Chaos

[OB] Full Book Reactions / Full Spoilers Thread

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On 3/1/2018 at 1:30 AM, hippiedogmom said:

:o voidbringers are..... HUMANS!?!? :blink:

Quite the bait-and-switch, isn't it?  

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OB is honestly one of the best works of Fantasy fiction I've had the pleasure of reading. It has the right mix of questions and revelations, actions and politicking. Dalinar's character arc in general was just powerful, and moving.  I didn't love the love triangle, but it turned out how I wanted.

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Spoiler

Ok everybody’s got to stop with the shalladin stuff. She married Adolin. Get over it. I actually really think their a good match. And Adolin keeps getting shafted left and right. I mean think about it, his dad, brother, wife, cousin and 

bodyguards are all radiants/ squires. He probably feels pretty left out. I mean Kaladin or shallan could have made him a squire. Or even Dallinar (can bondsmiths even have squires?) or renarin or even storming Jasnah for crying out loud. But no. Nobody even thinks about it. I’m glad Adolin got anything in OB. 

 

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1 hour ago, supersmith said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Ok everybody’s got to stop with the shalladin stuff. She married Adolin. Get over it. I actually really think their a good match. And Adolin keeps getting shafted left and right. I mean think about it, his dad, brother, wife, cousin and 

bodyguards are all radiants/ squires. He probably feels pretty left out. I mean Kaladin or shallan could have made him a squire. Or even Dallinar (can bondsmiths even have squires?) or renarin or even storming Jasnah for crying out loud. But no. Nobody even thinks about it. I’m glad Adolin got anything in OB. 

 

Friend, if you would classify Adolin's experience thus far in the SA as "getting shafted left and right", then I suspect you aren't going to like what is coming in future books...

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1 hour ago, supersmith said:

 

  Hide contents

Ok everybody’s got to stop with the shalladin stuff. She married Adolin. Get over it. I actually really think their a good match. And Adolin keeps getting shafted left and right. I mean think about it, his dad, brother, wife, cousin and 

bodyguards are all radiants/ squires. He probably feels pretty left out. I mean Kaladin or shallan could have made him a squire. Or even Dallinar (can bondsmiths even have squires?) or renarin or even storming Jasnah for crying out loud. But no. Nobody even thinks about it. I’m glad Adolin got anything in OB. 

 

I don't know why you put this in spoilers, it wasn't required... I just wanted to say I did found it odd no one commented on the fact Adolin was not made a Radiants... Here they are, about the fight an endless battle against the Voidbringers and not one, besides Kaladin, of their Radiants is actually a field soldier, a general or someone having any valid military knowledge. Pretending Jasnah knows everything is cute and everything, but no way has she anywhere near a tenth of Adolin's field experience: the boy was raised in a warcamp.

I thought it was bizarre Dalinar didn't reflect on it, didn't wonder why her perfect son wasn't chosen while is sick one was. Or didn't think how useful it would be if one of those Radiants could have been a ranking officer... Or thinking it would be more useful to have Adolin have surges than little Lift.

On the squire comment though, it isn't just up to the Radiants to decide who becomes a squire... A squire first needs to become one and it is clear Adolin has no intention to turn himself into a squire. He admires the Radiants, but he thinks they are up there and he is down there. He is no squire because he doesn't want to emulate any of the Radiants, unlike every single other squire.

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28 minutes ago, maxal said:

I thought it was bizarre Dalinar didn't reflect on it, didn't wonder why her perfect son wasn't chosen while is sick one was. Or didn't think how useful it would be if one of those Radiants could have been a ranking officer... Or thinking it would be more useful to have Adolin have surges than little Lift.

1 hour ago, supersmith said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Ok everybody’s got to stop with the shalladin stuff. She married Adolin. Get over it. I actually really think their a good match. And Adolin keeps getting shafted left and right. I mean think about it, his dad, brother, wife, cousin and 

bodyguards are all radiants/ squires. He probably feels pretty left out. I mean Kaladin or shallan could have made him a squire. Or even Dallinar (can bondsmiths even have squires?) or renarin or even storming Jasnah for crying out loud. But no. Nobody even thinks about it. I’m glad Adolin got anything in OB. 

 

Perhaps, despite all the things that Adolin excels at and had been gifted with in his life, that these things are not what would make him worthy of attracting a spren to become Radiant? Maybe the spren know something about him we don't?

