[AU Spoilers] Khriss and Silverlight

[PallonianFire]

So we got our first mention of Silverlight in the Drominad system intro a few days back, and it certainly seemed that context was a big clue that Silverlight is indeed the Restaurant. Today another intro popped up on Google Play, and this one makes it even clearer:

"Indeed, I am convinced that without the Lord Ruler’s oppression of technology on the planet for a thousand years, Scadrial would have eclipsed all others in scientific learning and progress—all on its own, without the interaction between societies we enjoy in Silverlight."

Additionally, this really does sound like Khriss is writing from Silverlight itself. It makes sense that she'd post up there during her exile from Taldain, but I hadn't really considered where she lives, before this.

[Pagerunner]

Yeah, it definitely sounds like Silverlight isn't a planet.

I don't know if we're discussing the rest of the Scadrian essay in this topic, but here are a couple of other things I found interesting:

• There have been worse disasters in the cosmere than TLR and Sazed basically firebombing the planet. Yikes.
• Humankind predates the arrival of the Shards on all but two planets. This one, and... what's the other one? Roshar, maybe? That means there's not a rogue Shard running around creating minor Shardworlds; what could it have been? Adonalsium? Or something else?
• There are non-human Vessels (since Khriss points out that both those Shards were human before their Ascension)
• Yolen is an earth analogue, and the cosmere standard (except for the 'fain life,' which won't mean much for those who haven't read the Liar of Partinel excerpts)
• There had been more users of the Well of Ascension (I think Vin would have been the 4th cycle, assuming that Preservation betrayed Ruin soon after the Shattering, which means there would have been 2 before Rashek)
• Khriss calls herself an 'Arcanist.' I like that term, and think it would make a great term for us hardcore fans.
• Someone named 'Guyn' has provided star charts. He appears to be Khriss's astronomer contact. Probably from Silverlight?
• I can't decide if the interactions of Scadrial's magic with 'natural physics' refers to Realmatics (which Khriss would view as natural), or a sneaky remark about time bubbles and all the analysis that has been done by certain forum members.

A lot of cool stuff...

 

[Eki]

10 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

There had been more users of the Well of Ascension (I think Vin would have been the 4th cycle, assuming that Preservation betrayed Ruin soon after the Shattering, which means there would have been 2 before Rashek)

Really? I thought Mistborn was closer to 10000 years after the Shattering, and it would be ~1024 years between cycles.

[PallonianFire]

27 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

Yolen is an earth analogue, and the cosmere standard (except for the 'fain life,' which won't mean much for those who haven't read the Liar of Partinel excerpts)

I'm actually really excited about that little tidbit. I was planning on going for a WoB on the coming signing tour re: whether fain life and trune rings were going to stay canon

[Pagerunner]

41 minutes ago, Eki said:

Really? I thought Mistborn was closer to 10000 years after the Shattering, and it would be ~1024 years between cycles.

I'm assuming Stormlight prologue was relatively soon after the Shattering; 4500 years, back off 300 years from Alloy of Law, gives 4200 years. 4 cycles, with a few extra years for Preservation and Ruin's original deal to play out.  I think the whole cycle is 10,000, with Mistborn about halfway. I can look for specifics quotes later.

[PallonianFire]

1 minute ago, Pagerunner said:

I think the whole cycle is 10,000, with Mistborn about halfway. I can look for specifics quotes later.

That sounds right to me, though I don't know where I saw it. I'm pretty bad with the timeline stuff, though. I thought Shadows For Silence took place way before Mistborn, but I guess it's after Warbreaker, for instance.

[WeiryWriter]

Actually if I remember correctly Brandon once placed the Prelude as about 6000 years post-Shattering, with the stipulation that he didn't have his timeline on hand so didn't want to necessarily canonize that. Regardless it's safe to say the Prelude did not take place "relatively soon after the Shattering" as that would not leave room for several thousand years of Desolations.

Edit: Here's that WoB:

Quote

leiftinspace

Can you tell me how long it was from the Sshattering of Adonalsium to the prelude of The Way of Kings when the Heralds abandoned the Oathpact?

Brandon Sanderson

Current timeline, which I have NOT canonized, is around 6,000 years... I have not finished with my outline document yet.

leiftinspace

'Cause I've looked at the current chronology and it's very, very spotty...

Brandon Sanderson

Yes it is... the real trick is... making sure that I fit in, for instance, White Sand and things with the proper amount... because I haven't released that book series yet, I have to make sure while we're doing the graphic novel, that it fits the chronology, which is why I can't quite canonize things yet.

leiftinspace

That one takes place before The Way of Kings doesn't it?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes.

leiftinspace

'Cause I know one of the worldhoppers from there shows up in The Way of Kings...

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, White Sand is one of the very earliest.

