that people conclude to on their wedding day, that's for children's stories. The real troubles and problems start once you are married and the masks of perfection drop. The wedding is only the beginning of the journey.

Now on Adolin's predisposition, I'd find it interesting if he broke the expectations of becoming an Edgedancer. Mayalaran was not attracted to him in the first place and it's not an easy task to bond a dead spren. I think he could potentially become a tragic character, because he wants so badly to become a KR, that he sets on an impossible task, of reviving Mayalaran, only to be disappointed further on. And as much as this could surprise you, I would also like him to be redeemed into becoming a Willshaper instead. Taking these bits from Coppermind:

Quote

 

Little is currently known about the Willshapers. They were said to be varied in personality, but generally possessing a "love of adventure, novelty, or oddity."

The Willshapers would "probably be ok" with Adolin killing Sadeas[1]

 

"love of adventure, novelty, or oddity." could explain his womanizing years, his interest in Shallan, wanting to become a KR and his desire of reviving Mayalaran, Maybe?

 

 

Edited December 4, 2017 by insert_anagram_here
removed irrelevant topic quote

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, insert_anagram_here said:

I'm still not certainly sure if there will be a divorce at some point yet, but I'd like it if there was a realistic view into marriage. The 'happy marriage' isn't something that people conclude to on their wedding day, that's for children's stories. The real troubles and problems start once you are married and the masks of perfection drop. The wedding is only the beginning of the journey.

Of course. I just don't really see that changing quickly, but I might get surprised.

[insert_anagram_here]

2 hours ago, PhineasGage said:

Do we know if he/she/it is back yet?

Um.. I have no idea why I got this impression in my head, that Ba-Ado-Mishram maybe is the Everstorm itself?

[Awesomness]

1 hour ago, insert_anagram_here said:

Quote

Little is currently known about the Willshapers. They were said to be varied in personality, but generally possessing a "love of adventure, novelty, or oddity."

The Willshapers would "probably be ok" with Adolin killing Sadeas[1]

"love of adventure, novelty, or oddity." could explain his womanizing years, his interest in Shallan, wanting to become a KR and his desire of reviving Mayalaran, Maybe?

 

mmm, everyone is ok with Sadeas´s murder...

BTW Hi, glad to be back

[PhineasGage]

1 hour ago, insert_anagram_here said:

 I like how you have given us the professional's opinion on Shallan's disorder and I find it quite interesting on how it explains it in detail. But have in mind that OSDD is not of general knowledge, so even if there is a logical, scientific explanation on a par with her behavior, it doesn't mean that the solution is clear to the average reader.

I don't know that it has to be common knowledge. He could be using a real life situation to build the story - I doubt anyone thinks Shallan should just "be well" now - even without the knowledge. He can then continue to follow a life-like arc whilst having her make appropriate decisions for the story. Its the same with addiction for Teft and Dalinar. I don't think anyone expects them to just "be well" now either - addiction is a life-long problem and someone with it always has to bear in mind that they can lose control of it very easily. I dn't see why anyone should assume that Shallan should be any different. I know people got annoyed with Kaladin still being mopey in WoR but honestly, making him happy and bouncy would have made a mockery of the character, I just think we can be true to life and manage the story. 

 

1 hour ago, insert_anagram_here said:

I don't think the fact that a time-skip should direct our conclusions one way or another. On one side, as you are stating, it can be used as 'a time of calm', before the issues start developing, but on the other hand he might as well describe the state of things a year later having a huge contrast to OB's ending, then flashback into the interesting bits that happened in the last year, that lead to that outcome. He can wiggle out his way either one way or another really.

True, though that would mean double flashback sequence - this is supposed to be Eshonai's book iirc? Venli and Eshonai can't get good flashbacks for the Urithiru crowd (based on current evidence) so we'd either need mini-flashbacks from multiple PoVs (like we got mini-Kaladin flashes) to get the story, or he needs it to be limited in terms of the level of detail he needs to cover. If too many things happen we'd have to wonder why he skips the period rather than writing it out in real time.

 

2 hours ago, insert_anagram_here said:

I'm still not certainly sure if there will be a divorce at some point yet, but I'd like it if there was a realistic view into marriage. The 'happy marriage' isn't something that people conclude to on their wedding day, that's for children's stories. The real troubles and problems start once you are married and the masks of perfection drop. The wedding is only the beginning of the journey.

