2016-12-06 [Arcanum Unbounded] Herald Washington Library Center - Chicago, IL

[Khyrindor]

2 hours ago, emailanimal said:

My stress is on third... Have we found out something about the second Bondsmith before that I have missed? Or is it so assumed that the second Bondsmith bonds Nightwatcher that it goes without saying?

That's the assumption. I don't know if anyone has asked Brandon about the second, but that would make sense. A leading theory on the third Bondsmith is Cuiscech (or however you spell it).

[ROSHtaFARian2.0]

Ever since we learned about the Sleepless, I've been wondering if they might have a connection to Cusicech. (I can't remember how to spell it either, lol). With the bit about all the faces appearing in that spren, it feels similar to how the Sleepless are made up of multitudes of smaller organisms (or can separate into multitudes of smaller organisms, more accurately). I'm wondering though if maybe that's the godspren of the Sleepless, like the spren that represents their race....and as such, if the third Bondsmith might be a Dysian Aiman.

[Khyrindor]

Edgedancer spoilers:

Spoiler

Does anyone know if the Sleepless are Diagramists? One of the chapter prefaces on the Diagram in WoR (IIRC) said something along the lines of "awakening every sleepless agent in the area" or something like that. I initially thought they were their own thing, but that would explain why Taravangian knows so much about the goings-on in the Warcamps

[Zmann966]

46 minutes ago, Khyrindor said:

Edgedancer spoilers:

  Hide contents

Does anyone know if the Sleepless are Diagramists? One of the chapter prefaces on the Diagram in WoR (IIRC) said something along the lines of "awakening every sleepless agent in the area" or something like that. I initially thought they were their own thing, but that would explain why Taravangian knows so much about the goings-on in the Warcamps

Ooooh good catch!

Even if he wasn't in direct contact, his clarity that day might have picked them out as a faction hidden beneath the surface of Roshar and he could be working with/towards/for them once the connection was made post-deciphering.

[emailanimal]

34 minutes ago, Zmann966 said:

Ooooh good catch!

Even if he wasn't in direct contact, his clarity that day might have picked them out as a faction hidden beneath the surface of Roshar and he could be working with/towards/for them once the connection was made post-deciphering.

Good catch indeed, agreed!

This however causes more questions... Why would Sleepless be agents of the Diagram? How would Mr. T. even go about initially recruiting them? Walk up to a random cremilng and say "Take me to your leader!"?

[Djarskublar]

It would be a good catch, but it actually says sleeper agent, which is something totally different.

[Zmann966]

On 12/11/2016 at 0:14 AM, Djarskublar said:

It would be a good catch, but it actually says sleeper agent, which is something totally different.

Touche.

 

Quote

“No. It’s more.” They had survived. Taravangian stood up. “Wake every Alethi sleeper we have; send every agent in the area."
Words of Radiance, Interlude-14

 

[Argent]

So are we done with this transcript? Any questions we need another pass on? 

[Khyrindor]

3 hours ago, Argent said:

So are we done with this transcript? Any questions we need another pass on? 

There were a few really long ones that I didn't want to do lol I marked them in case anyone had the time and patience and wanted to. Granted I haven't looked in a couple days so I don't know if anyone's gone over them yet.

[Argent]

Well, I think a lot of the work on this transcription has been yours, @Khyrindor, so good work and thank you! I don't think many (any?) other signings get 20 page reports, so it's always a point of particular pride (alliterations ftw!) of mine when the Chicago events get such an amazing turnout. Though I also feel a tiny bit guilty because some poor soul will have to transcribe all that - since I rarely have the time these days.

@Volratho, can I ask you to update the first post in this thread with a copy of the entire document hidden behind a spoiler tag (so people can search for stuff on the forums)? If you are feeling extra generous, you could go over all the comments we have dangling and see if anything needs additional addressing (e.g. unclear/incomplete questions), so we can address it before you update your post.

On a different note, I've been thinking about how I feel about signings, and how my experience attending the Chicago ones and contributing information from them compares to events and reports from other places, and I've decided that, for whatever reason, the information we get in Chicago is more... diluted. I feel like the Utah signings tend to get the best WoBs in terms of Cosmeric significance, but the Illinois ones tend to produce more WoBs (of lesser significance) overall. Anyone else notice this, or am I just high on coffee?

[Ironeyes]

12 minutes ago, Argent said:

On a different note, I've been thinking about how I feel about signings, and how my experience attending the Chicago ones and contributing information from them compares to events and reports from other places, and I've decided that, for whatever reason, the information we get in Chicago is more... diluted. I feel like the Utah signings tend to get the best WoBs in terms of Cosmeric significance, but the Illinois ones tend to produce more WoBs (of lesser significance) overall. Anyone else notice this, or am I just high on coffee?