 

[Kingsdaughter613]

Also, the prologue actually takes place closer to 5000 years before SA begins. The years are Rosharan and are slightly off. Scadrian years are closest to Earth standard.

[Chaos]

We have also known there were people prior to Rashek who held the Well of Ascension, though they didn't hold it in just the same way as Rashek and Vin did. They were more like protectors. I'll try and find the quote.

[Yata]

6 hours ago, Chaos said:

We have also known there were people prior to Rashek who held the Well of Ascension, though they didn't hold it in just the same way as Rashek and Vin did. They were more like protectors. I'll try and find the quote.

This made a question:

If someone who Ascend with the Well didn't use the power or release it. Will he/she be able to keep it for a long time and expend it in a long periodo of time ?

[ScarletSabre]

Well now. This. Is. Iiiiiiiiinteresting.

Quote

Because of this, the flora and fauna on Scadrial are very similar to what you’ll find on Yolen. (The non-fain parts, of course.) It is also very similar to Yolen in size and gravitation, both being exactly at 1.0 cosmere standard.

So the existence of fain parts of Yolen is still canon, amd the size and gravitation of both Yolen and Scadrial are the standard for the Cosmere. I wonder if there are planets with increased gravity, which will have humans with higher bone and muscle density to compensate.

Quote

Scadrial, another dishardic planet, is characterized by a host of unique features .

New term coined! Dishardic.... so this would encompass Sel before the splintering, and does that make Roshar Trishardic?

Quote

It is one of only two places in the cosmere where humankind does not predate the arrival of Shards.

So humans on every other planet predates the arrival of Shards.... though she doesn't specifically say "planets", but "places". I wonder if an off-world settlement happened before the Shattering? Perhaps Silverlight was a space station from one of those planets with humans that predate the Shards.

Quote

Indeed, I am convinced that without the Lord Ruler’s oppression of technology on the planet for a thousand years, Scadrial would have eclipsed all others in scientific learning and progress—all on its own, without the interaction between societies we enjoy in Silverlight.

Interaction between societies.... This makes me squee so hard. It implies that in Silverlight, we will already see the mingling of cultures between Worldhoppers. Terrismen showing people from Sel the colours of their robes, Forgers creating silver for Threnodites to take back and make a profit on, Sand Masters refining glass and other silicates for Fabrials.... Silverlight is going to be a hodgepodge of the Cosmere and I am so excite.

[Argent]

3 hours ago, Rawrbert said:

New term coined! Dishardic.... so this would encompass Sel before the splintering, and does that make Roshar Trishardic?

Eh, I wouldn't even call it a term. No more than "bilingual" is a term - it technically is, but I don't find it all that exciting. It's more of a natural language adaptation, I think.

[Pagerunner]

I've been thinking about the second place that humans didn't exist before the Shards. Could this be the slight reference to Nalthis that Peter said we'd get? Humans there are different than humans elsewhere - without their Breath, they are less, they are Drabs. Did Endowment take an existing human civilization and change them? Or did she create a new one? (Or, somehow, did they always have Breath?)

[PallonianFire]

4 hours ago, Rawrbert said:

Perhaps Silverlight was a space station from one of those planets with humans that predate the Shards.

To be fair here, Brandon did say that it's not a space station. My best guess is that it's a Cognitive Realm city.

[VirtuousTraveller]

21 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

I've been thinking about the second place that humans didn't exist before the Shards. Could this be the slight reference to Nalthis that Peter said we'd get? Humans there are different than humans elsewhere - without their Breath, they are less, they are Drabs. Did Endowment take an existing human civilization and change them? Or did she create a new one? (Or, somehow, did they always have Breath?)

IIRC breath in general is a genetic aspect of humans on Nalthis.  With a single unshattered shard, I like the idea that Nalthis is the second place of created humans!

[ScarletSabre]

1 hour ago, Argent said:

Eh, I wouldn't even call it a term. No more than "bilingual" is a term - it technically is, but I don't find it all that exciting. It's more of a natural language adaptation, I think.

True, but it's still nice to have a defined term for a planet with more than one Shard overseeing it.

20 minutes ago, PallonianFire said:

To be fair here, Brandon did say that it's not a space station. My best guess is that it's a Cognitive Realm city.

And yeah, I got a little carried away there... but I did say WAS, so to try and turn that slip of the tongue into an awesome idea, perhaps Silverlight was a spaceship/spacestation from one of the Pre-Shattering human planets, and upon the Shattering, was blasted into a planet, or into the Cognitive, or even Spiritual Realm, embedding itself there and becoming a city.

[PallonianFire]

49 minutes ago, Rawrbert said:

And yeah, I got a little carried away there... but I did say WAS, so to try and turn that slip of the tongue into an awesome idea, perhaps Silverlight was a spaceship/spacestation from one of the Pre-Shattering human planets, and upon the Shattering, was blasted into a planet, or into the Cognitive, or even Spiritual Realm, embedding itself there and becoming a city.

