[Bands Spoilers] Manufacturing

[Irkutsk]

There seems to be a lot of confusion regarding how the medallions were created, so I've decided to make a single thread for discussing the discreet steps for making a medallion. Feel free to correct me if I have something grossly wrong.

I am assuming for these purposes that storing investure in a Nicrosilmind stores "hours of metallic-art ability." So you store F.Brass in a Nicrosilmind for two hours, and another person can tap it to have the abilities of a brass Ferring for two hours.

An unkeyed metalmind refers to one that was created while storing identity, so that anyone (with access to the correct powers, naturally or by tapping Nicrosil) can use it. I am also assuming that as long as the first person to begin filling a metalmind was storing identity at the time, then the metalmind can be filled or tapped at will without keying it accidentally.

1) The Sovereign (Spike-eye man) visits the south. He is a fullborn and carries the bands of mourning. He creates two unkeyed Nicrosilminds containing F.Nicrosil, and one with A.Nicrosil.

2) He fills one F.Nicrosilmind with some investure, then burns it to compound and fill the other two with the excess investure.

3) He creates an unkeyed Nicrosilmind containing F.Aluminum.

4) He now has three Nicrosilminds containing F.Nicrosil, A.Nicrosil, and F.Aluminum. He puts these together as a medallion along with some aluminum metal. This makes a medallion that anybody can access and use to create new unkeyed Nicrosilminds containing any of those three powers. They can also Compound to refill their Nicrosilminds, as they are not naturally a Feruchemist and therefore would not be able to store investure.

5) Using this medallion along with an unkeyed Nicrosilmind containing another power, one can create more medallions. This would be how they produce medallions with Nicrosilminds granting F.nicrosil and F.brass, for example. Compounding refills the Nicrosilminds and makes the practice sustainable, given that they have enough Nicrosil to burn for compounding.

That's it. FireParents would be people who use a medallion with F.Aluminum, F.Brass and A.Brass for compounding heat. After the original set of medallions were created, it would be easy for anyone with access to Nicrosil to create more.

The only hole in this process is that one step requires you to have a medallion with four powers (F.Aluminum, F.Nicrosil, A.Nicrosil, and a fourth power of your choosing) which Alliki says he's never seen. It's possible that medallions that were so important to their society's survival would be kept locked away and only allowed to be used by tribe leaders and such.

Thoughts? See any other major holes in this process?

[Moogle]

The major hole in this is the need for nicrosil.

 

You need to tap Feruchemical nicrosil to use the other metalminds - so everyone should need to be a Nicrosil Ferring for this entire process to work, or else you could just create unkeyed metalminds anyone could use.

 

Why can everyone, powered or not, tap nicrosil, and why can't they do the same for other metals? Are they actually tapping the nicrosil in the medallions? It doesn't seem like the weight medallions run out, so I suspect they aren't actually tapping the nicrosil part.

 

Look at Wax:

As soon as he thought of it— as soon as he knew what it might do— the metalmind started working, and he found a store within him, a reserve he could tap. Wax gasped. They called them copperminds. A very special kind of Feruchemical storage. One that stored memories.

 

Note that at NO POINT in this process does he tap the medallion's nicrosil component - he feels the copper, not the nicrosil.

 

---

 

Also, I edited the thread title to be more vague.

[Shardbearer]

They reduce their weight, so they are storing, not tapping.

[Pagerunner]

The major hole in this is the need for nicrosil.

 

You need to tap Feruchemical nicrosil to use the other metalminds - so everyone should need to be a Nicrosil Ferring for this entire process to work, or else you could just create unkeyed metalminds anyone could use.

 

Why can everyone, powered or not, tap nicrosil, and why can't they do the same for other metals? Are they actually tapping the nicrosil in the medallions? It doesn't seem like the weight medallions run out, so I suspect they aren't actually tapping the nicrosil part.

 

Look at Wax:

As soon as he thought of it— as soon as he knew what it might do— the metalmind started working, and he found a store within him, a reserve he could tap. Wax gasped. They called them copperminds. A very special kind of Feruchemical storage. One that stored memories.

 

Note that at NO POINT in this process does he tap the medallion's nicrosil component - he feels the copper, not the nicrosil.