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2 minutes ago, DeployParachute said:

Perhaps, despite all the things that Adolin excels at and had been gifted with in his life, that these things are not what would make him worthy of attracting a spren to become Radiant? Maybe the spren know something about him we don't?

I agree there might elements within Adolin's life which made him unsuitable to the sprens having chosen to investigate his family (though apart from the classic "he's not broken enough", I really don't see what he doesn't have he'd need to have for one spren to pick him, considering he is a Kholin), but in-world characters are practically clueless as to why a given individual is made a Radiant and not another. Considering every known Kholin is a Radiant, I found the fact no one questioned why Adolin, of all people, was left out a bit odd... It seems to me it would have been within Dalinar's character to question why his "deeply honorable son walking the path he set for him" wasn't picked. Why Renarin? Why not Adolin? As for Renarin, it is odd to he isn't wondering why he was chosen over Adolin, the brother who can never do no wrong, the brothers who always knows what to do? Why isn't Renarin not wondering why he and not Adolin was made a Radiant?

The lack of in-world questioning was bizarre. Even if not Adolin, I feel Dalinar should have wondered why no higher ranked officers was chosen, no Highprince, no individual with the military knowledge to make a greater difference onto the battlefield. No one seems to think it matters Adolin is not a Radiant and this too was odd to me.

It would make a nice question for Brandon... Why aren't in-world characters, especially Dalinar/Renarin, not asking why Adolin wasn't made a Radiant?

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57 minutes ago, maxal said:

I don't know why you put this in spoilers, it wasn't required... I just wanted to say I did found it odd no one commented on the fact Adolin was not made a Radiants... Here they are, about the fight an endless battle against the Voidbringers and not one, besides Kaladin, of their Radiants is actually a field soldier, a general or someone having any valid military knowledge. Pretending Jasnah knows everything is cute and everything, but no way has she anywhere near a tenth of Adolin's field experience: the boy was raised in a warcamp.

I thought it was bizarre Dalinar didn't reflect on it, didn't wonder why her perfect son wasn't chosen while is sick one was. Or didn't think how useful it would be if one of those Radiants could have been a ranking officer... Or thinking it would be more useful to have Adolin have surges than little Lift.

On the squire comment though, it isn't just up to the Radiants to decide who becomes a squire... A squire first needs to become one and it is clear Adolin has no intention to turn himself into a squire. He admires the Radiants, but he thinks they are up there and he is down there. He is no squire because he doesn't want to emulate any of the Radiants, unlike every single other squire.

Maybe Adolin isnt a Radiant because he's hauling around a spren corpse everywhere? Or maybe he's just not cut out to be a Radiant? I like how you refer to Adolin as the "perfect" son who doesn't get to be a Radiant, but Renarin as the "sickly" one who does. So, because Adolin got to grow up strong, handsome, well liked, and was always daddy's favorite he's more deserving of being a Radiant than sickly Renarin, who's been ostracized his whole life because of his health? Right.

Then theres Jasnah, no one is pretending she knows everything, she's head and shoulders more intelligent than Adolin. And he's not actually a "boy" but a 23 year old man, and if hes so smart and capable, why doesn't he step up and do something, instead of you know, playing at fashion while everybody else actually does the work?

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I may be off base here but I don’t think maxal is neccesarialy saying Adolin should be a radiant but that people like Dalinar, Renarin and Jasnah should be questioning why he hasn’t attracted a spren. Obviously they need more KR and there is no discussion about any of this in the books. No one is questioning why Renarin got picked and not Adolin who’s a master duelist and military leader. These questions would be logical yet they are completely missing. 

Edited by StormingTexan
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6 minutes ago, StormingTexan said:

I may be off base here but I don’t think maxal is neccesarialy saying Adolin should be a radiant but that people like Dalinar, Renarin and Jasnah should be questioning why he hasn’t attracted a spren. Obviously they need more KR and there is no discussion about any of this in the books. No one is questioning why Renarin got picked and not Adolin who’s a master duelist and military leader. These questions would be logical yet they are completely missing. 

Perhaps because these characters understand at a deeper level that it is the spren who choose, not the individuals. Maybe all the individuals you and maxal named recognize that they have flaws that played a role in their selection, and they recognize that Adolin doesn't have any flaws (something to assist in breaking open of their spirit web that allows the bond to form), and it just goes without saying that he is not in a place where he would attract spren. Maybe, because Adolin hasn't been confronted with any issues severe enough to challenge his behavior and morals, he shouldn't be trusted with access to surges quite yet...

