435 posts in this topic

5 hours ago, A Joe in the Bush said:

Props to Mage and Sart, who I respect killed,

:o 

I... I was respect killed?

B)

4 hours ago, A Joe in the Bush said:

Because by killing their teamates they got you to trust them enough to kill your teammates.

This is why you can't trust anyone in this kind of game. :P You have to rely on your gut and analysis.

6 hours ago, JUQ said:

This is going to be my last post on the Shard before my hiatus. I'll show myself out. See you all in February!

See You JUQ!  You'll be missed.

Thank, Hael, for running this game.  I enjoyed both of these games that you've run, and I like to think I learned something.  Knowing me, I'll probably forget it, but all the same these games have been awesome. :D I think the Items in this game added a lot of Flavor, which I loved, and even if I didn't get to RP as much as I would have liked, I felt like I could still contribute with the Items.  The inactivity filter was... good.  It got people to post more.  I lost my pass because I was suddenly unable to get on the Shard at all, which was unfortunate, however, I think that the filter did what it was supposed to do pretty well.

Thanks Again for running this game, Hael.  I thoroughly enjoyed it.

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Thanks to the M'Hael for running this game! You'll be missed ;) Congrats to the Eliminators.

My thoughts on the inactivity filter are that it's necessary, and it's helpful, IMO. Sure, it helps the Eliminators a bit, but really, it doesn't prevent people from lurking (whether Eliminator or power role) - you just have to be a bit more strategic about doing so. Just look at the number of people who managed to generally go beneath the radar for this game, despite the filter! Not to mention that long-term inactives just generally drag the game out because they're not the people Eliminators tend to pick off first, especially in a standard game, so you'd end up either having to call the game, or having to go through the boring parts of culling inactives.

That being said, I don't really think we need 'objective' criteria for avoiding the filter, but it would be nice from a GM perspective to spell those out more concretely. Even if you can't give a set of necessary and sufficient conditions, giving a few examples of what doesn't count as having made a post would have helped borderline cases get a better idea, IMO. (And it also pretty much prevents someone from coming back to complain you didn't tell them until after the cycle that it didn't count.) I don't think it's that much of an issue for this game, but it might be better practice to have clarified that from the beginning, going forward.

I'm actually interested in what those like @Elbereth or @Alvron might think about the free pass system, though. Granting free passes at GM discretion is definitely a good idea, but at the same time, the worry is that it could get ugly, depending on whether people think the GM was being a bit too lenient with the Eliminators or not. Ideally, one might suggest letting the IM decide on the free passes, but they're already plenty busy - bogging them down with extra admin isn't a good idea and it's like turning them into GM#2.

My solution to that might be for the GM to recognise possibly contentious cases/swingy cases and talk to the IM on those. But I'm by no means sold on this - I'm honestly just pinging Alv and El because I know they have strong views on GM impartiality that may be a counterpoint here.

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Yeah, I really needed to have thought through and written out the criteria for the filter clearer. I tried to give a warning first before enforcing it in some cases. And for that last cycle, with whether to filter kill JUQ or not, I'm fairly confidant that Stick would still have kept her vote on Kynedath, and so the outcome would have been unchanged. Asking the IM for the specific cases is probably the best thing, along with clearer criteria.

I imagine this style filter is going to feel more comfortable in a MR with 48 hour cycles, where a single surprise on one day can get you killed.

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Good game, everyone! ^.^ My strategy this game was to go after any fellow eliminator that had accrued any logical suspicion while, for the most part, avoiding voting for villagers who were going to get lynched. It appears to have worked xD I even tried to make sure I had answers every turn to the question "Why is Nyali still alive?" I actually went deliberately afk for the second to last day, spending my free pass on purpose. That way, when Burnt died instead of me, I could say the elims didn't go after me because I was inactive that turn if anyone had brought that up. The turn before that, Joe killing Sart made total sense because everyone was so convinced that either Joe or Sart was an eliminator and the other was a villager.

