160328 - Hold the Bridge, Part 1 of 2 - Robinski - 5,068 words (L,S,V)

[Robinski]

Welcome to the first of two parts of this short story. It's fantasy, but I'll tell you right now there are no wizards with pointy hats. I'm interested in any comments that you can give me. Not prescriptive in that sense, you want to line edit, go to town, anything that jumps out at you would be very helpful, I'm sure.

Perhaps the single biggest thing though, setting aside issues that can be fixed easily enough in the edit is, are you entertained?

 

Thanks for reading! 

 

[krystalynn03]

General Impressions

 

Am I entertained? I’m 75% to 80% entertained on the first read through, which is enough for me to read a whole thing—short story, book, etc. The first paragraphs excited me because I could tell I was in the hands of a good narrator.  It developed fairly well through the first 40%, and then dragged a little in the middle with some of the military jargon, and then picked back up at the end for me because it spiraled back toward character development and the curious situation of the world you’re creating.

Overall, the biggest plus to me is that you have set up questions in my mind that I want answered. Good readers ask questions as they read, though advanced readers might not even notice they’re doing it because they’ve been doing it for so long, and you’ve made me ask myself some very good questions here in this bit. I read and loved “Ender’s Game” and tried to read “Speaker for the Dead.” The question of who/what/why the pig aliens killed that character at the beginning of the book was enough to keep me plowing through that book of completely uninteresting (to me) plot and subplot development just to find out a question I had in my head from the very first chapter. So, that’s how my mind works when I read. If I have a question, I’ll forgive a lot in the middle if my curiosity has been piqued well.

Good Questions I’m Pondering in This Universe (and no I don’t want you to tell me in forum…I want to keep wondering or discover them in story)

• Who/why was the ferryman chosen? (I know he’s not a ferryman, but he represents that archetype.)
• What does the ferryman have to gain redemption?
• What causes the waning of day to dusk? I do love the idea that it never becomes night, only that light weakens.
• Is there anyone commanding the opposing side? Or is hell so full of chaos that it just erupts with no rhyme or reason?
• Harth has two conflicts, an internal and an external. I think the external conflict with the fiendish hoard will resolve naturally in the narrative, but will his internal conflict really resolve? This part of the narrative feels a little less focused.
• How is the hoard always replenished? Will I see?Hm!

Questions Caused by Confusion

• What effect has a lifetime of battle really had on Harth? Like, I know you told me that he’s killed hundreds and that he’s slept with whores and the like, and the internal dialogue seems to waver from nihilism to begrudging acceptance.
• Does Harth want redemption or not? (Maybe you mean for this conclusion to remain yet undrawn)
• Why do Harth’s eyes water? From looking into the sunless sky, I guess?

Thoughts

• I liked the bit about the place lightening his heart. It makes the place seem more otherworldly than even the descriptions do. I think the juxtaposition of ideas between the heavenly effect of purity, calm, and holiness, drawing him away and making his battle harder would be an interesting theme to see developed. I don’t know where the narrative’s going to end up so it’s hard to give ideas like this, though.

Revision Suggestions

More fighting – Harth felt his heart sink. For a few moments, he had been free of it, dead, but free of the eternal slaughter, the grinding sadness, the screaming bloodlust, the dreadful emptiness. This place had lightened his heart he realised, but now the burden returned, the weight of bodies crushing his shoulders, pressing down on him.

Harth’s chin dropped to his chest, “I thought myself free of it. I hoped...”

• You just told me how he felt in the deep third person. If you drop the dialogue here, but keep the ferryman’s reaction, it adds to the effect that the ferryman can so easily predict the reactions of the recently awoken recruits.

The grey man’s features conveyed nothing. He extending an arm inviting Harth to turn and walk back the way he’d come. “The gates of hell are that way.”

• Harth’s moment of agency truly so far has only been to go left or go right. His response to it, “I’ll do what I must.” Maybe if this part were a little clarified on his internal motives, I’d have a better feel for who he is as a person and a better grasp of where I think he’s going as a character, regardless of whether my initial guesses as a blind reader are right or not.

Harth ensured that his bitterness came through.

• I think you can give me a better visual for this.

After maybe an hour, Harth’s unspoken questions had multiplied to the point of choking him.

• And all his questions are very visceral, not spiritual… I’m not sure if that’s a good thing or a bad thing because I’m not sure where he’s going as a character yet.

