Sixth of The Dusk and Mistborn (1, 2, 3)

[shinigamisid]

NOTE: Please DON'T spoil Shadows of Self, Emperor's Soul, Bands of Mourning, Secret Histories, Hope of Elantris, Shadows for Silence in the Forests of Hell. Also, I deeply apologize in advance if this has been posted before.

 

Also, there are spoilers from Mistborn 1, 2, 3, The Way of Kings and Words of Radiance.

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So, I'm reading Sixth of The Dusk and a thought occurs to me: "Hey, aren't Sak and Kokerlii like.... metals?" We know that Allomancy doesn't need metals as the source of power, but rather as a catalyst. So, I'm thinking... Maybe, in this world (which btw, reminds me of TSA, mostly the Reshi Isles part where Rysn goes in WoR), instead of metals, these Aviars are the catalysts.

I mean, Sak's power is like burning atium, but it only shows warnings and Kokerlii's is like burning copper. Except, Kokerlii shields minds instead of Allomancy. This is obviously related to the Cognitive Realm. What if Allomancy just works differently here? Like how Lift can convert food into Stormlight.

[Observer]

I'm not really very good with Sixth of Dusk, and I apologize if you already know this, but I think the world the book takes place on is one of the moons of Roshar. It doesn't have a Shard on it, but has a couple of animals and such that are innately invested. It's not quite like metals on Scadrial, but it's a similar concept.

[Pagerunner]

Observer, I think you're getting some minor Shardworlds confused. Ashyn is a minor Shardworld, a separate planet (not moon) in the Roshar system, where the planned novella The Silence Divine will be written. First of the Sun, where Sixth of the Dusk takes place, hasn't been confirmed to be in any known system.

 

We know that First of the Sun doesn't have a Shard on it, so it couldn't technically be Allomancy - that's an interaction of Preservation with the planet of Scadrial. But, yeah, now that you mention it, the powers do seem similar, although the Initiation is quite different - no Snapping involved. I wonder what it would look like for an Aviar to give a steel-like ability...

[Argent]

Somebody actually asked a very similar question during the Austin Calamity signing event:

 

Q: You mentioned that the flakes of metal are catalysts to access the power of Preservation. What do the birds from Patji use? 

A: You don't always have to have the exact same thing for catalysts, for that it’s more of an innate connection, in the same way that the metals have an innate connection. They ARE the catalyst.

[Titan Arum]

I asked at the Calamity signing if Kokerlii's power would block an Awakener's life sense, which in my opinion is very similar to a Smoker's use of copper:

 

 

Titan Arum: Would Kokerlii disguise you from an Awakener’s Lifesense?

Brandon: Yes.

Now we can put this into the context of your question and a previously RAFO-ed WoB (that Argent asked) about Smoker's and life sense. I believe that we can probably now assume that this would be a "Yes" as well.  

 

 

 Argent: Could a Seeker who was properly trained and experienced detect AonDor or Awakening? Similarly, does a Coppercloud block an Awakener's life sense?

 
Brandon: A Seeker could sense somebody else using magic not native Scadrial. RAFO on the Coppercloud blocking similar magic.

 

 

Also, useful could be Kurkistan's discussion on the Nature of Copper, to apply as further evidence that the Aviar's powers could be similar to metals. I think with this triangulation, there are similarities. 

Edited March 9, 2016 by Titan Arum

[shinigamisid]

Observer, I think you're getting some minor Shardworlds confused. Ashyn is a minor Shardworld, a separate planet (not moon) in the Roshar system, where the planned novella The Silence Divine will be written. First of the Sun, where Sixth of the Dusk takes place, hasn't been confirmed to be in any known system.

 

We know that First of the Sun doesn't have a Shard on it, so it couldn't technically be Allomancy - that's an interaction of Preservation with the planet of Scadrial. But, yeah, now that you mention it, the powers do seem similar, although the Initiation is quite different - no Snapping involved. I wonder what it would look like for an Aviar to give a steel-like ability...

Ashyn is in the Roshar system? Is it WoB or did I miss something?

 

First of the Sun doesn't have a Shard on it? Well, there's other reasons I think it's Allomancy. Well, you know how Vin's Mistborn trilogy takes place several years before The Stormlight Archive takes place? We also know that Brandon plans on writing a Mistborn series far in the future, with space travel and everything. He also mentioned that this future series will be closely tied to the cosmere and Dragonsteel than any others. So, what if "The Ones Above" are Allomancers? And since it's in the future, what if Harmony has found a way to leave Scadrial but still provide Allomantic powers to people. It also explains why The Ones Above can track Aviar. What if they realized that Allomancy doesn't need metals, so they invented a device that can track Allomancy (based on Copperclouds) anywhere, in any form.

 

I asked at the Calamity signing if Kokerlii's power would block an Awakener's life sense, which in my opinion is very similar to a Smoker's use of copper:

 

 

Now we can put this into the context of your question and a previously RAFO-ed WoB (that Argent asked) about Smoker's and life sense. I believe that we can probably now assume that this would be a "Yes" as well.  

 

 

 

 

Also, useful could be Kurkistan's discussion on the Nature of Copper, to apply as further evidence that the Aviar's powers could be similar to metals. I think with this triangulation, there are similarities. 

Yeah, there's some Feruchemical metal that can store Investiture, right? So, maybe the bird Kokerlii acts like that. It stores Dusk's Breath....

[natc]

I am fairly sure Ashyn being in the Greater Roshar system was, like, one of the only two things we even know about Ashyn. The other being the diseases thing.

[Titan Arum]

Yeah, there's some Feruchemical metal that can store Investiture, right? So, maybe the bird Kokerlii acts like that. It stores Dusk's Breath....

There is, but I do not think Kokerlii's abilities work like this because Dusk doesn't have a Breath. Only people from Nalthis have Breath, because it's given to them by Endowment. Thus, I'd see Kokerlii's abilities as more similar to a coppercloud. 

[SirrahGreed]

I would argue that unlike burning metals (Preservation) and having a net gain equation (metal consumed, power arrives), the Aviars? seem to be a zero-sum magic like Ruin's (Metal contains power and slowly drains away from source 1, but is gifted to source 2 to a lesser degree).

Bird eats food, parasite feeds off bird, investiture is created, and the birds use it. The birds themselves are infect with parasites which "grant" them the abilities.  (Bird eats anyway, and if the bird begins to starve I think the abilities will continue until the point the parasite kills the bird or death from starvation after death of parasite)

Kokre's abilities seem very much like a Copperclouds, while Sak's abilities seem like Lightbending, Atium burning, or maybe something we have seen Hoid do with smoke combined.  If the bird can see future instances, showing them to others is outside of what we've seen so far in Mistborn (Atium visions), but similar to what we've seen Hoid do with Kaladin (Campfire Flute Storytime).

My real question is... why the hell don't the worms get out of town if they can forsee danger...   I don't understand why mistings can only burn some metals, you would think that they can either access leras based investiture or not, but it gets to be so specific based on not only the metal being used for access, but on the person..   So the birds resemble Stormlight more since the parasites seem to affect all birds of a similar type the same way, and the worms are all the same.

Those worms/parasites in the worms seem so interesting...

Does Lift have a parasite maybe ?!