 

---

 

Also, I edited the thread title to be more vague.

 

 

I think they do tap Nicrosil when using medallions. After they escape in the lifeboat:

 

"Investiture," Waxillium said. "This inner ring is nicrosil. You tap it, and it grants you Investiture - turning you into a temporary Feruchemist who has the ability to fill a metalmind with weight."

 

...

 

"You now much about this, Mysterious One," Allik said. "You are wise and-"

 

"I learn quickly," Waxillium said...

 

 

And then, when Wax is using the Bands:

 

His resources were diminishing. Not merely the metals inside of him, but the reserves stored inside the Bands. Stores that changed his level of Investiture.

 

 

There are finite stores of Investiture in the Nicrosil portion of the bands, which Wax taps to gain his abilities. Since it's the same phenomenon as the medallions, it stands to reason they are also Nicrosil metalminds. Which still doesn't explain how anyone can tap them... but it is definitely Feruchemy at play.

[Moogle]

I think they do tap Nicrosil when using medallions. After they escape in the lifeboat:

 

I read it as Allik being sarcastic, like he is barely a moment later:

 

“...I’ve seen medallions with three. Twice in my life only. Every attempt at four has failed.”

“So wear multiple medallions,” Waxillium said. “Strap thirty-two to your body, and have all the abilities.”

“I’m sorry, great Wise One,” Allik said. “You are obviously very knowledgeable about this, and know things that none of us would ever think to try. How could we be so foolish as to not realize that we could simply—”

 

If these medallion creations are just people tapping nicrosilminds, there is zero reason to expect there would be a limit to the number of medallions you could wear at once. You can tap multiple metalminds at once! People do it multiple times during the series!

 

The Bands are a special case, I think, where Wax was tapping from a nicrosilmind - but the purpose there was to grant ultra-strong Allomancy beyond that of a lerasium Mistborn, so of course those reserves were going to run low. But of course I can't say this for sure - I just suspect that Wax, while holding the Bands, probably could have stored/tapped from the Feruchemical parts even after the nicrosil reserves ran out.

 

If the medallions WERE requiring you to tap nicrosil, we would expect the characters to have to tap from the nicrosil part of the medallion, then they would be able to tap/store in the non-nicrosil part of the medallion. But look at Marasi, for example:

 

“What do they do?” MeLaan asked.

“Make you lighter,” the masked man said. As soon as he said it— as soon as she knew what it did— something inside of Marasi understood. She was holding metal that, somehow, she could feel. It wanted something from her, and she poured it in, filling the metal … the metalmind. She grew lighter, rising on her seat, the force of her body pushing less on her backside. Telsin gasped, obviously experiencing a similar sensation.

 

Marasi just fills the ironmind, no mention is made of tapping the nicrosil part. Wax is the same in my quote above.

 

So again, I feel quite confident here that there's something we're missing here, and it's not as simple as tapping from an unlocked nicrosilmind (which, to be consistent, should require you to be a Nicrosil Ferring).

Edited January 30, 2016 by Moogle

[fyodor]

Three points

1.Allik refers to them having metal born who fill the bracelets during his explanation. As for where they came from I don't know. Maybe Kelsier had a bunch of kids.

2.On page 31 of the Kindle edition VenDell floats the idea that most people have some feruchemist blood in them and thus even non feruchemists could tap one of these metal minds. I don't find this particularly satisfying but that is probably how non nicrosil ferrings can tap the amulet investiture.

3.Allik mentions an excisor which lets metal born create the amulet. I assume that this is something which temporarily gives them aluminum and nicrosil feruchemy.

Edited January 30, 2016 by fyodor

[Moogle]

2.On page 31 of the Kindle edition VenDell floats the idea that most people have some feruchemist blood in them and thus even non feruchemists could tap one of these metal minds. I don't find this particularly satisfying but that is probably how non nicrosil ferrings can tap the amulet investiture.

 

VenDell was wrong. Wax tries to tap the unlocked goldmind they stole from the Set, and he couldn't tap it. Only Wayne could.

 

“Why didn’t I notice what it was immediately?” Wayne said. “I had to be told. And, oh, rusts! This is proof of the Bands of Mourning, ain’t it?”

