Long Game 15: ...The Shards Themselves...

[little wilson]

So sad. They turned me and it was just Burnt and Elkanah left. I was hoping for atleast 3 or 4. We pretty much lost even if Lopen got lynched.

 

Well, to be fair, the game was lost when the Traitors started with 6 against 26. While that percentage might not seem terrible, against not only 3 Hemalurgists (so it'll take longer for the HI to subvert) but also 2 Mistborns, 3 Feruchemists, 2 Elantrians, and two Voidbringers? Yeah, the Traitors started the game with a 75% chance of losing and that increased to 95% the second the Forger died.

[Clanky]

Well, to be fair, the game was lost when the Traitors started with 6 against 26. While that percentage might not seem terrible, against not only 3 Hemalurgists (so it'll take longer for the HI to subvert) but also 2 Mistborns, 3 Feruchemists, 2 Elantrians, and two Voidbringers? Yeah, the Traitors started the game with a 75% chance of losing and that increased to 95% the second the Forger died.

I'm not too sure about that. You did have some pretty powerful roles yourself. That said I did expect there to be 7 traitors.

[Biggoron]

Awesome. uvu)b
Thanks for the great game, Captain Wyrm, sir, man!!

Edited December 15, 2015 by Biggoron

[Amanuensis]

Good game everyone! I'm glad you all figured it out! Kudos especially to phattmer who figured out that Burnt and Elkanah were traitors several cycles ago. Also very proud of Lopen for roping everyone together after my untimely demise.

Edited December 15, 2015 by Adavantos

[Arrae]

GG everybody! I enjoyed this game a lot except for the part where I was horribly manipulated and lied to.  

[Elbereth]

Okay, time for actual thoughts.

This was a really, really fun first game for me. I was in fact the Mistborn, obviously. I was trying to hint for a while that I was covering for someone else, because I didn't want to be roleblocked, which worked? I guess? I haven't managed to read all of the way through the evil doc yet (given how long it is), but I have a feeling things will make a lot more sense when I get nearer the end of it.

I wasn't the one in contact with Adavantos. In fact, I was one of two whose role he didn't know by the time he died, I think (though I suspect he might have figured it out). I just wasn't comfortable telling anyone my role, and my character wasn't either (more on that in a bit). Plus I thought it would be better to stay in the shadows as a Mistborn, and given that at that point the only traitor who I hadn't killed was Wilson, I was a little bit paranoid that the kandra or Adavantos was evil.

My kill list:

N1: No one (I was nervous and didn't have any solid suspicions)

N2: Polking (Adavantos had suggested lynching inactives, and polking seemed the most inactive of them all-- by random chance, Arrenae also targeted polking)

N3: Bridge Boy (This was mainly for information. I trusted Adavantos more, and thought it would be really useful to know the alignment of at least one of the players up for the lynch on D1.)

N4: No one (I think I got distracted? Also, at that point QF11 had started, and I was more concerned with that.)

N5: No one (Was going to send in an order on The Cow, but forgot because of family and QF11.)

N6: The Cow (only for inactivity and nothing else) (Arrenae also apparently targeted him as well.)

N7: Araris (This was my only kill out of pure suspicion. Very glad I was right.) (At this point I had contacted Arrenae to see if she was claiming to be a Mistborn. I had been suspicious of her the whole game, so once she claimed, I immediately contacted Adavantos to see if she was his Mistborn. I was in fact hoping she wasn't, and planning on targeting her that night. But Adavantos confirmed that she was the Mistborn he was in contact with, and we talked for a little while before the cycle ended.)

N8: Biggoron (blocked) (Here, Arrenae asked for a list of people I'd targeted. I composed one off of the top of my head without notes, but it was somewhat wrong. Due to this, Arrenae told Lopen my claim, and he then told me. I then revised my list to make more sense. Arrenae and I discussed our targets. The plan was to target both claimed Voidbringers (phatt and Biggoron), but Arrenae decided to target Alvron instead.)

N9: Biggoron (blocked again) (by this point Lopen had revealed my role in thread, so I was pleasantly surprised not to be roleblocked.)

Okay, last thing. I tried something interesting this game, which I'm planning to continue doing for at least 5 more games. Given that this game started right before November, NaNoWriMo was on my mind a lot. And what I'm doing for NaNoWriMo is interesting, but in its essence it involves six character viewpoints, except rather than being stiched together as in a normal novel (e.g. in Elantris you have rotating Raoden, Sarene, and Hawthorn viewpoints), each viewpoint is a discrete piece.

