Quick Fix Game 27: Lord of the Lynches: Terror in Minas Tirith

[Sparkrunner]

1 hour ago, Steeldancer said:

I don't feel like lynching him yet, because how would he have learned to not make slightly unguarded comments?

Unguarded, thoughtless comments are my play style. 

18 hours ago, Alvron said:

Flip-flap-flopping fish.  Black trees and thistles.

Inquiry. Methodology. I think, therefore I am.

Alv is speaking in code, I just haven't cracked it yet.

5 hours ago, randuir said:

I haven't got much on roadwalker, but if Orlok proves to be evil, he's one of the first I'd look at, because of this post:

18 hours ago, Roadwalker said:

Oh my. Not good. And for Mestiv's second comment, I remember hearing about wilson getting a two year streak where she was killed only because she was experienced, correct?

I might be wrong, but this post almost feels like it's meant to go with mestiv's to promote the idea that the attack on Orlok was because he was village. This is only really suspicious if we go with my tinfoil that the attack on Orlok was a WGG, which is not certain at all, but definitely a possibility.

 

I meant that as more of a comment to Mestiv, though I can't really defend that position.  Oh well.

I think that Manukos being a jester is entirely possible, given the secret roles, however he could be playing off of the leftover Paranoia from El's QF... I am not voting for now, but if I will vote it will probably be on Manukos or Asterion for jumping right in there and going "Oh, he can't be a jester, ha-ha!"

Maybe Alv's talking funny is part of his role...

[Doc12]

 

Quote

I think I have overused my "new kid" card, as has Lemonelon, which gives some suspicion on my part to Lemon, and to you Doc, and anyone else who mentions Lemon's "Inexperience." 

Can I just say that you're all new to me? I've been away for so long I don't know who the experienced new kids are.

15 hours ago, Manukos said:

i am an eliminator !  HOW GOOD AN EYE DO YOU HAVE ?

This post annoys me, as really, it does nothing but promote confusion if you're village, and an silly one if you're an eliminator. Or perhaps you're drawing on the fear that you might be a jester to keep you alive. There are no known jester roles, and no known roles that would turn a lynch on you against us, so either you have a secret role, or you hold an item such as Pipe weed or the One ring (If Straw is to be believed). Either way, I certainly believe you're worth lynching to call your bluff. 

7 hours ago, randuir said:

Just FYI, 'Guardsman' is an ability that Mordor could have as well. If they do, it would allow them to do something called a Wounded Gazelle Gambit, in which they both attack and protect one of their own to make him look good. I'm not saying that is what has happened here, as protecting Orlok seems like a very reasonable thing to do, as is attacking him if he's village, but I don't think we should consider him 100% cleared for now.

Wilson's WGG in AG3 has completely broken my trust in situations like this. I definitely am not crossing off Orlok from the list, nor those who would defend him. 

17 hours ago, Roadwalker said:

Oh my. Not good. And for Mestiv's second comment, I remember hearing about wilson getting a two year streak where she was killed only because she was experienced, correct?

It is, it was, and infinity is frogs. Manukos: Don't look at the spoiler.

  Reveal hidden contents

There is only one escape.

 

@Roadwalker, you acknowledged my point in the last cycle that you were not actually saying anything of relevance to the game, and you agreed you have overused this 'new kid' card. Sadly, I do not see anything changing with this cycle, with OOG speculations and more speculations on Isengard based on tags. Again, while speculations are well and good, I have the suspicion that your ramblings might be an attempt to distract us from the fact that you have nothing much to say, or simply to promote discussion on other aspects such as Isengard on which we have nothing to go on. If you really are trying to stop being a new kid, you'll know you have to do better. 

From this cycle, then, my suspicions fall on Roadwalker and Manukos.

There is also a vote on Steeldancer by Alv and Orlok. I have yet to make sense of Alv's ramblings, but I'm beginning to see that his ramblings might not be as random as they first seem. Sadly, I am still unable to find the meaning in them. Orlok, on the other hand gave reasons very similar to why I am targeting Roadwalker. 

@Orlok Tsubodai Could you state your opinion on Roadwalker, and perhaps why you think that Alv's decision to vote on Steeldancer is one worthy of joining?

For now, I am willing to try and get Manukos lynched, but if there is a compelling argument to investigate further into Steeldancer, I will change my vote. 

---

The Steward, dead. Struck by the hand of the Valar, they say. 

Ninor snorted at that. The Steward had likely died from sitting all day on the step and doing nothing at all. What did the Vala care for the affairs of men? Men who ran, men who did nothing as their world collapsed around them. 

A burning building, crunching wood. A man saved from deadly flame.

