Silvers

{SoS Spoilers} Wax- The (probably not) steel compounder

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So the unknown metal, maybe I'm a bit confused but it allowed a kandra to use hemalurgy to gain feruchemical and allomantic abilities? So the spikes that contained these abilities are regular spikes?

 

So now Wax knows a bit of hemalurgy and now has access if not in his possession one steel runner spike.  He's also a coinshot... has nobody pointed this out before? 

 

Yes I know he probably doesn't know which spike, or where to put the spike, and Harmony would probably be against it. However I think it's a major  hidden gem that's being overlooked? Unless the Kandra took the spikes but not the uknown metal. 

 

The more I think, the less attractive this idea is, the Kandra probably keep those spikes for themselves, to make new Kandra or use themselves. 

 

What do you guys think? I know it won't happen in the books but I haven't seen any speculation yet. 

Edited by Silvers
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This... is very interesting, and I hadn't even considered it. Which is unusual for me.

 

It strikes me as something Wax wouldn't want to do. But you're right. Tactically, it's a brilliant move.

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This is terrifying.

 

Wax can no longer lose fights if he does this.

 

Wax doesn't like the idea of Harmony reading his thoughts all the time, so I don't think he'll do it... but really this is terrifying.

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He could put it somewhere that it could be removed, and only one spike at least doesn't open him up to much control. The only reason Wax would have for not doing it is that it's immoral, but he's been pushed by Spook's book into believing that it isn't, necessarily. Personally, I don't think he'd do it, at least as he is now, because it's Idashwy's power. He knew her, saw her corpse. I don't think he'll be keen on using her power. 

 

Now, that could very well change in the next book(s).

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But it's not a normal metal, so he wouldnt want to be spiked with a god metal of a deity that drove others crazy. Even if he would want to do it, probably not with crazy godmetal  

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But it's not a normal metal, so he wouldnt want to be spiked with a god metal of a deity that drove others crazy. Even if he would want to do it, probably not with crazy godmetal  

 

Did it drive her crazy though? Or was she already crazy, and it just removed Harmony's stabilising influence from her?

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Well he's already shown he doesn't mind using spikes that have already been made so I don't think it's outside the realms of possibility but I think it'd be used pretty sparingly, as mentioned he doesn't want Harmony in his head all the time especially now. That said he wouldn't need to use it particularly frequently, just spend an hour a week compounding into metalminds and just keep the spike on him for when he needs it or potentially if he can burn the metalminds without needing the spike just do that.

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I've just finished the book and somewhat undecided on why I feel Paalm was crazy. I kinda want to say Harmony pushed her too far at the moment, and that the combination of the influence of the unknown shard and her emotional instability led her to go waaaay to far. Part of that is due to the fact that if the spike is from who I think it's from, it would seem to me to be against his Intent to give her anything that would drive her insane, but he thought he could use her to destabilise Elendel into a revolt against Harmony despite the fact that she was already in a pretty unstable place, and it would be perfectly fine for him to free an insane or unstable person from Harmony's control.

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But it's not a normal metal, so he wouldnt want to be spiked with a god metal of a deity that drove others crazy. Even if he would want to do it, probably not with crazy godmetal

We don't know that the godmetal was also what she was using to steal allomantic/freuchemical powers, due to the utter confusion of Paalm's spikes. It might just be a regular pewter Hemalurgical spike.
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I only just finished the book, so I'm still working may way through the spoiler forums and don't know if anyone's brought this up yet or not - but is it possible that the thing Harmony wanted Paalm to do that she really, really didn't want to do was let Wax keep thinking she was dead?

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Sparks, that would be... extreme. Wax already has an incredibly powerful Twinborn combination, giving him one, if not the, most powerful form of Compounding... yeah no ordinary person on Scadrial would stand up to him afterwards unless they take him by suprise.

 

Now, the crazy he might be putting into his head... somewhat risky. Then again the new spikes apparently allowed Paalm to hide from Harmony so that might be worth it with his current distrust towards big H.

I only just finished the book, so I'm still working may way through the spoiler forums and don't know if anyone's brought this up yet or not - but is it possible that the thing Harmony wanted Paalm to do that she really, really didn't want to do was let Wax keep thinking she was dead?

