Sirscott13 Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Speculation on the breath of everyone being the gaseous form of endowment similar to the mists being of preservation. Or at least the divine breath being of endowment. Seems to me it just fits what we know of godly physical representation. The mists weren't like any other form of weather and were used to empower and even fuel the art of allomancy. Similarly the breaths are different from a normal exhale inhale and have magical properties as the entire magic system is based off it. Could endowment have sacrificed it's gaseous physical half and "endowed" it upon the entire world of warbreaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 I am not sure if Breath counts as Endowment's power anymore. You get a new Breath when you're born, and I doubt that Endowment purposefully grants it. I agree that it's likely a gaseous form of Investiture, though, like Stormlight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocHoliday Posted February 27, 2014 Report Share Posted February 27, 2014 I am not sure if Breath counts as Endowment's power anymore. You get a new Breath when you're born, and I doubt that Endowment purposefully grants it. Why not? Every Scadrian is born with a bit of Preservation in them, and he never had to purposely grant it (aside from getting the ball rolling). Why couldn't Endowment do the same thing? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted February 27, 2014 Report Share Posted February 27, 2014 Why not? Every Scadrian is born with a bit of Preservation in them, and he never had to purposely grant it (aside from getting the ball rolling). Why couldn't Endowment do the same thing? Do you have a WoB on every Scadrian having a bit of Preservation inside of them? That would weaken Preservation every time someone was born, so I have issues with this interpretation. I think it's more that Preservation gave up a sort of 'seed' and the Investiture given up is 'of' Preservation but not really Preservation's Investiture anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocHoliday Posted February 28, 2014 Report Share Posted February 28, 2014 My quote-fu is weak, but yes there is a WoB concerning this. Mistborn and AoL spoilers. Preservation Invested more into Scadrians than Ruin to make them sentient. There is also a second WoB that Harmony is not in perfect balance, he has more Ruin in him and is doing something with that Investiture. They only thing that is not clear is wether or not its an initial seed cloning itself (unlikely I think as this would allow infinite Investiture), or a genetic trait that so siphons of more and more Investiture. I am a proponent of the latter. Odium is well known to never want to Invest. It's a slippery slope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted February 28, 2014 Report Share Posted February 28, 2014 (edited) I am not questioning whether Preservation Invested himself to make humans, I am questioning whether that Investiture is 'his' when in humans. If a human dies, and its Preservation's Investiture, that means Preservation would have become more powerful, from my understanding of things. I am doubtful of this proposition. Edited February 28, 2014 by Moogle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swimmingly Posted February 28, 2014 Report Share Posted February 28, 2014 By a miniscule amount compared to his total investiture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocHoliday Posted February 28, 2014 Report Share Posted February 28, 2014 I am not questioning whether Preservation Invested himself to make humans, I am questioning whether that Investiture is 'his' when in humans. If a human dies, and its Preservation's Investiture, that means Preservation would have become more powerful, from my understanding of things. I am doubtful of this proposition. I don't think that reasoning his water. Odium is intent on destroying Roshar specifically to reclaim all his Investiture. If he could just up and go, why does he sit around to Final Desolation the world? From Sel we know he doesn't care about other Shards minions. So I think it's fair to conclude the death of Roshar would return his Investment. Therefore when a human is born they get receive that Preservation Sentient Investiture, and when they die its returned. When a Returned returns, they receive a divine Breath. When they due or use said Breath, it is returned to Endowment. Makes sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted February 28, 2014 Report Share Posted February 28, 2014 (edited) Odium is intent on destroying Roshar specifically to reclaim all his Investiture. If he could just up and go, why does he sit around to Final Desolation the world? When a Returned returns, they receive a divine Breath. When they due or use said Breath, it is returned to Endowment. Way of Kings spoilers: Cultivation is still around. That's more than reason enough for Odium to stick around. I will grant that Odium will probably destroy Roshar to get his Investiture back, but that doesn't mean the Investiture is in humans; it could just be part of the planet itself. We don't really know what is involved with Investing a planet (I have theorized it supercharges the identity of the planet though). Odium wasn't around for the original creation of humans on Roshar, so at what point would they have received his Investiture? Was there a point where he just added it to every human alive, making the Thrill come about? Would it only have started adding his Investiture to newly born humans? As to the Returned, the Divine Breath is a special case. It is not Innate Investiture. I don't believe it is strong evidence either way. Edited February 28, 2014 by Moogle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocHoliday Posted March 1, 2014 Report Share Posted March 1, 2014 Way of Kings spoilers: Cultivation is still around. That's more than reason enough for Odium to stick around. I will grant that Odium will probably destroy Roshar to get his Investiture back, but that doesn't mean the Investiture is in humans; it could just be part of the planet itself. We don't really know what is involved with Investing a planet (I have theorized it supercharges the identity of the planet though). Odium wasn't around for the original creation of humans on Roshar, so at what point would they have received his Investiture? Was there a point where he just added it to every human alive, making the Thrill come about? Would it only have started adding his Investiture to newly born humans? As to the Returned, the Divine Breath is a special case. It is not Innate Investiture. I don't believe it is strong evidence either way. Fair enough points, we really just cannot be sure what he had Invested in on Roshar at this point. Although he was not present to Invest early in the humans we have precedent of Shardic meddling in genetics and Investiture post human creation. You also correct concerning the Divine Breath. I was asserting that the Investiture is returned post mortem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocHoliday Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 There also is a WoB apparently that all Investiture works like a water wheel in a river. Every time that Investiture (river) is tapped(wheel) it circles around and is returned to its original source (shard). I really can see no other way to interpret this as anything but evidence that the OP is correct, Breath may very well be the gaseous form of Endowment Investiture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swimmingly Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Under that model, wouldn't burning Atium actually return the power back to Ruin? That always baffled me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocHoliday Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Under that model, wouldn't burning Atium actually return the power back to Ruin? That always baffled me. I'm certain that it would return Ruin Investiture. TLR stored it for a purpose, an attempt ultimately to weaken the one he considered his true foe. Yes, he used it for his Compounding. What other choice did he have? He also used it to control the Houses. This was a poor decision I think. Considering how brutal be was with the Skaa, a little shock and awe with the nobles should have been a far easier route than economic policies. Look at Russia and Ukraine this very day. But in the end he was storing 9/10 of all the Atium in the world. This is a PERFECT indication that he was trying to siphon away Ruin's power. HoA spoilers: whenElend burned Atium with his army at the end, that Investiture was returned to Ruin. According to my theory. Human however roared in frustration when he found the Trust empty, IDK why. If the Koloss were searching for it in the first place to return it to Ruin, then the Ruin controlled Koloss should have been delighted. Perhaps it was due to the Koloss'inherent rage at the unexpected leaking through Ruin's control. Perhaps the Investiture was so minute in comparison to the total of Ruin that he didn't notice its return. I feel this may be worthy of quizzing BS on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Observer Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 I always got the impression that the investure Elend burned was trapped on Scadrial, with the power flow interrupted. Like, Preservation was slowly eating off bits of Ruin and pulling them out of the cycle, so they'd return to the Pits instead of back to the Shard. Ruin wanted to be able to directly absorb the Atium, and burning it all screwed him over. Less sensically, it could just be that once burned the stuff takes a small eternity to make the trip back around to Ruin, which would kind of open him up for attack, but that one seems a little less plausible to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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