No. Yes. That. that had been courage. The courage of a simple guardsman, running into the fire when he, an elf with far superior physical advantages, had done nothing. 

He could have. He didn't. 

And now he was shamed.

Surely that one man did not represent all the men of Numenor. No, they were more in kin to the steward who had fallen over - falling without a sound, without making any impact to the world whatsoever. Yes. Numenor was the steward, decaying, dying meekly to the empty silence. 

He would have been content with that, except for the continued nagging of his conscience.

Does one fat steward represent all of Man, then, when the courageous guardsman could not?

Shadows take that logic. He could not deceive himself, not even if he wished to. Must he who had no need for doubt now begin to doubt? 

What was he to think of men now? What was he to condemn them all to hopelessness?

He, an elf, one who would gladly quit this land for another fairer one, who was he now to judge those who had to remain, those who would still raise their swords in defiance of the shadow?

What was this courage, that shamed him so? 

[Sparkrunner]

2 minutes ago, Doc12 said:

@Roadwalker, you acknowledged my point in the last cycle that you were not actually saying anything of relevance to the game, and you agreed you have overused this 'new kid' card. Sadly, I do not see anything changing with this cycle, with OOG < What does this mean? speculations and more speculations on Isengard based on tags. I felt it needed to be brought up. Len wouldn't give me a straight answer about it in the GM PM. Again, while speculations are well and good, I have the suspicion that your ramblings might be an attempt to distract us from the fact that you have nothing much to say, What am I to say? I have said my piece on Manukos, which seems to be the major discussion topic for this cycle. Do you want me to write up an analysis on someone? or simply to promote discussion on other aspects such as Isengard on which we have nothing to go on. We aren't going to get anything to go on if we don't bring it to the table. If you really are trying to stop being a new kid, you'll know you have to do better. :|

 

[manukos]

Ok i 've gotten enough , it'd be unreasonable to keep this going any further tho i hoped that you caught the hint 
Hmm perhaps my encryptions might have been too good 

So we were at a point with too few info, so as Sylvester from twig once said: when the box is too static atempt to act  in an unexpected direction to catch people Off guard and check for reactions . i never expected for it to work on smn like orloc senpai or randuir  but i did expect a new player to come after me.  
Risk of the ploy would be that it might cause confusion but i dont think it did that , 
Regarding my vote i think steeldancer is the most lekely one  even thogh i am not fully convinced 
You can chose to lynch me for this and i'd be fine with that , but i found it nessecary to do something that could give us more/any info and i thought it outweighed the risk of shuting conversation about the  breadcrums of info that we had . also just so that we are clear i am not an elim 

YOU ARE NOT LOOKING HARD ENOUGH , THERE IS ALWAYS AN OTHER SECRET 

Edited October 7, 2017 by Manukos

[Jondesu]

Ok, from what I’m seeing, a lot of ya’ll think Manukos has a jester-type role. If so, voting on him is a horrible idea! If you think he’s just trying to make us think he’s a jester, sure, vote on him, but if you genuinely believe it, vote for someone else. You’ll most likely die if he truly is a jester.

Rand, sorry I haven’t had a lot to say. I haven’t been getting a good feel for anyone because of the seemingly random comments.

[Straw]

@Manukos, it seems like you're just trying to sow confusion within the village. If you are not an Eliminator/Jester, please stop. Right now, my main goal is to figure out the use of the One Ring. I'm trying to decide between the following options on its use in the game mechanics:

1. It's just a item, with no secret effects.

2. It is part of a player/faction's win condition.

3. It triggers some sort of effect that has not affected me yet.

4. It's triggered by some sort of in game event.

As to Alvron's ramblings, I believe that it's just an interesting play style experiment, so I have no problem with Alv having a bit of fun. As to Orlok, I do not believe that he is part of a WGG. Interestingly, I have noticed that WGGs are extremely rare, so unless Orlok exhibits Eliminator indicative behavior, I would not wish to lynch him. Also, I would recommend that nobles not use their kill, and that they should try to keep their alignments hidden, so the eliminators cannot get an extra kill.

[Mestiv]

I don't have much time, but I'll try to explain why I'm suspicious of Alvron. By being active and not saying anything with a meaning he kind of hides in plain sight. He's active, but not saying anything that would make people suspect him. He's not trying to manipulate anyone's opinion. I made a mistake of being too expressive, he's hiding behind nonsense. 

Also, it's irritating me

 

EDIT: What is jester role?