Why does this apply to the game? Well, each viewpoint takes a very long time to write. The first was pretty short (only 10,000 words), but the second was 40,000, and the rest look like they're going to be of similar length. And 40,000 words is more or less the length of one SE game. So, what I decided to do was basically to RP each character in turn as I wrote them. But instead of normal RP, it would be a RP for the entire game, including discussion and analysis, amount of PM usage, etc. Part of the reason I decided to do it that way was because I wanted to write a scene where these characters play Mafia. I'm no longer sure I'm going to, but it'd still be really fun.

Of course, I finished the first viewpoint far before LG15 ended, but it was still really fun, and I do understand my character more. And it worked out perfectly: my first character was also the newbie at the superpower school place. He's logical, intelligent, and willing to ask lots of questions in order to learn the ropes, but also somewhat shy. He would use some PMs, but do no RP, because he's not comfortable enough yet.

This worked out very well for me. You'll notice that I never placed a vote until Cycle 9, and no one ever placed a vote on me. (I wouldn't be pointing this out, but I think it's going to be pointless given my character for MR10 anyway). I did send in kills, but largely they were others' suggestions. I played the newbie card, but not in the way that Biggoron did or that Kas is wary of ("I'm new! Don't kill me, please!!"). I was more of a bright young thing. I contributed occasionally, but I almost never stated an opinion, and never strongly enough to make people defensive. I downplayed my role in QF11 as much as I could (although, looking back, I really shouldn't have. That was a different game that did not count for this character.)

And hey, I survived to the end! I guess it worked. I did get a little bit out of character when we got nearer the end of the game, because there were things I wanted to say that didn't really fit in with my character. Hopefully I won't be having that problem again.

All in all, it was a great game, and I look forward to playing more in the future!

[TheMightyLopen]

First of all, I've gotta give props to Burnt Spaghetti. That was some pretty good manipulating! You had me fooled the whole game. If not for Kas' lessons of paranoia, I probably wouldn't have tried to get you lynched like I did. Even though I was a major part in your lynch(even though I hilariously accidentally removed my vote from you   ), I still feel like I need to get revenge somehow.   I'll pass on the revenge, but I'll be sure to watch you a lot closer from now on!   Of course the real reason I was so trusting of you was so you would keep me alive like you did! That's totally what I was doing! Yep.......

I think it was a good game by all, and even though the eliminator team might have started off a little disadvantaged, they made us keep guessing for a long time and even caught a few breaks early on, like the village losing our 1 Kandra and our 1 Forger in the first 2 Cycles. If our Mistborn hadn't helped us out like they did, things could have been a lot different, so in my mind, I think the game was pretty well balanced, all things considered. (Or at least, most things considered   )

 

I felt like I helped out the Traitors more than I should have in this game. Like I revealed Ripple was roleblocked so they could set up the WGG for Burnt, and I was so trusting of Burnt, and, well, pretty much anything involving Burnt.  I was able to be a small part in almost every Traitors death(I voted for Wilson of course, was suspicious of BB and asked for him to be scanned, nothing with The Cow but I did say I was a bit suspicious of him to Ada, I tried to get Araris lynched a few times and he was eventually Mistborn killed, I kinda led the lynch on Burnt, and I voted on Elkanah at the end), so I'll take a little bit of consolation in that. 

 

I would like to apologize to Hellscythe though, since I was basically the reason he turned. Sorry about that! If I'd have known that STINK wasn't forged on that 2nd Night, I wouldn't have been pushing to kill Alfa since one of the main reasons I was suspicious of him was that I couldn't think of a reason a Loyal forger would forge him into anything. Now that I've read(skimmed) the Traitor doc, that whole situation makes a lot more sense to me. 

 

Great work team! We were able to protect our Captain(unstable as he was, killing Cordero like that!  ), and our mission! I think it's cool that me and my siblings were able to survive together as well.

 

A very big thank you to Wyrm for running this game! I really enjoyed every minute of it! (There was quite a lot of minutes too.  )

[RippleGylf]

Reading the traitor doc had me cracking up over me apparently being a kandra. It was honestly just a gut feeling added to by the Shallan lynch.

[Arrae]

I was the Mistborn that was contacting Adavantos, and by extension Burnt Spaghetti. Of course, I trusted her, and took a shardblade to the neck because of it. I... may have been unnecessarily trigger happy with my kills. They were:

N1 nobody

N2 polkinghornbd

N3 originally Honey Badger, then nobody, then Kaid

N4 Zed

N5 STINK (ah, the joys of targeting a hemalurgist to test the loyalty of another hemalurgist...)