, ugly scar on the face of this vacant land

• I’d really like the face taken out, just scar on this vacant land. Harth seems a very literal kind of person, and besides ‘scar on the face of’ doesn’t feel quite clichéd, but it does feel very used to me.

More questions spilled into Harth’s mind, but he quelled them, time enough to ask them on the walk.

• He says this, but then we get a big description and he doesn’t ask any questions at all.

He tried to convince himself that it mattered, that he would miss them but in truth, all optimism and aspiration had drained from his life years ago. Had he really been any more alive than the corpses he left on the field? Scattered memories of drinking and whoring suggested not. But now there was hope? Hope of what, an eternity at the Creator’s side filled with regret?

• This is the internal bit I’m hoping gets cleared up, developed or resolved by stories end.

Harth began to hope that they never reached the fortress, that he could just walk and walk and never stop.

• Why?

Harth turned back to his troops. Their dark blue coats and pale grey trousers made him feel shabby, but he drew himself up, finding the presence that had cowed countless thousands of recruits over the years. It came from an unwavering belief in his authority, now from the Creator himself. He walked forward to stand ten feet from the middle of the front row and clasped his hands behind his back.

• So far he had only thought of soldiering life in terms of killing and whoring. Now he reveals he has leadership skills? This threw me as a surprise, but not a good one. It didn’t jar me from the story too hard, but I felt it overlooked.

Harth strove to disguise his agitation as he stood in front of them. His army was not just fallen combatants but all the victims of war.

• I wish more about the description of the characters before told me that they were victims. I would have liked to draw that conclusion simultaneously with him. In a fantasy world, seeing that there were women and youngsters there in the ranks wasn’t enough for me to know that.

He found Magdi in the back row, eyes-front like the others. She was no work of art, thin, flat-chested, her coloured blonde hair unruly, with long, dark roots. Her expression was calm like the soldiers around her.

“What happened?” he asked.

• I would really, really like some sort of emotional signaller here from him before he dialogues. That would give me an idea of how he sounds when he asks ‘what happened’
• Also, the roots and coloring bothered me. I don’t know how long bleaching hair has been a thing, but it pushed me out of the story as not matching the level tech you’ve got with axes and the like the weapons. I’m not saying you can’t do it or have it, only that it pushed me out of the narrative.

“Is there a sergeant among you?”

The bald man snapped a salute, “Dumkald, sir.”

“On my order, dismiss the troops. You three remain.” Harth took one last look over the disparate band. “Dismiss!”

Dumkald stepped out beside Harth and bellowed the order. The troops dispersed with the same uneven precision of their assembly.

“Name, rank and time served, here,” Harth demanded.

“Captain Yons Fermarald,” said the blond man. “Ninety-four sorties.”

“Lieutenant Cresca,” clipped the woman. “Thirty-eight sorties.”

“Dumkald?”

“Ten sorties, sir.”

Harth nodded. “Captain, show me my rooms. You can explain what I’ve landed in. Dumkald,” the sergeant clicked his heels, “Send Magdi to me in two hours.”

I know this isn’t long, but this is where you lose me every time I’m reading through. I can feel that these people aren’t important characters and the exchange bores me.

Commander and captain walked off the sward into the colonnade’s soft shadow, through that to the capacious white stone halls of the citadel. […]

Fermarald opened the door and Harth entered. The sitting room was spacious had the same pale, unadorned walls and was stocked with sturdy furniture. Harth walked across the room, through the sheer curtains, all that separated the room from a wide balcony beyond. Fermarald joined him in looking over the endless plain. The chasm cut darkly through the soft browns, an ugly scar on eternity.

This part is long, and it does not entertain me. It feels more like wallpaper than setup, if you know what I mean. I don’t see any impact of it to the plot. Change my mind or slim it down, imho.

“They are monstrous – twisted by pain and anger. They are foul creatures, and desperate. A hoard fit for hell indeed.”

I was excited to get description at last on the hoard, but then I feel skimped when the actually show up. You give us some okay panoramas of the action, but no crisp details for my imagination to really chew on. Also, I don’t really know what’s at stake. If Harth were to feel some anxiety at not knowing the answer to that himself, I think I would be a little more invested in the play by play of the battle.

“You sent for me, oh high commander.” She came forward slowly, head bowed. The demure look was unlike Magdi. She started to unbutton her shirt. A part of Harth wanted her to continue, but it was not the time, if that time ever came here.