Regarding JUQ not dying from inactivity, ironically, I think it would have been easier to get Stick to keep her vote on Kynedath in the last turn if JUQ had died from inactivity. Dunno, Stick would have to answer that, but 2v2 is hard because you KNOW two of the players have to be lying, and the elims won't want to get their own killed at that point because that puts them in an even worse situation. So if there are three votes on someone, you can tell that one elim has to be voting with you, and therefore the target is innocent. If there are only two votes on someone, then it's going to be a cointoss on who gets killed. Games where 1v1 is an eliminator win because no lynch can occur make this moot, but games without that rule (like this one) leave the ending to a cointoss in this situation.

With 2v1, you just need to convince one person that the other is an eliminator.

Props to Kynedath for that post on the last day which was totally correct in every way, and a great strategy. Unfortunately, it didn't sway Stick. Still, it was a really good post and tactic.

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2 minutes ago, Nyali said:

Props to Kynedath for that post on the last day which was totally correct in every way, and a great strategy. Unfortunately, it didn't sway Stick. Still, it was a really good post and tactic.

I've never really been good with telling if someone is an eliminator or not, but my forte is stats and probabilities. Unfortunately my usefullness came too little too late. My infamy screwed us over in the end. I wonder what would have happened if I hadn't been such a terrible player in the beginning.

To all the eliminators, well done. That was a game well played. 

To all the people dead from inactivity, you probably lost us the game, but no hard feelings. That last cycle was amazing. It was really tense.

To all the villagers who were killed by lynch, more precisely by me, I apoligize. My bad rep lost us the game, plus you had to die. Sorry.

To Hael, Well done. This was a well made game, I think we all learned a little bit. And the items were extremely well implemented. It adds something to the game rather than it just be pure discussion the entire time without adding mechanics taking away from the purpose of developing discussion based skills. Well done!

Overall, I really like this game. Especially since this was my first game coming back to the Shard. The first 12-13 games I played way back when sort of helped me, but I think that I really needed this game to get myself back in the flow of things. Thanks everyone who played and organized  to help make it such a fun game.

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1 hour ago, Nyali said:

Props to Kynedath for that post on the last day which was totally correct in every way, and a great strategy. Unfortunately, it didn't sway Stick. Still, it was a really good post and tactic.

My last post, the one that kinda went like 'I'm okay with my vote', was posted at like, 5:30 am, and I was barely awake. I usually slept six hours before turnover for this game, but last night I managed to get on for a few minutes. And to be honest, I whatever I read of Kyne's post sorta flew over my head (sorry Kynedath) XD I was looking for last minute vote changes and when I didn't find any, I should've known something was off, since I was positively sure JUQ would change his. But alas, sleep overtook my mind...Now that I read the post, it makes sense...a lot.

I enjoyed the game though. And I think we should have more of them like this (conversation and analysis based, without PM's or roles), not all the time, but I'd like to play games like this every once in a while.

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5 minutes ago, I_am_a_Stick said:

My last post, the one that kinda went like 'I'm okay with my vote', was posted at like, 5:30 am, and I was barely awake.

My first post of the cycle, I posted super early my time as well. JUQ came up with a great strategy for the last turn, but I misread it because I was out of it, and voted for the wrong person. I was supposed to vote for JUQ, for one xD

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@Elims, I'm flattered that you consider me a good analyst, but I didn't want to be killed so early for it. :( I like these discussion games!

@Hael, thanks for running this game. :) It was fun to play in, even if all of my reads ended up wrong. <_<

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Got to say, I enjoyed sending in joke orders, though :P What the M'Hael got:

1.

Mus squeaked dubiously as the much-abused and crumpled letter exchanged hands. Kjartan grunted in acknowledgement. "Kjartan does not much like this either, Mus!" He declared, inhaling expressively. "There is a stink of evil somewhere!" He sniffed at the man. "And, Mus thinks you should take a shower."



He strode on in, a hand to his claymore, ready to stick a boot to the backsides of evil in the Stendarr's name.