Possible. I for myself already wondered what Harmony expected to happen after Lessie's "death" that wouldn't lead to terrible complications. Although I don't think this is the right place for that discussion. This one might be better. http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/46130-wax-lessie-prologues-and-bloody-tan/

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The whole thing still puzzles me... Tan was talking the same brand of crazy Bleeder eventually came to. So, was she already crazy by then? Did that happen after? At what point did she go from Paalm the "not super excited about Harmony's plan" to Bleeder the "Drive myself insane and start killing people for their powers to free myself"? Was the whole thing orchestrated by Harmony? Was it orchestrated by Bleeder? Was it simply orchestrated by this new Shard on the scene?

 

I dunno. I have this speculative idea that one of the great tragedies of this whole scenario is Paalm's descent into madness. I kinds feel like at the end we're all gonna learn the other Shard was actually the puppet master behind that scene, but by the time Paalm had enough facts to realize this, she was down to one spike and too insane to make the proper connections. One of the great, tragic hallmarks of insanity is an inability to reason your own way out of it. If this other Shard manipulated her into turning against Harmony just so he could use her... this already sad story will become unbelievably tragic.

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The whole thing still puzzles me... Tan was talking the same brand of crazy Bleeder eventually came to. So, was she already crazy by then? Did that happen after? At what point did she go from Paalm the "not super excited about Harmony's plan" to Bleeder the "Drive myself insane and start killing people for their powers to free myself"? Was the whole thing orchestrated by Harmony? Was it orchestrated by Bleeder? Was it simply orchestrated by this new Shard on the scene?

 

I dunno. I have this speculative idea that one of the great tragedies of this whole scenario is Paalm's descent into madness. I kinds feel like at the end we're all gonna learn the other Shard was actually the puppet master behind that scene, but by the time Paalm had enough facts to realize this, she was down to one spike and too insane to make the proper connections. One of the great, tragic hallmarks of insanity is an inability to reason your own way out of it. If this other Shard manipulated her into turning against Harmony just so he could use her... this already sad story will become unbelievably tragic.

 

Yeah, the way events seem to be lining up in my head:

 

1 - Harmony sends Paalm to protect Wax.  Romantic shenanigans ensue, Harmony facepalms.

 

2 - Harmony wants to send Wax back to Elendel.  Paalm says nuh-uh. 

 

3 - Before they have a chance to resolve that argument, the Bloody Tan incident happens.  Speculation:  Paalm got her first alien Godmetal spike from Tan's body.  Tan was being manipulated by the other Shardic influence, possibly specifically to get to Paalm in order to set events into motion.

 

3a - Harmony foresees Paalm's fake death, isn't directly responsible for it, but does nothing to stop it.  He pushes Paalm to not reveal herself as still alive to Wax, and this is her breakpoint.

 

4 - Paalm replaces her normal kandra spikes with the alien Shardspike and goes completely bugnuts (i.e. it's the combination of only one spike and the Shardspike's influence that sends her into true insanity).  It puts her in contact with that Shard or its agents, and she is able to obtain more for use in hemalurgy.  (Edit:  On further examination, there is no evidence that she had more than one of the Shardspikes.  Still, having it in her for long enough could have sent her onto this course.)

 

Further speculation - had she not suicided at the end of the book, it's possible that removing the godmetal spike and restoring her normal spikes would have brought her back to some level of sanity.  This is most likely what Harmony viewed as the best-case scenario.

Edited by Kaymyth
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1 - Romantic shenanigans ensue, Harmony facepalms.

Heh

 

4 -  (Edit:  On further examination, there is no evidence that she had more than one of the Shardspikes.  Still, having it in her for long enough could have sent her onto this course.)

Disagree. The Howlers (chimaerae?) had the spikes, and seemed to be part of Bleeder's plan. (btw I love that she attempted to nerdsnipe him...)

 

Also she had at least a spike for Allomantic steel and a spike for Feruchemical steel. If she could have both powers at once, she could easily simply compound and never run out of speed, so it must be two different spikes.

