theory Bloody Tan and Lessie's Death

[Argent]

I was writing a different post, trying to analyze the events of the Era 2 prologues with the new knowledge available in Shadows of Self, when an interesting idea struck me - what if Bloody Tan was in on Harmony's plan to get Wax out of the Roughs and back into Elendel? Here me out, let's look at the events in The Alloy of Law prologue, but using our Shadows of Self lenses.

 

When Wax first encounters Bloody Tan in the dead city of Feltrel, Tan says the following:

 

“I have seen God, lawkeeper,” Tan whispered. Where was he? “I have seen Death himself, with the nails in his eyes. I have seen the Survivor, who is life.”

Knowing what we know about each one of these legendary figures, I tried to work out how Tan could've seen them all. Death is easiest - that's Marsh. So, for some reason, Marsh must have revealed himself to Tan. He is a pretty secretive guy, I find it terribly unlikely that Tan could've just ran into him on the street. But Marsh works for Harmony, so it's very likely that Harmony wanted Tan to see Marsh. Or, alternatively, Harmony wanted something done, it had something to do with Tan, and Marsh could do it.

 

So here's what I am thinking. At some point before this prologue, Harmony decided that the way send Wax back to Elendel was to instill a desire in him to get away from the Roughs (Lessie's death), and make sure there is nothing holding him back there (Lessie). So Lessie had to die. How do we kill her? We get Wax to do it, because of divine sadism or something. Harmony knows there is this trick that Wax and Lessie do when one of them is held at a gunpoint where they coordinate a shot at the captor - which works great, unless the captor is both Metalborn and has one of the few powers that would allow him to cheat. For some reason (possibly because of timing, but also possibly because he was unstable), Harmony chose Bloody Tan to be his instrument. He sent Marsh to him, recruiting him (either by negotiation or by force, doesn't matter), and then spiking him with whatever power would let Tan react to Wax's shot. So now Tan has seen Death (Marsh) and potentially God (Harmony), since spikes allow for visual manifestation. Not sure how the Survivor fits in all this, but I'll settle for a 90% complete theory.

 

So now that I've overanalyzed two lines of text, let's move on.

 

Bloody Tan then proceeds to tell Wax that:

 

Other men wonder, but I know. I know I’m a puppet.

Yep, he sure does. "Someone else moves us" runs with the same idea. 

 

There is only more interesting piece, I think, that it involves the origin story, so to speak, of Bleeder. Either MeLaan or TenSoon informs Wax that what finally caused Paalm to snap and adopt the identity of Bleeder was a situation where Harmony asked too much of her, and when she refused him, he took the reins. Lessie's death is a prime candidate for this. Lessie - Paalm - loved Wax and didn't want him to live with the pain she knew her death, at this hands on top of that, would bring him; she probably asked Harmony to find another way. Harmony, for one reason or another, decided that his way was either better or it was the only way, so he forced her to go with it. I imagine she removed one of her spikes not too long after Wax left Feltrel. When and how she got the trellium spike(s) is a topic of another place and time, however.

 

All in all, I find that this theory provides are more complete picture of the events in The Alloy of Law prologue. It makes a lot of sense to me.

[fyodor]

I don't think that he took over her. Wax asks TenSoon if Harmony controlled her and he says, no, but he pressured her a lot and that caused her to snap.

 

I think that Harmony also tells Wax that he can/will only take over Bleeder now because she has violated her contract by killing.

[Moogle]

Marsh doesn't work for Harmony, as far as I know. Harmony outright disagrees with Marsh's choice to give Wax the Hemalurgy book.

 

As to Sazed controlling Lessie, look at this line in AoL:

Wax followed her gaze. A letter was peeking out of his pocket, delivered earlier that day. It was from the grand city of Elendel, and was addressed to Lord Waxillium Ladrian. A name Wax hadn’t used in years. A name that felt wrong to him now.

He tucked the letter farther into his pocket. Lessie thought it implied more than it did. The city didn’t hold anything for him now, and House Ladrian would get along without him. He really should have burned that letter.
 

Paalm didn't want Wax to go back - why would she tell him his letter was super important? That's when Harmony stepped in, I think.

[Kurkistan]

What Fyodor said. Here's the quote: "He didn't try to control her directly, but He did push her very hard to do something she didn't want to do." (relayed via TenSoon).

 

Let's also look at Lessie's dying words:

"He moved us, even then!" she whispered. "I refused. I wouldn't manipulate you into returning to Elendel! You loved it out there. I wouldn't bring you back, to become his pawn...."

 

So if we're to believe Harmony (which I do), then he never took her over directly and she refused to do what Harmony wanted.

 

My initial read of the situation is thus: Harmony wanted Lessie to help Wax decide to go back to Elendel. Lessie disagreed. Harmony grew insistent. At this point, I'd say the crazy started setting in (or perhaps came to fruition). Lessie, concluding that Harmony would probably be able to get his way through one machination or another, started her plots.