[manukos]

12 minutes ago, Mestiv said:

What is jester role?

there is a role archetype called jester , basicaly they want to be lynched to win and usualy have some other effect like kill someone who voted you or something 
 i am not one though , as to the confusion caused i am sorry @Straw even if i dont think it was that impactful, as for the ring i dont think it is an event trigger , perhaps it could be a win con for something like a hobbit but i dont think it is anything more than what it stated , also, for the record i dont have it 

[Sony]

Hey, sorry I’m a little late, but here’s my thoughts on a couple of things.

Alvron:

I don’t see much talk on this, but is it possible that he’s being forced to talk like this? It seems possible to me that there’s an item that could have corrupted him in some way and makes him talk like this (I’m going to list some potential items at the end of this post.)  

12 hours ago, Alvron said:

A snowflake will lie.  On a hook.  A hook!  In the weeds.  With no hat!

Man and yet not man.  Black trees and thistles.  Twigeye.  Become fire.

I’d argue that “Man and yet not man,’ is Alv’s way of saying that he believes that Steeldancer is an eliminator or part of some third faction (While I don’t think that there is a third faction in this game, there is a chance that there is one.)

I’d also like to point out that it could be just his playstyle. Maybe some of the more experienced players could comment on that, since this is only my first game playing with him.

Manukos:

It does seem odd that you just caused distraction and confusion, but I did smile at your little encryption within the text.

1 hour ago, Manukos said:

Ok i 've gotten enough , it'd be unreasonable to keep this going any further tho i hoped that you caught the hint 
Hmm perhaps my encryptions might have been too good 

So we were at a point with too few info , so as Sylvester from twig once said  : when the box is too static atempt to  act  in an unexpected direction to catch people Off guard and check for reactions . i never expected for it to work on smn like orloc senpai or randuir  but i did expect a new player to come after me.  
Risk of the ploy would be that it might cause confusion but i dont think it did that , 
Regarding my vote i think steeldancer is the most lekely one  even thogh i am not fully convinced 
You can chose to lynch me for this and i'd be fine with that , but i found it nessecary to do something that could give us more/any info and i thought it outweighed the risk of shuting conversation about the  breadcrums of info that we had . also just so that we are clear i am not an elim 

YOU ARE NOT LOOKING HARD ENOUGH , THERE IS ALWAYS AN OTHER SECRET 

I would like to point out here that saying that you’re not an eliminator doesn't mean that you're not an eliminator. It sort of makes you more suspicious in my eyes.

Roadwalker:

1 hour ago, Roadwalker said:

Unguarded, thoughtless comments are my play style. 

Inquiry. Methodology. I think, therefore I am.

Alv is speaking in code, I just haven't cracked it yet.

I meant that as more of a comment to Mestiv, though I can't really defend that position.  Oh well.

I think that Manukos being a jester is entirely possible, given the secret roles, however he could be playing off of the leftover Paranoia from El's QF... I am not voting for now, but if I will vote it will probably be on Manukos or Asterion for jumping right in there and going "Oh, he can't be a jester, ha-ha!"

Maybe Alv's talking funny is part of his role...

 

1 hour ago, Roadwalker said:

Maybe Alv's talking funny is part of his role...

You mention secret roles; however, I have seen no indication of secret roles in this game. Can you explain what you mean by this? Also, while I do agree with you there is a possibility that he's talking like this due to his role or an item, why did you make this text invisible? 

I am leaning towards either lynching Roadwalker or Manukos right now, albeit that these are only minor suspicions. Roadwalker since that they said there are secret roles, but I haven’t seen any indication of that. Although, I honestly could have just missed something. Manukos since he just caused a distraction and confusion, and he said that he isn't an eliminator (which I feel like an eliminator would say.) Those are all my thoughts right now, but hopefully I’ll be able to comment more throughout the day before the cycle ends.

 

Possible items list:

Evenstar - The necklace Arwen gives Aragorn. Although this seems more like a “Lovers” type of item, Elenion could have set it up where the Elven magic within the necklace could protect a person from being attacked (I.e in Orlok’s case, although I do admit that is a stretch.)

 

Narya - Gandalf’s ring. From what I’ve looked up about this ring, it seems like it can shield the wielder from “prying eyes.” From that use of the ring, it could make the person invisible from the Lieutenant of Mordor scan and/or the Palantir of Minas Tirith (Although, that can’t be used anymore.)

 

Andúril - The sword used by Aragorn. From what I remember, this sword made the people who lived in the mountains whom Aragorn’s ancestors betrayed fight for Gondor. My guess is that this item would be used to either bring someone back from the dead (far-fetched theory) or just as a one-time use to protect them.

 

There are a bunch of other famous items in LotR (There are soooo many rings) but those are just three items that I think could be in the game.

[Steeldancer]

I'm still not sure what I did to earn scrutiny. 

Encription is annoying. 