I agree. I personally could cope with Shadolin being endgame as long as the romantic arc is filled in properly. I would be sorry about the loss of all the Shalladin foreshadowing though so that will always be my preferred ship. I actually think by marrying Shallan, Adolin has painted a great big "kill me" sign on his back. Someone's gonna end up geting him. If the skybreakers are still killing proto-radiants and Adolin is bonding Maya then its only a matter of time before the wrong person finds out he killed Sadeas.

 

2 hours ago, insert_anagram_here said:

"love of adventure, novelty, or oddity." could explain his womanizing years, his interest in Shallan, wanting to become a KR and his desire of reviving Mayalaran, Maybe?

The reachers don;t want to bond with humans atm though - they are still mad at us. That said, of any of those on the boat, Adolin seemed to get the best rapport with them.

52 minutes ago, insert_anagram_here said:

Um.. I have no idea why I got this impression in my head, that Ba-Ado-Mishram maybe is the Everstorm itself?

Oh that's interesting. I don't know - maybe its a form of some sort? It can't be Ba Ado Mishram exactly because the storm is new but perhaps it is a version of the Unmade? 

On that note, I thought Mishram and Mishin (the blue moon iirc) had similar names and that might be relevant?

15 minutes ago, Awesomness said:

mmm, everyone is ok with Sadeas´s murder...

Yes I know.... Personally I have a problem with any order that thinks Sadeas had it coming. He deserved justice not vengeance. Anyone else think it is interesting that Dalinar describes Adolin as "steady" in the chapter where Sadeas' body is found. Especially as steady is not that good a way to describe someone who murdered on impulse.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, PhineasGage said:

I actually think by marrying Shallan, Adolin has painted a great big "kill me" sign on his back. Someone's gonna end up geting him.

Yes. That is a thought, that has been in my head too.

Being the Kholin highprince, the husband of the (probably) most powerful Lightweaver, full Shardbearer and a very capable fighter, he has a nice big bullseye on his back. Though I'm not necessarily thinking about Nale's Skybreakers, but rather... Moash. He is definitely being groomed as an assassin by the singers and Adolin would definitely make a good target to cause distress in Urithiru's ranks.

[insert_anagram_here]

3 minutes ago, PhineasGage said:

I don't know that it has to be common knowledge. He could be using a real life situation to build the story - I doubt anyone thinks Shallan should just "be well" now - even without the knowledge. He can then continue to follow a life-like arc whilst having her make appropriate decisions for the story. Its the same with addiction for Teft and Dalinar.

Yes, I agree that he needs to build it up just like Teft and Dalinar's addiction and Kaladin's depression, but addiction and depression are well-known issues these days. Even a person without scientifically related background (such as myself) is aware, can recognize addiction and depression and know a possible solution. But OSDD isn't that clear. What I was trying to say here, is that it will take a lot more work for BS to explain what is going here, if this indeed is OSDD, even if he explains it in every day life language.

12 minutes ago, PhineasGage said:

this is supposed to be Eshonai's book iirc

Unless I see the book, I'm not betting on anything. 

9 minutes ago, PhineasGage said:

I would be sorry about the loss of all the Shalladin foreshadowing though so that will always be my preferred ship. I actually think by marrying Shallan, Adolin has painted a great big "kill me" sign on his back.

Yeah, I know exactly what you mean. But there could be something else happening related to the KR powers that we are not aware of yet. Something of supernatural nature that could end the marriage in a less... murdering way. Extended life maybe?

 

[PhineasGage]

1 minute ago, insert_anagram_here said:

What I was trying to say here, is that it will take a lot more work for BS to explain what is going here, if this indeed is OSDD, even if he explains it in every day life language.

Perhaps - I thought Wit was pretty clear in what needs to happen. I do see your point though - I'm just not sure you need to explain it for her arc to work with both a realistic portrayal for those who recognise it as well as function as a story-telling mechanism. I mean, multiple personality disorder (whilst poorly portrayed) is something people recognise in terms of storytelling gimics. As long as he can push the idea that Shallan needs to recognise herself as one (eg via one Wit conversation) then I think her can probably pull it off. As Wit is now a full blown LW he is definitely going to be around more. And he clearly relates to Shallan. If she follows Kaladin's pattern of Wit interactions then she is due another one in the next book anyway. He needs to tell her another story.

