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The End [DT Spoilers]


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7 hours ago, Kairos said:

First off, totally missed Bastille's letter. I was in shock. Like, serious shock. Could not believe it. I mean, I could, it sounded like Alcatraz, but seriously. Cruel. Then I thought to check with all of you wonderful people. So relieved. 

Awesome puns, great meta, loved the footnotes, so many great references. The chapter four wanting to add an extra o to his name was great. Bet Brandon had to fight his editors on that one. 

List of ways to die was amazing. Anyone else catch balefire on there? 

Totally forgot about the Bob joke and the Balefire, which just shows how late I stayed up because those were my two favorite jokes. 

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I assumed that the story had to pick up again after the first ending. I was listening to the audiobook and reading on the Kindle app on my ipad (disappointing for them not to be synced like the first book was when it was re-released.) The audiobook read the acknowledgments, which is very rare, so I had a feeling that something was coming. Then I got to Bastille's note and the Kindle app still had hundreds of footnotes to scroll through, so I got very confused, but also happy. 

At first, I couldn't tell if that was just a joke or if he was really going to continue the series. However, the more I think about it, along with all the reasons you guys have mentioned, it actually makes a lot of sense. It seemed wildly generous to his fans of him to buy back the rights to Alcatraz, but if he was planning another series, it's still a rare thing, but it makes more sense. I also think that it will be more than one book, both because he spent the money to reacquire the series and because so many more questions were raised by this book. I don't think you'd start expanding the mystery, if you were planning to only right a single sequel.

I must say that I'll actually miss Alcatraz as the narrator. I'm sure he could get annoying to some people, but I re-listened to the series this week, and Ramon de Ocampo does a great job with the humor of the book (I especially liked the way he would interject the footnotes, in a way that had the perfect amount of seriousness and obnoxiousness.) I think it'll be interesting to hear Bastille's voice, though, and see Alcatraz and all the Smedrys through her eyes.

Great book! While I would have enjoyed a true ending, I am glad that we're not completely done with this story.

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On 10.9.2016 at 4:41 AM, LeftVash said:

That was great! The first half of the book was.... Not my thing. I struggled with how abrupt and SO very full of jokes it was. It got better though. I loved the references to other authors, I caught Abercrombie, Naomi Novik, and obviously Rowling. The Mistborn cover was great. I knew Dif was a traitor. I like that Brandon is stealing Pratchett's footnotes. 

Im really glad I found Bastille's letter.... I'd be pretty ticked if I hadn't....

Abercrombie?!

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Wow! Just finished it. I think the footnotes were put in there for eBook readers -- makes it look like there are several more pages to go  -- I thought the acks, etc. were fake, till I hit the footnotes, and then I groaned, then started clicking the next page button to blaze through them in the hope that there would be something at the end. Brandon really outdid himself with this series. I wonder if we will get 5 Bastille books to  loosely mimic SA....

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I figured something was up with D'If. His name is from the Chateau D'If which is the prison from the Count of Monte Cristo. The Count was disguised after escaping from D'If, so I thought it might be something along those lines. Didn't figure out that he was Biblioden though. After reading this thread, I wonder if there might be a tie to Alcatraz the First (maybe the brother he killed?)... He would need some kind of talent to be able to still be alive... He also references fighting Alcatraz's "great-great-whatever-grandfather". I don't have the reference, but isn't that how Alcatraz refered to Alcatraz the First?

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20 minutes ago, quizno43 said:

I figured something was up with D'If. His name is from the Chateau D'If which is the prison from the Count of Monte Cristo. The Count was disguised after escaping from D'If, so I thought it might be something along those lines. Didn't figure out that he was Biblioden though. After reading this thread, I wonder if there might be a tie to Alcatraz the First (maybe the brother he killed?)... He would need some kind of talent to be able to still be alive... He also references fighting Alcatraz's "great-great-whatever-grandfather". I don't have the reference, but isn't that how Alcatraz refered to Alcatraz the First?

Possible, but Biblioden is stated to build the evil librarians about 500 zears ago, while Alcatraz I. was much older - something about 2500 years. Also, Alcatraz I. didn't look murdered.

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Well, that was a shocker. 

This book didn't turn dark quickly, it turned dark instantly. It was just... everything was going fine, and then nothing was! Did not expect that. I expected death, and I expected darkness, but not of this magnitude. 

I am glad for a Bastille book. Alcatraz, while a fun character, is not as much my type of character as I imagine Bastille would be. So I am looking forward to that.

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17 hours ago, quizno43 said:

I figured something was up with D'If. His name is from the Chateau D'If which is the prison from the Count of Monte Cristo. The Count was disguised after escaping from D'If, so I thought it might be something along those lines. Didn't figure out that he was Biblioden though. After reading this thread, I wonder if there might be a tie to Alcatraz the First (maybe the brother he killed?)... He would need some kind of talent to be able to still be alive... He also references fighting Alcatraz's "great-great-whatever-grandfather". I don't have the reference, but isn't that how Alcatraz refered to Alcatraz the First?