So, manukos was trying to draw out eliminators. To be frank, that is an awful way to draw out eliminators. I'm soldifying my vote on manukos, unless something comes up I'll be keeping my vote on him. 

Speculating on a WGG is going to get us nowhere. The only way to find out is to kill Orlok, which I don't think is a good idea. 

If you decide to lynch me, whatever. Now if I could just come up with something meaningful to write after I die... yes I'm claiming Scribe. Frankly I can tell you now what I think: I'm suspicious of Manukos. 

[asterion137]

2 hours ago, Manukos said:

Ok i 've gotten enough , it'd be unreasonable to keep this going any further tho i hoped that you caught the hint 
Hmm perhaps my encryptions might have been too good 

So we were at a point with too few info , so as Sylvester from twig once said  : when the box is too static atempt to  act  in an unexpected direction to catch people Off guard and check for reactions . i never expected for it to work on smn like orloc senpai or randuir  but i did expect a new player to come after me.  
Risk of the ploy would be that it might cause confusion but i dont think it did that , 

lol wut

Manukos I guess

[Orlok Tsubodai]

2 hours ago, Doc12 said:

There is also a vote on Steeldancer by Alv and Orlok. I have yet to make sense of Alv's ramblings, but I'm beginning to see that his ramblings might not be as random as they first seem. Sadly, I am still unable to find the meaning in them. Orlok, on the other hand gave reasons very similar to why I am targeting Roadwalker. 

@Orlok Tsubodai Could you state your opinion on Roadwalker, and perhaps why you think that Alv's decision to vote on Steeldancer is one worthy of joining?

For now, I am willing to try and get Manukos lynched, but if there is a compelling argument to investigate further into Steeldancer, I will change my vote. 

@Doc12, Alv's posts mostly express sentiment, rather than meaning, at least to me. Steeldancer being an Ent, and Alv talking of black branches and black brambles gives me a sense that he's expressing an opinion of Steeldancer being evil, for instance. From my own perspective, I am (clearly) not voting on Steeldancer for the same reasons as Alv. I don't know why Alv thinks Steeldancer is evil. I think that Steeldancer hasn't contributed anything of note, has been inconsistent in his position on Alv, and I think he's posting fluff that makes it seem like he's contributing without actually doing so. Unlike Mestiv's position, I think Roadwalker has the experience to know better.

2 hours ago, Manukos said:

Ok i 've gotten enough , it'd be unreasonable to keep this going any further tho i hoped that you caught the hint 
Hmm perhaps my encryptions might have been too good 

So we were at a point with too few info , so as Sylvester from twig once said  : when the box is too static atempt to  act  in an unexpected direction to catch people Off guard and check for reactions . i never expected for it to work on smn like orloc senpai or randuir  but i did expect a new player to come after me.  
Risk of the ploy would be that it might cause confusion but i dont think it did that , 
Regarding my vote i think steeldancer is the most lekely one  even thogh i am not fully convinced 
You can chose to lynch me for this and i'd be fine with that , but i found it nessecary to do something that could give us more/any info and i thought it outweighed the risk of shuting conversation about the  breadcrums of info that we had . also just so that we are clear i am not an elim 
YOU ARE NOT LOOKING HARD ENOUGH , THERE IS ALWAYS AN OTHER SECRET

@Manukos, would you explain why you're voting for Steeldancer? What convinced you to vote on him beyond bandwagoning on the votes from Alv and I?

Frankly, I don't think Manukos' ploy makes sense for an eliminator. I think it has brought an immense amount of scrutiny down on him, and don't think the confusion advantages for eliminator!Manukos. Indeed, the reactions of players to his ploy has generated information, and I don't think eliminator teams want to increase available information, given it increases the accuracy of lynches.

 

1 hour ago, Sony said:

Hey, sorry I’m a little late, but here’s my thoughts on a couple of things.

Alvron:

I don’t see much talk on this, but is it possible that he’s being forced to talk like this? It seems possible to me that there’s an item that could have corrupted him in some way and makes him talk like this (I’m going to list some potential items at the end of this post.)  

I’d argue that “Man and yet not man,’ is Alv’s way of saying that he believes that Steeldancer is an eliminator or part of some third faction (While I don’t think that there is a third faction in this game, there is a chance that there is one.)

I’d also like to point out that it could be just his playstyle. Maybe some of the more experienced players could comment on that, since this is only my first game playing with him.

Manukos:

It does seem odd that you just caused distraction and confusion, but I did smile at your little encryption within the text.

I would like to point out here that saying that you’re not an eliminator doesn't mean that you're not an eliminator. It sort of makes you more suspicious in my eyes.

