Hogwarts RP Discussion Thread

[Voidus]

As much as I like the idea of a Muggle Dark Lord (and I do!) there are more problems with the Phoenix motivator than just the social fallout.

First is the matter of the core. Phoenix cores are the rarest and most temperamental of all the cores. Since the birds don't give their feathers to just anyone, there is a very good chance the wand wouldn't work or might even explode.

Then there's the matter of how a Muggle got ahold of Phoenix material in the first place. As mentioned before, their feathers aren't harvested; they're donated. The birds are very choosy about who they give feathers to, so how did a Muggle get one? Even if he's a tech genius, he can't mess with a phoenix's free will; he has to convince it to give him a feather somehow, which seems unlikely if he's a Muggle.

Finally, the wand chooses the wizard. Harry's Phoenix feather wand worked for him because it chose him. The same is true of Voldemort's. The core in this case wasn't donated, but stolen, so it probably wouldn't choose anyone at all. How is an eleven-year-old Muggle getting this wand to work for her? Even if it's a motivator and therefore functions on slightly different principles than a real wand, it's still the genetic and magical material of a Phoenix. There will still be rules to follow.

Taken directly from a wizards wand seems the most likely solution, and also an explanation of why they thought this would work, wizards need wands so something must be special about them, they find a feather inside it and get testing.

[TwiLyghtSansSparkles]

Taken directly from a wizards wand seems the most likely solution, and also an explanation of why they thought this would work, wizards need wands so something must be special about them, they find a feather inside it and get testing.

That'd explain how they got it, but not how it's still working. Leaving aside all the wacky stuff Harry's wand did, there's the matter of wand ownership. Stealing a wand will transfer the wand's loyalty to you, but we've only seen it work with wizards. The core shouldn't be loyal to Muggles, and I'd imagine that after all the testing its been through, it might even be annoyed.

[Voidus]

That'd explain how they got it, but not how it's still working. Leaving aside all the wacky stuff Harry's wand did, there's the matter of wand ownership. Stealing a wand will transfer the wand's loyalty to you, but we've only seen it work with wizards. The core shouldn't be loyal to Muggles, and I'd imagine that after all the testing its been through, it might even be annoyed.

Well non-loyal wands still work just not as well, plus that's a trait that comes from wands, not necessarily their cores. Wizards use magical ingredients in potions and artifacts all the time without needing their loyalty.

[TwiLyghtSansSparkles]

Well non-loyal wands still work just not as well, plus that's a trait that comes from wands, not necessarily their cores. Wizards use magical ingredients in potions and artifacts all the time without needing their loyalty.

They don't, actually. Remember the blackthorn wand Ron stole and gave to Harry in DH? The magic wasn't as effective, and that's from a wand stolen by one wizard for another. Assuming it would work better for a Muggle seems like a stretch to me.

[Voidus]

They don't, actually. Remember the blackthorn wand Ron stole and gave to Harry in DH? The magic wasn't as effective, and that's from a wand stolen by one wizard for another. Assuming it would work better for a Muggle seems like a stretch to me.

That's what I said It's just not as effective. Which is totally excusable for a first year student.

[TwiLyghtSansSparkles]

That's what I said It's just not as effective. Which is totally excusable for a first year student.

And I'm saying that this shouldn't work well at all. They stole a wand core from a wizard's wand and forced it to do what they wanted. There should be major problems here. It's true that a wizard doesn't need a unicorn's loyalty before using its hair in a potion, but wands are different.

[Edgedancer]

While we're (well you are ) counting the ways that this would be problematic, the wand wood isn't just decor, so removing the core out of it, especially without knowing what you're doing, would leave you with heavily damaged material. Then there's how phoenix core's are litterally protagonist special master class core material that is not only the pickiest, thus highly unlikely to put up with any of this (and even then there's a big difference between actively disarming the wands owner and just kind of taking it when the wizzard kind of forgot where he put it), but has only been figured out how to use (from my knowledge) by Ollivander, who was the wandmaker of his time.

If you want to make this plausible it might be best to at least take a core that less... special.

[Voidus]

And I'm saying that this shouldn't work well at all. They stole a wand core from a wizard's wand and forced it to do what they wanted. There should be major problems here. It's true that a wizard doesn't need a unicorn's loyalty before using its hair in a potion, but wands are different.

