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40 minutes ago, Silverblade5 said:

So, I'm currently sick and am having trouble breathing without coughing every five seconds. I'm going to try to still play. Might not be as active as I'd like though. I haven't read through the entire thread yet, and shall begin to do so shortly.

Yech.  Hope you feel better.  :(

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Current thoughts (after having read a single page)

Wilson was attacked. Why?

She's good at seeing though lies. She can also lie well when she wants to. She's a great analyst 

Ryth's suspicions are currently on people who have only played one or two games with her. Taking her out would be a good strategic move, and would allow them to stay hidden more easily. They'd be able to kill her without feeling bad or fearful due to not knowing her. However, Ryth have no clue who fits that description. Anyone want to help Ryth out?

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7 hours ago, Madagascar said:

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I *hiccupsh* done releashed that forgetful lad and the imperial from the pillory, but the resht of'em are still scratchin' poshts fer me catsh. Not my fault, the catsh jusht need somewhere to shcratch, y'know. Lord Ruler ish generoush, blessh him, but he ain't done shquat for catsh. I'm gonna keep drinkin' and then I'll go lookin' for cluesh! Ooh look a nishe gutter, I bet there'sh cluesh there!

*collapses in gutter and starts snoring*

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I have already reached out to quite a few members of this community via PM, and I'm trying to get a feel for who's on whose side, as this can be a good way of pinning down motivations. I was wondering if Straw had any information on interplayer alliances. I have no interest in sharing my role with anyone.

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Spoiler

Wyrmhero (1): Gamma Fiend

Conquestor (4): Madagascar, Dalinar, Elenion, Sart

Arraenae (1): Nyali, Magestar

Stick (1): Wilson

Nyali (2): Arinian, Lopen

Lopen (1): Araris

Orlok (1): Wyrmhero

Ecthelion (2): Hemalurgic, Straw

Elbereth (2): Jondesu, Ecthelion

If I was really an eliminator, would I really PM Straw asking for information? No. That's ridiculous.

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Deceiving you? By doing what? That guy sitting over there in the corner is probably deceiving you more than I am. When I try to be honest and open about gathering information, I'm written off as apparently some very gutsy eliminator, yet when I'm secretive and tricksy, everyone passes me over as village. Why does this happen? In every game, the people who are acting "oddly" are labeled as the eliminators, when in reality the eliminators are the ones who are trying the hardest of everyone to "fit in".

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Hi, I just got online and skimmed through a bit. Then I see Assassin in Burgundy's post and thought, "You know, that would be useful for me to look at because I haven't been on yet." Then I see all the votes on me. :blink: I was pretty shocked, so, could people again say why they would like to murder me on the first day, please?

Why are the people gathering close to me? All I have done is prophesy of there death. I need to get there attention away from me. I will . . . I need to continue my research on hemalurgy.

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1 minute ago, Conquestor said:

Hi, I just got online and skimmed through a bit. Then I see Assassin in Burgundy's post and thought, "You know, that would be useful for me to look at because I haven't been on yet." Then I see all the votes on me. :blink: I was pretty shocked, so, could people again say why they would like to murder me on the first day, please?

Why are the people gathering close to me? All I have done is prophesy of there death. I need to get there attention away from me. I will . . . I need to continue my research on hemalurgy.

Uh, if you haven't noticed the Crusade going on...

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15 minutes ago, Ecthelion III said:

Deceiving you? By doing what? That guy sitting over there in the corner is probably deceiving you more than I am. When I try to be honest and open about gathering information, I'm written off as apparently some very gutsy eliminator, yet when I'm secretive and tricksy, everyone passes me over as village. Why does this happen? In every game, the people who are acting "oddly" are labeled as the eliminators, when in reality the eliminators are the ones who are trying the hardest of everyone to "fit in".

Remember what I said earlier? You've got to make an assumption and stick to it.

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1 minute ago, Hemalurgic_Headshot said:

Uh, if you haven't noticed the Crusade going on...

Well, I had just gotten on and my stupid luck of dying lately is just getting me killed over and over . . . wait a second, I have only lived through one game since I have joined SE! I had even lost on that occasion as well.  <_< 

"This hemalurgic research is incredible, I need to tell my old masters what I have learned!" Mr. Hoid's eyes misted over and he began to speak in a low whisper. "We are all doomed, I won't be able to warn anyone, they all want me dead, they see it as justice, but it is not." His eyes returned to normal and he continued his research, but now with a feeling of dread.