 

13 minutes ago, SLNC said:

Though I'm not necessarily thinking about Nale's Skybreakers, but rather... Moash. He is definitely being groomed as an assassin by the singers and Adolin would definitely make a good target to cause distress in Urithiru's ranks.

That's certainly a possibility. It also will feel even more like a betrayal to Kaladin than Elhokar's death did. I am just feeling that Moash is going to be off killing heralds. Perhaps Adolin gets caught out while Moash targets Taln or Ash who will presumably in Urithiru? I don't find that appealing though. I am not wanting Adolin to die, but if he has to do so, I would rather he got something done about his murder. It feels.... wrong that its just being accepted and okayed.

9 minutes ago, insert_anagram_here said:

Unless I see the book, I'm not betting on anything. 

Yes this is true - Szeth as a flashback could cover both recent and more distant flashbacks. That said, I currently feel we need more understanding of the Listeners and that this will help Kal get to level 4 via interactions Rlain in the context of Venli's flashbacks. Its a preference, but it doesn't really matter as long as it works

11 minutes ago, insert_anagram_here said:

Something of supernatural nature that could end the marriage in a less... murdering way. Extended life maybe?

Pretty sure this is a thing. I have a feeling there is a WoB on investiture causing reduced sickness and extended life. Can't find it tho (sorry) Personally though, I'd prefer Adolin to die quite soon or there to be a divorce - I can't see there being any point in foreshadowing Shalladin if it isn't going to happen until +50years. I'd prefer divorce over Adolin's death. I think that whilst there are religious issues surrounding divorce, people do make mistakes and it isn't actually a good idea to go through life with both of you being unhappy just because it is the "right" thing to do. Sure relationships take work, but at some point, is the amount of work you are putting in reasonable given what you and your partner get out of the relationship? They got married very young (and frankly both quite immature). Would it be so wrong to end the marriage - esp if there are no children - because they are both unhappy in it? 

[Ailvara]

Hello, so happy to be back to our support group! Huh, last time I restored my activity in this thread, I was so agitated to come back for responses, aaand... I just sat there blinking in surprise for a moment. My first thought was that we had reached the post count limit xD

Back to the thread. After our discussions, I shifted fully to "denial" and started to believe the theory of this being not nearly over. However, yesterday I was rereading the ending and it struck me, that emotionally, this ending seems proper. Maybe it's the constant exploration of other people's opinions or a different pace of reading, but it felt to me like a natural progress and final resolution, which I could almost agree with. Now, before you get the wrong idea, if you think I'm jumping ship, that's not this at all. Looking at all the books, and not just the OB ending, I'm still all on Shalladin board. This change of heart just got me worried, that Brandon did his best resolving the triangle and there really isn't more to it. It scares me much more than it should, that we are developing some unreasonable expectations that will ruin book 4 for us, so I would like to keep challenging our assumptions and really try to get to the bottom of it.

So, as a newly self-appointed SS Shalladin's devil's advocate, I would like to put to discussion this quote:

Quote

Veil and Radiant faded. When Shallan looked back into the mirror, she didn't feel embarassed by the attention any longer. It was all right.

I would really hate that, but this feels like by dismissing Veil and Radiant, Shallan reclaimed some amount of her confidence from them. Could that actually mean, that she actually is on the best way to reintegrate them and we'll see her whole after the 1-year gap?

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Ailvara said:

I would really hate that, but this feels like by dismissing Veil and Radiant, Shallan reclaimed some amount of her confidence from them. Could that actually mean, that she actually is on the best way to reintegrate them and we'll see her whole after the 1-year gap?

No, I don't think that.

I think, that it was more herself realizing, that it was okay to be happy every once in a while, which it, of course, totally is. She thought, that she didn't deserve this and she just realized, that she does. I don't think, that it has anything to do with reclaimed confidence.

[Dreamstorm]

2 hours ago, PhineasGage said:

this is supposed to be Eshonai's book iirc?

