Darkness

Supanova, Australia, June 2017

88 posts in this topic

27 minutes ago, Extesian said:

Thanks Darkness. That's the more logical option and I expect it's the case. It just occurred to me it could be a nice way to foreshadow and distract from a true magical component, that of Seeing a person's soul by touching them. But most likely it's future sight rather than spiritual sight. I'm still going to try to pay attention to who Renarin touches and when, just in case :)

Considering the way the Spiritual Realm functions, I think in Cosmere future sight is going to allow for spiritual sight whether directly or as a side effect. 

It has plenty of precedent 

From Wikipedia,

Quote

Psychometry (from Greek: ψυχή, psukhē, "spirit, soul" and μέτρον, metron, "measure"), also known as token-object reading, or psychoscopy, is a form of extrasensory perception characterized by the claimed ability to make relevant associations from an object of unknown history by making physical contact with that object.

 

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1 hour ago, Darkness said:

Brandon actually gave quite a long answer about this one (and maybe the original asked could clarify more), but the sense that I got was Renarin being uncomfortable touching people had to do more with a part of his specific autism-spectrum, and less due to anything magical going on. He was simply more comfortable with his brother than with strangers.

Also, can I just say that I find it highly appropriate that my reputation level right now is "silent gatherer"?

Oh I'd be really interested in hearing Brandon's long and detailed answer here. It did figure out Renarin wouldn't be comfortable touching people due to his autism, it is why I wondered why he touched Adolin so much. Even if he is his brother, it was odd to be he would spontaneously go towards physical contact, every single time, considering he is autistic. It is why I wondered if maybe he didn't have another reason for it. Arguably, it makes sense he just happens to be more comfortable with his brother, but things still don't add up well to me. If Renarin isn't doing anything to Adolin, then how come his injuries aren't slowing him down? And how why is Renairn behaving the way he does around his brother?

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1 hour ago, maxal said:

Oh I'd be really interested in hearing Brandon's long and detailed answer here. It did figure out Renarin wouldn't be comfortable touching people due to his autism, it is why I wondered why he touched Adolin so much. Even if he is his brother, it was odd to be he would spontaneously go towards physical contact, every single time, considering he is autistic. It is why I wondered if maybe he didn't have another reason for it. Arguably, it makes sense he just happens to be more comfortable with his brother, but things still don't add up well to me. If Renarin isn't doing anything to Adolin, then how come his injuries aren't slowing him down? And how why is Renairn behaving the way he does around his brother?

No it's not that odd, actually...

As someone with autistic siblings, I've found that they are a lot more willing to touch family (me, their sibling) than others. The relationship between Adolin and Renarin feels accurate to me. That is, it's quite well done and realistic, I've seen similar relationships between autistic and non-autistic siblings, too...So, based on my personal experience, I believe that it has little to do with stuff that isn't mundane...

This doesn't mean that their closeness/Renarin's willingness to touch Adolin isn't related to something else (like their childhood relationship/lack thereof with their dad...perhaps?), though... I think it is related to something that happened in their family in the past, but well, we'll just have to wait and see. xD

Edited by Kandra-in-disguise
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On 6/17/2017 at 10:29 PM, Extesian said:
Quote

A:The way I have written dragons in the Cosmere… ALL dragons are naturally functionally immortal. They can be killed, but they don’t age.

I feel like this is more solid confirmation than we previously had? Maybe not. But still confuses me when read next to the line in The Letter "Though, as you are now essentially immortal". Why only 'now'? Unless it refers to an inability for Frost to even be killed now, but as we know he's not a Shardholder, I remain confused.

There are a lot of things it could mean, but my thought on reading it was that perhaps people can become dragons, and Frost hasn't always been one. 

I'm not sure how this jives with the little we know about the three Yolish races, but Brandon has said recently that dragons can assume human form. Perhaps that interconversion is more than a mimic of shape?

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3 minutes ago, ccstat said:

There are a lot of things it could mean, but my thought on reading it was that perhaps people can become dragons, and Frost hasn't always been one. 

I'm not sure how this jives with the little we know about the three Yolish races, but Brandon has said recently that dragons can assume human form. Perhaps that interconversion is more than a mimic of shape?

That would be a nice way around it actually, I hadn't thought of it, but

Quote

Question

What do you want to know about Frost? Everything.

Brandon Sanderson

I’m not going to tell you everything about Frost. He’s still alive. He can be killed, he’s just functionally immortal, he just doesn’t age. He was born as one. It is a race.

 

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Huh. That's more than I thought we knew about Frost. Source and related quote for others who are interested.

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36 minutes ago, wlmkfi said:

Me and my brother were lucky enough to meet Brendan on Sunday and i didn't really prepare enough to ask a lot of questions and the line was busy at the time so I just asked 1.

Q: if i was holding Szeth's oathstone would he understand my commands?

A. good question, i don't believe anyone has asked it before. No, an oathstone doesn't have any magical properties whatsoever.