It would seem that Magdi died after Harth, but maybe not. If not, then it would be nice if his first thoughts of her placed their last encounter at a time period long enough in the past that there’s obviously a time gap for her to have been killed. Otherwise, they haven’t been there long enough for her to be bored enough to complain that it’s more boring than hell. Also, why is she saying it’s more boring than hell if they have to fight every night. If she wasn’t a fighter in life, it’s got to be challenging and different. If I missed a detail and am jumping to fals conclusions let me know.

I don’t have a problem with her looking for something ‘familiar’ in the afterlife, but I would like her to be a little rounder as a character. If she had a little more fault and his were a little clearer, then I could see them going interesting places as a relationship within the major plot arch.

Again, I haven’t seen the ending, I might retract many thoughts once I see where you’re going

 

Edits

We need to have a good long talk about commas, but only after you’ve settled the narrative the way you really want it, so I’ll ignore them for now. There were a couple sentences with some odd phrasing that made my eyes jump back and reread, but it was minimal.

 

Sugar for the Medicine

Overall, your narrative is really good. I like the concept you’ve started and I’m interested in Harth and Magdi enough to keep going. You’ve got good sentence structure. I like your third person limited, and I like the rhythm of your narrative voice.

Even if this were a longer commitment than a 2 part short story, I’d be on board, and that’s saying something. The librarian used to call me the book snob, so no, I don’t say I like a thing enough to read it lightly.

I hope you submit next week. I really want to see where this going.

[krystalynn03]

The formatting on my post was a lot better in Word, I promise. I've been typing up anything long in Word because I hate it when the back button gets touched accidentally and I lose more than 3 minutes (and this was probably more than 30) worth or work. (Not that my cat would EVER go walking across my keyboard...)

[aeromancer]

This is very well written, but I think I have a moral issue with what happens in the end. If you're going to have a Hell, then shouldn't pre-marital relations be a taboo, or at least something to try to avoid? Every religion that I know of (which has a Hell) would agree with this. Excellent aside from that though.

[Kammererite]

First off, so far it is very enjoyable. 

The welcome to hell line is a great hook and i found it easy to read and very engaging.

 

I think in the first two pages you have a few run on sentences, that could be smoothed out. This one,  "He was tall, grey-haired and walked with confidence, was unarmed that Harth could see, and favoured his left side."  , threw me out of the story.

 

Location: My main complaint is that i was confused on where this story was taking place and it kinda brought down the story from this confusion. When you introduce us to the afterlife you say were on the outskirts of hell, and you mention the dirction to the gates of hell but you say that the major isnt going there. When they start walking you don't mention where they are going, but because you said the major isn't going to hell i assumed the went the other way down the path. Later you reference the place across the chasm as hell and the hordes of hell, so i am confused where we are. 

 

Description of the plains: I belie you have conflicting descriptions in the two paragraphs on page 6 (although both are great visuals). The first describe an endless plain with no end in sight, the second there is a chasm 5 miles away with the other side of the chasm out of sight as well. 

 

Commander: Be careful using this as a rank, some people are testy about it. Commander is a navy rank below Capitan, while a commander is some one in charge but is not a rank like a base commander. i don't think people refer to them as commander though. That said its fantasy so do rank structure how you want.

 

Armoured shoulder: This is super nit picky but the major didn't put on pauldrons or spaulders, just chest, head, forearm and lower leg armour.

 

I am definitely entertained Mr. Crowe. Look forward to the next

[kais]

I'm excited to read something from you! 

 

As I go comments
- I like the title. It's active and already fills my imagination. Bonus, I see the 'S' tag, which means I'm already on board with the narrative.

 

- need commas: ... and its stink, mercifully, was absent too

 

- ...unseen ax HAD hacked...  delete 'had'. Same with next sentence. Minimize passive voice

 

- ...side of a road through a short valley.' reads awkward. 

 

- 'The flanking hills...' sentence is a run-on. 

 

- 'Harth was picking...' suggest 'Harth picked himself...'

 

- "He was tall, grey-haired and walked with confidence, was unarmed that Harth could see, and favoured his left side. Harth felt good, strong, like he could take this man with his bare hands, but he did not seem like an enemy. "  Why didn't he seem like an enemy? Noting the description I can't get a feeling either way.

 

- I thought Harth didn't know where he was? The banter with the other man makes it seem like Harth knows exactly where he is

 

- "... had been a whore- her rough..." suggest dash instead of ellipse. 