2.

Kasimir - Cycle One - Orders:

Unfortunately, Kjartan was informed he could not beat the Dunmer's face in. Also, there were two of them. Kjartan did not like this. All the Dunmer looked the same to him, and two evil stinky Dunmer meant more rears to be kicked in the name of Stendarr!

Mus nestled deep on his perch, contentedly gnawing on a piece of cheese from Kjartan's pockets. The Voice of Stendarr was thus, for the moment, silent. Kjartan did not like this. He liked his evil blatant and creepy and easily dealt with by a simple kick to the rear. Or, when in doubt, a blow from his sword, or even a punch in the face, or just a good thorough thrashing with the shiny end of Stendarr's Toothpick...

Speaking of which, the staff shifted across his back, and Kjartan had to rework the harness so it didn't chafe. Stabbed people with red handprints was all and very well, since it meant there was more evil about to be smited - smitten? smote? - but Kjartan didn't like the look of the dagger. People hiding in the shadows and stabbing other people were difficult to smite. Or to kick. Or to club.

As the others continued to argue and point fingers at each other, Kjartan returned to the business of exploring the House the Manor. There was some lingering stink of evil about this place - he was certain of it! And then there was that evil painting he needed to chastise, in Stendarr's name!
 



Action: Find and punish evil (!) painting :P



3.

Kasimir - Cycle Two - Orders:

Kjartan scowled down at the floating paintbrushes, scrawling lewd diagrams on the walls. He disapproved of this. Paintbrushes were meant to be gnawed on by gigantic space hamsters, not--not doing whatever they were supposed to. "Mus?" he called out.

Already, Mus was peering out of his pocket at the floating paintbrushes. One of them had begun to draw a very crude impression of an extremely strange figure with lots of tentacles. Kjartan did not like this. He drew his claymore and slashed at it, but the floating paintbrush seemed very agile and his blow missed.

He roared and struck again. It was evil! He would punish it in Stendarr's name! Mus squeaked encouragingly as Kjartan struck, again and again, but each time, his blows merely swiped through empty air, failing to make contact. Finally, a two-handed sweep severed one paintbrush. Kjartan thought that would have been the end of it, except that the halves of that particular paintbrush simply appeared to reform and then there was one paintbrush again, scribbling lines on the wall in blood-red paint:

REDRUM REDRUM REDRUM REDRUM REDRUM

The other paintbrush was engaged in equally cryptic activity, and Kjartan could already make out its handiwork on the wall:

NOW IT BLEEDS
THE KING IN CRIMSON COMES WITH THE NIGHT
THE MOTHER HEARS ALL AND THE LISTENER WEEPS


Kjartan snatched one of the paintbrushes, snapped it, and cast it underfoot and stomped on it with his hobnailed leather boots, listening to the crunch of shattered wood. At last, when it was quiescent, he stopped. There were nothing but fragmented splinters of wood beneath his boot.

Time to bring the Boot of Stendarr to the other paintbrush!
 


Order: Punish evil floating paintbrushes! :P 

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Another game of Haels has come to a close and once again the Traitors win.  Hmm, there might be a pattern here.

Congratulations Traitors.  Enjoy all the booty you are looting from our corpses.  Many thanks and upvotes to Hael for another of his games that teaches us that discussion is the core of our games and not roles.  That and our fantastic community of players.

If anyone would like to try their hand at running a game, please get a hold of
 
GammaWilson, Metacognition or myself. Not only will we get you added to the list, but we'd also be more than willing to help out in any way we can.

You can also ask questions and get some hints and feedback from everyone over here in our 
Art of Game Creation thread as well. With all the games that we've run so far, we have plenty of experienced GMs that can help you refine any game you're thinking about!

For those wanting to play, 
MR20: With Ruin Beside Us is open for sign ups but will be starting soon so feel free to join in the fun.

Thanks again to everyone that played and we look forward to killing seeing you in future games!

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