Couple quick points (since I was reading WoB last night), that it is confirmed that Book 4 will be Eshonai's book.

Quote

Questioner [PENDING REVIEW]

So, I was gonna ask about which character the next book would focus on?

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW]

Oh, no, that's not spoilery. I said from the get-go I am perfectly all right writing a flashback sequence for a character who has already died in the books. So it's not telling you any spoilers to tell you who the various characters are. So, the front five are Kaladin, Shallan, Dalinar, Eshonai, and Szeth. Those are our front five. And our back five are Lift, Jasnah, Ash, Taln, and Renarin. And, not in that order. I've flipped the order quite a bit as I've been going. 'Cause Dalinar was gonna be book five, and now he's book three. So now Szeth is book five, and Eshonai is book four. Right now, Lift is book six. But the back five, I'm not concerned about, other than making sure I'm setting up the right things, and it's gonna come together.

2 hours ago, insert_anagram_here said:

Extended life maybe?

It's now confirmed via WoB that Radiants do not have extended life.  They are super healthy though, so would assume they live longer on average.  Note he says "not usually" so there may be exceptions to this.

Quote

Questioner [PENDING REVIEW]

Longevity of Radiants. So, I, before [Oathbringer], though that they were immortal. So, they're not?

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW]

No.

Questioner [PENDING REVIEW]

Do they have longer lifespans?

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW]

Slightly. They're very healthy, but it's not usually an expanded lifespan.

 

2 hours ago, PhineasGage said:

Personally though, I'd prefer Adolin to die quite soon or there to be a divorce - I can't see there being any point in foreshadowing Shalladin if it isn't going to happen until +50years. I'd prefer divorce over Adolin's death. I think that whilst there are religious issues surrounding divorce, people do make mistakes and it isn't actually a good idea to go through life with both of you being unhappy just because it is the "right" thing to do. Sure relationships take work, but at some point, is the amount of work you are putting in reasonable given what you and your partner get out of the relationship? They got married very young (and frankly both quite immature). Would it be so wrong to end the marriage - esp if there are no children - because they are both unhappy in it? 

This is exactly where I am - I think it would cheapen all of the Shalladin foreshadowing too if Shallan only ends up with Kaladin because Adolin is dead.  I don't think it's a stretch at all for Brandon to do a divorce.  In a time when drastic changes are happening in Alethi society (there is a heretic woman on the throne!!), I wouldn't even see this as that dramatic for our characters in-world.  Also, I really don't want Adolin to die, so therefore he won't 

2 hours ago, Ailvara said:

However, yesterday I was rereading the ending and it struck me, that emotionally, this ending seems proper. Maybe it's the constant exploration of other people's opinions or a different pace of reading, but it felt to me like a natural progress and final resolution, which I could almost agree with. Now, before you get the wrong idea, if you think I'm jumping ship, that's not this at all. Looking at all the books, and not just the OB ending, I'm still all on Shalladin board. This change of heart just got me worried, that Brandon did his best resolving the triangle and there really isn't more to it. It scares me much more than it should, that we are developing some unreasonable expectations that will ruin book 4 for us, so I would like to keep challenging our assumptions and really try to get to the bottom of it.

I like being pushed to see the other side because if my views can withstand scrutiny, I think they are so much stronger for it!  That being said, I've gone on the complete opposite journey.  I think there are so many little ways to add more certainty to Shallan's decision that if that's what Brandon wanted, he would have chosen to do so.  Not to mention Shallan's decision shows the least agency of any of Brandon's characters I've read (or, the least agency in making a supposed forward step in the character), so I also don't buy it.  Again, some small things in the "choosing Adolin" scene could have been tweaked to sell it to me.  Plus, there's no reason to have Kaladin foreshadowing in the actual scene where Shallan chooses Adolin if that's really the end game.  But, keep the arguments coming!  I'm also worried I'll be disappointed so I want to become entrenched, LOL.

2 hours ago, Ailvara said:

I would really hate that, but this feels like by dismissing Veil and Radiant, Shallan reclaimed some amount of her confidence from them. Could that actually mean, that she actually is on the best way to reintegrate them and we'll see her whole after the 1-year gap?