 

- I don't understand...is there a choice being given? Harth can either go to hell or go with the man to do more battle? If so, noting Harth's strong reaction to not being done with fighting, wouldn't he choose hell?

 

- The paragraph that begins with 'Replenished with the likes of him...' I find confusing. Is Harth part of the hoard? Is he wondering why he isn't manning the other side of...the bridge to heaven? Other side of what bridge? 

 

- "I might as well have passed hell's gates." Wasn't this made clear when he was offered the choice? I don't understand why he didn't just go to hell.

 

- "...silenced Harth as they walked on in silence." Redundant

 

- I feel like the narrative finds its stride about page nine

 

- hooray for female warriors!

 

- "...but all the victims of war." Oooh, haunting.

 

- "The sitting room was spacious..." sentence needs some punctuation

 

- The buildup to the hoard fight seems long. I started skimming because the paragraphs seemed the same. Might want to shorten

 

- "...and black mass of bodies..." black mass? Is it black because the lighting is poor? 'Dark' would be a better choice.

 

- I have feels about the end scene with Magdi. Harth notes her meekness and what seems like hesitancy. He notes how different she seems in death. I know she seeks him out for 'feeling something', but personally I'd be uncomfortable getting it on with someone presenting like that. Seems like she is being taken advantage of, when what she really might need is just a hug or some uplifting words.


Are you entertained?

Yes and no. The beginning was confusing, but the title caught enough of my attention that I wanted to persist. The middle really picked up and I was very engaged, but then the continuing description of the advancing hoard made my mind wander. I perked back up when it was revealed that some moved on after the battle, and was with the narrative then until the end with Magdi. 

I do want to read more!

[Robinski]

Great comments everyone, much appreciated. Lots to think about. I'll come back with detailed responses later in the day. Thanks so much!

[Robinski]

It developed fairly well through the first 40%, and then dragged a little in the middle with some of the military jargon, and then picked back up at the end for me because it spiraled back toward character development and the curious situation of the world you’re creating.

 

That's good, the characters are what I'm interested in, sometimes at the expense of plot, often a weakness of mine, I think. I feel the military aspects are important because of what Harth is, but I appreciate that some will find that boring. I minimise as much as I can, 'cause I don't think I'm skilled enough to make that stuff engaging for everyone (if that's possible).

 

Overall, the biggest plus to me is that you have set up questions in my mind that I want answered. Excellent, I'm very pleased that you have so many 'good' questions' - there are definitely some answers coming!

 

What effect has a lifetime of battle really had on Harth? Like, I know you told me that he’s killed hundreds and that he’s slept with whores and the like, and the internal dialogue seems to waver from nihilism to begrudging acceptance. - I felt that was reasonable, but more to come on Harth.

 

Does Harth want redemption or not? (Maybe you mean for this conclusion to remain yet undrawn) - Yup.

 

Why do Harth’s eyes water? From looking into the sunless sky, I guess? - I'll tweak, the sky is still fairly bright.

 

You just told me how he felt in the deep third person. If you drop the dialogue here, but keep the ferryman’s reaction, it adds to the effect that the ferryman can so easily predict the reactions of the recently awoken recruits. - Noted.

 

Harth’s moment of agency truly so far has only been to go left or go right. His response to it, “I’ll do what I must.” Maybe if this part were a little clarified on his internal motives, I’d have a better feel for who he is as a person and a better grasp of where I think he’s going as a character... - Yeah, good point.

 

Harth ensured that his bitterness came through.

• I think you can give me a better visual for this. - Done, happier already.

After maybe an hour, Harth’s unspoken questions had multiplied to the point of choking him.

• And all his questions are very visceral, not spiritual… I’m not sure if that’s a good thing or a bad thing because I’m not sure where he’s going as a character yet. - As a result of what he is, a soldier first, and distanced from his spirituality in any case.

, ugly scar on the face of this vacant land

• I’d really like the face taken out, just scar on this vacant land. Harth seems a very literal kind of person, and besides ‘scar on the face of’ doesn’t feel quite clichéd, but it does feel very used to me. - Fair point, done.

More questions spilled into Harth’s mind, but he quelled them, time enough to ask them on the walk.

• He says this, but then we get a big description and he doesn’t ask any questions at all. - And that's some sub-grade discovery writing right there, lol. Now fixed.

He tried to convince himself that it mattered,... But now there was hope? Hope of what, an eternity at the Creator’s side filled with regret?

• This is the internal bit I’m hoping gets cleared up, developed or resolved by stories end. - Deal.

