Snapping?

[EmeraldPaladin]

It seems that all people must undergo some form of stress to gain their powers. Mistborn need to "snap" and experience some form of traumatizing physical or emotional stress to gain allomancy. The Elantrians need to be taken by the Shaod. The Returned somehow gain one incredibly powerful breathe when they return, although anyone can get enough breathe to become powerful. The parshendi must transform in the middle of a highstorm, and surgebinders must form the nahel bond with a spren. Kaladin, at least, was physically, emotionally, and mentally stressed before he figured out the oaths. Thoughts?

[IndigoAjah]

We know that Radiants need to be broken so that Investiture has cracks to fill in, so the Radiants all fit your pattern

[Yata]

It's quite common to became magic user in the Cosmere, to have some "cracks in the soul" where the Investiture may flow in.

 

It's not the only way but it's a common method to obtain above the average ability if you are not born with it.

(Example the first generation of Allomancers of the Final Empire, sons and grandsons of Lerasium Mistborns, didn't need to Snap as far as we know, but through the bloodline the Allomantic power is become more and more weak and the Allomancer of the Final Empire needed the Snapping to unlock their abilities.)

Edited March 29, 2016 by Yata

[Tellingdwar]

I have a hypothesis that end-positive magics (allomancy, surgebinding) require some sort of "snapping," end-negative magics (Hemalurgy, stuff the Dakhor monks did) require sacrifice, and end-neutral magics (feruchemy, biochroma) are innate and dependent upon Connection to a region or Shard.

Brandon RAFO'd me when I asked him

Edited March 29, 2016 by Tellingdwar

[Yata]

But Dakhor magic is end-positive :S

[natc]

Seemingly using human sacrifices (and what investiture their souls are worth) just to disrupt AonDor or teleport is end-positive?

[Yata]

Seemingly using human sacrifices (and what investiture their souls are worth) just to disrupt AonDor or teleport is end-positive?

Also if uses sacrifice in the "energy balance" is positive, you start with an amount of power and gaining some of it.

 

Much more, on Sel there is just a single Magic System, every Selish magic we saw are just different regional sub-manifestation of the same system... Therefore it's quite impossible to the Dahkor to be end-negative while AonDor, Forgery, Bloodsealing,ecc... are all End-positive.

 

Without counting about that the Dahkor like all the others sub-type is fueled by an outsider source, the Dor.

[Oversleep]

You could argue that DakHor makes the victim Snap (in fatal manner) which results in energy burst.

[natc]

There's really nothing stopping a system of such varied manifestations to have both end-positive and end-negative ways of application though.

The power flows in externally in all of them, but method of access differs greatly between regions. If one involves loss of human life surpassing the amount of power gained as the method of investing then the maths cleanly adds up to below zero.

[Yata]

The power flows in externally in all of them, but method of access differs greatly between regions. If one involves loss of human life surpassing the amount of power gained as the method of investing then the maths cleanly adds up to below zero.

I am not sure about that. Ok that positive-End/negative-end are in-world knowledge therefore may be unclear.

 

But we even know if the "Sacrifice" is build into Dahkor or it's simply a side effect, like to say "they may tap how much Dor they like but, they can't manage safety any kind of amount of Dor".

 

The loss of life isn't probably something build into the magic system, it's like if the AonDor is Negative-End because the user may die using too much Dor, or if the Allomancy is negative-end because the Savantism at the end may kill you.

[natc]

Those examples aren't part of the magic, that's the user being an idiot. Rarely happens.

On the other hand as far as the monks know dying is necessary to make it work. They've got ages to figure this out, if it's a screwup it should have been obvious long ago.

[Pathfinder]

So what I take from this is right now we just don't know if any of the abilities granted through the dor are end positive, end negative, or end neutral. Just guessing/theorizing?

[Tellingdwar]

So what I take from this is right now we just don't know if any of the abilities granted through the dor are end positive, end negative, or end neutral. Just guessing/theorizing?

Correct. The only canon uses of end-positive/neutral/negative are in the Ars Arcanum of the Wax and Wayne books, in reference to the Metallic Arts.

My previous post created more confusion than it did lead to answers, I think.