I think the WoB that Shallan is one in the spiritual realm counteracts the idea that he is trying to say Shallan should let Veil and Radiant fade into the background.  She may feel better without the back and forth in her head, but since these are integral parts of one "whole" Shallan (and being one person in the spiritual realm very strongly says that to me), they have to be acknowledged and integrated so that physical realm Shallan reflects spiritual realm Shallan. 

Edited December 4, 2017 by Dreamstorm

[Lelouch Vi Britannia]

I used to be a Shalladin shipper, but than I took an arrow to the- *inaudible smacking sound*

Anyway, I'm glad that's no longer a concern. I was a bit disappointed that Shallan chose Adolin, but it was fairly inevitable. I couldn't see Brandon going back on that. But I realized Syladin is both way better and more likely (even though Kalazure is probably the most viable, sadly), so all is well. Not sure how that would work, but whatever. 

[Awesomness]

My coping process took me to consider some things in the last week away from this trerapeutic thread.

First, I really liked Kaladin´s arc in OB. And Kal "realizing" he was never in love with Shallan, though anticlimactic to say the least, is very healthy because he will stop relying in other people to find happiness.

Second, from Shallan´s perspective, Kaladin would be a very problematic choice. How can you be with someone knowing he killed your brother? Even if she understands the situation, reason and feeling not always align. Maybe in time, but right now she found this out 2 months ago...

Besides, neither of them are ready for a relationship, and wouldn´t be good for each other.

I still haven't processed: Shadolin´s  mildness and Shallan´s issues... 

So, right now, I don't think they could be together if she hadn't chosen Adolin. But I refuse to think all that foreshadowing went down the loo with her marriage...

 

[Guest]

39 minutes ago, LewsTherinTalamon said:

But I realized Syladin is both way better and more likely (even though Kalazure is probably the most viable, sadly), so all is well. Not sure how that would work, but whatever. 

Quote

Questioner [PENDING REVIEW]

Is there even the babiest tiniest little bitty babiest chance of Syl and Kaladin ever being able to be together?

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW]

That would take a lot.

Questioner [PENDING REVIEW]

But itty bitty babiest chance?

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW]

Itty bitty babiest chance? Sure.

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/171-oathbringer-release-party/#e8267

Sorry, mate.

24 minutes ago, Awesomness said:

So, right now, I don't think they could be together if she hadn't chosen Adolin. But I refuse to think all that foreshadowing went down the loo with her marriage...

Yes. I still stand strongly by, that Shallan shouldn't have chosen at all at this point. Shallan isn't ready for a long-term relationship IMHO. Nor is Kal for that matter. With Adolin I'm not so sure, but he's the most ready of the three I think.

Edited December 4, 2017 by SLNC

[Lelouch Vi Britannia]

2 minutes ago, SLNC said:

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/171-oathbringer-release-party/#e8267

Sorry, mate.

Yes. I still stand strongly by, that Shallan shouldn't have chosen at all at this point.

What do you mean, not chosen at all? Not chosen anyone specifically?

[Guest]

1 minute ago, LewsTherinTalamon said:

What do you mean, not chosen at all? Not chosen anyone specifically?

Yes.

[Lelouch Vi Britannia]

Just now, SLNC said:

Yes.

That would've simplified things for sure.... Fortunately, the books' focus on this seems mostly minimal anyway. Although I have to wonder why there was so much Shalladin stuff if nothing would come of it. Sure it makes sense in a real life scenario, but it sort of feels out of place in OB.

[Dreamstorm]

11 minutes ago, LewsTherinTalamon said:

Although I have to wonder why there was so much Shalladin stuff if nothing would come of it. Sure it makes sense in a real life scenario, but it sort of feels out of place in OB.

So out of place that the disorientation over the ending feels almost intentional...   To channel Pattern, mmmmm, a wonderful lie.

[PhineasGage]

3 hours ago, Ailvara said:

I would really hate that, but this feels like by dismissing Veil and Radiant, Shallan reclaimed some amount of her confidence from them. Could that actually mean, that she actually is on the best way to reintegrate them and we'll see her whole after the 1-year gap?