Not working well is still good enough for a first year. And actually stealing it is somewhat more likely to work, stealing a wand typically wins its loyalty if you steal it from the right person. But this is emphatically not a wand, just a technological device designed to produce certain effects.

[Edgedancer]

Not working well is still good enough for a first year. And actually stealing it is somewhat more likely to work, stealing a wand typically wins its loyalty if you steal it from the right person. But this is emphatically not a wand, just a technological device designed to produce certain effects.

Except that zombifying a wand core, which wizards haven't managed since ever, might actually be the bigger acomplishment than just making a mechanical wand for muggles.

[TwiLyghtSansSparkles]

Not working well is still good enough for a first year. And actually stealing it is somewhat more likely to work, stealing a wand typically wins its loyalty if you steal it from the right person. But this is emphatically not a wand, just a technological device designed to produce certain effects.

Yes, but they're fooling around with magic here. This goes beyond just Neville Longbottom magic and gets into dangerous territory. If she tries anything more risky than some basic spells (like transfiguration) the wand might blow up or backfire on her.

[Voidus]

Except that zombifying a wand core, which wizards haven't managed since ever, might actually be the bigger acomplishment than just making a mechanical wand for muggles.

Wizards don't have technology until now and what do you mean zombifying? *No inferi were harmed in the making of this wand*

 

Yes, but they're fooling around with magic here. This goes beyond just Neville Longbottom magic and gets into dangerous territory. If she tries anything more risky than some basic spells (like transfiguration) the wand might blow up or backfire on her.

Good thing they're at a school where backfiring wands, explosions and accidentally transfiguring your ears onto another person are all just expected accidents. 

But yes I would expect a few things to go wrong, but its better than the alternative tech-based transfiguration which would destroy not only the user, but also all of Hogwarts and a sizable chunk of the entire planet when used.

[Nashan’Elin]

Well, I got a short post up. Finally

[Edgedancer]

Wizards don't have technology until now and what do you mean zombifying? *No inferi were harmed in the making of this wand*

I mean what i said. You can't think of wands like actual ordinary tech that's just components and craftsmanship. There is such a thing as wand cores wilting (aka dying) if not treated properly and they still have to acknowledge their owner, which is highly unlikely to happen after being physically ripped apart and tested on.

[Voidus]

I mean what i said. You can't think of wands like actual ordinary tech that's just components and craftsmanship. There is such a thing as wand cores wilting (aka dying) if not treated properly and they still have to acknowledge their owner, which is highly unlikely to happen after being physically ripped apart and tested on.

Well that's kind of the point, to use them technologically rather than magically. Plenty of tech can be used for life support and the rest to be used magically. A wand is never going to choose a muggle however it is treated, that's the point, to bypass the need to be chosen as a wizard and substitute it with technology.

[TwiLyghtSansSparkles]

Well that's kind of the point, to use them technologically rather than magically. Plenty of tech can be used for life support and the rest to be used magically. A wand is never going to choose a muggle however it is treated, that's the point, to bypass the need to be chosen as a wizard and substitute it with technology.

But that's the point: this stuff is magical. It doesn't function by technological rules or even logic. Hacking it should've been the product of years of wizard and Muggle research, not one Muggle working alone.

[Mestiv]

Soo, maybe use some other magic material, different than the well known wand cores? Make it a magical device immitating a wand, but working on different principle?

[Voidus]

But that's the point: this stuff is magical. It doesn't function by technological rules or even logic. Hacking it should've been the product of years of wizard and Muggle research, not one Muggle working alone.

The ministry has an entire department dedicated to stopping people from mixing technology with magic, it's been shown to be possible, this is just that in reverse. Yes it should have taken longer and more people but this was apparently a magically gifted genius and it's part of the backstory. I'm not exactly satisfied but far more so than I am with the alternative of one person having technology thousands of years from development or that may be actually impossible and that logically should blow an england-sized crater into the earth.

[Master Elodin]

As much as I like the idea of a Muggle Dark Lord (and I do!) there are more problems with the Phoenix motivator than just the social fallout.

First is the matter of the core. Phoenix cores are the rarest and most temperamental of all the cores. Since the birds don't give their feathers to just anyone, there is a very good chance the wand wouldn't work or might even explode.