Harth began to hope that they never reached the fortress, that he could just walk and walk and never stop.

• Why? - Yup, needs clarifying.

Harth turned back to his troops... He walked forward to stand ten feet from the middle of the front row and clasped his hands behind his back.

• So far he had only thought of soldiering life in terms of killing and whoring. Now he reveals he has leadership skills? This threw me as a surprise, but not a good one. It didn’t jar me from the story too hard, but I felt it overlooked. - Hadn't considered, but I can foreshadow.

Harth strove to disguise his agitation as he stood in front of them. His army was not just fallen combatants but all the victims of war.

• I wish more about the description of the characters before told me that they were victims. I would have liked to draw that conclusion simultaneously with him. In a fantasy world, seeing that there were women and youngsters there in the ranks wasn’t enough for me to know that. - Ok, I thought I had done that by showing people among the troops who clearly could not be active soldiers or have been soldiers at all. I feel I can get closer to your realisation with another line.

He found Magdi in the back row... “What happened?” he asked.

• I would really, really like some sort of emotional signaller here from him before he dialogues. That would give me an idea of how he sounds when he asks ‘what happened’ - Fair point, done.
• Also, the roots and coloring bothered me. - On reflection, I agree, sorted - she now has mousey blonde hair.

“Is there a sergeant among you?”...

• I know this isn’t long, but this is where you lose me every time I’m reading through. I can feel that these people aren’t important characters and the exchange bores me. - Hmm, they have roles to play. I'm going to keep them in for the moment. I need named people to be able to do stuff around Harth. Maybe I can jazz them up a bit more (lol).

Commander and captain walked off the sward into the colonnade’s soft shadow, through that to the capacious white stone halls of the citadel…

• This part is long, and it does not entertain me. It feels more like wallpaper than setup, if you know what I mean. I don’t see any impact of it to the plot. Change my mind or slim it down, imho. - Again, discovery written towards something that maybe doesn't resolve, but I need the reader to know about the internal layout. I can trim here and there.

Gotta go or I'll get a parking ticket - Response, Part 2 to follow!!

 

[krystalynn03]

Don't get  a parking ticket!

[Robinski]

Don't get a parking ticket!

No, at $50 a pop, not to be trifled with!!

[Robinski]

This is very well written, but I think I have a moral issue with what happens in the end. If you're going to have a Hell, then shouldn't pre-marital relations be a taboo, or at least something to try to avoid? Every religion that I know of (which has a Hell) would agree with this. Excellent aside from that though.

Good point. They are not actually in hell or heaven, the Traveller's line is rather over dramatic, but he goes on to explain. It's something I'll touch in Part 2. Thanks for the encouragement, great comment.

[Robinski]

Run-ons: Fair cop, I can fix those.

Location: will clarify in the edit, but it's neither heaven not hell.

Description of the plains: I will tweak.

Commander: Yeah, I have to admit I knew I was doing this, but didn't take the time to adjust before submitting. Consider it my deliberate mistake for this week. I'll fix that.

Armoured shoulder: Excellent eye for detail. I will fix that too!

Great comments, great for keeping me honest on the detail. Glad it's working for you

[Mandamon]

Seems the others have done a good job of hacking this to pieces so far.

 

Overall, this flowed well.  I read through most of it with no comments coming up.  It held my attention, and I want to know what will happen in the second half.

 

I do have those little nagging thoughts whenever someone gives a location around or near Heaven or Hell, just because I find it hard to visualize where exactly that would be.  That said, I was actually alright with this interpretation because the location was given as the outskirts of Hell, but the plain seems to go on forever, implying it's more of an idea.

 

Promises:

1) Who's on the other side of the bridge and why?

--I think I read that the chasm was finite, and the bridge went over it.  My engineer brain of course wonders why the enemy doesn't go around, with infinite time.

 

2) How/why are people deemed worthy or unworthy?

--You say "lost," but it may actually be a good thing?  Is there any difference to one who was worthy and one who was unworthy, or do they just disappear?  No detail here.

 

3) Who is the Traveler?

--I have a feeling this will be important...or at least it's built up that way.

 

 

Notes:

pg 3: “No, Harth that is not your destination today. The Creator has other plans for you.”

--No, Harth, that  (And other commas, which everyone else has already harped on)

 

pg 5: “Each finds hope where they can. How can I show you when it takes everything I have to find my own?”

--Blind leading the blind?