Roadwalker:

 

You mention secret roles; however, I have seen no indication of secret roles in this game. Can you explain what you mean by this? Also, while I do agree with you there is a possibility that he's talking like this due to his role or an item, why did you make this text invisible? 

I am leaning towards either lynching Roadwalker or Manukos right now, albeit that these are only minor suspicions. Roadwalker since that they said there are secret roles, but I haven’t seen any indication of that. Although, I honestly could have just missed something. Manukos since he just caused a distraction and confusion, and he said that he isn't an eliminator (which I feel like an eliminator would say.) Those are all my thoughts right now, but hopefully I’ll be able to comment more throughout the day before the cycle ends.

@Sony, I agree on your reading of Alv's post. This particular manifestation of Alv's playstyle is new, but I'm reading it as normal, given he typically plays games trying to make himself deliberately hard to read, regardless of his alignment. I think he's looking for those who attack him as an easy target, those who ignore him, knowing he's not evil, and that he's just having fun. 

I don't see your reasoning for being suspicious of Roadwalker from that which you've posted. Would you mind setting that out? 

As I said above, I'm of the view that Manukos' actions are more likely to come from a villager than an eliminator. I don't think he was expecting anyone to take him at his word when he said he wasn't an eliminator, but that he was just clarifying his earlier ploy, which involved claiming that he was an eliminator.

[Orlok Tsubodai]

52 minutes ago, Steeldancer said:

I'm still not sure what I did to earn scrutiny. 

Encription is annoying. 

So, manukos was trying to draw out eliminators. To be frank, that is an awful way to draw out eliminators. I'm soldifying my vote on manukos, unless something comes up I'll be keeping my vote on him. 

Speculating on a WGG is going to get us nowhere. The only way to find out is to kill Orlok, which I don't think is a good idea. 

If you decide to lynch me, whatever. Now if I could just come up with something meaningful to write after I die... yes I'm claiming Scribe. Frankly I can tell you now what I think: I'm suspicious of Manukos. 

@Steeldancer, it's not important whether or not Manukos' strategy was effective. What is important, and alignment indicative, is the mindset that produced his strategy. Why do you think eliminator Manukos would pursue this strategy?

 

Edit: My apologies for the double post. I had technical issues editing a new quote into my previous post.

Edited October 7, 2017 by Orlok Tsubodai

[Steeldancer]

15 minutes ago, Orlok Tsubodai said:

@Doc12, Alv's posts mostly express sentiment, rather than meaning, at least to me. Steeldancer being an Ent, and Alv talking of black branches and black brambles gives me a sense that he's expressing an opinion of Steeldancer being evil, for instance. From my own perspective, I am (clearly) not voting on Steeldancer for the same reasons as Alv. I don't know why Alv thinks Steeldancer is evil. I think that Steeldancer hasn't contributed anything of note, has been inconsistent in his position on Alv, and I think he's posting fluff that makes it seem like he's contributing without actually doing so. Unlike Mestiv's position, I think Roadwalker has the experience to know better.

@Manukos, would you explain why you're voting for Steeldancer? What convinced you to vote on him beyond bandwagoning on the votes from Alv and I?

Frankly, I don't think Manukos' ploy makes sense for an eliminator. I think it has brought an immense amount of scrutiny down on him, and don't think the confusion advantages for eliminator!Manukos. Indeed, the reactions of players to his ploy has generated information, and I don't think eliminator teams want to increase available information, given it increases the accuracy of lynches.

 

@Sony, I agree on your reading of Alv's post. This particular manifestation of Alv's playstyle is new, but I'm reading it as normal, given he typically plays games trying to make himself deliberately hard to read, regardless of his alignment. I think he's looking for those who attack him as an easy target, those who ignore him, knowing he's not evil, and that he's just having fun. 

I don't see your reasoning for being suspicious of Roadwalker from that which you've posted. Would you mind setting that out? 

As I said above, I'm of the view that Manukos' actions are more likely to come from a villager than an eliminator. I don't think he was expecting anyone to take him at his word when he said he wasn't an eliminator, but that he was just clarifying his earlier ploy, which involved claiming that he was an eliminator.

Ok... that actually makes sense. Hm. Ok. @Alvron would you please elaborate upon your suspicions of me? 

 

15 minutes ago, Orlok Tsubodai said:

@Steeldancer, it's not important whether or not Manukos' strategy was effective. What is important, and alignment indicative, is the mindset that produced his strategy. Why do you think eliminator Manukos would pursue this strategy?

 

Edit: My apologies for the double post. I had technical issues editing a new quote into my previous post.

Ok. I admit I haven't actually said much of substance. This might have something to do with the fact that I'm working with so little information that I'm not sure who to accuse. 

