TheLerasNosed Posted January 24, 2016 Report Share Posted January 24, 2016 Any chance Vivenna is a Worldhopper with Vasher? Vivenna is last seen with Vasher and they seem to have a connection. If anyone on Nalthis would be able to help Vivenna unlock the ability to use Breaths to remain young, it would be him, and I'm guessing she'd want to Worldhop with him if she's still alive 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king of nowhere Posted January 24, 2016 Report Share Posted January 24, 2016 it's certainly a possibility, but as far as i know we've never seen her around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfa Posted January 24, 2016 Report Share Posted January 24, 2016 There is a theory somewhere in the Stormlight Archive forum (which I do not support) that Vivienna is Dalinar's deceased wife. Another possibility is that she's hunting Nightblood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weltall Posted January 24, 2016 Report Share Posted January 24, 2016 (edited) We've only seen a little bit of Vasher on Roshar so we don't really have much to go on for Vivenna's status one way or another. Since Biochroma does offer a relatively easy method of immortality and Vivenna could potentially obtain the necessary Breath over the course of Nightblood or after (and knows someone who could provide all of it in one go without really noticing the lack, if need be) I could see her still around and doing something. I agree that if she is, the end of Warbreaker makes it sound like she'd want to travel with Vasher wherever he goes but we don't know how things end up with those two in the unwritten Nightblood. Definitely something to keep an eye out for in the next book, now that we've been warned to expect at least one worldhopper from Nalthis. Edit: I realized that I'm now Pahn Kahl. That seems appropriate. Edited January 24, 2016 by Weltall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiver Posted January 24, 2016 Report Share Posted January 24, 2016 Considering Vivenna is my favourite character from the Cosmere, I'm more conflicted on this than you might expect. On the one hand, more Vivenna. On the other... Warbreaker sets up her story. Vasher was already there when that series started; it makes sense he'll still be around when it's over. He's like Hoid, in that he already existed with his own story. I don't know if Vivenna is the same. The Nalthis books COULD end up being a "Worldhopper Origin" story...but right now, I find it more likely that she won't. Or, if she does go worldhopping, it won't be with Immortality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfa Posted January 24, 2016 Report Share Posted January 24, 2016 Probably we'll see Vivienna in Stormlight Archive only after Nightblood is written, which means most likely in Arc 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pechvarry Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 It never made a whole lot of sense. I'm not sure why I feel this way, but I keep coming back to the woman who teaches the bridgemen horseback riding as actually being Vivenna. I guess just because she's described as pretty, is angry at Kaladin, and is physically not too far away from Vasher. Though I still think Shai would be the better worldhopping partner for Vasher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ari Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 Probably we'll see Vivienna in Stormlight Archive only after Nightblood is written, which means most likely in Arc 2. Or events in Nightblood will preclude her hopping worlds. As I understand it, she'd essentially have to Return to have enough time on her hands to do so, which presumably means she'd have to die, unless the Royal Locks make you special in some other ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yurisses Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 (edited) It never made a whole lot of sense. I'm not sure why I feel this way, but I keep coming back to the woman who teaches the bridgemen horseback riding as actually being Vivenna. I guess just because she's described as pretty, is angry at Kaladin, and is physically not too far away from Vasher. Though I still think Shai would be the better worldhopping partner for Vasher. Shai+Vasher... sounds like a darn good chemistry. Shai+Kelsier is less interesting... but both hate Hoid... Edited January 25, 2016 by yurisses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weltall Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 Or events in Nightblood will preclude her hopping worlds. As I understand it, she'd essentially have to Return to have enough time on her hands to do so, which presumably means she'd have to die, unless the Royal Locks make you special in some other ways. So far as we know of non-Returned reaching the upper Heightenings, as long as she gets enough Breath to reach the Fifth, she would actually have an easier time than Vasher because she'd get the immortality without having to consume one Breath (or equivalent Investiture) per week like he does. So it's at least possible without her becoming a Returned herself. Shai+Vasher... sounds like a darn good chemistry. Shai+Kelsier is less interesting... but both hate Hoid... I think we can all agree that the Cosmere needs more Shai. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowwisp Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 (edited) Or seeing how Vasher seems to be the archetype "tragic hero", Vivenna could have died even before Vasher got on Roshar. Edited January 25, 2016 by shadowwisp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retsam Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 I think people are a bit too quick to read the end of Warbreaker as a "romance ending" between Vivenna and Vasher. They go off together at the end; but I don't think it's romantically motivated for either of them. Vivenna is, as Sanderson puts it in the annotation, "running away from responsibility", and Vasher claims (I think honestly) that he doesn't really care if Vivenna comes with him or not. There's certainly the possibility that romance develops between the two, but then it's certainly not a given, so I definitely don't think the presence of Vasher in Words of Radiance means that Vivenna needs to be around somewhere. I rather doubt we'll get anything definitive about Vivenna, for the sake of not spoiling Nightblood, if nothing else. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ari Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 So far as we know of non-Returned reaching the upper Heightenings, as long as she gets enough Breath to reach the Fifth, she would actually have an easier time than Vasher because she'd get the immortality without having to consume one Breath (or equivalent Investiture) per week like he does. So it's at least possible without her becoming a Returned herself. I think we can all agree that the Cosmere needs more Shai. Doesn't the fifth just make you immune to disease, not aging? Or was it that we never saw anyone at fifth heightening who wasn't already Returned? (At this point I quickly checked the Warbreaker AA and apparently it does stop you from aging. Whoops! Guess she just needs to accrue another thousand-and-change breaths if she wants to go worldhopping or join the 17th Shard) And Retsam: I completely agree that there's no implications of romance between Vivenna and Vasher. If they get together, it ought to be because of events in Nightblood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrakeMarshall Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 Hm. An interesting thought on this, since I just remembered something. "That's right," Adolin said with a nod. "Stick to women your own age." Wit grinned. "Well, that might be a little harder. I think there's only one of those around these parts, and she and I never did get along." Here, wit/hoid confirms the presence of exactly one effectively immortal female character on roshar. It might not be Vivenna. But it might be, if she got enough breath to reach the fifth heightening. Or died and returned, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfa Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 (edited) Vivienna, by Hoid's standards is pretty young, even if she's over twohundred by now. The (female) Heralds are older, but also reasonably younger than Hoid. Probably Nazh's employer? I think it was a woman and author of the Ars Arcanum, but she can still be pretty joung (just some threethousand years, it seems still be half Hoid's age). But most likely he means Cultivation. Edited January 25, 2016 by Alfa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLerasNosed Posted January 26, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 I think people are a bit too quick to read the end of Warbreaker as a "romance ending" between Vivenna and Vasher. They go off together at the end; but I don't think it's romantically motivated for either of them. Vivenna is, as Sanderson puts it in the annotation, "running away from responsibility", and Vasher claims (I think honestly) that he doesn't really care if Vivenna comes with him or not. There's certainly the possibility that romance develops between the two, but then it's certainly not a given, so I definitely don't think the presence of Vasher in Words of Radiance means that Vivenna needs to be around somewhere. I rather doubt we'll get anything definitive about Vivenna, for the sake of not spoiling Nightblood, if nothing else. I agree, in that I don't view their relationship as a romantic one. I see much more of a Kelsier/Vin type of relationship for the two of them. Vasher/Kelsier have already loved and tragically lost when meeting a younger girl Vivenna/Vin. Vin was treated horribly by the men in her life prior to Kelsier (Reen and Camon) and Vivenna spent her entire youth awaiting a marriage with a seemingly horrible being (God King) and then also lied to and betrayed by the first guy she met (Denth). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSC01 Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 I could see it happening, but the fact that Vasher shows up in WoR, and Vivenna is nowhere to be found, struck me as somewhat ominous. I know that there are a million ways that it would not indicate that anything had happened to her. Vasher remains the consummate antisocial grump, and whatever companionship the two shared, it is easy to imagine that they would have parted ways, how ever many years later it is. It's just an idea I had. My thinking was that Vasher seems pretty morose in WoR. While that's really just his character, I got the impression that perhaps his travels with Vivenna might do him some good. I just had a gut feeling that if he's back to where he started in Warbreaker, maybe something happened to her. He doesn't seem particularly depressed, but given what he has gone through in his life, I wouldn't expect him to, even if something really bad had happened to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilamal Posted January 27, 2016 Report Share Posted January 27, 2016 (edited) Hm. An interesting thought on this, since I just remembered something. Here, wit/hoid confirms the presence of exactly one effectively immortal female character on roshar. It might not be Vivenna. But it might be, if she got enough breath to reach the fifth heightening. Or died and returned, I suppose. The one Hoid mentioned there is actually Cultivation, one of the 16 Shards. Also, Hoid is still much older than Vivenna, because she was born long after Hallendrin was built, which was long after the beginning of Nalthis, which was long after the Shattering of Adonalsium, and Hoid was there before the Shattering of Adonalsium. (this is a huge understatement, by the way) Edited January 27, 2016 by Lilamal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ari Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 Did we get confirmation that Nalthis specifically was created post-shattering? I know some of the shard worlds already existed beforehand, and I thought it was only Scadrial that we'd had confirmed as created post-shattering to date? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 Not really. But Hallendren is geographical weird apparently. Of the "too absurd to be normal" variety. Haven't seen the maps though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasarr Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 Not really. But Hallendren is geographical weird apparently. Of the "too absurd to be normal" variety. Haven't seen the maps though. IIRC, it's a jungle area in geographical region that shouldn't permit humid jungles to grow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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