 

pg 7-8 there's a lot of thinking going on here, which cuts into the tension of Harth getting to the bridge.

 

pg 9: is 512 an important number?  I wonder why it's "again."

 

pg 9: "closer to Harth’s age"

--I assume this is over 30, since he's been a soldier for a 25 years, but this could put him anywhere from 40 to 60.

 

pg 15: "There was no fire in the afterlife it seemed, and the tunnel was dark."

--I was confused here as to what tunnel.  I looked back and saw mention of a passageway to the bridge, but I usually think of tunnels as longer.

 

pg 17: good tension here, waiting for the enemy to get close enough.

 

pg 18: "That’s not how it works, I gather. One only departs when deemed worthy, or unworthy.”

“How many did we lose?”

“Twenty-three, they’ll be replaced before dusk.”

--So 23 were deemed worth or unworthy, since they can't die?

 

pg 19: "He spared a passing through for the opposing commander."

--thought?

[Eisenheim]

Okay, I like the concept. I'd love to be deeper in Harth's head or more fully pulled out for an omniscient camera.  Feels a little flat at the moment.

 

The kill counts really threw me off. I know a little about medieval and earlier warfare, which seems to be what you're aiming at, and I just can't believe a soldier, even one who fought for their whole life, killing that many people outright, so that they knew for certain.

 

A second warfare buff issue is equipment.  Is everyone just sort of pulling stuff from a grab bag or is it standardized, at least for the 512? Formations really depend on the weapons people are using.

[Robinski]

Promises:

1) Who's on the other side of the bridge and why? --I think I read that the chasm was finite, and the bridge went over it. My engineer brain of course wonders why the enemy doesn't go around, with infinite time. - I'm sitting in Costa Coffee and laughed out loud when I read this, don't think I got all that many strange looks. Excellent question, for all you know, they are making their way around as we 'speak'. ;op

2) How/why are people deemed worthy or unworthy? --You say "lost," but it may actually be a good thing? Is there any difference to one who was worthy and one who was unworthy, or do they just disappear? No detail here. - Yeah, they have moved on, but might have gone either 'up' or 'down', so to speak.

3) Who is the Traveler? --I have a feeling this will be important...or at least it's built up that way. - Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaybe, maybe not.

Notes: pg 3: (...other commas, which everyone else has already harped on). - Oh, man, you have a birthday and your grammar turns to mamals byproducts.

pg 7-8 there's a lot of thinking going on here, which cuts into the tension of Harth getting to the bridge. - Okay, I'll moderate.

pg 9: "closer to Harth’s age" --I assume this is over 30, since he's been a soldier for a 25 years, but this could put him anywhere from 40 to 60. - Yeah, mid forties, in my mind.

pg 15: "There was no fire in the afterlife it seemed, and the tunnel was dark."

--I was confused here as to what tunnel. I looked back and saw mention of a passageway to the bridge, but I usually think of tunnels as longer. - Hmm, good point. I'm not so sure. There are some very short 'tunnels' in the Rockies, constructed at landslide/avalanch risk points, maybe only 100-200 yards long in places. Obvs, there longer tunnels built for general road (sorry, highway) alignment reasons. Interesting research point, I'll look into it.

pg 18: So 23 were deemed worth or unworthy, since they can't die? - Yup.

pg 19: "He spared a passing through for the opposing commander." --thought? - Aye, thanks.

Super-duper comments, as ever. Thank you, kind sir. I have a lot of questions to answer in Part Deux.

Edited March 30, 2016 by Robinski

[Robinski]

Okay, I like the concept. I'd love to be deeper in Harth's head or more fully pulled out for an omniscient camera. Feels a little flat at the moment.

Thank for commenting, much appreciated. Okay, in relation to flatness, is there something obvious missing? I wonder if you're feeling an absense of emotional response / reaction in the characters? It's something I'm beginning to suspect I'm overlooking.

The kill counts really threw me off. I know a little about medieval and earlier warfare, which seems to be what you're aiming at, and I just can't believe a soldier, even one who fought for their whole life, killing that many people outright, so that they knew for certain.

I didn't spend long on the numbers. I can revisit those. I'll run over those details again.

A second warfare buff issue is equipment. Is everyone just sort of pulling stuff from a grab bag or is it standardized, at least for the 512? Formations really depend on the weapons people are using.

Noted. Standardised, in my head. Is there something off here, do you think?