As for manukos, his ploy works on two premises. First, it creates confusion in the village. Second, it seems so weird that it almost clears him. 

Admittedly, if I were an elim, that is NOT the ploy I would use. It could work, but it's just so... aggressive. 

Now I am not going to be on for the remainder of the cycle, because I have work. I will have a 15 minute break, and if you lynch me, I'll try to give some opinions in my 100 character scribe thing. That being said, I would prefer if you didn't lynch me. It's been a while since I survived a true lynching game. 

[Orlok Tsubodai]

1 minute ago, Steeldancer said:

Ok... that actually makes sense. Hm. Ok. @Alvron would you please elaborate upon your suspicions of me? 

 

Ok. I admit I haven't actually said much of substance. This might have something to do with the fact that I'm working with so little information that I'm not sure who to accuse. 

As for manukos, his ploy works on two premises. First, it creates confusion in the village. Second, it seems so weird that it almost clears him. 

Admittedly, if I were an elim, that is NOT the ploy I would use. It could work, but it's just so... aggressive. 

Now I am not going to be on for the remainder of the cycle, because I have work. I will have a 15 minute break, and if you lynch me, I'll try to give some opinions in my 100 character scribe thing. That being said, I would prefer if you didn't lynch me. It's been a while since I survived a true lynching game. 

So, if you don't think it's a ploy you'd use as an eliminator, why do you think Manukos is using it as an eliminator? THat strikes me as contradictory. Why keep your vote on someone you think is "almost cleared", and who is pursuing a strategy you think is too aggressive for an eliminator to consider?

[Megasif]

Just dropping in for my daily comment. 

Looks like everything is under control so far. After reading through, the one thing that stood out to me was Jondesu's comment. From randuir's post and a quick scan of the this cycle, I believe Jondesu hasn't been very active and that's Jondesu's first comment this cycle.  And it's in defense of Manukos. If he's not very active, I find it strange that his first comment is something like this. 

Now this reading could be totally off and Jondesu is sincere in trying to help us make the right decision about voting. I, however, feel that it's just a really safe topic to talk about without having much repercussions, especially in the case of Manukos being village or jester, making Jondesu appear very villagery. 

[Steeldancer]

20 minutes ago, Orlok Tsubodai said:

So, if you don't think it's a ploy you'd use as an eliminator, why do you think Manukos is using it as an eliminator? THat strikes me as contradictory. Why keep your vote on someone you think is "almost cleared", and who is pursuing a strategy you think is too aggressive for an eliminator to consider?

*sigh* 

1. It's a ploy I wouldn't use as an eliminator. There's nothing stopping someone else from doing so. 

2. I'm saying not that he's cleared. I'm saying other might think he's cleared for making such a comment. But saying "I'M AN ELIMINATOR"  probably shouldn't be used as a way to clear someone. And I'm thinking it's basically a double bluff. 

If I thought he was cleared, then I would not be voting on him. I'm saying it doesn't clear him. 

18 minutes ago, Megasif said:

Just dropping in for my daily comment. 

Looks like everything is under control so far. After reading through, the one thing that stood out to me was Jondesu's comment. From randuir's post and a quick scan of the this cycle, I believe Jondesu hasn't been very active and that's Jondesu's first comment this cycle.  And it's in defense of Manukos. If he's not very active, I find it strange that his first comment is something like this. 

Now this reading could be totally off and Jondesu is sincere in trying to help us make the right decision about voting. I, however, feel that it's just a really safe topic to talk about without having much repercussions, especially in the case of Manukos being village or jester, making Jondesu appear very villagery. 

Good point, megasif. I didn't notice that... 

Edit: ok one last thing before I start working. This sort of thing has happened before, where I get randomly accused, and I get over defensive, and I promptly get lynched. And im village. This happened in El's quick fix. And probably some other games. I don't think I'm over reacting this time, but if rhats why you're voting on me, please take a look at that. 

Edited October 7, 2017 by Steeldancer

[Sony]

@Orlok Tsubodai It seemed to me that they mentioned the existence of secret roles as if they knew it was part of the game. From my understanding, secret roles are roles that we don't know about before the game starts. So, from what I've seen, there hasn't been any evidence of secret roles besides the speculation that there is a jester role. It just seems like they have information on secret roles that they're hiding. Plus, they made their last comment on Alv invisible unless you highlight it. It just seemed a little suspicious to me. 

[Orlok Tsubodai]

25 minutes ago, Megasif said:

Just dropping in for my daily comment. 

Looks like everything is under control so far. After reading through, the one thing that stood out to me was Jondesu's comment. From randuir's post and a quick scan of the this cycle, I believe Jondesu hasn't been very active and that's Jondesu's first comment this cycle.  And it's in defense of Manukos. If he's not very active, I find it strange that his first comment is something like this. 