N6 The Cow (the only day that I got a traitor!)

N7 role blocked

N8 originally Elby (sorry about that ) then Phatt, then Alvron

N9 dead

[Alvron]

N8 originally Elby (sorry about that ) then Phatt, then Alvron

You're sorry about targeting Elb but not about killing me?  Harsh.

 

 

Another great game Wyrm.  Thanks for running it.  Much enjoyment was had.

[Wyrmhero]

There was one very glorious moment when the Mistborn almost took each other out at the same time. That would have been a very fun write-up...

[Kasimir]

There was one very glorious moment when the Mistborn almost took each other out at the same time. That would have been a very fun write-up...

Seriously, don't wish that trauma on them, you old sadist! They would've had much sads.

 

First of all, I've gotta give props to Burnt Spaghetti. That was some pretty good manipulating! You had me fooled the whole game. If not for Kas' lessons of paranoia, I probably wouldn't have tried to get you lynched like I did.

You're a true credit to the Paranoid, young Padawan Skaa Bro

Edited December 17, 2015 by Kasimir

[Wyrmhero]

So, post-op on this game...

 

Actually, not a massive amount to say about this game. There's not much to say that isn't kind of obvious in hindsight.

 

Eliminators

The Eliminators were underpowered, I will agree with that. However, as one of them went inactive, it's impossible to say just how underpowered they were. I gave them six people because there was the possibility of getting an extra vote from the HI - But more on that later. Five people, effectively, was not enough. Particularly when some of those five weren't very active either. If I could swap them with someone active, I think we'd have seen a much closer game. The only real things I would change is perhaps swapping a Roleless for a second Hemalurgist, and the Voidbringer for an Elantrian.

 

The other unfortunate aspect for the Eliminators is that each of their kills and Burnt's scans seemed to hit Roleless players. The Village still had all the most important, core Roles, right at the end of the game. However, they did play a rather good game, and I am surprised it ended in a 'lynch-the-cop' situation. I don't think we've ever had that before.

 

Forgers

The Forgers sadly did not end up being used to a great degree. They were intended to be a fairly important part of this game, but they both got killed early on. I think what I should have done was perhaps make up to four players Forgers (maybe an even split, maybe 1:2 Traitors to Loyals), and give fewer Roles out to players (so only one Mistborn, Elantrian etc.). That would have made Roles a lot more sought-after, and Forgers a lot more valuable for both sides.

 

The HI

The HI was not intended to always switch sides at the end of the game. It was a possibility (growing stronger as the game went on) if Hemalurgists were tracked down, and the idea was that the HI could provide a shot-in-the-arm to an otherwise slightly unfavoured Eliminator team at the end of the game, by injecting knowledge about Roles and the extra vote. For some reason though, the Eliminators had the chance and knowledge to grab him early-game, but seemed to forget that this was the plan.

 

Other Mechanics

I might also have tweaked the Kandra Role slightly to allow it to give protection to a player against scans as well. I only put one Kandra in on the Loyal side because of this, and also because I wanted to subvert the expectations that the Village would have two. Pleasingly, it seems that did get people.

 

I also feel that the time-limited PMs worked well. The delay in information meant that they were slightly less strong and central to the game, but were still useful at Night when planning. There were very few instances of players forgetting this rule.

 

 

Conclusion

So, things to take away from this - Could have done with a slightly more experienced/active Eliminator team (or perhaps a larger one, depending on who was chosen), and scans aren't really balanced without protection against it. Finally, if your game is meant to have a 'central' ability or mechanic, make sure it is actually central .

 

Aside

I enjoyed doing a variety of different styles of writeup in this game. We had journal entries, incident forms, police reports, a mental journey, and present tense. My only regret is that I forgot I was going to title this thread 'Ghost in the Shell' >>. Ah well. Thinking about it now, I also wish I'd done a second person styled-one, because I think that would have been interesting. But yes, I enjoyed doing things a bit differently here.

Edited December 17, 2015 by Wyrmhero

[Burnt Spaghetti]

Well I've gotta say that I had a lot of fun with this game even though I expected to lose.