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Felix surveyed the crowd. His eyes settled on the mangled corpse still in the square. Someone really needs to clean that up... Give him a proper burial or something.

It was time for a death apparently. The people of Tyrian Falls were scared, and someone would hang. Hm... A vote, then... Civic duty and all that.

"Townspeople... You require a death? Fine then. I will cast my vote. Survivor guide my hand... I must think about this for a moment.

 

If I were one of those spiked, foul servants of the Lord Ruler...

I would be moderately active, while doing my best to not contribute anything real. I would be particularly vocal about the attack on Whistler last night, because acting concerned about the attack is the simplest way to pretend to be a normal townsman.

I would not risk making a first vote. I would however gladly pile my vote on top of someone else's so that an innocent could be lynched. "Guilt has very quick ears to an accusation." That is true when the guilty is accused, but it is doubly true when an innocent is accused.

 

Now, in truth this is something of a shot in the dark... But the best fits to this description are probably Sothe, El, or Grumbles.

Seeing as there are already two votes on El (and it looks like, for good or for ill, this town is lynching someone)... I vote for El.

 

El, you stand accused of being an abominable and demonic servant of the Lord Tyrant, and an agent of darkness and chaos. I wouldn't mind hearing your defense."

 

Survivor send that I am right about this...

 

Also, unrelated to the above reasoning, but I don't think Wilson was pulling WGG. I don't know Wilson all that much, but from what people are saying... The fact that this is Wilson, and the fact that this was n1... That would be a somewhat foolish gambit.

And I doubt the elims decided to both attack and heal an innocent. Even if that innocent is Wilson, that just doesn't make any sense as a strategy. Far better to make a clean kill on n1 when nobody even has real suspicions. The elims probably are a little annoyed that their kill failed.

So, chances are we legitimately have a lurcher that guessed the right person to protect last night. Good job lurcher.

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@Gamma Fiend, I'd be very interested in hearing from you. You've hopped onto the thread several times without posting, and currently you're in PMs. What are you up to? Sneaky person, you put your ear to the door and hear the old man speak these words: "Ah, Soulbinding. A lost art, I fear, and one that may be possessed only by me and my Soullinked clones, such as the one speaking to you right now. It's a form of Investiture that manipulates the Connection between two people. It's similar to the other forms of Investiture, though it requires a "focus" of the person I am building Connection to. For instance," the man paused, and you hear rustling, "something like this. Having a focus from a person gives you access to Light Soulbinding and its four domains: Physical, Mental, Temporal, and Enhancement. With me so far?"

Edit: sp/grammar

Edited by Ecthelion III
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4 minutes ago, Ecthelion III said:

@Gamma Fiend, I'd be very interested in hearing from you. You've hopped onto the thread several times without posting, and currently you're in PMs. What are you up to?

Actually not been up to much, just been checking in on my phone while at work to *try* and keep up on things, mostly failing. I poked vote on Wyrm earlier because we were talking in PMs, mostly discussing the latest news in Magic the Gathering. XD 
Just been trying to view the threads and get a "feel" for the posts again, since I've been gone so long from the forums and these games, my gut-instinct is a little off now, since I don't really have a pulse of how people tend to play, or typical behavioural tendencies that players have, etc. That said, Hemalurgic Headshot feels a little "off" to me so far. Their posts don't really seem to add much in the vein of actual discussion, just seem to be more or less posting for the sake of inactivity and putting forth the effort of participation to avoid the Crusades, without adding much substance to conversation. That said, that's just an initial feeling off of what I perused while at work all day, and I don't know players' current meta-play styles, so that might not be as unusual. 

Trying to avoid the current discussion of the Wilson/WGG thing right now, as most players have already hit all of the major talking points about it, so adding anything further would just obfuscate the debate at this point. It's either the WGG or it's not, and we just need to rely on power roles (Seekers, Lurchers, etc.) to keep on top of that for now until we can get actual verified results. 

As far as that goes, if we have any Village Seekers, they should have Scanned somebody last night, as that was definitely their best chance to start a Trust Team before anything else had happened. So if they got proper results, they should be communicating with whomever they scanned to work together going forward to earn and build trust and investigating the WGG further. But other than that...

*Disclaimer*
Just because somebody contacts you alleging to be a Seeker, I would not auto-confirm them as Village. Even if they are correct -- they very well might have scanned you -- but that doesn't guarantee their actual allegiance, so do not trust any Seekers yet, because you may not know the allegiance of the Seeker. I would recommend you *work* with them going forward to best coordinate things for the village, but I would not let them necessarily dictate what your actions are going to be, just yet. 
 

