Reading Excuses - 4/11/16 - aeromancer - Twin Moon chapters 1-2 (4715 words)

[aeromancer]

This is based on a concept I had a while back. I was getting sick of all the werewolf / vampire things (especially since I know the actual legends. Blood-rose, people!) so I came up with a concept of a moon-based magic system which has every creature of the night all one nice happy snug family – firmly on the side of good. Of course, there has to be some creativity, so the protagonist is part of an organization that gets a unique magic system, which is detailed somewhat. The book’s working title is Twin Moon, because there are two moons on this world.

 

This is the test run of it. I would like to hear your impressions of the protagonist (‘Moon’), as well as how interested you are to read more on top of everything else, like grammar mistakes, syntax, etc.

 

The unnamed protagonist doesn't have a name yet, so just call him "Moon." He's late teens (nineteen).

[kais]

Since this is a test run, I will skip my normal play by play comments and just go to overall discussion.

 

Points of Note

I was thrown off when Moon says he is technically human, since all the text leading up to that was very clearly making a differentiation between humans and him. It was startling enough to throw me out of the narrative. This is problematic because the narrative grabbed me by the shirt and shoved me into the world right from the beginning, and I was not pleased with leaving. Harrumph.

 

I felt a lot of similarities to Elantris in these chapters, with the symbology and line art. I like the homage, and it gives the narrative a comfortable feel.

 

Whenever I read climbing scenes, I always reference Wolfwalker by Tara K. Harper. If you're looking to emulate language that makes a simple climb utterly nerve wracking, that'd be the way to go. Up the stakes! You have witty banter, some probable sexual tension, magic, and a little fear of falling to one's death would really be the icing on the cake.

 

I'm interested in the magic system, and the world building has me hooked. The interaction between Slane and Moon is stilted sometimes, and comes off as very YA teenager-y. If this is the intent, you are doing a great job. Those two are all kinds of awkward. 

 

I liked the dialogue between Eclipse and Moon, and that dialogue alone would have hooked me to read more. I am interested in reading more, and in the world, and will look forward to next week's submission from you!

 

 

Magic System

I wanted to specifically address this, because Sanderson deals so well with magic systems, and its something I've struggled with in my own writing. I'm left after these two chapters with some haze still on the system, and thoughts of Elantris. Is this the kind of magic system that we have a chart for at the beginning of the book (Daughter of the Blood style)? Or is more a system that is so straightforward we don't need a chart (Mistborn)? It'd be worth committing one way or the other, or at least spending some time discussing.

[aeromancer]

Moon is actually fully human, aside from his ability to use Guardian magic. He is a "casual elitist" as the term goes. He is superior to humans (he has magic, for starters) so he does view himself separate from them.

 

In terms of Magic, the system is somewhat simplistic. Ae for destructive magic, Iu for constructive magic. Most of the magic revolves around energy projection.

 

And ... Eclipse. The reader can possibly get an idea of what Eclipse represents, because they have knowledge of what it is.

[kais]

Ooh, if we're only working with the two symbols, then I retract my statement about the magic system commitment. Very straight forward. Seat belts fastened. I am in for the ride.

[aeromancer]

Well, then you have witches, moon/darkwolves, and (possibly) vampiric entities, but who's counting, really?

They all have rather one-dimensional powers, so don't worry about that. 

[kais]

I really wish this forum supported gifs. I really want to gif respond right now. Something witty. Something fantasy. Something on fleek, as it were.

 

Alas, I am left with emojis.     

[krystalynn03]

Hey Aero,

 

Thanks for sharing! I read through this once, and I want to say off the top that I like your narrator. He's got some annoying quirks, like his ego, but they're annoying in a good way. I like it.

 

I look forward to commenting more thoroughly tomorrow when it's not so late for me here!

[king007]

This was such a pleasant read. The narration reminded me of comedy animes. They have similar tones, and I like it!

 

I don't have much to comment on. I found everything to be excellent so far: the characters, their interactions, the world, the writing style, THE PRESENT TENSE! With this as the second lovely submission I read using present tense, I must say that I'm falling in love.

 

Aside from that, you have some brushing off to do in the spelling and grammar department. But they're only minor mistakes and a careful read will sort them out.