Wish i knew you could ask him a few more and if i knew how friendly the guy was i would of re-read the books and racked up heaps. I have only read the first few chapters of WOK recently and the nature of the oathstone interested me. Hope this helps :).

Oh that helps! He's been cagey about the Oathstone being magical (unless I've missed a WoB) and I really thought it was. It fitted with bonds so well. But finally getting an answer is awesome :) nice work!

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6 hours ago, wlmkfi said:

Q: If I was holding Szeth's Oathstone would he understand my commands?

A. Good question, I don't believe anyone has asked it before. No, an Oathstone doesn't have any magical properties whatsoever.

I actually have no idea what theories this answer will shatter, but have an upvote for getting another of Brandon's "maybe, maybe not" subjects pinned down.

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On 19.6.2017 at 1:06 PM, wlmkfi said:

Q: if i was holding Szeth's oathstone would he understand my commands?

A. good question, i don't believe anyone has asked it before. No, an oathstone doesn't have any magical properties whatsoever.

 

17 hours ago, The One Who Connects said:

I actually have no idea what theories this answer will shatter

Well, I had some thoughts on this, only an embryonic theory (gem inside a vein of the stone, etc...), nothing ripe yet. It's done now. Over. Out.

Edited by Pattern
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it shattered some of mine, that's for sure.

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On 6/17/2017 at 10:29 PM, Extesian said:
Quote

Q: Regarding a certain dragon mentioned in Stormlight Archive, and dragons in general in the Cosmere: is functional immortality a natural part of a dragon’s lifespan?

A: The way I have written dragons in the Cosmere… ALL dragons are naturally functionally immortal. They can be killed, but they don’t age.

I feel like this is more solid confirmation than we previously had? Maybe not. But still confuses me when read next to the line in The Letter "Though, as you are now essentially immortal". Why only 'now'? Unless it refers to an inability for Frost to even be killed now, but as we know he's not a Shardholder, I remain confused.

My pet theory, is something about the Shattering caused the Dragon race of Yolen to gain functional immortality, perhaps even Hoid as well.  I sometimes speculate that as a possible contributing factor to desire to Shatter Adonalsium in the first place... but have nothing to back it up.

This pet theory of mine covers the statement in The Letter, but does get a bit more ambiguous with the current answer, though not fully excluded since it's not a specific answer to the question (he dodged "a natural part" IMHO).

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Maybe Frost is simply not in a situation where nobody could harm him...so he is really 100% immortal. Maybe his policy made him lock himself away in some remote place

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8 minutes ago, Yata said:

Maybe Frost is simply not in a situation where nobody could harm him...so he is really 100% immortal. Maybe his policy made him lock himself away in some remote place

Alternatively (and I just thought of this so I haven't researched) - could he be a Sliver? We know he doesn't hold a Shard but I don't think I've seen anything saying he's NEVER held a Shard. Dragons don't age but a dragon sliver would be pretty invincible. 

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1 hour ago, Extesian said:

Alternatively (and I just thought of this so I haven't researched) - could he be a Sliver? We know he doesn't hold a Shard but I don't think I've seen anything saying he's NEVER held a Shard. Dragons don't age but a dragon sliver would be pretty invincible. 

Actually I don't understand. As far as we know be a Sliver doesn't give anything to the Sliver himself (at least while the Sliver is alive)

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20 minutes ago, Yata said:

Actually I don't understand. As far as we know be a Sliver doesn't give anything to the Sliver himself (at least while the Sliver is alive)

Eh it was a lazy post from a brief thought :( yeah you're right Yata, thanks.i was thinking in the sense that he'd be guaranteed Cognitive Shadow status if he does die but that kind of adds nothing. Let's pretend I didn't say it ;)

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@DarknessThanks so much for all of the WoBs.  This is impressive.  Something I'd like to follow up on though:

  Hide contents

 

Darkness: Ok. 2 more. Will Jashnah’s sisters show up in the present day arc? (I meant the 2 biological sisters that are mentioned in one part of tWoK but I guess Brandon wasn’t thinking about them)

Brandon: Jasnah sisters… Oh… OH! The other… veristatilians. (Sure) Um… yes. You will actually meet 2 more veristatilians in the next book!

 

Do Elhokar and Jasnah have 2 biological sisters we have yet to meet?  I don't recall a reference to them anywhere in WoK.  The only time Jasnah mentions having "sisters" is in WoK Chapter 45 where she says:

Quote

"I'm a Veristitalian," Jasnah said. "We search for answers in the past, reconstructing what truly happened...My sisters and I choose projects that we feel were misunderstood or misrepresented, and in studying them hope to better understand the present." Chapter 45, Shadesmar, Way of Kings.

It appears that Jasnah is referring to other veristatilians as her sisters, just like Brandon did.  I couldn't find any other reference to Jasnah having sisters anywhere in WoK.  Where did you see mention of Jasnah and Elhokar having additional biological siblings?  Or is this from a WoB that I've missed somewhere?

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Was, is or will anyone be at the Perth signings this weekend? I'm greedily and deeply hoping for some recordings or signing reports. It hurts not being there when it's my home city :'(

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5 hours ago, A Budgie said:

I did a question!