“No,” Wax said. “I can’t sense a reserve in the bracelet— I can’t use this, as I’m not a Bloodmaker. It’s not a metalmind anybody can use, just one that anyone with the right powers already can use.”

 

This doesn't mean nicrosil isn't something special that anyone can tap, but it's evidence against the idea.

[Irkutsk]

~Snip~

So again, I feel quite confident here that there's something we're missing here, and it's not as simple as tapping from an unlocked nicrosilmind (which, to be consistent, should require you to be a Nicrosil Ferring).

Well, obviously we know anyone can use the medallions, so there must be some method by which to make anybody able to use a metalmind, not just Ferrings of the same type.

So we have a few possibilities:

1) The southern Scadrians have some way of creating entirely unkeyed metalminds that anyone can use, with no Nicrosil requirement. This could be through mechanical metallic arts, possibly related to Ettmetal and/or the "Excisors."

2) The medallions do actually function by tapping the Nicrosilmind. This would mean that anyone can tap an unkeyed Nicrosilmind, not just Nicrosil Ferrings. This would be due to traces of Terris blood, innate investure, or what have you. This wouldn't be entirely a first, because we know that anyone can burn Lerasium, not just Mistborn. Tapping Nicrosil seems to have a similar, if much weaker effect. This seems to make more sense to me as well, because otherwise there would be no need for Nicrosil at all as a part of the medallions.

[Moogle]

...

 

The issue again is that none of the characters (except for Wax with the Bands) actually consciously tap the nicrosil in the Bands. This makes me think that the medallion itself, because it stores a portion of a Metalborn's Spiritweb, gains the ability itself to use the metalminds, and then humans just piggyback on that.

 

Put another way, maybe when making a nicrosilmind you infuse the thing with a Spiritweb, like Awakening an object. This serves to "unlock" any metals in contact with it, allowing the use of them as metalminds.

 

Of special note, we do not see any medallions which grant Allomancy - just medallions. This suggests there's something majorly different between the two things, and granting Allomancy is not as simple as making a nicrosilmind infused with Allomantic power. One has to use a "primer cube" to get the Allomancy thing working with the ship, after all.

[Irkutsk]

...

That's definitely a possibility. I don't think we've seen enough of the mechanical metallic arts to really know what is possible.

The other issue with both our theories is the inability to use more than one at a time. Somehow, the bands of mourning give you all the powers, including allomancy, despite the fact that Allik says you can't use more than one medallion at once.

I think it's probably because of the fact that being a Ferring and being a Feruchemist are different spiritual traits. You can't have more than one feruchemical ability, unless you are a full Feruchemist. Similarly, it seems you can't borrow more than one (or two?) powers from a medallion, unless it happens to be the bands, which contain full Feruchemical and Allomantic investure, rather than one power like the medallions.

Thoughts?

[aon]

VenDell was wrong. Wax tries to tap the unlocked goldmind they stole from the Set, and he couldn't tap it. Only Wayne could.

 

“Why didn’t I notice what it was immediately?” Wayne said. “I had to be told. And, oh, rusts! This is proof of the Bands of Mourning, ain’t it?”

“No,” Wax said. “I can’t sense a reserve in the bracelet— I can’t use this, as I’m not a Bloodmaker. It’s not a metalmind anybody can use, just one that anyone with the right powers already can use.”

 

This doesn't mean nicrosil isn't something special that anyone can tap, but it's evidence against the idea.

 

Wayne's Gold Metalmind doesn't have any Nicrosil. It has probably been created by someone who's stored with Identity in Aluminium, then made a generic Gold Metalmind that any Bloodmaker can use. 

 

Now as for if you tap the Nicrosil or not;

 

“Investiture,” Waxillium said. “This inner ring is nicrosil. You tap it, and it grants you Investiture— turning you into a temporary Feruchemist who has the ability to fill a metalmind with weight.” He held up the medallion. “The iron on this is for convenience, right? You can fill it, but so long as you’re tapping the Investiture, you could touch any source of iron and turn it into a metalmind.”

 

That, to me at least, makes it clear that you do actually tap the Nicrosil Metalmind to get the abilities.