I also have two points to argue about: First is I didn't see how the man would choose so rapidly to start fighting Moon. In normal circumstances, that would be uncalled for, which makes it even weirder when Moon is famous for his superior power.

Second is the warning Moon gave to Salane: "You will have to learn quickly, or die." Is it just Moon tricking her again or it's really that dangerous? I saw it as a genuine warning which, considering nothing about the dangers of the spire is spoken of or at least hinted at, came to me abruptly and somehow ruined the mood.

 

I'm looking forward to more from this story. Good luck!

[spieles]

I would like to hear your impressions of the protagonist (‘Moon’).

 

I like Moon - he's a loner - he's resourceful with a sense of humor and a real history going on.

 

My favorite part was actually when the apex predator was hunting him (I like being scared) and he had to warn it off. It upped the stakes and gave weight to the later part when he has to scare Salane into climbing the cliff with him.

 

I will happily read more. You're building an intriguing world. One note I would add now is that I feel like the unique conflict in your story really takes off when he enters the forest and heads to the Spire. And agents/editors are always rattling on about getting right to the conflict. That being said, I enjoyed meeting Salane and George and I thought the fight was good too. 

[aeromancer]

@king007: Writing in present tense in somewhat of a chore, but I felt it was completely worth it, I'm glad you agree. "Learn quickly or die." Yes, Moon is being completely serious. Moon is very bad at tricking people.

 

@spieles: My impression of Moon: Moon is a casual elitist, in the sense that he looks down on humans subconsciously. He's a loner by default, not by choice, so he lacks social skills, and is aware of this. He is very serious by nature, consequently, he takes everything seriously. This means he gets irritated very easily as a result of this, which is the main reason he avoids people. I will point out, though, that he has a very strong sense of duty to his task as Guardian, which is exactly what the name implies.

 

Thank you all for your feedback! I didn't think I'd get such a positive reception.

Edited April 12, 2016 by aeromancer

[krystalynn03]

Chapter 1 Thoughts:
 

I like the narrative voice, like I mentioned last night (Ae and Iu were up for me and I needed to go bed!). The protagonist has a kind of attitude that's fun to read without it going over the top, playing off the ego with cynicism keeps him likeable.

 

I like that kebab guy a lot, though I'm maybe wishing for some kind of set piece in here giving me an idea of the level of technology (doesn't need to be specific at all) just so that I'm not picturing it too much one way or the other and later feeling surprised if I didn't guess right. I wouldn't want any lengthy descriptions or anything like that at all. The pacing feels good for YA.

 

On page 2-3 you use the word sarcastic/sarcasm seven times in eight paragraphs. That needs some tightening.

 

I also like the idea that his ability to perform either healing/destructive magic is ariable with the strength of the moon that night. It's a fun idea, and I look forward to seeing what problems/advantages it gives the protag.

 

I don't really understand his strange rituals for when he does/doesn't speak with hood being on/off. When I first read that bit about it being impolite to talk with the hood on toward the beginning, I was half-expecting him to not be human and require some sort of covering when he talks or something? It was just disorienting.

 

The occasional mentions of the hair seem like you're targeting a lighter note with them, but they distract me, too, a little when I read.

 

 

Chapter 2

 

Did you mean to repeat predator on page 9? The wording seems awkward.

 

I hear a skid, and a howl. Comma splice--take it out.

 

I’ll track down that moonwolf later, Didn't he just think it was darkwolf a minute ago?

 

“It’s dangerous to go alone.” I say. “I’m not leaving you alone down here. You’re coming with me up the Spire.”

 

It's dangerous to go alone...Take this! (Sorry couldn't help it) But more seriously, it doesn't make sense to Moons that she could get there so fast, but I'm still thinking it doesn't make sense that she went out there and wondering why he doesn't press that out of her before making her climb tower with him. Did I miss a detail?

 

 “We aren’t sure what the name means. Every Guardian knows about him. All we know is hat he is not to be trusted. Ever.

 

How close is this man? Shouldn't Moons be whispering?

 

I like the chemistry between the two, both through narration and dialogue.

 

Hope that was useful and hope you submit more soon!

[aeromancer]

Chapter 1 Thoughts:

I like that kebab guy a lot, though I'm maybe wishing for some kind of set piece in here giving me an idea of the level of technology (doesn't need to be specific at all) just so that I'm not picturing it too much one way or the other and later feeling surprised if I didn't guess right. I wouldn't want any lengthy descriptions or anything like that at all. 

