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Question on Harmony and the Set [Full Spoilers]


godam90

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So, I was rereading Mistborn Era 2 and was nearly finished with bands of mourning again when I thought of a question.

 

If Harmony can take control any being with more than 2 spikes, and the Set (Sequence and Suit) both spiked themselves multiple times to become Allomancers and Feruchemists - then why didnt Harmony simply take control, talk or give the Kandra the 411 on what was happening?

 

I know they said at the beginning of the novel that Harmony was being distant, but even at the beginning of Era 2 Book 2 when Harmony was openly talking with Wax, couldnt he have mentioned something?

 

And going further, it seems like the more people in the Set practice Hemalurgy, the worse it will get for them?

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First, did they have more then one spike? I don't remember....

But if you remember the end of BoM, you find out that the Set work somehow together with this Kandras with red eyes (whatever you might call them...).

Harmony obviously can't control them either. 

I think this has somehow to do with the spike of Bleeder, which we assume to be Trellium. We don't know for sure what exactly you can do with that, but Harmony couldn't even detect Bleeder, which he should be capable of doing, even if she has only one spike.

So, I guess we can't say for sure yet - but I think it has to be something regarding this metal

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There was a comment on this in Bands of Mourning. Suffice it to say, humans are not kandra. The limit on spikes seems to be different. I think the comment was that three spikes was pushing it; more risked Harmony taking control. 

EDIT: Found it. From Bands of Mourning, Chapter 27.

Quote

Suit: "The trouble with Hemalurgy is in its limitations (. . .) What's more, if you spike yourself too much, you become subject to Harmony's . . . interference (. . .) I am limited to three boons (. . .)"

 

Edited by Art
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32 minutes ago, Art said:

Suffice it to say, humans are not kandra. The limit on spikes seems to be different

This is correct. One of the kandra (TenSoon I think) mentioned 'we are weaker than other hemalurgic creatures. Two spikes are enough to control us'. Implies that other sapient species need to be spiked more than two times to be controlled by Harmony. 

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One thing I don't get is that Ruin was able to converse with Vin when she only had one spike and, I believe, Preservation was able to listen to people's thoughts when they had one spike. Sure, Harmony cannot control humans with less 4 spikes but why didn't he just eavesdrop on them?

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5 minutes ago, CaptainRyan said:

One thing I don't get is that Ruin was able to converse with Vin when she only had one spike and, I believe, Preservation was able to listen to people's thoughts when they had one spike. Sure, Harmony cannot control humans with less 4 spikes but why didn't he just eavesdrop on them?

Good question. Had a thought, but removed it. I'd need to re-read Shadows first.

Edited by Art
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4 minutes ago, CaptainRyan said:

One thing I don't get is that Ruin was able to converse with Vin when she only had one spike and, I believe, Preservation was able to listen to people's thoughts when they had one spike. Sure, Harmony cannot control humans with less 4 spikes but why didn't he just eavesdrop on them?

Ruin wasn't able to read minds period. He had to get people to speak out loud. They needed to either be mentally broken enough for him to speak to them or be spiked for him to be able to speak to them directly. 

Preservation is the opposite, and can hear into minds but not speak. 

Sazed, as holder of both Shards, has both abilities. 

Edit: As for listening to them, he probably did. He probably also spoke directly to them if he thought it worth his time. 

They seem rather set on what they want though, so considering his stance on freewill, he may not have bothered with that. 

Edited by Calderis
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3 minutes ago, Calderis said:

Ruin wasn't able to read minds period.

I didn't say Ruin could. I said he was able to converse with Vin. I am aware of his limitations.

My question is why Harmony doesn't just use his Preservation ability of listening to spiked people's thoughts and out the Set that way. Also, Harmony could speak directly to any spiked Set member - if Harmony chattered at you 24/7 for weeks on end you might agree to just give up haha.

Edited by CaptainRyan
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1 minute ago, CaptainRyan said:

I didn't say Ruin could. I said he was able to converse with Vin. I am aware of his limitations.

My questions is why Harmony doesn't just use his Preservation ability of listening to spiked people's thoughts and out the Set that way. Also, Harmony could speak directly to any spiked Set member - if Harmony chattered at you 24/7 for weeks on end you might agree to just give up haha.

I forget: Could Harmony listen to or speak to Bleeder? Or was he blind in that way to the foreign metal alloy?

Edited by Art
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4 minutes ago, Art said:

I forget: Could Harmony listen to or speak to Bleeder? Or was he blind in that way to the foreign metal alloy?

Honestly? I don't remember. I've only read Shadows of Self twice as I don't really enjoy it. Best guess is Harmony was able to talk to Bleeder but was unable to pinpoint her location thanks to Trellium. I could be wrong on this though.

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