Perhaps Utah people are more confident in being able to see Brandon often, so they're bolder with their questions. Cause if they get RAFOed it's just a matter of waiting till next time he does an event. Those of us in the East see him less often, so we're more cautious about asking questions we're sure he'll answer. At least that's my thought process with regard to his trip to Boston next year. I'm trying to come up with questions I think won't be RAFOed cause this may be the only chance I get to attend a signing for a long time. 

[Zmann966]

1 hour ago, Argent said:

On a different note, I've been thinking about how I feel about signings, and how my experience attending the Chicago ones and contributing information from them compares to events and reports from other places, and I've decided that, for whatever reason, the information we get in Chicago is more... diluted. I feel like the Utah signings tend to get the best WoBs in terms of Cosmeric significance, but the Illinois ones tend to produce more WoBs (of lesser significance) overall. Anyone else notice this, or am I just high on coffee?

I also feel that all those "deep" questions get asked in Utah because he always goes there first.

It's like, our question shardpool fills up during the spaces between publications, then he goes on Tour and we all get to tap into it with our questions, but Provo almost always gets the first sip because of the release party's and midnight premiere signings. By the time he makes it out to the last few stops of the tour, all the PRESSING questions have been answered or RAFO'd... Fewer questions left since—as a community—we pool them all for clarity and the first vessels get their pick of the lot, and get the deeper ones. So we shift focus to filling in smaller cracks of our communal-question-spiritweb with smaller and easier answers. (Far less likely to get hard RAFO's too!)

It's just how you expect community-sourced question pools to be emptied. 

[Ted aka WinespringBrother]

15 hours ago, Argent said:

Well, I think a lot of the work on this transcription has been yours, @Khyrindor, so good work and thank you! I don't think many (any?) other signings get 20 page reports, so it's always a point of particular pride (alliterations ftw!) of mine when the Chicago events get such an amazing turnout. Though I also feel a tiny bit guilty because some poor soul will have to transcribe all that - since I rarely have the time these days.

@Volratho, can I ask you to update the first post in this thread with a copy of the entire document hidden behind a spoiler tag (so people can search for stuff on the forums)? If you are feeling extra generous, you could go over all the comments we have dangling and see if anything needs additional addressing (e.g. unclear/incomplete questions), so we can address it before you update your post.

On a different note, I've been thinking about how I feel about signings, and how my experience attending the Chicago ones and contributing information from them compares to events and reports from other places, and I've decided that, for whatever reason, the information we get in Chicago is more... diluted. I feel like the Utah signings tend to get the best WoBs in terms of Cosmeric significance, but the Illinois ones tend to produce more WoBs (of lesser significance) overall. Anyone else notice this, or am I just high on coffee?

I added the transcript to the Theoryland database also since it looked somewhat complete. Some great information in there!

[Volratho]

On 12/13/2016 at 4:26 PM, Argent said:

 

@Volratho, can I ask you to update the first post in this thread with a copy of the entire document hidden behind a spoiler tag (so people can search for stuff on the forums)? If you are feeling extra generous, you could go over all the comments we have dangling and see if anything needs additional addressing (e.g. unclear/incomplete questions), so we can address it before you update your post.

Done

[Argent]

Some follow-up on savants: [link].

[Chaos]

Really great work transcribing this!

I think with the House Venture having some members who worldhop, Felt is obviously one of those. But we saw Felt after the destruction of Hathsin. So I wonder how he got into the Harmony perpendicularity (or perpendicularities) later to worldhop to Roshar and other places.

[soyperson]

16 minutes ago, Chaos said:

Really great work transcribing this!

I think with the House Venture having some members who worldhop, Felt is obviously one of those. But we saw Felt after the destruction of Hathsin. So I wonder how he got into the Harmony perpendicularity (or perpendicularities) later to worldhop to Roshar and other places.

*facepalms* 

The idea of Harmony perpendicularities never occured to me before about 7 seconds ago. 

*dons tinfoil hat*

[Chaos]

23 minutes ago, bleeder said:

*facepalms* 

The idea of Harmony perpendicularities never occured to me before about 7 seconds ago. 

*dons tinfoil hat*

Hah!

There must be Perpendicularities post Catacendre. (Apparently it is "easy" to get to Scadrial in this interview, which I imagine is just true after the first trilogy.) While I expect there to just be a single Perpendicularity, there very well could be two.

[soyperson]

4 minutes ago, Chaos said:

Hah!

There must be Perpendicularities post Catacendre. (Apparently it is "easy" to get to Scadrial in this interview, which I imagine is just true after the first trilogy.) While I expect there to just be a single Perpendicularity, there very well could be two.