 

I don't really understand his strange rituals for when he does/doesn't speak with hood being on/off. When I first read that bit about it being impolite to talk with the hood on toward the beginning, I was half-expecting him to not be human and require some sort of covering when he talks or something? It was just disorienting.

 

The occasional mentions of the hair seem like you're targeting a lighter note with them, but they distract me, too, a little when I read.

 

 

Chapter 2

 

I’ll track down that moonwolf later, Didn't he just think it was darkwolf a minute ago?

 

“It’s dangerous to go alone.” I say. “I’m not leaving you alone down here. You’re coming with me up the Spire.”

 

It's dangerous to go alone...Take this! (Sorry couldn't help it) But more seriously, it doesn't make sense to Moons that she could get there so fast, but I'm still thinking it doesn't make sense that she went out there and wondering why he doesn't press that out of her before making her climb tower with him. Did I miss a detail?

 

 “We aren’t sure what the name means. Every Guardian knows about him. All we know is hat he is not to be trusted. Ever.

 

How close is this man? Shouldn't Moons be whispering?

George uses a stove which is "coals in a clay pot" - so this was actually meant to give a relative idea of the tech age but I guess it fell flat.

So, it seems that a lot of people are surprised that Moon is human. Either I need to make it more clear from the beginning, or actually make him non-human.Oh, and his hair. It may be more important than it sounds. Haven't decided yet.

Moonwolf/darkwolf that's an error.

Hey! Listen! There's a 99% chance you'll get a silver rupee for catching that reference.

... And yeah, Moon should be whispering. Conceited fool isn't.

[krystalynn03]

Clay pot: that makes sense I suppose but I also thought of it as a poverty marker possibly rather than just a tech marker...

If the hair becomes important then it's good that it distracted me because I'll remember it. Either way, I'm in for the ride!

[Kammererite]

Cloak: So the clock is Silver on Silver. Not sure if that would show up to anyone who isn’t 6 inch away.

 

George is trying to give not sell the Kabobs to moon.

 

Yay potions: I like potions in books!

 

Moon being human is a stretch so far with how he talks about humans on page 1. But I think I need to see more on the creature diversity before I am sold on this.

 

On page 9, you contradict yourself by saying the stalker is very dangerous but then retract that in the next line.

 

“Salane cheerfully steps in the very slight light around the Spire where the tree cover does not block”....Phrase is awkward

 

 Running in new boots...Poor Salane, she would be blistered to death. From personal experience you need to break footwear first, not go on a two hour run with it.

 

Salane smiles only when annoyed. This is contradicts previous scenes unless you’re saying that the entire time she’s been on page she has been annoyed (which I don’t buy).

 

Page 16…but claiming to have ‘stalked’ them means that they surprised you know..... I have no ideas what you’re trying to say here.

 

I think the setting need some buffed up descriptions, as I did not have a clear picture. Right know your story could range from stone-age to modern age; however, I lean toward modern based on your word choices (Cart, Market, building, shop, alley)

 

All in all a cool premises. I like the moonwolf...darkwolf difference and the magic seams interesting. I am interested to know more about the powers other than the moon light channelling and the rest of the world.

Cheers

Edited April 14, 2016 by Kammererite

[aeromancer]

Thanks for the review. Most of your points were spot on, however, be aware that this is told from a first person narrative. And Salane is lying about her boots. She just claims she bought them for sixty to annoy Moon. Thank you for the rest of the comments though.

 

I am wondering why no one views Moon blasting a man so hard his ribs are exposed as 'overkill' or 'unnecessary'. I was planning on cutting it as I thought it was violent and out of character, but no one seems to have an issue.

[kais]

 

 

I am wondering why no one views Moon blasting a man so hard his ribs are exposed as 'overkill' or 'unnecessary'. I was planning on cutting it as I thought it was violent and out of character, but no one seems to have an issue.

Personally, I don't know enough about the world to determine what is overkill yet. Maybe people spontaneously heal from stuff like that. Maybe violence is part of life. Maybe they live in absolute peace. It's just too early to make these kinds of judgements.