I must admit that this is the best evidence for it being genuinely closed. But then I see all the foreshadowing and think, "Huh, the ending is no more deliberate than any of this." There is so much foreshadowing and plenty of it cannot be dismissed as only being wishful thinking. On top of that, whilst this may be a romanticisation of an OSDD sufferer "gaining control" as a temporary stop gap (she's a bit too far gone imo for this to work IRL but I gues we can allow BS some wiggle room for story purposes), she still needs to relaise she is one person. She hasn't done that during the wedding. Indeed the 3 of the are still very much seen as unique individuals. Shallan just "reigns over them" for now.

1 hour ago, Dreamstorm said:

They are super healthy though, so would assume they live longer on average.

Awesome - thank you for finding that! I don't think we should assume massively longer life expectancy. Perhaps Dalinar as he is bonded to a massive splinter of Honor, but that presumably is not the norm. Also perhaps for anyone who becomes a new Herald if that is a thing - but I suspect that if this happens it won't give massive life expectancy because Cultivation is not going to put power behind immortality (Cultivation needs death as part of life and growth imo) and Honor's power is too splintered.

1 hour ago, LewsTherinTalamon said:

I used to be a Shalladin shipper, but than I took an arrow to the- *inaudible smacking sound*

Anyway, I'm glad that's no longer a concern

Don't be so sure. Want a list of all the foreshadowing? We can definitely provide - we've been thinking about this a long time now.

46 minutes ago, Awesomness said:

So, right now, I don't think they could be together if she hadn't chosen Adolin. But I refuse to think all that foreshadowing went down the loo with her marriage...

Exactly. I am glad Kaladin is free for now. I don't think Shadolin is the best outcome for Shallan or Adolin and I think they are heading for problems. I especially think Adolin has a massive target on his head now he is married to Shallan. What happens if he accidentally stops her acting for the Ghostbloods? Do they assassinate him? And they are by no means the only group that might decide he is better off dead.

23 minutes ago, SLNC said:

Yes. I still stand strongly by, that Shallan shouldn't have chosen at all at this point. Shallan isn't ready for a long-term relationship IMHO. Nor is Kal for that matter. With Adolin I'm not so sure, but he's the most ready of the three I think.

I think Adolin is in love with the idea of being in love. So he wants to settle down. I'm not sure that makes him ready so much as at least the most willing to put the work in for now. I'm not convinced that he'll stay that way once the gloss of the relationship has worn off a bit. 

15 minutes ago, LewsTherinTalamon said:

Although I have to wonder why there was so much Shalladin stuff if nothing would come of it. Sure it makes sense in a real life scenario, but it sort of feels out of place in OB

It does. BS is normally very good at putting in hidden foreshadowing and this was hardly hidden. I think he is at risk of "lying" to his readers (something he doesn't want to do) if he doesn't eventually go there.

[Awesomness]

51 minutes ago, SLNC said:

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/171-oathbringer-release-party/#e8267

Sorry, mate.

@LewsTherinTalamon Not to keep up your hopes, but BS said pretty much the same about reviving shardblades  

[GoddessIMHO]

OK, maybe this should be a new topic but it pertains here i think. The one year will be both sides building up their forces. We need hundreds of KR, our little handful will not be enough. There may  be a prelude chapter with some relationship information in it since they will be at a different place in a year than they are at the end of OB. Or maybe not, perhaps that will just be blended into the story line.

Yes, it will be Eshonai's book for the flash backs so that makes me think it will be Venli she is talking about and how it all came to be. However, Shallan is a main character so I still expect her to have whatever crisis of truth she needs to reach the 5th level. I don't believe that will be about her marriage but either something still from the past or Ghostblood related.

[analyticaposteriori]

Shallan/Adolin just feels so vanilla/passionless in comparison to Shalladin. Just randomly flipping through the book:

Quote

Her heedless joy made him want to show her how to really fly. She didn’t have Lashings, but could still use her body to sculpt the wind and dance in the air.…

Yeah, she should really ride that wind, right Kal? She really merely reminds you of Tien...

Find me a similar suggestive thought process in Shadolin, I dare you... at this point I am starting to think that all these constant "wind" innuendos are unintentional and Brandon is wholly oblivious to writing them, seeing as what he apparently considers the proper pairing.

Edited December 4, 2017 by analyticaposteriori