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17 minutes ago, GarrethGrey said:

Maybe Adolin isnt a Radiant because he's hauling around a spren corpse everywhere? Or maybe he's just not cut out to be a Radiant? I like how you refer to Adolin as the "perfect" son who doesn't get to be a Radiant, but Renarin as the "sickly" one who does. So, because Adolin got to grow up strong, handsome, well liked, and was always daddy's favorite he's more deserving of being a Radiant than sickly Renarin, who's been ostracized his whole life because of his health? Right.

Then theres Jasnah, no one is pretending she knows everything, she's head and shoulders more intelligent than Adolin. And he's not actually a "boy" but a 23 year old man, and if hes so smart and capable, why doesn't he step up and do something, instead of you know, playing at fashion while everybody else actually does the work?

@StormingTexan got it right: I am not questioning why Adolin was not made a Radiant. I am questioning why the in-world characters aren't asking themselves why? They do not have our knowledge. They are barely aware of the "broken criteria", they don't really know why one is chosen and not another. It is odd there aren't asking themselves more questions.

My post has nothing to do with Adolin deserving it more than Renarin: it has to do with why Dalinar isn't thinking it. Why Renarin isn't thinking it. Not myself, they.

I never said Jasnah was not deserving, but we can't pretend she has anywhere near the field experience of Adolin nor his military knowledge. She can't. She isn't a soldier. She wasn't raised to be a soldier. No one we know in-world was raised to be a soldier like Adolin.

I think you completely misunderstood my post. 

12 minutes ago, StormingTexan said:

I may be off base here but I don’t think maxal is neccesarialy saying Adolin should be a radiant but that people like Dalinar, Renarin and Jasnah should be questioning why he hasn’t attracted a spren. Obviously they need more KR and there is no discussion about any of this in the books. No one is questioning why Renarin got picked and not Adolin who’s a master duelist and military leader. These questions would be logical yet they are completely missing. 

Yep. This is exactly it. Why aren't they wondering about it? Why aren't they questioning why Renarin was picked? Sure we, the readers, are able to rationalize it, but in-world characters? Based on what they know? 

Those questions are unbelievably logical and yet, they were skipped.

2 minutes ago, DeployParachute said:

Perhaps because these characters understand at a deeper level that it is the spren who choose, not the individuals. Maybe all the individuals you and maxal named recognize that they have flaws that played a role in their selection, and they recognize that Adolin doesn't have any flaws (something to assist in breaking open of their spirit web that allows the bond to form), and it just goes without saying that he is not in a place where he would attract spren. Maybe, because Adolin hasn't been confronted with any issues severe enough to challenge his behavior and morals, he shouldn't be trusted with access to surges quite yet...

They don't know it is their flaws which made them Radiants... Kaladin knows, to some extend, but not Dalinar. Not Renarin. Not Shallan either. They don't really know. And considering the number of viewpoints we have on Radiants, if they had an inane sense as to why they were chosen, they'd speak about it. On the contrary, Teft doesn't understand why he is chosen and not someone else.

The Radiants are nearly clueless and given they know so little, their lack of questions is odd.

 

 

Edited by maxal
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2 minutes ago, maxal said:

@StormingTexan got it right: I am not questioning why Adolin was not made a Radiant. I am questioning why the in-world characters aren't asking themselves why? They do not have our knowledge. They are barely aware of the "broken criteria", they don't really know why one is chosen and not another. It is odd there aren't asking themselves more questions.

My post has nothing to do with Adolin deserving it more than Renarin: it has to do with why Dalinar isn't thinking it. Why Renarin isn't thinking it. Not myself, they.

I never said Jasnah was not deserving, but we can't pretend she has anywhere near the field experience of Adolin nor his military knowledge. She can't. She isn't a soldier. She wasn't raised to be a soldier. No one we know in-world was raised to be a soldier like Adolin.

I think you completely misunderstood my post. 

Yep. This is exactly it. Why aren't they wondering about it? Why aren't they questioning why Renarin was picked? Sure we, the readers, are able to rationalize it, but in-world characters? Based on what they know? 

Those questions are unbelievably logical and yet, they were skipped.