Then there's the matter of how a Muggle got ahold of Phoenix material in the first place. As mentioned before, their feathers aren't harvested; they're donated. The birds are very choosy about who they give feathers to, so how did a Muggle get one? Even if he's a tech genius, he can't mess with a phoenix's free will; he has to convince it to give him a feather somehow, which seems unlikely if he's a Muggle.

Finally, the wand chooses the wizard. Harry's Phoenix feather wand worked for him because it chose him. The same is true of Voldemort's. The core in this case wasn't donated, but stolen, so it probably wouldn't choose anyone at all. How is an eleven-year-old Muggle getting this wand to work for her? Even if it's a motivator and therefore functions on slightly different principles than a real wand, it's still the genetic and magical material of a Phoenix. There will still be rules to follow.

You misunderstand. This is not a wand, it is a series of complex magitech machines. As for the Phoenix feather, it's all part of the backstory where she saves the life of a Phoenix with her wizard friend, and the Phoenix chooses to give her the feather. It also did take longer, there was a secret organization the she spent about a year with on the top of Mount Everest who were experts with magitech. I know this sounds crazy but I was trying to introduce it piece by piece. Unfortunately, you all forced me to reveal more than I was supposed/wanted to. Edited April 14, 2016 by Master Elodin

[Mestiv]

1. How can one endanger life of a Phoenix?

2. I see no problem with magical device, imitating a wand. However, if a wizard ever got hold of it, it should be obvious for him that's not a wand.

3. Such device, although capable of performing some basic magic shouldn't be able to compete with a real wand held by real wizard.

4. I really like to plot idea of muggle genius figuring out how to use magic. Just tone it down a bit and I think we'll all be happy

[Young Bard]

It's so weird... It's showing up Mestiv made the last post at 7:07 Sydney Time today (about 5 hours ago), and yet I can't help feeling I read it last night.

 

Also, I'd like to make a post for Gregory, but it has a fair amount of godmodding in it for what I'm trying to do. I might PM it to Honor, Mistrunner and Elodin first just to double check there are no problems.

[The Honor Spren]

It's so weird... It's showing up Mestiv made the last post at 7:07 Sydney Time today (about 5 hours ago), and yet I can't help feeling I read it last night.

 

Also, I'd like to make a post for Gregory, but it has a fair amount of godmodding in it for what I'm trying to do. I might PM it to Honor, Mistrunner and Elodin first just to double check there are no problems.

Go ahead.

[TwiLyghtSansSparkles]

You misunderstand. This is not a wand, it is a series of complex magitech machines. As for the Phoenix feather, it's all part of the backstory where she saves the life of a Phoenix with her wizard friend, and the Phoenix chooses to give her the feather. It also did take longer, there was a secret organization the she spent about a year with on the top of Mount Everest who were experts with magitech. I know this sounds crazy but I was trying to introduce it piece by piece. Unfortunately, you all forced me to reveal more than I was supposed/wanted to.

Look, I just feel like I wasn't given all the relevant information up front. I love the idea of a Muggle sneaking into Hogwarts. It's a fantastic idea with a lot of potential for interesting conflict. The magitech is in another ballpark entirely. And while I get wanting to keep a few surprises in store, I feel like the magitech is something so big with so many world-altering consequences that it shouldn't have been kept a surprise.

[Master Elodin]

Look, I just feel like I wasn't given all the relevant information up front. I love the idea of a Muggle sneaking into Hogwarts. It's a fantastic idea with a lot of potential for interesting conflict. The magitech is in another ballpark entirely. And while I get wanting to keep a few surprises in store, I feel like the magitech is something so big with so many world-altering consequences that it shouldn't have been kept a surprise.

That makes sense. I didn't want to across as hostile, so I'm sorry if I sounded that way. I agree about the fact that it shouldn't be kept nit rely a surprise, but I don't want everything to be incredibly predictable. Because of this, this is what I'll do: Anyone who would like information about the magitech and how it works, PM me. If it's a group consensus that this should not be a thing, then I'll retcon everything and figure out a new solution.

[The Honor Spren]

Keeeep ittttttttttt . . .

[Master Elodin]

Keeeep ittttttttttt . . .

I agree. Elodin should keep his incredibly amazing idea.