Ooo, nice catch.

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20 minutes ago, Lightning said:

Nice catch about D'If!  Note that since France doesn't exist, neither could the Chateau D'If.  Another reason to suspect that he wasn't a true Smedry.

But where the Sands was then Bastille built?

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3 minutes ago, WeiryWriter said:

Well it is important to remember that Bastille (and by extension "Dif") aren't named after prisons, they are named after people whose names the Librarians took and used as prison names. So the fact that France doesn't actually exist doesn't really matter.

Well that's true to an extent. But if the Librarians took Bastille's namesake and named a prison after it, where's the prison?

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Just now, Sand Master said:

Well that's true to an extent. But if the Librarians took Bastille's namesake and named a prison after it, where's the prison?

It may not actually exist. Whether or not it actually does doesn't matter as much as the fact that the Librarians say it exists.

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So, I'm one of those guys who missed the folded over end page until I came here. 

 

And I was absolutely gutted. Like, completely. I was lying in bed, trying to go to sleep thinking 'how could he do that to us?'

it was brutal, and brilliant. I'm still feeling it. 

 

Absolutely loved this book. The humour kept getting better, and the story more fun, when WHAM. Grandpa Smedry gets shot in the head. 

And suddenly everything goes horribly wrong. 

 

I can't wait for the Bastille books now. 

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First, what an amazing job by Hayley Lazo. The last drawing of Alcatraz in the book (page 280 in my book) is just perfect. How someone could depict such complex emotions so perfectly in a relatively simple line drawing is beyond my understanding. Words fail me. Hope you all agree.

Second, how about the Potted Plant as the author's photo? I think that was mentioned in each of the other 4 books; don't recall it in DT but maybe it's there too.

@ hafje & others: "the ritual at the end of the book" - Biblioden was making a "blood-forged" lens, right? Like used by Dark Oculators and Scriveners Bones? My question is, will Attica's Smedry Talent affect what the lens does / how it works? I also wondered if a similar fate befell the "Smedry family" that Dif/Biblioden killed to create his false story and infiltrate the Free Kingdoms, like maybe that's where the evil lenses in Book 2 came from. How horrible.

@ Sand Master: "in the same way as becoming a Smedry gives you a Talent, now it also makes you an Oculator" - Great theory! Also, I totally missed "Thesaurus" - thanks!

@ zas678: "his name's similarity to Dilaf" - Wow I missed that ! Good call!

@ Dramatus: "When Alcatraz looked into her soul..." - Absolutely agree with you. Both Shasta and Atticus are portrayed as extremely complex characters, especially for a tween novel. I love how Brandon raises the bar and doesn't write "down" to that audience - they are quite sophisticated.

@ junior: "has Brandon Sanderson been holding that little item in reserve since book 3?" - I just reread the series before starting DT, and there are penguin references in every book, in some way or another, but none as  blatant as the one you caught in Book 3. :)

@ Lightning: "Biblioden's backstory!  I mean, sinking an entire continent of followers?" - Atlantis is my guess.

@ LeftVash: "...stealing Pratchett's footnotes" - Thanks for this, as I didn't know Pratchett used them. I know Brandon admires his humor, so how fitting that he'd honor Pratchett who recently passed away (last year IIRC).

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On ‎9‎/‎14‎/‎2016 at 0:20 PM, Lightning said:

Nice catch about D'If!  Note that since France doesn't exist, neither could the Chateau D'If.  Another reason to suspect that he wasn't a true Smedry.

Biblioden was impersonating a real person though.  He would have taken the real Dif's name, for the disguise.

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I came out of 2 years of inactivity on this forum because of this book. What does that say about me? I literally have no idea. 

Anyways, this book killed me. You see that corpse on the floor? That's me. (Attica criiiii) I knew absolutely nothing about this book going into it, so the last few pages were a surprise to me. Bastille SMEDRY?? My biggest ship has been confirmed!! 

But now, to the serious part of this post. I've been wondering about this since book 1, and I reeeeeally need an answer. 

How the heck do dark oculators get their powers???? I need to know this. 

(Also, if anyone else wants to plan Alcatraz and Bastille's wedding with me, let me know. I've already sent out invitations)

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2 hours ago, Sand Master said:

I imagine Dark Oculators get their powers the same way as anyone. They just happen to be evil. Just as Librarians can be good, some Oculators can be evil.

Yeah, but I thought they had to be a Smedry? I've read the series like 4 times where did I miss that they didn't have to be Smedrys?

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44 minutes ago, MISTaken said:

Yeah, but I thought they had to be a Smedry? I've read the series like 4 times where did I miss that they didn't have to be Smedrys?

Anyone can be born an Oculator (it's hereditary I believe, so it has to be in your family line somewhere), it's just far more common in Smedrys.

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