It seems I did misunderstand a bit, my bad. However I do understand the question of why the characters don't question it, and I just don't think its relevant in world, right now. A desolation just started, the Radiants have just been refounded, the last thing on anybody's mind is why Adolin isn't one. They have bigger things to worry about than why Renarin or Jansah is a KR and Adolin isn't. I get the question, I get why the characters might want to question it, I just dont think its at the top of their priority list as to why Adolin specifically isn't a Radiant.

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12 minutes ago, maxal said:

They don't know it is their flaws which made them Radiants... Kaladin knows, to some extend, but not Dalinar. Not Renarin. Not Shallan either. They don't really know. And considering the number of viewpoints we have on Radiants, if they had an inane sense as to why they were chosen, they'd speak about it. On the contrary, Teft doesn't understand why he is chosen and not someone else.

The Radiants are nearly clueless and given they know so little, their lack of questions is odd.

Every one of those individuals have reflected on their flaws (well, perhaps not Jasnah yet, but that is a lack of viewpoint issue likely), the fact that they are flawed.  They all also view Adolin as, if not flawless, at least a better person than they are, so again, perhaps instinctually they know. Your speculation about how they all should be asking those questions has about as much support a my speculation as to why they don't question it. So in the end, all I can offer you is reasonable explanations contrary to what you have put forth. I don't think it is odd at all. They know Adolin is different, and perhaps that is enough for them to not question it further.

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14 minutes ago, maxal said:

The Radiants are nearly clueless and given they know so little, their lack of questions is odd.

It actually isn't. If they can't precisely determine the requirements to being chosen by a spren, how and why should they infer, that Adolin is worth it more than others?

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1 minute ago, GarrethGrey said:

It seems I did misunderstand a bit, my bad. However I do understand the question of why the characters don't question it, and I just don't think its relevant in world, right now. A desolation just started, the Radiants have just been refounded, the last thing on anybody's mind is why Adolin isn't one. They have bigger things to worry about than why Renarin or Jansah is a KR and Adolin isn't. I get the question, I get why the characters might want to question it, I just dont think its at the top of their priority list as to why Adolin specifically isn't a Radiant.

One of Dalinar's priority is to get more Radiants and to train his Radiants. He beamed with pride when he learned about Renarin: end of the world or not, he knows he is going to need many more Radiants if humanity is to have a chance. As a military leader himself, he ought to know he'll need Radiants able to lead armies. 

The fact he is spending time thinking of how bad it is they lost Sadeas's military mind, but not thinking why no one more military inclined was chosen is very odd. 

As for Adolin, the fact he was left out is so blatant, end of the world or not, it would have been very human, realistic and normal they would ask themselves why. They all think very highly of Adolin.

2 minutes ago, DeployParachute said:

Every one of those individuals have reflected on their flaws (well, perhaps not Jasnah yet, but that is a lack of viewpoint issue likely), the fact that they are flawed.  They all also view Adolin as, if not flawless, at least a better person than they are, so again, perhaps instinctually they know. Your speculation about how they all should be asking those questions has about as much support a my speculation as to why they don't question it. So in the end, all I can offer you is reasonable explanations contrary to what you have put forth. I don't think it is odd at all. They know Adolin is different, and perhaps that is enough for them to not question it further.

Kaladin needed Syl to tell him before he started understanding... Many of them have reflected on the fact they were too flawed to be Radiants... 

Our characters also know so little about the various orders... I don't buy the argument they have some sort of "sixth sense" which makes them never ask the question.

3 minutes ago, SLNC said:

It actually isn't. If they can't precisely determine the requirements to being chosen by a spren, how and why should they infer, that Adolin is worth it more than others?

It is not even a matter of thinking Adolin deserves it, it is more a matter of having every single Kholin being a Radiant, except him, is so blatant, it is odd it didn't register into anyone's mind. Had no Kholin been a Radiant, had we only have Dalinar or just Jasnah, I wouldn't be making the commentary, but there are four of them, if we count Elhokar. 

It also isn't within Dalinar's character not to ask the question.

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Further thoughts

4 minutes ago, maxal said:

One of Dalinar's priority is to get more Radiants and to train his Radiants. He beamed with pride when he learned about Renarin: end of the world or not, he knows he is going to need many more Radiants if humanity is to have a chance. As a military leader himself, he ought to know he'll need Radiants able to lead armies. 

The fact he is spending time thinking of how bad it is they lost Sadeas's military mind, but not thinking why no one more military inclined was chosen is very odd. 