Edited January 30, 2016 by aon

[Moogle]

Wayne's Gold Metalmind doesn't have any Nicrosil. It has probably been created by someone who's stored with Identity in Aluminium, then made a generic Gold Metalmind that any Bloodmaker can use.

 

Right. So plainly, you cannot make a metalmind anyone can tap unless you involve nicrosil in the creation somewhere in some unknown process.

 

Now as for if you tap the Nicrosil or not;

 

“Investiture,” Waxillium said. “This inner ring is nicrosil. You tap it, and it grants you Investiture— turning you into a temporary Feruchemist who has the ability to fill a metalmind with weight.” He held up the medallion. “The iron on this is for convenience, right? You can fill it, but so long as you’re tapping the Investiture, you could touch any source of iron and turn it into a metalmind.”

 

That, to me at least, makes it clear that you do actually tap the Nicrosil Metalmind to get the abilities.

 

Wax never uses any of the medallions before he says that, so he wouldn't know whether or not you need to tap nicrosil. (And again, Marasi and Wax plainly do not tap nicrosil consciously when using their medallions.) And his theory has a major hole, because why would you be able to tap nicrosil but not an unlocked goldmind like he tried before?

 

There is no guarantee Wax is correct in the passage you quote. He is theorizing, and Allik worships him and will never tell him he is wrong.

[Irkutsk]

Wax never uses any of the medallions before he says that, so he wouldn't know whether or not you need to tap nicrosil. (And again, Marasi and Wax plainly do not tap nicrosil consciously when using their medallions.) And his theory has a major hole, because why would you be able to tap nicrosil but not an unlocked goldmind like he tried before?

I feel that perhaps the book never says that they consciously tap Nicrosil because it would be wordy and distracting. It's not much fun to read, "Marasi strapped the medallion to her arm, tapped Nicrosil and then filled weight." It seems implied, especially with how Wax talks about tapping Nicrosil and that the Bands of Mourning seemed to drop in power slightly as he wore them.

[Moogle]

I feel that perhaps the book never says that they consciously tap Nicrosil because it would be wordy and distracting. It's not much fun to read, "Marasi strapped the medallion to her arm, tapped Nicrosil and then filled weight." It seems implied, especially with how Wax talks about tapping Nicrosil and that the Bands of Mourning seemed to drop in power slightly as he wore them.

 

I think we'll have to agree to disagree here; enough time was spent on Marasi's description of events that I would fully expect an extra line saying that, after Marasi began tapping from this strange metalmind, she could feel another metalmind and then store into it to reduce her weight.

[Copperkeep]

I don't think a medallion with four metals is necessary. (Though note that when Allik says he's seen a medallion with "three" metals only twice in his life, he doesn't seem to be counting the nicrosil part.)

I'm guessing the Southerners have natural metalborn, and that these "fire-parents" are actually natural Brass ferrings. All they need is the medallion/excisor that grants Feruchemical nicrosil and Feruchemical aluminum, and they can create medallions of Feruchemical nicrosil and Feruchemical brass.

...oh, but the medallions we've seen also store other feruchemical powers. Right.

Hm. That might be why I originally believed the "excisor" to be a hemalurgic spike. Presumably, a nicrosil and aluminum spike pair wouldn't interfere with your ability to use a medallion of nicrosil and another metal, so any natural metalborn who took one of those excisors could create medallions.

So, um... They'd take the excisor and the medallion made by another metalborn, and so firemother could put Feruchemical nicrosil, Feruchemical brass, and Feruchemical iron all in one medallion. But filtering the power from one medallion through a natural metalborn and into another medallion that combines their powers seems like it would involve some kind of resistance, which is supported by Allik saying those with multiple metals get more and more difficult to create and that you can't use two different medallions at once.

Hm. I rambled on pretty nonsensically in another thread as I tried to piece all this together, pardon. Now it makes more sense to me.

I'm guessing the interference comes from the nicrosilminds, or the investiture they store, belonging to too many different people, which is why Allik says that to create a medallion with all the powers, you'd need someone fullborn and also an excisor to borrow their power.

...wait. Why would a fullborn need an excisor, if the excisor is either a spike or a medallion granting fN&fA?

I feel like there's probably a lot of important pieces to this puzzle that we just don't have yet. .-.

