Oversleep Posted June 12, 2016 Report Share Posted June 12, 2016 (edited) The more we learn about Three Metallic Arts, the more powers of TLR become broken. Let's break it up in a few steps, as I think we don't really appreciate the full power of a Fullborn.The Compounder First, we learned that not only he was an extremely powerful Mistborn whose power exceeds the power of Lerasiumborns by far, but we also learned that he's a Full Feruchemist who never runs out of the Feruchemical attributes. Infinite Feruchemy storages + extremely powerful Allomancy. The Savant Then we learned he was a savant in nearly all metals. Not really groundshaking revelation, but power is power. The Twinborn When we learned that certain powers form a synergy, like Crasher combo, which makes both Skimmer power and Coinshot power far more powerful than any of them would be on their own. If there are any other such combinations (like suspected Soothing/Rioting + Identity or maybe Connection), he has them. All of them.Now, there are also those so-called 'Twinborn effects'. Ars Arcanum notes that they may be not as noticeable as the effect of mixing Surges on Roshar, but they still are there. Fullborn has all 256 of them. I do not know what they are or even how useful or how powerful those may be, but nevertheless he has them. EDIT: Thanks to Yata we know that's not the case. The Soulbearer Then we got to the Bands Of Mourning and we learned what a Soulbearer can really do. Soulbearers can store their Innate Investiture and later tap them... Which means they can store their abilities. And later strenghten them. Forget multiple spikes, a Soulbearer Twinborn can just strenghten his Allomancy several times at ease!The Nicrosil Compounder Now, not only it's possible to strenghten abilities several times by just tapping nicrosil... No, a Fullborn can rusting COMPOUND IT. And TLR's base power level already was 'extremely powerful'... Now, we can suspect that he wasn't so powerful because he didn't have access to all of the metals, as they couldn't have been produced in Final Empire. The thing is, there is a WoB stating that TLR wasn't using duraluminium for his feats, but it seems unreasonable that he was using nicrosil Feruchemy (as it would be one of the hardest metals to obtain nad make). So, the power he has shown us was only his normal, base power? Oh, and he's a Sliver on top of all that. Anyway, we've got another Fullborn running around. While his Allomancy may be just of an ordinary Mistborn, the rest of the things I listed here matches as well. Oh, and Kelsier is a Sliver too. I believe he can do much more than what we have seen done with the Bands... If he Compounded enough nicrosil, he could be always at mistpoint. That's a lot of terrifying power. This is really immense, godlike power. I wonder where did he go? Edited November 11, 2016 by Oversleep 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king of nowhere Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 yeah, tlr was immensely powerful. his only weakness is that iif you somehow manage to remove his metalminds, he loses almost all his powers and he is totally lost because he has no idea how to use his reduced powers, and all his instincts scream for him to do stuff he can't do anymore. plus, he can't even push back his own metalminds because they are too heavily invested for someone who is not a soulbearer or is not tapping the mists. but anyway, only a coinshot/nicrosil compounder, or a coinshot tapping the mists, can push on his metalminds. and it would require tlr to be sure enough of himself that he won't kill immediately his opponent. where are you going to even find one to challenge him? Oh, about the nicrosil thing, I believe he made some purified nicrosil for himself when he had the power of the well (it would have been a trivial matter at the time). Then, without any way to make more of the metal, he could not compound, but since he was already immensely powerful on his own, and he was rarely using his powers, he could have just stored investiture the normal way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecthelion III Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Is TLR The Lord Ruler? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 yeah, tlr was immensely powerful. his only weakness is that iif you somehow manage to remove his metalminds, he loses almost all his powers and he is totally lost because he has no idea how to use his reduced powers, and all his instincts scream for him to do stuff he can't do anymore. plus, he can't even push back his own metalminds because they are too heavily invested for someone who is not a soulbearer or is not tapping the mists. but anyway, only a coinshot/nicrosil compounder, or a coinshot tapping the mists, can push on his metalminds. and it would require tlr to be sure enough of himself that he won't kill immediately his opponent. where are you going to even find one to challenge him? Oh, about the nicrosil thing, I believe he made some purified nicrosil for himself when he had the power of the well (it would have been a trivial matter at the time). Then, without any way to make more of the metal, he could not compound, but since he was already immensely powerful on his own, and he was rarely using his powers, he could have just stored investiture the normal way. So it's entirely possible that he is less than his normal power level at any given point in time. And he's still unstoppable. Great. Considering that he can bullet time both physically and mentally as well as having both physical and investiture senses heightened to extreme degrees, his one weakness would actually be nearly impossible to exploit if he wasn't so cocky all the time. And he made sure nobody had the resources or strength to do so the normal way anyway. Vin won quite literally by divine intervention. That had been set into motion since her birth of course, but if she was literally any other mistborn she would have died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) So it's entirely possible that he