Now this reading could be totally off and Jondesu is sincere in trying to help us make the right decision about voting. I, however, feel that it's just a really safe topic to talk about without having much repercussions, especially in the case of Manukos being village or jester, making Jondesu appear very villagery. 

@Megasif, would you care to add your own thoughts on the rest of the lynch? I do appreciate your own thoughts on Randuir, as it is alignment indicative, but not engaging in the rest of the thread because other players are generating discussion doesn't help ongoing discussion. What are your thoughts on Alv, Steeldancer, Manukos, Roadwalker, and Randuir?

20 minutes ago, Steeldancer said:

*sigh* 

1. It's a ploy I wouldn't use as an eliminator. There's nothing stopping someone else from doing so. 

2. I'm saying not that he's cleared. I'm saying other might think he's cleared for making such a comment. But saying "I'M AN ELIMINATOR"  probably shouldn't be used as a way to clear someone. And I'm thinking it's basically a double bluff. 

If I thought he was cleared, then I would not be voting on him. I'm saying it doesn't clear him. 

Good point, megasif. I didn't notice that... 

Sure. I presume you consider yourself rational. Why are you not considering Manukos similarly rational? If something wouldn't be a sensible strategy for you, as a player with some experience, it's probably a strategy other players with some experience will also consider not terribly sensible.

I'm not arguing that he should be cleared, merely questioning your own rationale for voting.

4 minutes ago, Sony said:

@Orlok Tsubodai It seemed to me that they mentioned the existence of secret roles as if they knew it was part of the game. From my understanding, secret roles are roles that we don't know about before the game starts. So, from what I've seen, there hasn't been any evidence of secret roles besides the speculation that there is a jester role. It just seems like they have information on secret roles that they're hiding. Plus, they made their last comment on Alv invisible unless you highlight it. It just seemed a little suspicious to me. 

Interesting. I hadn't read his post in that sense. I think it could be a typo of secret rules (which have been confirmed, given the Ring), or it could be an assumption that given secret items exist, secret roles must also exist. Why do you think possession of a secret role is necessarily something that warrants a vote, though? A secret role doesn't mean that he must have an evil alignment, although I suppose it might be more indicative of a serial killer type role.

[DeTess]

15 minutes ago, Sony said:

@Orlok Tsubodai It seemed to me that they mentioned the existence of secret roles as if they knew it was part of the game. From my understanding, secret roles are roles that we don't know about before the game starts. So, from what I've seen, there hasn't been any evidence of secret roles besides the speculation that there is a jester role. It just seems like they have information on secret roles that they're hiding. Plus, they made their last comment on Alv invisible unless you highlight it. It just seemed a little suspicious to me. 

The existence of secret factions/roles/whatever is a bit of an open secret, given that elenion very clearly called the rules section in the rules "Known Roles". That is not guarantee there actually are any, but it does make you wonder. I don't think there's a 'Jester' type role though, because part of the fun and difficulty of the Jester is that everyone knows there is a jester. If no one knows there is, it suddenly becomes quite easy to full-fill that particular win-con, while the general reaction from the players upon finding out is "How could we have done anything to stop this?", rather than "Well played", which is generally speaking a bad reaction.

Usually roles have counter-play. You know, 'wipe out all the elims to stop their killing' or 'have guards guess the target correctly'. For a jester, the counterplay would be 'Make sure someone isn't intentionally trying to get lynched', but that only works if we know that the jester is a role.

I'm going to take another read through the thread in a bit to see if I want to move my vote. I can't guarantee that I can make up my mind before the cycle is over, however, so this isn't a promise of another post.

Vote tally

Manukos(2): asterion, Steeldancer, Doc

Steeldancer(3): Alvron, Orlok, Manukos

Mestiv(1): Randuir

Alvron(1): Mestiv

Edited October 7, 2017 by randuir
grammar

[manukos]

 

40 minutes ago, Orlok Tsubodai said:

 

@Manukos, would you explain why you're voting for Steeldancer? What convinced you to vote on him beyond bandwagoning on the votes from Alv and I?

Frankly, I don't think Manukos' ploy makes sense for an eliminator. I think it has brought an immense amount of scrutiny down on him, and don't think the confusion advantages for eliminator!Manukos. Indeed, the reactions of players to his ploy has generated information, and I don't think eliminator teams want to increase available information, given it increases the accuracy of lynches.

