i’m in the details Posted November 3, 2017 Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 So it just occurred to me that in the original trilogy crazy people or people who are not fully sane were described as having cracked spirit webs just like spiked individuals. So my question is can a particularly powerful soother, or a duralumin bursted soother control insane people? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted November 3, 2017 Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 44 minutes ago, i’m in the details said: So it just occurred to me that in the original trilogy crazy people or people who are not fully sane were described as having cracked spirit webs just like spiked individuals. So my question is can a particularly powerful soother, or a duralumin bursted soother control insane people? No, this can't happen. Mind Control in the Cosmere requires to use a "backdoor" to the guy, Hemalurgy provides this backdoor if the guy is spiked enough but by default a being could not control someone only because he is broken. As example, notice how even a Shard can't directly control someone without Spikes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i’m in the details Posted November 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 2 hours ago, Yata said: No, this can't happen. Mind Control in the Cosmere requires to use a "backdoor" to the guy, Hemalurgy provides this backdoor if the guy is spiked enough but by default a being could not control someone only because he is broken. As example, notice how even a Shard can't directly control someone without Spikes. But I distinctly remember Kelsier in ghost-esk form being able to affect the crazy man he finds in the hotel. Without a spike. I’m fairly certain it states that the man has a cracked spirit web...but if you’re right than what made kelsier able to affect him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amflare Posted November 3, 2017 Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 There is a difference between influence and command. Vin can command the Koloss and they have to obey (i.e. Human saying he wanted to kill her but couldn't). Anything not spiked can only be influenced (i.e. Kelsier having to spend a couple days convincing the insane guy to do what he wanted). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted November 4, 2017 Report Share Posted November 4, 2017 18 hours ago, i’m in the details said: But I distinctly remember Kelsier in ghost-esk form being able to affect the crazy man he finds in the hotel. Without a spike. I’m fairly certain it states that the man has a cracked spirit web...but if you’re right than what made kelsier able to affect him? As @amflare said in the previous post, influence is a thing and by the way it's just comunication and another is control. The Mind control in the Cosmere is extremely hard to obtain, I believe we have only two instances (one in Mistborn and the other in Stormlight Archive) because the prerequisites required. There is a WoB about, that explain better the "backdoor" need but you could find an explicit in-book example in SoS's ending and others in BoM. I will avoid to write the specific events because I don't know if you read them, but it's fairly implied that a being without the right number of spike can't be controlled even by Shards (by the way also the first Mistborn's trilogy is a good example of this, but less explicit) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowwisp Posted November 4, 2017 Report Share Posted November 4, 2017 The real question is if a Kandra or significantly spiked person can still be controlled with a strong Soother/Rioter when they are wearing an aluminum lined hat. Bands of Mourning Spoilers: Spoiler It probably wouldn't work as a defense against the Ruin Shard otherwise the Set would have tried it but then again that's a very dangerous thing to test out. If Harmony could, he wouldn't make it obvious that he could until the right moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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