is less than his normal power level at any given point in time. And he's still unstoppable. Great. I find unlikely he stored his power during his "show times" on screen. Anyway I don't think he used at all unknown metals (for the TFE time)...After all someone have to notice the presence of unknown metal when they inspected the body and his metalminds Edited June 13, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 So it's entirely possible that he is less than his normal power level at any given point in time. And he's still unstoppable. Great. Considering that he can bullet time both physically and mentally as well as having both physical and investiture senses heightened to extreme degrees, his one weakness would actually be nearly impossible to exploit if he wasn't so cocky all the time. And he made sure nobody had the resources or strength to do so the normal way anyway. Vin won quite literally by divine intervention. That had been set into motion since her birth of course, but if she was literally any other mistborn she would have died. Honestly, seeing how extreme the bullet timing gets in BoM, he probably could have killed Vin in the time it took his metalminds to pull from his body and grab them with his hands to continue tapping, if he actually took the situation seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) Honestly, seeing how extreme the bullet timing gets in BoM, he probably could have killed Vin in the time it took his metalminds to pull from his body and grab them with his hands to continue tapping, if he actually took the situation seriously. He was in pure Spiritual Shock...For some seconds He didn't actually know what he have to do Edited June 13, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 He was in pure Spiritual Shock...For some seconds He didn't actually know what he have to do As I said, if he took the situation seriously. I just find it shocking that the Lord Ruler was so powerful that even with literal divine intervention Vin needed the element of suprise to kill him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) As I said, if he took the situation seriously. I just find it shocking that the Lord Ruler was so powerful that even with literal divine intervention Vin needed the element of suprise to kill him. Hey now wait a minute! In another thread I proved that a sniper rifle with aluminum jacketed bullets, with an aluminum magnesium core, head shotting the Lord Ruler from miles away would kill him. So see? All you need is far superior technology than the time period allows, an impossible vantage point as the tallest building in Luthadel is the Lord Ruler's castle itself, and the hope that none of his inquisitors decide to chop off his head to complete negate the problem of liquid aluminum suffusing his brain/skull. So yeah! See? Totally can kill him without divine powers........sorta......lol Edited June 13, 2016 by Pathfinder 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) Hey now wait a minute! In another thread I proved that a sniper rifle with aluminum jacketed bullets, with an aluminum magnesium core, head shotting the Lord Ruler from miles away would kill him. So see? All you need is far superior technology than the time period allows, an impossible vantage point as the tallest building in Luthadel is the Lord Ruler's castle itself, and the hope that none of his inquisitors decide to chop off his head to complete negate the problem of liquid aluminum suffusing his brain/skull. So yeah! See? Totally can kill him without divine powers........sorta......lol mmm and if they knows where he kepth his Goldmind and cut them from the body while he tapped it... whold He completely regrow from a Finger ? (if the Goldmind is a ring of course) PS: he may cut his head (in your idea) or his metalmind (if the mine is possible) alone to allow the regrow PPS: My idea can't work on him... He would have his Atiummind no more... and die. Edited June 13, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 mmm and if they knows where he kepth his Goldmind and cut them from the body while he tapped it... whold He completely regrow from a Finger ? (if the Goldmind is a ring of course) PS: he may cut his head (in your idea) or his metalmind (if the mine is possible) alone to allow the regrow PPS: My idea can't work on him... He would have his Atiummind no more... and die. My only disagreement is if the bullet hits the brain, shatters, and spreads liquid aluminum around preventing healing, The Lord Ruler would not have the motor skills nonetheless the cognitive functions to decide to cut off his own head so he can heal. So as long as he is alone long enough after getting head shotted in this incredibly unlikely scenario, he would die for good lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oversleep Posted June 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) My only disagreement is if the bullet hits the brain, shatters, and spreads liquid aluminum around preventing healing, The Lord Ruler would not have the motor skills nonetheless the cognitive functions to decide to cut off his own head so he can heal. So as long as he is alone long enough after getting head shotted in this incredibly unlikely scenario, he would die for good lol. Okay, I think we agree that even after getting headshoted with an aluminium shattering (shrapnel bullet) TLR will live as long as he can tap his goldminds - I assume that since he already was burned to bones and beheaded on separate occasions, he unconsciously taps gold the moment he's damaged. Picture the scene - TLR is lying on the floor, there's blood everywhere... The question is: was there anybody smart enough to deduce that the only way to save his ruler was to behead him? Maybe an Inquisitor walks in, sees the body in half-alive, half-dead state and whips out his axe. I'm sorry, but the idea that beheading someone is the method to make that person heal is utterly hilarious to me XD "What are you doing?!" "The Lord Ruler has been wounded, my duty is to help him!" "By CUTTING HIS HEAD OFF?! Are