Thanks for commenting. The flatness is a particular issue for me, and something I want to tackle head on. Maybe it's pacing, or some other deficiency. Interestingly, there are at least two peeps who noted almost exact mirror-images of the bits that dragged for them - one Sine graph and one Cosine graph, if you will.

Edited March 30, 2016 by Robinski

[Kammererite]

Warfare Equipment question: Jump up and down with hand in the air.

First off i am not an expert, but i do research this area and watch tons of videos on arms and armour in the middle age (not sure why since my book is set in a pusedo-bronze age) so this information could be wrong.

Anyway standardized equipment depends i think mostly on force organization, as well as the time period (for cost and availability of weapons and armour). I do not believe the Romans were quite as standardized as TV portrays, but they were likely very standardized compared to most armies before and after them.  Historically  most soldiers equipped themselves even in standing armies which were rare.This leades to mix matched equipment, although a pike block would have all pikes still. Modern armies are equipped by the army so they are standardized, helmets, shields and spears for all. 

I have no issue believing that "the creator" could spring for top notch arms and armour as needed for his 500 (which is a small army size), that would be standardized across the unit (of course soldiers would likely augment it themselves to their personal preference). 

Sorry if i'm out of line commenting here.

Cheers

Edited March 30, 2016 by Kammererite

[Robinski]

Thank you, Kaisa, for your comments - very helpful. Typos, etc, always helpful - much appreciated.

- Why didn't he seem like an enemy? Noting the description I can't get a feeling either way. - It was my aim to make the Traveller's alignment / role somewhat ambiguous. I take your point that I might be telling here in the phrasing of Harth's reaction.

 

- I thought Harth didn't know where he was? The banter with the other man makes it seem like Harth knows exactly where he is. - Hmm, not intended. I'll need t review that.

 

- I don't understand...is there a choice being given? Harth can either go to hell or go with the man to do more battle? If so, noting Harth's strong reaction to not being done with fighting, wouldn't he choose hell? - Would anyone choose hell over a chance to go somewhere else? It's a realisation that Harth's coming to terms with, but I could probably hang a lantern on it better, that his life

 

- The paragraph that begins with 'Replenished with the likes of him...' I find confusing. Is Harth part of the hoard? Is he wondering why he isn't manning the other side of...the bridge to heaven? Other side of what bridge? - The bridge across the chasm? The geography is supposed to be mysterious. I'm not going to go into detail here, but Harth is given the option of going straight to hell

 

- "I might as well have passed hell's gates." Wasn't this made clear when he was offered the choice? I don't understand why he didn't just go to hell.

 

- The buildup to the hoard fight seems long. I started skimming because the paragraphs seemed the same. Might want to shorten. Hmm, had at least one other comment like this, but as many seemed okay with it. Will try and balance, but still edit to keep brief.

 

- "...and black mass of bodies..." black mass? Is it black because the lighting is poor? 'Dark' would be a better choice. - I can work with 'dark'.

 

- I have feels about the end scene with Magdi. Harth notes her meekness and what seems like hesitancy. He notes how different she seems in death. I know she seeks him out for 'feeling something', but personally I'd be uncomfortable getting it on with someone presenting like that. Seems like she is being taken advantage of, when what she really might need is just a hug or some uplifting words. - It wasn't a great place to cut in some ways, as there is a scene sequel to be read that might help with this issue.

Yes and no... I do want to read more! - I'm taking that as glass half full. I feel that there are changes taking shape from all the comments here that will help with some of these issues. I'm glad that there is enough to keep you reading!

Thanks again, you're comments really are a great help

[Robinski]

Warfare Equipment question: Jump up and down with hand in the air...

...I have no issue believing that "the creator" could spring for top notch arms and armour as needed for his 500 (which is a small army size), that would be standardized across the unit (of course soldiers would likely augment it themselves to their personal preference).

Sorry if i'm out of line commenting here.

Happy to have your comment, of course. I'm sticking with the divine intervention angle that you anticipate in the comment. I just don't want to delve too deeply into that subject of arms etc. Alternatively, I could get into an angle with everyone arriving with the armour they died in, but I fear that would be more armour description than I could get away with and still keep a certain portion of the audience. Great to have the comment though - thanks!

[Eisenheim]

So, I don't want to hijack this on armaments. The one thing I'd stress is that the kind of formations you've described, along with the weapons you've called out, more-or-less require everyone on the creators team to have fairly big shields. Those geometric formations are a shield and/or pike style of combat. Just something to be aware of.