[Irkutsk]

I think we'll have to agree to disagree here; enough time was spent on Marasi's description of events that I would fully expect an extra line saying that, after Marasi began tapping from this strange metalmind, she could feel another metalmind and then store into it to reduce her weight.

Supposed to be an up vote, sorry bout that. I agree. We need more information before we can make any concrete judgements.

[Pagerunner]

Supposed to be an up vote, sorry bout that. I agree. We need more information before we can make any concrete judgements.

Balanced that out for ya.

 

I'm inclined to trust Wax's description of events. He is knowledgeable about Feruchemy (Marasi's thoughts after Wax explains Nicrosil tapping: "This was fascinating... but the Metallic Arts was not one of her areas of expertise. Waxillium had a passion for it though.") Also, I'm pretty sure that Wax tapped a medallion at the beginning of Chapter 22:

Most of the others slept, comfortably tapping warmth as Allik had taught them.

 

...

 

"Well, what we have [ettmetal store] in Wilg, it'll be enough to fly us a day or two. After that, we'd need an Allomancer Pushing full-time. So unless His Greatness the Drowsy One back there wants to fly with me all the way back, I'm stuck, yah?

 

Yes, we go on to discover that Wax wasn't actually sleeping, but that doesn't mean he wasn't tapping warmth while he was pretending to sleep. If the Nicrosil portion of the medallions doesn't use Feruchemy, Wax doesn't notice the difference.

 

EDIT: Fixing quote tags.

Edited January 30, 2016 by Pagerunner

[Moogle]

Yes, we go on to discover that Wax wasn't actually sleeping, but that doesn't mean he wasn't tapping warmth while he was pretending to sleep. If the Nicrosil portion of the medallions doesn't use Feruchemy, Wax doesn't notice the difference.

 

This is a very good point, though again based on Wax and Marasi's descriptions of using the medallions I'm hesitant to lend it too much weight.

[mossyfisk]

I think it's important to remember the Cosmere mechanics that allomancy/feruchemy uses for this problem.

 

When using Scadrian magic, you pump Investiture through your DNA that acts a Catalyst to shape the magic; it's the same as drawing an Aon but using your genes instead if a drawing. So when you tap a metalmind you have the right flavour of Investiture, but you still need the DNA that includes the Catalyst in your Spritweb in order to direct it.

 

Since Nicrosil metalminds can give people the ability to use magic, they must include a copy of that Spritweb Catalyst. So it just needs to be stuck onto your soul for you to have the ability. Obviously in Hemalurgy you need a big ol' spike to staple other people's souls onto yours. I would guess that is because you get something akin to organ rejection; since its someone else's soul it tries to reject it. If Nicrosil metalminds just have the Spritweb Catalyst, then they won't have any of the personal bits that cause that, meaning a spike is not necessary and skin contact suffices.

[aon]

This is a very good point, though again based on Wax and Marasi's descriptions of using the medallions I'm hesitant to lend it too much weight.

 

 

The thing is Allik tells Wax that he is correct in his presumption of how the Nicrosil/Medallions work. And it does make sense why everyone might be able to tap into an identityless Nicrosil Metalmind.

Think of it this way, you're a Nicrosil Feruchemist. You start storing your Investiture into some Nicrosil. Whilst you're doing that, you're suddenly no longer a Nicrosil Feruchemist... How are you supposed to continue storing Investiture when you're no longer a Feruchemist? Or tap that Investiture back?

Presumebly Nicrosil works slightly differently due to the very nature of it taking away your Investiture.

The Metalmind probably looks at the person, sees they have Feruchemical sDNA and sees that their Identity matches that of the Metalmind so allows it back into the person.

But when that Metalmind has no Identity tied to it? Anyone with Feruchemical sDNA (So everyone alive) can tap into the Metalmind.

They discussed this at the start that this might be a possibility. Allik confirms to Wax that his guess is indeed correct.

 

 

I think it's important to remember the Cosmere mechanics that allomancy/feruchemy uses for this problem.

 

When using Scadrian magic, you pump Investiture through your DNA that acts a Catalyst to shape the magic; it's the same as drawing an Aon but using your genes instead if a drawing. So when you tap a metalmind you have the right flavour of Investiture, but you still need the DNA that includes the Catalyst in your Spritweb in order to direct it.