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6 hours ago, Arraenae said:

Nyali, Bugsy, and Magestar, I'm flabbergasted that you thought that I was telling the lurchers to protect inactives because actives are unimportant. Yeah, of course this is part of my master plan to make actives (and I consider myself in this category) die early on. Of course I want to make this game turn into LG28, where around a half of the players were inactive. I just love hearing players and spectators tear their hair out over the lack of activity.

If you'll look at my post, I realized almost immediately that I was wrong, and edited my post to express that I recognized that I had been tunneling. I left the idea, in case it helped jog someone else's thought process, but recanted my views as soon as I realized how illogical it was. Furthermore, I never implied that you meant to post such a message.  I did say that it seemed in line with a potentially productive eliminator strategy of protecting against vig kills to derail village lynches and possibly reveal the coinshot's identity, however. Again, in the greater context of your post, it doesn't make sense.

Also, I'm not really loving this pathos. Seems a bit like a guilt trip :P 

1 hour ago, Drake Marshall said:

Also, unrelated to the above reasoning, but I don't think Wilson was pulling WGG. I don't know Wilson all that much, but from what people are saying... The fact that this is Wilson, and the fact that this was n1... That would be a somewhat foolish gambit. And I doubt the elims decided to both attack and heal an innocent. Even if that innocent is Wilson, that just doesn't make any sense as a strategy. Far better to make a clean kill on n1 when nobody even has real suspicions. The elims probably are a little annoyed that their kill failed.

I agree. Wilson has a rep that would essentially guarantee suspicion of a WGG, and her being targeted would therefore give her no real advantage in trust. This also robbed the eliminators of the initiative, giving the villagers an opportunity to draw first blood with the lynch. An early kill is too valuable to loose, and a failed kill on Wilson gives us what I'd argue is substantially more information than a kill on a legitimately random player.

As for those voting on El, might I ask why? She is, in my opinion, very unlikely to have opened with the kill target we've just seen. The votes on her likewise have no substantial grounding in suspicion that I've seen, though I may have missed it. 

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@Bugsy6912 My vote on El was because she was the one who shifted the conversation at the start to talking about Wilson, which is something I believe an eliminator would do. I'm not incredibly suspicious of her, but she's the best target I have (although Hemalurgic Headshot is worrying me a little with his strong tunneling, especially for a new player).

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5 minutes ago, Ecthelion III said:

@Bugsy6912 My vote on El was because she was the one who shifted the conversation at the start to talking about Wilson, which is something I believe an eliminator would do. I'm not incredibly suspicious of her, but she's the best target I have (although Hemalurgic Headshot is worrying me a little with his strong tunneling, especially for a new player).

My reasoning is similar. Anyone who starts ruling people out on such minimal information makes me suspicious. Joe is on my list for similar reasons, but El started that approach and has kept the discussion in that direction.

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4 minutes ago, Ecthelion III said:

@Bugsy6912 My vote on El was because she was the one who shifted the conversation at the start to talking about Wilson, which is something I believe an eliminator would do. I'm not incredibly suspicious of her, but she's the best target I have (although Hemalurgic Headshot is worrying me a little with his strong tunneling, especially for a new player).

Ok, thank you! I disagree, myself, but I can definitely see that point of view

I have to go for awhile for homework and all, but I should be back tomorrow afternoon. If anyone has anything urgent, PM me and I'll get an email notification, but short of that I'll be off for ~16 hours.

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Warning: Long post ahead. >> Much to say. 8 posts in multiquote will do that. 

21 hours ago, Madagascar said:

Boo! Tempting as it is to change my vote to Gamma Fiend for beating me to first vote of the game. :(

He didn't, actually. I did. :P (Please don't throw a cat at me?)

21 hours ago, Silverblade5 said:

I'm terribly sorry, but Ryth is afraid he'll have to drop out of this game. He requests that he gets targeted by the elims next cycle 

While this has now been retracted, note - in future cases I'd suggest asking a Coinshot to target you, rather than the eliminator team? For various reasons, pretty much every game since... oh, LG24 or so? I can't remember it happening since LG22, but I could be wrong... vigilantes have had some reason or other not to kill inactives (there weren't any, or they were limited, or they were faction-based and killed based on that instead). I don't think it's been suggested as a strategy in ages. That's the reason I agree with Lopen about not lynching an inactive today - we hopefully have Coinshots whoc an do that if they don't have any other suspicions. (Of course, in the last AG, there were no coinshots. Hopefully that doesn't hold true again.)