you INSANE?!" Edited June 13, 2016 by Oversleep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king of nowhere Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 interesting idea, but i'm not so sure. the level of healing tlr possessed could be enough to retain full cognitive and bodily functioning even without brain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 Feruchemy other than wakefulness requires consciousness though. You can't actually heal without a working brain. Or your head, presumably. Hoid can grow his head back but I'm not sure TLR can. The beheading story was either slightly exaggerated, or it was done with a sword so he can reconnect the severed neck as the sword passed through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 Well at least my logic is that if the head isn't severed within a certain amount of time, the Lord Ruler would be brain dead. His body would keep healing the organ failure, but it couldn't heal what happened to the brain as there would be shards of aluminum as well as liquid aluminum pervading it. Even assuming he could tap gold unconsciously, I am fairly certain he cannot compound unconsciously, so he would run out of healing stores trying to keep his body alive from organs shutting down as there would be no brain activity to keep them going and no artificial machines working them. It would take longer than for others people, but I do still believe it is possible. Then again the reason for my post in this thread wasn't to argue how to kill the Lord Ruler, but to point out how ludicrously hard it would be for a normal person to accomplish it. It would have to take an impossible scenario where the shooter had technology far beyond what was present during his rule, from a position that did not exist in the city, and enough time for him to be brain dead and run out of stores (assume he can as you say unconsciously tap without any brain functions at all) that would not occur as TLR had guards. If all those requirements were met could it be done? I believe yes. Could it realistically ever be accomplished, I think no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 14 hours ago, natc said: Feruchemy other than wakefulness requires consciousness though. You can't actually heal without a working brain. Or your head, presumably. Hoid can grow his head back but I'm not sure TLR can. The beheading story was either slightly exaggerated, or it was done with a sword so he can reconnect the severed neck as the sword passed through. If i remember right we have a WoB that said a Bloodmaker may regrow his own head with enough Healing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king of nowhere Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 2 hours ago, Yata said: If i remember right we have a WoB that said a Bloodmaker may regrow his own head with enough Healing i remember the same, but i wonder, since the brain, source of cognitive activity, is in the head: will it be the body that regrows a head, or the head that regrows a body? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecthelion III Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 (edited) Dragonsteel totally answers that question! (But I can't say anything :zip: ) Edited June 14, 2016 by Ecthelion III Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 Actually in the Cosmere the Brain aren't the source of the Cognitive, the mind is pretty separate by the biology... this is the reason for things like Cognitive Shadow and the "trip" everyone made after death Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windrunner Posted June 15, 2016 Report Share Posted June 15, 2016 I don't think we can say the brain is totally unrelated to a person's Cognitive aspect, otherwise people in the cosmere wouldn't be able to get traumatic brain injuries. Perhaps the brain is the area that allows the body to communicate with its own Cognitive aspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingsdaughter613 Posted June 19, 2016 Report Share Posted June 19, 2016 Or perhaps Traumatic Brain Injuries damage the cognitive aspect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windrunner Posted June 19, 2016 Report Share Posted June 19, 2016 That's possible, it's difficult to say. Whatever the explanation, the brain does have more to do with a person's Cognitive aspect than say an arm would. I'm curious how Brandon actually has the brain explained within the confines of the three Realms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asterion137 Posted June 19, 2016 Report Share Posted June 19, 2016 plus if he was so inclined, he could give his powers to as many people as he wanted in nicrosilminds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landis963 Posted June 20, 2016 Report Share Posted June 20, 2016 8 hours ago, asterion137 said: plus if he was so inclined, he could give his powers to as many people as he wanted in nicrosilminds Where would he get the nicrosil? Actually, better question, where would he get the chromium? And how would he hide it from Ruin? Because if there's a single slip, hello Leecher Inquisitors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted June 20, 2016 Report Share Posted June 20, 2016 (edited) 7 hours ago, Landis963 said: Where would he get the nicrosil? Actually, better question, where would he get the chromium? And how would he hide it from Ruin? Because if there's a single slip, hello Leecher Inquisitors. He may forge a single ring/braclet of Nicrosil while He kept the Well's power. He didn't need to compound Nicrosil, his base power alone would be more than enough to exterminate everyone. But if He manage to store some little part of his Power to use it in the right moment (as to hit the population with Emotional Allomancy or some other "scenic feat"). Also remember that an Leecher may destroy his Allomantic Reserve but... Rashek with his Feruchemy alone would be able to kill a dozen of Inquisitors Edited June 20, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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