[Mandamon]

pg 2: "black hair feels mad at me"

--This seems to imply that his hair has a mind of its own.  Not knowing much about this person, I don't know if it's literal, or you're being poetic about his hair.

 

pg 3: sounds like Moon/Hood is rather far along the autistic scale?  He doesn't understand most human emotion?  Either that or not human.

 

Pg 4: order one before every twin moons

-I would think he would remember this himself unless the event is very rare.

-Also, the dialogue tag is in the wrong tense.  It should be "replies"

 

pg 5: I'm not sure what moon- or dark- wolves are or what the difference is, so I'm not sure of the threat level.

 

pg 5: know Salane the best

--really?  It seems like he knows her mother better.

 

pg 6: This fight really comes out of nowhere...

 

pg 8: his hair's personality is starting to annoy me a bit.  Either it needs to start emoting or stop talking.

 

pg 10: moonwolf/darkwolf.  Now you use both words interchangeably?

 

pg 10: then the moonwolf just backs off.  This drains away any tension that was building.

 

pg 12: "I can be tricky when I want to be!" 

--unnecessary, and now he sounds pretentious.

 

pg 15: X by moonlight:  This goes on a little long.

 

 

Overall:

I liked the protagonist--he actually reminds me of John Cleaver a little in that he doesn't understand human behavior.  I was also surprised he identified as human after all the build up.  I felt there was a little too much "cheery banter" between Salane and Moon.  It got tiresome after a while.

Also tiresome was the hair.  I get that it must be important somehow, but it dragged me out of the story every time it was mentioned.

I do like the worldbuilding with the twin moons.  I'm also hazy on the magic system so far.  Not sure whether it will be hard, with rules, or more of a soft magic where things just happen.

I do think Moon comes across as overpowered.  So far nothing has even given him pause except maybe the most dangerous predator in the forest.  I'm wondering where the character will grow, if this is his starting state.

 

I'd be interested to read more--there was enough here to catch my attention even with some grammar and syntax flaws.

[aeromancer]

@mandamon: All your comments are spot on, so thank you. I know I have problems with the tenses, and the moonwolf/darkwolf was a last second split, so I miss a couple. The "I can be tricky" is meant to sound pretentious, it shows that he's a bit stuck-up, and possibly needs to prove himself.

As for the moonwolf (it's actually a darkwolf, but tomato tamato at this point, the difference hasn't been said yet), you'll see why he backs off. The hair - yeah, I really should take that out. It is amusing for me to write, but it does kill some of the tension. 

Hmm. I didn't concept Moon as having autism, it's more that he was raised without feeling much emotion, and constantly channeling lunar energy affects his ability to use emotions as well. In terms of power - you'll see.

The intention is for him to grow. A large potion of the plot is him learning about the world around him, as he was raised in semi-isolation.

[rdpulfer]

- I had a hard time figuring out the setting at first. The kebab and coffee put it in a more modern setting. But if it's not a real world setting, what is it?

 

- Okay, what does a moonwolf look like? And is this different from how he looks in his human state? It's confusing when Moon is fighting one, especially after just talking about hunting one in the forest.

 

- I do like the moon centric channeling system.

 

- As previously noted, the frustration with the main character's hair is kind of annoying after a while. Unless it's actually a sentient, living being separate of Moon, I would suggest cutting it down.

 

- Okay how is a moonwolf different than a darkwolf, since you mentioned the man Moon fought was probably a moonwolf.

 

- I do like the suspension as Moon realizes something is tracking him.

 

- I love Salene reminding Moon that her mother will kill him if she dies.

 

- I like the honorific exchange between Moon and Eclipse. 

 

- I like the humor in the closing dialogue, but I feel like the last line needs more. It feels like an excuse for infodumping more than anything else. 

[Robinski]

(A bunch of stuff that I agree with...)

 

Mandamon, I want to thank you for your post, because I was beginning to think was reading a different story from a lot of the others. You have commented on many the things that bothered me, but you've been more patient than me in commenting on them.

 

.

[Robinski]

So, hey, I guess this is welcome to Reading Excuses. Sorry it's taken me so long to get to this point. I'll dive straight into comments as I read, with summation at the end.

The "Never mention..." line is odd. 'Not to mention...' is the usual phrasing of the sense that I think you meant, but "Never mention..." sounds like an instruction.