Even though the WGG took a few cycles to set up it worked out well and I have to say that I was getting super excited when I got people trusting me and even role revealing to me (Clanky, I squeed so loud and happy danced when you told me you were elantrian- that was probably one of my happiest moments in the game). I did feel kinda bad for how much Lopen and Arraenae trusted me: Lopen was so trusting and so many trust group pms were made with me in them (though Lopen, our one on one pm was also one of my favorite parts of the gane-it was great chatting to you (even if half of it wasn't on topic)), and Arraenae didnt have a great time with her targets because she was taking my advice, so sorry to you two if you feel a bit betrayed but to be fair, its your fault for trusting me

When I read through the dead doc it seemed like there were a few times where we got lucky and killed off someone who was about to post with accurate suspicions, so I think its partly because of that that the WGG worked and why I wasn't lynched earlier.

But yes, this was a extremely fun game for me, so thank you Wyrm for running it.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Burnt Spaghetti

[Clanky]

Well I've gotta say that I had a lot of fun with this game even though I expected to lose.

Even though the WGG took a few cycles to set up it worked out well and I have to say that I was getting super excited when I got people trusting me and even role revealing to me (Clanky, I squeed so loud and happy danced when you told me you were elantrian- that was probably one of my happiest moments in the game). I did feel kinda bad for how much Lopen and Arraenae trusted me: Lopen was so trusting and so many trust group pms were made with me in them (though Lopen, our one on one pm was also one of my favorite parts of the gane-it was great chatting to you (even if half of it wasn't on topic)), and Arraenae didnt have a great time with her targets because she was taking my advice, so sorry to you two if you feel a bit betrayed but to be fair, its your fault for trusting me

When I read through the dead doc it seemed like there were a few times where we got lucky and killed off someone who was about to post with accurate suspicions, so I think its partly because of that that the WGG worked and why I wasn't lynched earlier.

But yes, this was a extremely fun game for me, so thank you Wyrm for running it.

 

I read the traitor doc so i understand how happy you were.   If you had ended up winning I was definitely in line for honourary eliminator for my contributions to your cause.

[Arrae]

You're sorry about targeting Elb but not about killing me?  Harsh.

Well, I never talked to you in PMs. Once I started talking to people in PMs that made me not want to kill them. Then Orlok suggested that I kill either Lopen, Burnt, or you...

 

 

I did feel kinda bad for how much Lopen and Arraenae trusted me: Lopen was so trusting and so many trust group pms were made with me in them (though Lopen, our one on one pm was also one of my favorite parts of the gane-it was great chatting to you (even if half of it wasn't on topic)), and Arraenae didnt have a great time with her targets because she was taking my advice, so sorry to you two if you feel a bit betrayed but to be fair, its your fault for trusting me 

Well, you did give me a valuable lesson in PM safety, so I can't feel too unhappy about that.  I had a few moments where I suspected that you and Adavantos were both traitors, but I always thought it was just paranoia. Now I know that friendliness and trustworthiness aren't the same thing. 

 

I read the traitor doc so i understand how happy you were.   If you had ended up winning I was definitely in line for honourary eliminator for my contributions to your cause.

According to Wilson I'm first in line for that. 

[TheMightyLopen]

I did feel kinda bad for how much Lopen and Arraenae trusted me: Lopen was so trusting and so many trust group pms were made with me in them (though Lopen, our one on one pm was also one of my favorite parts of the gane-it was great chatting to you (even if half of it wasn't on topic)), and Arraenae didnt have a great time with her targets because she was taking my advice, so sorry to you two if you feel a bit betrayed but to be fair, its your fault for trusting me

 

Yeah, those "Loyal" PM's........whoops. I'm not being too harsh on myself though, since I remember Wilson making one in LG14 and it had an eliminator in it, so if she can do it, so can I, right? 

 

Not to take away from your brilliant manipulation of me or anything, but I really should have been more wary of you. No hard feelings though, it was fun talking to you. (Of course, the off-topic things probably distracted me from your evilness!  )

[Alvron]

That's a wrap folks.  Many thanks to Wyrmhero for running another of his games and to the players for, um, playing.

If anyone would like to try their hand at running a game, please get a hold of Gamma, Wilson, Metacognition or myself. Not only will we get you added to the list, but I'm sure we'd be more than willing to help out in any way we can as well.

You can also ask questions and get some hints and feedback from everyone over here in our Art of Game Creation thread as well. With all the games that we've run so far, we have plenty of experienced GMs that can help you refine any game you're thinking about!

For those wanting to play, QF12: The Time of Reckoning and LG16: The Empty Throne Part 2: The Catacombs are open for sign ups so feel free to join in the fun.

Thanks again to everyone that played and we look forward to killing seeing you in future games!

Edited November 11, 2016 by Alvron