The Pool in the mountains that Ms Sauvage happened upon, perhaps?

[Argent]

4 minutes ago, Chaos said:

While I expect there to just be a single Perpendicularity, there very well could be two.

Possible, I suppose, but the whole "mixing of investitures" thing Brandon is hinting at when he talks about how savants of multiple powers work leads me to believe that it will be a single Perpendicularity. The intention for Wax was for him to become a savant of the combination of Allomantic Steel and Feruchemical Iron - like the two powers had become one for him. So I figure Sazed is very much in the same boat - for him, there is no Preservation and Ruin, there is only Harmony. Another Vessel might not allow the powers to mix, and so they would let two different types of investiture seep into the world.

[Kurkistan]

Sazed being singular/dual doesn't necessarily dictate the number of perpendicularities. If the pools in the Horneater peaks are all Cultivation's perpendicularities, that's certainly quite a few for a single shard.

Not to mention that Trell might have a perpendicularity or two on Scadrial.

[Chaos]

3 hours ago, Argent said:

Possible, I suppose, but the whole "mixing of investitures" thing Brandon is hinting at when he talks about how savants of multiple powers work leads me to believe that it will be a single Perpendicularity. The intention for Wax was for him to become a savant of the combination of Allomantic Steel and Feruchemical Iron - like the two powers had become one for him. So I figure Sazed is very much in the same boat - for him, there is no Preservation and Ruin, there is only Harmony. Another Vessel might not allow the powers to mix, and so they would let two different types of investiture seep into the world.

I tend to agree there would only be one. But, who knows, we don't know the full mechanics of how those are made and why.

3 hours ago, Kurkistan said:

Sazed being singular/dual doesn't necessarily dictate the number of perpendicularities. If the pools in the Horneater peaks are all Cultivation's perpendicularities, that's certainly quite a few for a single shard.

Not to mention that Trell might have a perpendicularity or two on Scadrial.

I tend to think that only one pool is actually Cultivation's. But they don't need to be pools. I think the Pits were kind of weird in that respect, and obviously Honor's being in a highstorm and moving indicates they aren't always pools. 

Again, it is quite hard to say as we don't have full knowledge of the mechanics involved. How much of a Shard's influence must be on a planet for one to form? I don't think Trell has actually Invested on the planet directly--as in, no Scadrian has Innate Investiture from there, or something. So I tend to lean towards there not being such a perpendicularity of Trell. But hard to say.

[Zmann966]

27 minutes ago, Chaos said:

I tend to think that only one pool is actually Cultivation's. But they don't need to be pools. I think the Pits were kind of weird in that respect, and obviously Honor's being in a highstorm and moving indicates they aren't always pools. 

 

Correct. Brandon even mentioned it at the Chicago signing, that "Perpendicularities" = shardpools, but that "ShardPool" was a community-invented term. Subsequently, it's inaccurate.

Especially if we think Honor's Perpendicularity is the Highstorm (it DOES move... pools usually don't do that on their own) and it's mentioned that Elsecallers create their own Perpendicularity when they... Elsecall... So yeah, definitely not always a pool... 

[Jazzy Kandra]

On 12/16/2016 at 5:05 PM, Chaos said:

Hah!

There must be Perpendicularities post Catacendre. (Apparently it is "easy" to get to Scadrial in this interview, which I imagine is just true after the first trilogy.) While I expect there to just be a single Perpendicularity, there very well could be two.

I think there should (eventually) be three...two doesn't really make logical sense to me (but maybe I'm not logical, ha ha). What I mean, though, is that because Harmony has a Perpendicularity in the South where Ettmetal is being produced (and where his "pool" is). Supposedly, the other two would be where Ruin and Preservation's pools are, and while that might seem at first, Scadrial has Perpendicularities, and they'd probably be related to the two Shards that make up Harmony's one Shard...*shrug*

I feel like I've theorized this before...

[TheBlueShifting]

On 12/16/2016 at 3:22 PM, Chaos said:

 

Really great work transcribing this!

I think with the House Venture having some members who worldhop, Felt is obviously one of those. But we saw Felt after the destruction of Hathsin. So I wonder how he got into the Harmony perpendicularity (or perpendicularities) later to worldhop to Roshar and other places.

 

From the interview, I got the impression that the Perpendicularity was not destroyed by Kelsier, Yes the mini ones were, but I doubt the little ones would work to send someone into the Cognitive Realm anyway. I think the "dark pool" still exists deep in the pits, which would have provided a means to travel had it been found. I might be reading into things, but he answered the question in a way that made it seem that the perpendicularity was still accessible.