12 hours ago, Nyali said:

That's pretty much all I've got right now, though I do want to say that the kill attempt on Wilson is interesting. It's either the first WGG I've actually seen around here, or it's yet another attempt to eliminate a known strong player before she gets going. Given how often Wilson dies early on, it's completely plausible that someone would protect her (or she could have protected herself).

The later is far more likely, but the former is still theoretically possible. When was the last WGG around here? For now, I personally tentatively trust Wilson, though that's burned me pretty hard in the past (LG20 anyone?).

The only WGGs that have been performed successfully are LG2 and LG15 (LG15 moreso than LG2), both planned by Wilson but not executed on her. 

11 hours ago, Kipper said:

@Elbereth Disappointed that you wouldn't put me on the list of people who wouldn't kill Wilson N1. I thought we were friends. I thought we understood each other?!

Also, about this whole Wilson thing...it DOESN'T MATTER. And for anyone who thinks that it's "more likely" for Wilson to be a villager or an Eliminator-  no, it's not.

We are in D1. Nothing substantial was said in the Night. We do not know who Wilson PMd, or what was said in that PM. We do know that most people consider Wilson a dangerous person who is likely to be killed (she's really just a teddy bear you guys), so that creates equal motivations for 1. A villager saving her, 2. Her fellow Eliminators doing a WGG to try and clear her, or my favorite strategy, 3. The Eliminators doing the attack/save actions with her as a villager, so when their Lurcher dies later on, she receives suspicion #timebomb (Which, @Elbereth, is totally something an experienced players would consider amusing so pls reconsider your list).

TL;DR: We can't gain any new information from that save, or use it to analyze old information. The save makes sense from both alignments. Wilson remains of neutral suspicion.

Well... I don't understand you at all. :P I didn't put you on the list because I honestly had no idea whether you wouldn't kill her or not. 

I would argue that it does matter, at least insofar as it's causing discussion. 

This applies to a below point, too - yes, I'm not saying those players are cleared for this. The possibilities of an experienced player pulling a fake-WGG and a team without one of those players just straight attacking her are about equal chances (given her post, I would say that her being evil is very unlikely, in my opinion). There's a reason I didn't go to all the trouble of listing out tiers all nice like Joe did - we don't know that that is actually the scenario we're dealing with. But it is an interesting thought, and it's D1. I'll provoke discussion in whatever way I can get. 

10 hours ago, Magestar said:

I personally think that Seekers should try to find Lurchers and Smokers first.  I wouldn't be surprised if the Elims had a Seeker of their own, and it's very important for a Seeker to be protected.  Finding a Coinshot is not quite as important, but if you don't want to reveal to the thread or have a person speak for you, then it's probably a good idea to contact a Coinshot.

And... how exactly do you suggest they do that? Seekers can scan based on what their guesses for alignment are, yes. Guessing and scanning roles is somewhat harder. 

Also, somewhat less useful? Being able to find alignment is far more important than finding roles, in my opinion. So yes, while it'd be nice for a Seeker to be able to find a Village Lurcher, that's not really a helpful suggestion, in my opinion. 

10 hours ago, Nyali said:

I thought anyone could open PMs with anyone else as long as a Tineye was alive?

For clarification - though Stink already mostly said - he was referring to his current character at the time not being a Tineye. PMs can be opened with anyone so long as thehre's a Tineye alive. His character just wasn't a Tineye at that point.

(Speaking of PMs, I would greatly appreciate being PMed. I am considering PMing everyone, but will likely see sense and only PM a few players I particularly want to talk to. But any PMs sent to me would be quite welcome.)

6 hours ago, Jondesu said:

Now El…El was beginning to try to claim innocence for herself and others by claiming they wouldn't have attacked Whistler. It was a long list, in fact, nearly a third of the town.  It was based on some nonsense about Whistler not wanting to die (wasn't that true of everyone?) and those people having known her longer.  Remart doubted it, plus he knew that he would have been tempted to do exactly that if he'd been aiming to sow chaos in the town. Perhaps the spiked had even saved Whistler themselves, just so there was a witness and fear could grow.  In fact, El sounded more and more suspicious the more he listened to her.  He didn't truly trust anyone, sure, but he also wasn't about to let someone divide the town unnecessarily.


Just to add, I would consider myself one of those relatively new players who wouldn't realize that Wilson died so often and would instead simply know she could be a threat as a good player, and might have considered targeting her.  If there were any of those players that did understand on the Elim team, however, I can see them swaying the group to go for someone else.  I could also very easily see them attacking and also saving Wilson just to make themselves less suspicious, however, even if Wilson was completely unaware of that plan.  I wouldn't rule anyone out as an Elim based on that, but if it wasn't the Elims themselves saving her to cover themselves, then that person was probably one of those older players.