As for Adolin, the fact he was left out is so blatant, end of the world or not, it would have been very human, realistic and normal they would ask themselves why. They all think very highly of Adolin.

What makes you think that Adolin is not capable of leading armies, even Radiant armies, simply because he himself does not have a bond with a spren? If Adolin is as much of a capable and brilliant and experienced military commander that you say, why would Dalinar not utilize him anyway? Perhaps Dalinar doesn't ask these questions because he doesn't value his son less simply because he doesn't have a bond. Perhaps Dalinar never doubted his son will have a role to play. Perhaps Dalinar has more faith in Adolin's future without Radiancy than you do.

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1 minute ago, DeployParachute said:

Further thoughts

What makes you think that Adolin is not capable of leading armies, even Radiant armies, simply because he himself does not have a bond with a spren? If Adolin is as much of a capable and brilliant and experienced military commander that you say, why would Dalinar not utilize him anyway? Perhaps Dalinar doesn't ask these questions because he doesn't value his son less simply because he doesn't have a bond. Perhaps Dalinar never doubted his son will have a role to play. Perhaps Dalinar has more faith in Adolin's future without Radiancy than you do.

At the Thaylenar battle, Dalinar doesn't bother himself with Adolin: he only focused on the Radiant, he didn't even think he also had Adolin as a resource. I would thus not argue Dalinar is not Radiant focused.

Adolin was presented as a capable military leader, I never said he was brilliant, you did, but Dalinar does complain over having lost too many officers. In this optic, why isn't he looking out to get Radiants officers does strike me as odd. 

I also never said anything about Dalinar valuing Adolin less, though he did leave him out of the battle.... They need Radiants. Humans can't fight the Desolation. They can't defeat the thunderclasts nor the Fused. It isn't a matter of what Dalinar thinks of Adolin, but a matter of him needing more Radiants, having his entire family being Radiants except the one son having the most military inclined abilities. He is going to need Radiant officers... He ought to know this, so his lack of questioning remains, odd.

This isn't about Adolin's future or what Dalinar thinks of it or myself, this about the elephant sitting in the room and no one is actually speaking about . When everyone in a given family suddenly gets super-powers, isn't it normal to ask why one was left out? It isn't about thinking Adolin has no more future or is irrelevant, it is about observing the fact all Kholins are Radiant, except him.

It is normal for humans to ask themselves questions. In Oathbringer, our characters didn't ask many and this is one questions no one asked why was very obvious to me. This was very odd, to me at least.

I see no one else thought it was odd, but it wasn't very realistic to me they didn't question the process more. This is all.

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3 minutes ago, maxal said:

This isn't about Adolin's future or what Dalinar thinks of it or myself, this about the elephant sitting in the room and no one is actually speaking about . When everyone in a given family suddenly gets super-powers, isn't it normal to ask why one was left out? It isn't about thinking Adolin has no more future or is irrelevant, it is about observing the fact all Kholins are Radiant, except him.

I think you know why this is. We've discussed it at length before. Just trying to offer alternatives in order to keep the dream alive. Take it or leave it.

Also: "He beamed with pride when he learned about Renarin"

this is the sentence that stood out to me as suggesting you felt Dalinar felt some sort of elevated sense of satisfaction for the son who was radiant, and perhaps the son who wasn't had fallen down in worth, at least in Dalinar eyes. Overall, the tone of your posts here suggest (rightly or wrongly) that you find these characters at fault for not having the same thoughts and questions about Adolin that you do. So my reading of them reflected my thought that you assumed the worst about the characters motivations in this regard. 

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3 minutes ago, DeployParachute said:

I think you know why this is. We've discussed it at length before. Just trying to offer alternatives in order to keep the dream alive. Take it or leave it.

Also: "He beamed with pride when he learned about Renarin"

this is the sentence that stood out to me as suggesting you felt Dalinar felt some sort of elevated sense of satisfaction for the son who was radiant, and perhaps the son who wasn't had fallen down in worth, at least in Dalinar eyes. Overall, the tone of your posts here suggest (rightly or wrongly) that you find these characters at fault for not having the same thoughts and questions about Adolin that you do. So my reading of them reflected my thought that you assumed the worst about the characters motivations in this regard. 

But this isn't about whether or not Adolin should or should not become a Radiant or his story arc or anything of the sorts... It is a legit question as to why in-world characters didn't ask the question. 