 

Since Nicrosil metalminds can give people the ability to use magic, they must include a copy of that Spritweb Catalyst. So it just needs to be stuck onto your soul for you to have the ability. Obviously in Hemalurgy you need a big ol' spike to staple other people's souls onto yours. I would guess that is because you get something akin to organ rejection; since its someone else's soul it tries to reject it. If Nicrosil metalminds just have the Spritweb Catalyst, then they won't have any of the personal bits that cause that, meaning a spike is not necessary and skin contact suffices.

 

You actually pump the Investiture through the Metal (the Focus) which shapes the magic. Brandon has said that like the Aons of AonDor the shape of the Metal at it's atomic scale causes the Investiture/Magic to vibrate at a certain harmonic, which causes the effect. 

The sDNA only comes into play as it's in your sDNA that the coding that allows you to use the magic (your Initiation) is stored.

It is presumed that pretty much everyone on Scadrial has in their sDNA some Feruchemical coding as everyone alive is descended from a Feruchemist. It's not usually enough to actually do any Feruchemy however I presume it's enough to allow you to tap Identityless Nicrosil Metalmind. Whilst you're tapping that Metalmind your sDNA changes to make you a full-fledged-Feruchemist during the tap.

[aon]

I don't think a medallion with four metals is necessary. (Though note that when Allik says he's seen a medallion with "three" metals only twice in his life, he doesn't seem to be counting the nicrosil part.)

I'm guessing the Southerners have natural metalborn, and that these "fire-parents" are actually natural Brass ferrings. All they need is the medallion/excisor that grants Feruchemical nicrosil and Feruchemical aluminum, and they can create medallions of Feruchemical nicrosil and Feruchemical brass.

...oh, but the medallions we've seen also store other feruchemical powers. Right.

 

 

 

I think there's a little confusion here. We have seen Medallions with 3 metals ... The ones that both stored weight and gave heat.

What Allik said he'd seen only twice in his life were Medallions that granted 3 abilities at once. He also said that you can have different Feruchemist/Allomancers put in their ability into a Medallion seperately.

 

To make a new Medallion you only need to be GIVEN F. Nicrosil and F. Aluminium. You store your Identity in some Aluminium, then make a Nicrosil Metalmind with your origional ability. Someone else can then add to that Nicrosil Metalmind their ability also.

This means they can make Nicrosil Metalminds with any ability someone is naturally born with. Firemothers and Firefathers presumably are natual Brass Alchemists/Feruchemists whom use a Medallion to gain F. Aluminium and the other F/A Brass so that they can compound Brass and make a supercharged Identityless Brass Metalmind.

As the OP said the issue comes from the supply of F. Nicrosil and F. Aluminium. But that's easily compounded to make a large supply (To Compound F. Nicrosil you only need F. Aluminium, F. Nicrosil and A. Nicrosil... and we know there are medallions that grant 3 abilities).

I think the Excisors are just the origional F. Nicrosil and F. Aluminium granting Nicrosil-Metalminds that were left to them, which is needed to make a new Nicrosil-Metalmind.

[Moogle]

The thing is Allik tells Wax that he is correct in his presumption of how the Nicrosil/Medallions work. And it does make sense why everyone might be able to tap into an identityless Nicrosil Metalmind.

 

Allik also tells Wax he's correct a minute later and the Southerners are all stupid when he says they all should just wear 32 medallions to get over their "max of 3 metals per medallion" limitation. I'm hesitant to say Allik is correct there when he shows an inability to tell Wax he's wrong.

 

Think of it this way, you're a Nicrosil Feruchemist. You start storing your Investiture into some Nicrosil. Whilst you're doing that, you're suddenly no longer a Nicrosil Feruchemist... How are you supposed to continue storing Investiture when you're no longer a Feruchemist? Or tap that Investiture back?

Presumebly Nicrosil works slightly differently due to the very nature of it taking away your Investiture.

 

This isn't how Feruchemy works. You can almost never store an attribute to the 0 point - you can never store more than like 20-30% of your strength, for example. (You'd die if you did.)

 

So a Nicrosil Ferring is always going to have at least some small portion of their original gift, allowing them to store/tap.