I don't get him using the terms morning sky and afternoon sky together. It's one or the other, surely.

"I internally groan" - this sounds odd because it's a split infinitive. 'I groan internally' would be more correct. I'm trying not to quibble about grammar, but this stands out like a sore thumb for me.

I'm a bit frustrated by the things that Moon focuses on. Kebabs are playing a very prominent part in the story so far, as is sarcasm. I can't imagine that these things are actually important, they seem frivolous.

Yeah, in fact as I read on, the sarcasm thing is getting really annoying. The first rule of sarcasm is don't talk about sarcasm. I know, I'm British.

I find the dialogue rather unsophisticated. What age are these two? It sounds like they are maybe 16 or so, like they are trying to sound more mature than they are.

I don't care what things cost, or about the tip. Moon seems obsessed with tipping and paying for things. Again, this seems like something that should not be so prominent so early in a story, or at all.

I don't get the hair being mad thing. Is he feeling something physical, or is it in his head? Either way, it's strange.

What?! Whoa, I'm totally on the other guy's side in this. Somebody walks into me in the street then blanks me. I don't see how the other guy started it and, since I don't understand why Moon won't speak, I can't find any sympathy for him.

I think I've put my finger on the trouble I'm having with both the dialogue and a lot of the narrative. It seems very heavy on the telling, and doesn't allow the reader to work much out for themselves. We're told what to think about pretty much everything. Climbing the spire is dangerous because there is no safety equipment. Salane is panicking.

Her clinging to his back is still him carrying her.

The tenses seem a bit mixed up in places. "She did so..." instead of 'does so'.

"A man named..." for me, this is really quite cheesy, like everyone is holding their breath.

The one-to-another and did-this-by-that stuff is quite annoying, it's really melodramatic. Also, it's very repetitive, like the sarcasm stuff, it gets boring pretty quickly. And then there is a bunch more telling as Moon explains this to Salane so the reader can know it.

Then the chapter closes on Moon being really dense about the kiss. Is he really that naive and innocent?

---------------------------------

To sum up, I had various problems with this, I'm afraid. The biggest of these was the amount of repetition in the 'word games'. For me, that got old really quickly. The sarcasm thing turned me off by the third mention of it, but the word sarcasm or sarcastic is used 13 times.

Protagonist, for me at least, was rather one note, lacking depth. I don't want to read a story about which potion to take, or have the character explaining stuff to me all the time, I want to see him or her being vulnerable, challenged by circumstances, trying and failing. I'm just not interested in him at this point, and after two chapters, I would expect to be.

Sorry to be the bad guy.

[aeromancer]

Yay! An fully negative review! I'm not being sarcastic when I say thank you. This, as well as the two more submissions I plan on setting are the very rough draft of this setting. This will help me when I rewrite everything. 

 

I have addressed certain comments, though I will take exemption to the comment by rdpulfer that coffee represents modern. It's supposed to be set at high middle ages technology (minus gunpowder), but coffee was drunken at that time. Not really in Europe, but still.

 

In terms of a vulnerable protagonist. I am a bit stuck here, because Moon is egotistical, so he won't admit his own failings, but I do intend to make him struggle. If you have any ideas, I'd gladly take them.

Edited April 17, 2016 by aeromancer

[Robinski]

Yeah, I suppose it's close to being fully negative... What I didn't do was note anything that I liked, so I'll think on that now.

 

I liked the pacing. There was always something happening, and I did get the sense of time being critical for Moon to get to the top of the Spire. I didn't know why, but I got the sense, and you can add the why.

 

I'm not saying a character needs to be vulnerable or outmatched from the start, but his attitude didn't seem to leave any room for vulnerability. Doubt or fear, lack of confidence, can be present in small quantities, and hinted at in actions and reactions. The appearance of Eclipse offered the opportunity for this, although you need to get the reader to that point of course, which I was, but would I have taken your book to the till in a book store after reading a few pages? Probably not in it's current form - but it's a tester, so I would read a more writerly version.

[Mandamon]

Mandamon, I want to thank you for your post, because I was beginning to think was reading a different story from a lot of the others. You have commented on many the things that bothered me, but you've been more patient than me in commenting on them.

 

.

That's what I'm here for!