 

i'd gladly do that senpai , 

basically after the ... thing two people voted on me , doc made an analitical  post for the day as a whole  that also  well established his views on why he felt suspicious of my post 
on the other hand steel dancer's only concern seemed to be that it was ilogical or smt like that  
my point is that while doc's posts seemed more general in nature , steeldancer's felt more targeted (i think i am translating idioms incorrectly :/ )
as for why one of them idk, perhaps  i want to belive i did something with my ploy , i am petty like that 

i would also like to say that i rly doubt there are secret roles , items perhaps but i dont get the feeling 

NO RLY YOU ARE NOT SEARCHING HARD ENOUGH!

[Orlok Tsubodai]

5 minutes ago, Manukos said:

basically after the ... thing two people voted on me , doc made an analitical  post for the day as a whole  that also  well established his views on why he felt suspicious of my post 
on the other hand steel dancer's only concern seemed to be that it was ilogical or smt like that  
my point is that while doc's posts seemed more general in nature , steeldancer's felt more targeted (i think i am translating idioms incorrectly :/ )
as for why one of them idk, perhaps  i want to belive i did something with my ploy , i am petty like that 

i would also like to say that i rly doubt there are secret roles , items perhaps but i dont get the feeling 

NO RLY YOU ARE NOT SEARCHING HARD ENOUGH!

Am I interpreting you correctly as saying that whilst you think Doc had reasons to vote for you, and addressed a number of players before coming to the conclusion that he should do so, Steeldancer seemed to promote you to consideration without considering other players too?

Your ploy certainly produced information, and you don't necessarily need to vote on one of the people who targeted you for it to have born fruit, but I do think a case exists for lynching Steeeldancer.

[BrightnessRadiant]

I was about to make a very lengthy post when I remembered I have a DnD game in 8 minutes xD ripppp

So, guess I'll get to that next cycle if I'm still around :P.

A few thoughts tho on the lynch targets:

1. Manukos' post just seemed to be trying to generate discussion..it may have been a bit confusing, but I don't see an elim trying that tactic as Orlok stated earlier

2. Steeldancer I've not gotten a lot of a read on but I feel like I wish I had more time to read through his posts (ack QF so fast!)

3. Mestiv hasn't said much and I don't have any idea about his playstyle xD

4. Alvron I never understand xD

I don't think I've spent enough time on this cycle to merit a vote...I'm sorry y'all..I was sick today and then forgot about my DnD session! I don't think I should vote without doing analysis first. I'll try and post more next cycle.

[Alvron]

5 hours ago, Orlok Tsubodai said:

@Alvron, uncertainty on Roadwalker, as well as suspicion on Steeldancer, or was this indicating suspicion of Roadwalker?

@Alvron, glad to see that you too caught the meaning. If you feel able to try to convey more specific sentiment, that would be useful. 

Flip-flap-flopping fish.  Ooo. Shiny.  Beetles don’t like people! No, no. No, no, no, no.

Wiggle-wiggle-wiggle-wiggle!  On a hook.  A hook!

4 hours ago, Doc12 said:

There is also a vote on Steeldancer by Alv and Orlok. I have yet to make sense of Alv's ramblings, but I'm beginning to see that his ramblings might not be as random as they first seem.

Tasty!  Tasty, tasty.

3 hours ago, Mestiv said:

Also, it's irritating me

Purple foxglove.  Skulls are happy.  They always smile.

2 hours ago, Sony said:

I’d argue that “Man and yet not man,’ is Alv’s way of saying that he believes that Steeldancer is an eliminator or part of some third faction (While I don’t think that there is a third faction in this game, there is a chance that there is one.)

Tasty!  Tasty.

1 hour ago, Orlok Tsubodai said:

@Doc12, Alv's posts mostly express sentiment, rather than meaning, at least to me. Steeldancer being an Ent, and Alv talking of black branches and black brambles gives me a sense that he's expressing an opinion of Steeldancer being evil, for instance.

Tasty.

56 minutes ago, Steeldancer said:

Ok... that actually makes sense. Hm. Ok. @Alvron would you please elaborate upon your suspicions of me? 

Flip-flap-flopping fish.  Two.  Then one … then none.

2 minutes ago, BrightnessRadiant said:

4. Alvron I never understand xD

A very fine carpet, sir.  Skip and dance!  Skip and dance!

[manukos]

9 minutes ago, Orlok Tsubodai said:

Am I interpreting you correctly as saying that whilst you think Doc had reasons to vote for you, and addressed a number of players before coming to the conclusion that he should do so, Steeldancer seemed to promote you to consideration without considering other players too?

Your ploy certainly produced information, and you don't necessarily need to vote on one of the people who targeted you for it to have born fruit, but I do think a case exists for lynching Steeeldancer.

yeah that basically , nah i am keeping my vote , plus i dont want to be open to last minuite votes