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Before the book was released, I predicted Marasi would get a voluntary Spike during SoS. Although I was wrong about SoS, my prediction still holds for the next book.

Of all the main characters, she's not only the "least powerful" (in quotes because I disagree), she's also the one who wishes she had more power.

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Before the book was released, I predicted Marasi would get a voluntary Spike during SoS. Although I was wrong about SoS, my prediction still holds for the next book.

Of all the main characters, she's not only the "least powerful" (in quotes because I disagree), she's also the one who wishes she had more power.

Do we really need another "Lord Mistborn" incident? She is talented, intelligent and holds an important position among Eledel constables. She should focus on the things she has and the ones she can improve, she does not need any magical power-up.

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Heh

 

Disagree. The Howlers (chimaerae?) had the spikes, and seemed to be part of Bleeder's plan. (btw I love that she attempted to nerdsnipe him...)

 

Also she had at least a spike for Allomantic steel and a spike for Feruchemical steel. If she could have both powers at once, she could easily simply compound and never run out of speed, so it must be two different spikes.

 

They had spikes, but it was never specified what the metal was.  They just said, "this is one of the spikes she was using," with no specificity (that I recall) as to whether her other spikes were made out of the same metal.  Paalm may have had just one of those Shardmetal spikes; she may have had all Shardmetal spikes.  Unless there's a line that I missed, we don't have enough information to know how many "special" spikes she had amongst the rest.

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The "howler" spikes were also noted to have red markings of some sort, which Wax assumed at the time was blood.

Then they found Paalm's spike, which is literally silvery laced with red, as if a metal with two colors is physically possible.

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The "howler" spikes were also noted to have red markings of some sort, which Wax assumed at the time was blood.

Then they found Paalm's spike, which is literally silvery laced with red, as if a metal with two colors is physically possible.

 

Kaymyth: What he said. Given what we know, I'm comfortable making the assumption that if they weren't the same metal, they were with alloying distance of each other. Either both alloys of Trellium or one was pure trellium, the other an alloy.

 

Maybe the metal was storing health and got a rash...

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Kaymyth: What he said. Given what we know, I'm comfortable making the assumption that if they weren't the same metal, they were with alloying distance of each other. Either both alloys of Trellium or one was pure trellium, the other an alloy.

 

Maybe the metal was storing health and got a rash...

 

:lol:

 

That does make me feel a little better about my initial knee-jerk reaction of, "aah, they're all Shardmetal spikes!"  Then I looked at my post and thought I didn't have the evidence to back it up.

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This thread makes me wonder if Harmony is grooming Wax into becoming an inquisitor or maybe Marasi if he refuses.

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This thread makes me wonder if Harmony is grooming Wax into becoming an inquisitor or maybe Marasi if he refuses.

 

I sincerely doubt that Harmony would ever deliberately do such a thing.  In fact, I personally believe that the only reason Marsh is still running around like that is because Harmony couldn't figure out how to fix the hemalurgic damage.

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Hrm. He could fix the damage Spook did to himself, no problem, and grant him the full powers of a Mistborn at the same time. I have difficulty believing that if he wanted, he could not restore Marsh, and give him at least atium compounding if nothing else, as well, if he wanted to leave his friend long-lived. Not sure why, then, he didn't.

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Hrm. He could fix the damage Spook did to himself, no problem, and grant him the full powers of a Mistborn at the same time. I have difficulty believing that if he wanted, he could not restore Marsh, and give him at least atium compounding if nothing else, as well, if he wanted to leave his friend long-lived. Not sure why, then, he didn't.

 

I think the Savant damage was on a different level from Hemalurgy, and granting Mistborn powers is already an established ability of Preservation. But the sheer number of cracks in Marsh's spiritweb from having so many spikes...eesh.  It's possible that it's something that he could have tried, but wasn't sure if he could succeed without killing him.

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I sincerely doubt that Harmony would ever deliberately do such a thing.  In fact, I personally believe that the only reason Marsh is still running around like that is because Harmony couldn't figure out how to fix the hemalurgic damage.

I'm pretty sure that Marsh simply refused to be healed.

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