Lol. Yeah, I think we can count out the possibility of space tech. Khriss talks about how Scadrial advanced versus any other planet, even despite the LR's repression. I don't see her making a big deal about that if there were worlds that had space stations before the Shattering.

[cometaryorbit]

19 hours ago, Rawrbert said:

 and does that make Roshar Trishardic?

I think Roshar only actually has 2 Shards. Odium is on Braize, though he messes with Roshar.

[Jofwu]

Quick question first... Where is this coming from?

On 11/14/2016 at 4:57 PM, Pagerunner said:

There had been more users of the Well of Ascension (I think Vin would have been the 4th cycle, assuming that Preservation betrayed Ruin soon after the Shattering, which means there would have been 2 before Rashek)

The amazement at Scadrial's technological development is confusing me a little bit. I was under the impression from Harmony that their world is actually lagging behind, right? Does Harmony just have really high expectations? Is he wrong about their tech level? It comes across like Khris is just impressed that with where they're at given how much they've had to deal with... But that just doesn't fit, in my opinion, with the tone offered by Harmony. Am I the only one getting that sense?

Do we know when Arcanum Unbounded is being written? Because this all makes me wonder if it's dated sometime after Mistborn Era 2.

[Pagerunner]

5 minutes ago, jofwu said:

Quick question first... Where is this coming from?

Here's the section that I was specifically referring to:

Quote

Periodically throughout Scadrial’s history, a man or woman gained access to vast amounts of power, with incredible effects. The most obvious evidence of this is the fact that the star charts Guyn has so kindly provided list two orbits for Scadrial. The planet was literally moved at various points by individuals wielding immense amounts of Investiture.

If it were just TLR and Vin, I would find that phrasing to be somewhat awkward. "Periodically," to me, necessitates at least three events. Any two points in time can define a period, but a third shows periodicity. The phrase 'a man or woman' also doesn't seem to jive; I would expect to say "a man and a woman gained access," since it was just the two of them.

But, you make a good point, it's not incontrovertible from the text, it's more that I would expect the wording to be different if it weren't the case. It's not as clear as my first impression. So, I'd be willing to walk my statement back.

[Jondesu]

2 hours ago, Pagerunner said:

Here's the section that I was specifically referring to:

If it were just TLR and Vin, I would find that phrasing to be somewhat awkward. "Periodically," to me, necessitates at least three events. Any two points in time can define a period, but a third shows periodicity. The phrase 'a man or woman' also doesn't seem to jive; I would expect to say "a man and a woman gained access," since it was just the two of them.

But, you make a good point, it's not incontrovertible from the text, it's more that I would expect the wording to be different if it weren't the case. It's not as clear as my first impression. So, I'd be willing to walk my statement back.

I would also think that virtually confirms that there were others that used the Well, but not that they did anything as drastic as moving the planet like Vin, Rashek, and Sazed all did (IIRC, Vin didn't push it closer or further from the sun, though, just rotated it, so I'm not sure that would have registered in the star charts, nor would there have been much in the way of records before Sazed fixed it anyways).  Other users may have been equally insidious as Rashek (perhaps there was a reason that Alendi and his culture were more advanced than the Terris, and even why there were fewer Allomancers in that time, if perhaps there had been more at some other point in Scadrial's history).  Perhaps one of the previous users of the Well even created/distilled the Lerasium while they were there, if they had enough knowledge about what the power of the Well actually was.

[Mason Wheeler]

With all the discussion of the references to the well of ascension, I'm surprised no one noticed the other salient bit here:

Quote

This is a powerful magic, and one where humans themselves have often had access to grand bursts of strength. I would challenge one to identify another planet, save only Roshar, where one can find such strength of Investiture so commonly in the hands of mortals.

So there's something that happens on Roshar where god-level strength comparable to an Ascension ends up "commonly in the hands of mortals"?!?

[Glamdring804]

I'm calling it now. SIlverlight is an ancient, severely damaged starship that was abandoned somewhere. Khriss's group (which is probably not the 17th) discovered it and decided to make it their base of operations.

Speculation of course, but this is the most immediate, most awesome idea that popped into my head as I read the essay.

[CosmereQuestioner]

Perhaps the ascension comparable power has to do with the heralds? we haven't seen the scope of their powers, but Brandon has hinted that they can do really cool things.  Maybe not as powerful as using the well of ascension, but theres 10 of them constantly powerful, so it could be similar in terms of investiture.

[PallonianFire]

36 minutes ago, Glamdring804 said:

I'm calling it now. SIlverlight is an ancient, severely damaged starship that was abandoned somewhere. Khriss's group (which is probably not the 17th) discovered it and decided to make it their base of operations.

Still think it's a Cognitive Realm city. Brandon himself has called it a city, so...