 

I see zero reason why nicrosilminds should be an exception to the rule that you need to be a Ferring of that metal's type to store/tap. Your model also does not explain why you're limited to one medallion at a time.

[Irkutsk]

I think there's a little confusion here. We have seen Medallions with 3 metals ... The ones that both stored weight and gave heat.

What Allik said he'd seen only twice in his life were Medallions that granted 3 abilities at once. He also said that you can have different Feruchemist/Allomancers put in their ability into a Medallion seperately.

To make a new Medallion you only need to be GIVEN F. Nicrosil and F. Aluminium. You store your Identity in some Aluminium, then make a Nicrosil Metalmind with your origional ability. Someone else can then add to that Nicrosil Metalmind their ability also.

If I'm correct, you can't simply store investure and pull it out as any power. That could make a fullborn out of any Nicrosil Ferring. Rather, I believe it works like F.Tin does, but instead of storing individual senses, you store individual powers. In this case you would need to have access to both F.Brass and F.Nicrosil to store Brass investure in a Nicrosilmind. To make it useable by anybody you need F.Aluminum. And finally, for a never-ending supply of investure in a population with very few natural metalborn, you need A.Nicrosil for compounding.

This gives us four metals in one Medallion, or three powers (If Allik isn't counting F.Nicrosil). So I guess it fits with what Allik said.

[aon]

If I'm correct, you can't simply store investure and pull it out as any power. That could make a fullborn out of any Nicrosil Ferring. Rather, I believe it works like F.Tin does, but instead of storing individual senses, you store individual powers. In this case you would need to have access to both F.Brass and F.Nicrosil to store Brass investure in a Nicrosilmind. To make it useable by anybody you need F.Aluminum. And finally, for a never-ending supply of investure in a population with very few natural metalborn, you need A.Nicrosil for compounding.

This gives us four metals in one Medallion, or three powers (If Allik isn't counting F.Nicrosil). So I guess it fits with what Allik said.

 

I'm not saying you can pull out any power, you pull out the power that was specifically stored in it. Allik says you could create a Nicrosil Metalmind that gave all powers if you were fullborn to start with (I.e the Bands of Mourning). He also says that someone can store their abiltiies in Nicrosil and pass it on to someone else to store their powers in, however the most granted he's seen created is 3, and we can presume most people in the South aren't Twinborns as it seems Feruchemists and Allomancers are rare/.

If you're a F. Tin user you then use a Nicrosil Metalmind that grants you F. Aluminium and A. Tin. Now you've compounded Tin and made the Tin part of the medallion any Tin user can use. Then you use a Nicrosil Metalmind that grants you F. Aluminium and F. Nicrosil and A. Nicrosil, and now you've compounded the Nicrosil part of the Medallion which gives the ability to use Tin...

You only ever need to be GRANTED 3 abilties at any one given time.

[VoltCruelerz]

I tried turning the whole process into computer code and it made me think that the only way this works is if Nicrosil and Aluminum work differently than the others or you cheat and use Hemalurgy.  Nicrosil has to be generic, otherwise it wouldn't "bind" to the other types of Feruchemy and make the whole process possible.  Similarly, you have to be able to drain identity to zero or you'll never be able to create unkeyed metalminds of any sort.

 

If you can use Feruchemy, you might be able to get away with avoiding both those though.  First, obviously you can spike someone with extra attributes.  Since spikes would literally depend on someone else dying and Metalborns are rare for the Malwish, it would explain the rarity of a medallion with three powers or more.  Getting around the identity problem is tougher, but it might be possible, depending on how souls are.  If we assume souls have different components in distinct locations, it might be possible to surgically spike someone and thus remove their identity without actually getting rid of their Feruchemy.  I don't think this is the answer though because that would be hard for real-world doctors to pull off, let alone the Malwish who may not even have electricity.

 

EDIT: I suppose one other option might be that compatibility with using another person's metalminds would be your Connection to them.  In theory, you'd have some Connection with everyone on Scadrial, so perhaps you just need to drain your Identity down enough so that what little Connection you have to everyone is enough to make the metalminds compatible.  This, combined with spiking people to get around the Nicrosil exception seems the most likely mechanic for this.  I think this is how it works...

Edited January 31, 2016 by VoltCruelerz