Q: So, Hoid can't physically hurt someone, but does this ban extend to mental harm and harm through inaction?
A: No. Hoid can mentally hurt someone, or allow them to be hurt, but when considering physical trauma he gets nauseous, to the point he can be incapacitated.

I love this Budgie! The two first points don't surprise me, though it's good to have them in the Canon. But the mechanism for stopping him doing it. That fascinates me now. It could have been that he's incapable of performing an action that directly physically hurts someone. Or that anything he does to someone else physically feeds back and happens to him. But a nausea that can literally incapacitate him I did not expect. Not an effect I can picture realmatically. The closest thing I can think of is the Nightwatcher. Could he have actually gone to her? Could that be the reason for the nickname Slammer, she 'imprisoned' him from his ability to cause damage? Seems an unlikely idea though, he'd ever risk that.

And can he hurt someone on the spiritual realm? Could he only do so by doing something that doesn't hurt them on the physical realm? Seems... unlikely. 

Too. Many. Questions. 

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8 hours ago, Extesian said:

I love this Budgie! The two first points don't surprise me, though it's good to have them in the Canon. But the mechanism for stopping him doing it. That fascinates me now. It could have been that he's incapable of performing an action that directly physically hurts someone. Or that anything he does to someone else physically feeds back and happens to him. But a nausea that can literally incapacitate him I did not expect. Not an effect I can picture realmatically. The closest thing I can think of is the Nightwatcher. Could he have actually gone to her? Could that be the reason for the nickname Slammer, she 'imprisoned' him from his ability to cause damage? Seems an unlikely idea though, he'd ever risk that.

And can he hurt someone on the spiritual realm? Could he only do so by doing something that doesn't hurt them on the physical realm? Seems... unlikely. 

Too. Many. Questions. 

It doesn't have to be magical in nature, I have a feeling this is...just how Hoid is (for some yet to be disclosed non-Investiture reason related to his past)...

Edited by Kandra-in-disguise
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I don't think Hoid has psychological reasons for not being able to harm someone living physically:

Spoiler

In SH, when he is able to punch und hurt Kelsier (as Cognitive Shadow), Hoid seems to be surprised but quite happy about that circumstance.

Having a psychological block would probably also stop him in the Cognitive Realm. You know, punching is punching, no matter in which realm.

Hoid visiting the Nightwatcher? Unlikely since Hoid would not be fine with a more or less random curse.

Nausea - somehow makes me think of Nightblood immediately. Could there be a parallel mechanism that induces nausea like Nightblood does with those unbonded to him and with "a pure heart"? Is Hoid in possession of an item that causes this? We know that Hoid "has a lot of stuff" so this might be a path for further inquiry...

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@Extesian said:

Quote

I've become a little obsessed with gemstones and the role of 'color' on Roshar. We had a previous WoB covering the first part of this answer, but confirmation that the differences are a sort of feedback loop with Rosharan perception is excellent, and the way it has actually changed the mechanics of the magic system. And I think it gives insight into why soulcasting as a subset has this requirement for a specific gem for each essence

The color has struck me too, especially when you take in to account the linguistics of Roshar.  As I discuss in this thread..

Spoiler

Dawnchant based languages survive in isolated and rigorous environments forming enclaves across the map.  This could indicate that it originally was the only language and was pushed out by invaders or immigrants to the point that only the most rigorous places maintained the original language much as Spanish and English pushed out Native American languages.

WOB on Reddit on language groups

  Hide contents
mistborn
Shardbearer
209d

Our basic language families are:

Vorin: Alethi, Veden, Herdazian, and more distantly Thaylen. Nathan is close to dead, but shares a root, and Karbranthian is basically a dialect. Other minor languages like Bav are in here.

Makabaki: Azish is king here, and most the languages around split off this. There are around thirty of these.

Dawnate: A varied language family with distant roots in the dawnchant. Shin, parshendi, Horneater. They share grammar, but they diverged long enough ago that the vocabulary is very different.

Iri: Iriali, Reshi, Purelake dialects, Riran, and some surrounding languages.

Aimian: These two are lumped together, but are very different. Probably what you were looking for.

That isn't counting spren languages, of course. I might have missed something. Typing on my phone without my wiki handy.

The Iriali "Long Trail" mythology suggests newcomers as well.  

Maybe some came from Nalthas and brought the color infatuation with them long ago.

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11 minutes ago, FiveLate said:

The Iriali "Long Trail" mythology suggests newcomers as well.  

Maybe some came from Nalthis and brought the color infatuation with them long ago.

Edit... the WoB I was remembering mentions the Tranquilline Halls, not the Iri.

Edited by The One Who Connects
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On 6/26/2017 at 6:24 PM, The One Who Connects said:

Edit... the WoB I was remembering mentions the Tranquilline Halls, not the Iri.

Interesting.....specifically the halls not the Iri...something more for my list.

Edited by FiveLate
Fixed some autocorrect spellings which resulted in words that did not make sense in the context.
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