Not sure how to respond to this? I agree that just because Wilson wouldn't have been attacked by one of those players (if that's even the case, which is probable but not necessarily correct), it by no means clears them. It's one possibility to consider, and an interesting one. There is a conflicting possibility which would say exactly the opposite. Right now, we're not in a position to tell which. But it's something to keep in mind. 

5 hours ago, Ecthelion III said:

I'd be willing to bet my brand new cane that at least one of the people who is trying to get us to overly focus on Wilson's death is an eliminator. Think about it. Assuming that Wilson was just randomly protected, the eliminators would want us to try to read too much into this and jump to false conclusions. Or, assuming that Wilson's protection was an elaborate WGG-like ploy, the eliminators would want to ensure that their scheme worked by talking about it and spreading false conclusions. Either way, it's likely that the eliminators want us debating about Wilson's death, which makes me quite suspicious of El.

So... you're saying we shouldn't discuss Wilson's death, because it'll lead us in circles, as far as I can tell. Sure. I can understand that. But it comes off as 'we shouldn't be discussing her death at all'. And... why not? Why shouldn't we discuss her death? It's not cutting out any other topics of discussion, obviously. It could potentially be helpful along the line, and at least shows the viewpoints of various players. And it's Day One. As I said above - I'll take any topic of discussion I can get. I'm really not sure why you're trying to stop that discussion from happening. 

 

Other notes:

1. Something no one's mentioned yet, that's somewhat important - we now know that there is at least one Lurcher or Mistborn in the game. (Could be either; my guess would be Lurcher just because that seems considerably more likely). Which is useful, given there was exactly one in the last game, and useless because there were no Coinshots or Mistborn. This is an indication that we have at least that much and very probably more. 

2. That Lurcher who protected Wilson - if you haven't yet, I'd highly recommend claiming to Wilson. If you are good, you pretty much know for a fact that Wilson is as well (unless you told anyone you were going to protect her, which you certainly should not have done). She can't necessarily trust you in return, but even so. That'd be something I would suggest. 

3. From what I can see, Drake is voting on me for being the first voter in the game. *sigh* I'm going to post this, and then I will go find where I did the statistics on first voters in every game. Though... actually. I may not have. I did second vote on a person, and the person voted on, but possibly not the voter. @little wilson, I don't suppose you remember?

I really, really shouldn't do what I might be about to do. 


El mashed the aloe down into the bowl, again and again. Thump. Thump. Burn salve, of course - she'd realized after last night that she didn't have any on hand, and she needed to be prepared. There hadn't ever been a fire bigger than an overturned candle here, in her memory. There hadn't been a need, before. Thump

She sighed, looking across the counter into the open room where she did most of her business. It was neat and tidy as always, of course. One couldn't do much healing if nothing was organized. She began making a list of mental items to put into the healing kit she would prepare next. The burn salve would go in, of course. Antiseptic, naturally. Gauze... Diseases tended to be slower than would be needed for going out and about, so she shouldn't need anything that countered those... 

Her attention drifted with the thumping of the pestle in her hands. She still couldn't remember how long ago it had been. She knew she hadn't always lived in Tyrian Falls. She'd been somewhere else. She had had parents. She just wasn't sure where, or when she'd come here, and her parents... well. She knew nothing of them except the locket. It had been at least a year ago, certainly... Probably more. But when? 

She frowned and began listing items for her kit again. She had to focus, not get distracted by idle memories. She was needed here, now. The people of the town needed her skills. She was pretty sure that they'd need them even more, in the coming days. 

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12 minutes ago, Bugsy6912 said:

As for those voting on El, might I ask why? She is, in my opinion, very unlikely to have opened with the kill target we've just seen. The votes on her likewise have no substantial grounding in suspicion that I've seen, though I may have missed it. 

I don't feel like RPing a response to your question, so allow me to just give you a simple answer.

I have explained why I suspect El in the thread I voted for her. Her behavior most closely matched what I speculated the behavior of an eliminator would be. No, the suspicions are not remotely substantial.

If we are dead set on killing someone this cycle (dead set... get it :D) then I have to vote to kill the person I most suspect. Even if, in truth, I don't suspect her all that much.

The alternative of me voting for El is that someone who I suspect even less than El gets lynched. Sorry El.

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