If Dalinar feels pride for the son being elevated to the status of Radiant, a very natural reaction, then shouldn't he wonder about the one who wasn't? I wouldn't go as far as to say I am faulting those characters, I am musing as to why it wasn't asked in the narrative. It seems to me there were more reasons for them to ask the question than not to ask it.

Pushing it a bit farther, it is odd they aren't asking themselves why there are no Radiant among the regular soldiers nor the field officers, not just Adolin, but everyone. Truth is, their small contingent of Radiants are ill-prepared and inexperienced to face battle. If I were a war leader, I'd wish the sprens would chose individuals better able to help on a military point of view.

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4 hours ago, maxal said:

don't know why you put this in spoilers, it wasn't required... I just wanted to say I did found it odd no one commented on the fact Adolin was not made a Radiants...

 

3 hours ago, maxal said:

I am not questioning why Adolin was not made a Radiant. I am questioning why the in-world characters aren't asking themselves why?

 

2 hours ago, maxal said:

As for Adolin, the fact he was left out is so blatant, end of the world or not, it would have been very human, realistic and normal they would ask themselves why. They all think very highly of Adolin.

 

2 hours ago, maxal said:

At the Thaylenar battle, Dalinar doesn't bother himself with Adolin: he only focused on the Radiant, he didn't even think he also had Adolin as a resource. I would thus not argue Dalinar is not Radiant focused.

 

2 hours ago, maxal said:

It is not even a matter of thinking Adolin deserves it, it is more a matter of having every single Kholin being a Radiant, except him, is so blatant, it is odd it didn't register into anyone's mind. Had no Kholin been a Radiant, had we only have Dalinar or just Jasnah, I wouldn't be making the commentary, but there are four of them, if we count Elhokar. 

 

2 hours ago, maxal said:

Pushing it a bit farther, it is odd they aren't asking themselves why there are no Radiant among the regular soldiers nor the field officers, not just Adolin, but everyone.

Your initial focus was very much on Adolin, so that is where I focused. I see you are trying to pivot here, and open it up to include more than just Adolin. Which I think is a good direction, because if we look at Teft, Lopen, the other bridge for squires, and even Shallan's squires, we can see that common soldiers and officers (Teft is a noncom at least), and even non soldiers are indeed on their path to Radiancy, while Adolin still is not. 

Idon't think there is any deeper or hidden meaning here. I think, like many other things Brandon has chosen not to write explicitly, it is supposed to be self evident. As for why the other characters are not asking questions, perhaps in Adolin's case, they don't want to bring it up, because they recognize the potential for embarrassment, or hurt feelings, or resentment. Maybe there are more important things on their minds than whether it is strange that Adolin Kholin has developed no radiant powers (and I remain focused on him, because clearly other non MCs are developing bonds)  and maybe Brandon expected that to be self evident to us as well. Or maybe you'll get some people questioning it in the next book, which might finally make Adolin more interesting: "look at that Adolin Kholin, where is his spren" "you'd think that all the Kholins would be radiants, what's the deal with Adolin, maybe he's hiding something" , "I never did trust that Adolin fellow. No spren seem to. I bet he's really a piece of crem". Maybe his family and friends are currently giving him time to develop a bond, but after a while, even they've got to start wondering. I bet that Adolin could take it coming from strangers, but perhaps it coming from those he loves would break him. Cause him to do things, things that inadvertantly lead him further away from Radiancy. Who knows, maybe Brandon left it out so he could surprise you next book. 

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18 hours ago, DeployParachute said:

Your initial focus was very much on Adolin, so that is where I focused. I see you are trying to pivot here, and open it up to include more than just Adolin. Which I think is a good direction, because if we look at Teft, Lopen, the other bridge for squires, and even Shallan's squires, we can see that common soldiers and officers (Teft is a noncom at least), and even non soldiers are indeed on their path to Radiancy, while Adolin still is not. 

Idon't think there is any deeper or hidden meaning here. I think, like many other things Brandon has chosen not to write explicitly, it is supposed to be self evident. As for why the other characters are not asking questions, perhaps in Adolin's case, they don't want to bring it up, because they recognize the potential for embarrassment, or hurt feelings, or resentment. Maybe there are more important things on their minds than whether it is strange that Adolin Kholin has developed no radiant powers (and I remain focused on him, because clearly other non MCs are developing bonds)  and maybe Brandon expected that to be self evident to us as well. Or maybe you'll get some people questioning it in the next book, which might finally make Adolin more interesting: "look at that Adolin Kholin, where is his spren" "you'd think that all the Kholins would be radiants, what's the deal with Adolin, maybe he's hiding something" , "I never did trust that Adolin fellow. No spren seem to. I bet he's really a piece of crem". Maybe his family and friends are currently giving him time to develop a bond, but after a while, even they've got to start wondering. I bet that Adolin could take it coming from strangers, but perhaps it coming from those he loves would break him. Cause him to do things, things that inadvertantly lead him further away from Radiancy. Who knows, maybe Brandon left it out so he could surprise you next book. 