 

In terms of flatness, I don't think it's pacing. I think it's the spareness of description. Everything is very matter-of-fact, so we don't get as much insight into Harth as we would if his emotions colored his narration more.

Edited April 1, 2016 by Eisenheim

[Robinski]

So, I don't want to hijack this on armaments. The one thing I'd stress is that the kind of formations you've described, along with the weapons you've called out, more-or-less require everyone on the creators team to have fairly big shields. Those geometric formations are a shield and/or pike style of combat. Just something to be aware of.

In terms of flatness, I don't think it's pacing. I think it's the spareness of description. Everything is very matter-of-fact, so we don't get as much insight into Harth as we would if his emotions colored his narration more.

Yeah, the armaments thing, I was glossing over that, but I knew it had to go in. Coming from the edges of the Roman Empire (north side of the Antonine Wall - just!), the basis comes from there, but obvs the Romans had muckle great shields. I will retro-fit in the edit. No biggy.

On the paucity of emotion, I agree. I was feeling that myself, another aspect for me to top-up, and address in Part 2, I hope.

Thank you.

[rdpulfer]

- I like the first line a lot.

 

- I am intrigued with the opening, as a dead soldier finding himself tasked with more fighting.

 

- "To keep the hoard at bay." I think you mean hordes, unless they are being attacked by a large stack of money (which really would be pretty awesome.)

 

- I'm really, really liking the set-up. The cryptic fate of the previous commander. The main character's incredible task. The Purgatory setting.

 

- You used hoard again on Page 3. 

 

- It might be good to know who they lost, even if it was just a character we saw sparingly. 

 

- I really like this set-up. I'll probably get caught up by the end of the week.

[Robinski]

Thanks RD - yeah I had a hoard vs. horde issue - I think I've search-and-replaced them in the second part.

 

Glad this is working for you so far - but be prepared for a whole raft of broken promises in this first draft, I'm afraid

 

Thanks for reading!

[Carcinios]

Sorry I'm so late to the party.

 

Firstly can I say how glad I am that you chose to write this. Being a massive fan of fantasy and military fiction (as well as military history) this piece really sits smack bang in my niche.

 

There are a few areas that I think could do with some consideration.

 

1. Era. Assuming this afterlife is based on an Earth-like world I really struggled to get a grip on what period of history the dead are drawn from. Their gear seems to be Roman or Medieval but Harth is a Major. A rank that did not appear in either of those historical periods. Now if the reason for this is that the dead come from multiple periods of history then that is awesome. If not then maybe look at flavouring the names and titles more towards the period you are aiming for.

 

2. War. A couple of people have mentioned the action scenes felt a bit flat. I think there is a reason for that. The rank of your POV character determines how the fighting should be observed. e.g. if you are following a general you hang back from the action and get a more omniscient description of the battle. If you follow a line soldier you will be in the heart of the fight but with no time for philosophical thought or advanced tactics. I think you try and do both; you have Major Harth who is essentially the general, but leading from the front. I wonder which story you are trying to tell.

 

3. Threat. I felt very little threat in the fighting. I think there needs to be more focus on why they are defending the bridge or if it is intentionally vague then they shouldn't be able to be revived after the battle. Again what story do want to tell. Is it more like 300 where a heroic few hold the horde at bay, or is it more of a Stalingrad story where our heroes that we love are thrown into a meat grinder that they are not expected to survive.

 

I'm interested to see what direction you take it and I'm now going to go read part 2

[Robinski]

Hey Carcinios! Thanks for reading, and for the encouragement. Glad this found you.

 

You're comments are well noted. Someone else pulled me up over the 'major' thing, and I commented under Part 2, I think. I appreciate that this will jar for those who know about this stuff. Clearly, him being a major as such is not an important part of the story. I think yours is the third mention of this, so I will almost certainly change it to something more appropriate / generically vague.

 

In terms of Harth's behaviour and role in the battles, this is something else that I'm willing to tweak, if not in what he does, then emphasising how his actions are surprising. I would like to have him act differently in each fight, in part to have variation so they might not drag as much for the non-combatant readers (if you see what I mean).

 

Threat - yes, this needs adjustment, which I will aim to do by clarifying the rules or expectations about who moves on, why and where. Why the bridge is to be held should also be set up much better in the beginning, and I will do that with the aim of increasing the threat level and the stakes.

 

Thank you so much for those comments, they are very helpful, and think you for reading. Good to 'see' you again!