My initial focus was Adolin because I was answering a post which referred to him. I do agree it is interesting to ask bigger questions as to why our characters aren't questioning the Radiant process more. So while yes, there are some soldiers on their way towards becoming Radiants, there are no officers. Every single squire or Radiant started up as a low ranked soldiers: no one among the upper ranks, apart from Dalinar, was ever chosen. 

No one was chosen within the other warcamps, yet, but I suspect this will change in its own time.

Considering Dalinar himself complains over lacking officers, considering he is very war oriented, him not questioning nor voicing the need to officers Radiants is odd. It goes hand in hand with the all-acclaimed notion being a Radiant is a substitute for experience as Dalinar doesn't shy away from sending untrained teenage girls and his young son into battle now they are Radiants.

I personally do not think it is self-evident nor do I think it is consistent with Dalinar's character nor to ask any questions. Are they, as you are suggesting, not wanting to hurt Adolin? Hard to say, Dalinar has a lot of viewpoints, he could have reflected on it without voicing it out loud. It is the lack of wondering or thoughts on the matter which I find peculiar. I can understand it never were a public thing. I also do not think it is "self-evident" why Adolin was not chosen by any spren just as I don't think it is "self-evident" why Elhokar was. I don't think it is self-evident for in-world characters either. Kaladin doesn't act surprised to see Elhokar bond a spren and yet... he doesn't think much of him.

Will it come into play? I have no idea, but I do not think not broaching those questions is a good idea for the narrative.

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10 hours ago, maxal said:

I also do not think it is "self-evident" why Adolin was not chosen by any spren just as I don't think it is "self-evident" why Elhokar was. I don't think it is self-evident for in-world characters either. Kaladin doesn't act surprised to see Elhokar bond a spren and yet... he doesn't think much of him.

What people are referring to 'self-evident' is the dead Shardblade Adolin has been carrying around from the beginning, which is conflicting to attracting another spren and forming a Nahel bond by result. And I think it is somewhat clever to do from Brandon's writing perspective, since it adds a tragic irony to the fact that Adolin felt like he lost his place in the world when the Knight Radiants appeared. It was exactly that Shardblade, that "big stick" that he has been fighting with, that had given him the social standing that he felt it was "his place in the world" to begin with. Now it's the reason he can't become a Knight Radiant. To me, unless we see something major happening that would deflect this narrative, this foreshadows why the Maya arc can't possibly end in a positive outcome.

Edited by insert_anagram_here
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6 hours ago, insert_anagram_here said:

What people are referring to 'self-evident' is the dead Shardblade Adolin has been carrying around from the beginning, which is conflicting to attracting another spren and forming a Nahel bond by result.

Elhokar had a dead shardblade and attracted a spren to bond with him. Maybe I am missing something because I am not sure where this assumption that if someone is bonded to a dead blade they are precluded from being able to attract/bond a spren. We have an example with Elhokar that it does not. Obviously once they do the spren is going to want them to give it up but I am missing the proof that it prevents attracting a spren. 

Edited by StormingTexan
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1 hour ago, StormingTexan said:

Elhokar had a dead shardblade and attracted a spren to bond with him. Maybe I am missing something because I am not sure where this assumption that if someone is bonded to a dead blade they are precluded from being able to attract/bond a spren. We have an example with Elhokar that it does not. Obviously once they do the spren is going to want them to give it up but I am missing the proof that it prevents attracting a spren. 

Probably from this WoB: https://wob.coppermind.net/events/77-shadows-of-self-lansing-signing/#e6592

Quote

Questioner

With Adolin you say there that he feels a connection to his sword. And all the other Shardbearers, when they touch a Shardblade they get the screaming in their ears. Does that mean he’s not going to be a Radiant.

Brandon Sanderson

It means he's- number one he's not on the path to being a Radiant, that's the main thing that means.

 

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