 

She got her hands on the "trellium" or whatever other spike let her talk into people's brains, then set to work on Bloody Tan. She may or may not have gone single-spike by this point. She manipulates Bloody Tan into getting her killed, in order to <Something, this one's a bit fuzzy>. Tan knows to shift her into the path of the bullet because she tells him, either beforehand or telepathically.

 

So far as Lessie's motivations on being fake-killed go, that's up in the air. But I think this general scenario is more in line with what we've seen so far than assuming that Harmony's become that nasty/liarly.

[Argent]

I don't think the comment about the letter qualifies as big enough of a deal to cause Paalm to snap. 

 

Marsh not working for Harmony... With the number of spikes in Marsh's body, I find it hard to believe. I think Harmony's disagreement(s) with Marsh are just that. As to why he allowed Marash to give Spook's notebook to Marasi... respect would be my guess. Or trust. Trusting that Marsh knows what he is doing. 

[Kurkistan]

I don't think the comment about the letter qualifies as big enough of a deal to cause Paalm to snap.  

 

Whoever said that the letter arriving was the first that Paalm had heard of Wax going back to Elendel? Particularly if Harmony knew about the Set (likely), then he could well have had a pretty good idea pretty far in advance that Mr. Suit was planning on "dying".

Edited October 7, 2015 by Kurkistan

[Argent]

And I don't know about Lessie orchestrating her own murder. All throughout Shadows she cares for Wax. Causing him pain is just not something I could see her do, especially during the early stages of her transformation into Bleeder.

 

What I will concede to, however, it the bit about Harmony taking control. I misremembered the textual evidence that he didn't. I maintain everything else as I proposed it, though - that thing he pushed for was the plan that would end up with Wax grieving and Lessie dead. 

[Jess]

I don't really buy Lessie orchestrating her own "death" (although if someone came up with a motivation for it, I might change my mind), I did wonder while I was reading the end of SoS why she didn't just reveal to Wax immediately after he killed Tan that she was a kandra and not dead. Sure, it would have been a giant shock to him that the woman he loved wasn't really human, but I don't think he would have just left her over it.

 

Since Harmony controlling her directly is ruled out, and I don't think she had started going insane yet at that point, the only thing I can come up with is that she was still devoted enough to Harmony to go through with his plan despite major reservations.

 

Tangentially, I think if she had been less mysterious with Wax during SoS, she may have actually succeeded in her plans. I spent the whole hour after finishing thinking "Why didn't Bleeder just TELL HIM who she was?" I guess that can be chalked up to insanity... but then again the book itself notes that while her goals were insane, her methods were really well planned, so I dunno.

[Moogle]

Tangentially, I think if she had been less mysterious with Wax during SoS, she may have actually succeeded in her plans. I spent the whole hour after finishing thinking "Why didn't Bleeder just TELL HIM who she was?" I guess that can be chalked up to insanity... but then again the book itself notes that while her goals were insane, her methods were really well planned, so I dunno.

 

I'm not even convinced her goals were insane. An (not altogether benevolent) god is watching over the world, orchestrating their advancement and manipulating them all. I imagine a lot of people would react against that.

 

I don't think she wanted to tell him she was Lessie because she knew it would cause him pain. She did it at the end because she was at the end of her rope and had one last chance to convince him to break from Harmony.

[fyodor]

I don't think the comment about the letter qualifies as big enough of a deal to cause Paalm to snap. 

 

Marsh not working for Harmony... With the number of spikes in Marsh's body, I find it hard to believe. I think Harmony's disagreement(s) with Marsh are just that. As to why he allowed Marash to give Spook's notebook to Marasi... respect would be my guess. Or trust. Trusting that Marsh knows what he is doing. 

 

I guess that it depends on what you mean by "working for." I think that Harmony's non-intervention principles keep him from taking over Marsh or unduly influencing him. 

 

Marsh says

 

""Harmony has particular views about how things must be done. I do not always agree with him. Oddly, his particular beliefs require that he allow that."

 

This sounds like they generally have common goals and purposes and are in communication but Marsh isn't necessarily doing stuff for Harmony.  Also, given Marsh's...conspicuousness, it's not really clear to me what Marsh would be doing for Harmony that he wouldn't be better off having a Kandra do.

[Moogle]

This sounds like they generally have common goals and purposes and are in communication but Marsh isn't necessarily doing stuff for Harmony.  Also, given Marsh's...conspicuousness, it's not really clear to me what Marsh would be doing for Harmony that he wouldn't be better off having a Kandra do.

 

As an example, Marsh going after and killing Paalm seems like a task he'd be very well suited to. He can Compound speed, negating her primary advantage. Just have Marsh trail Wax while he investigates and finds her for the first time.

 

Of course, he's off right now investigating Southern Scadrial, apparently.

[fyodor]

Except no one knew where she was. And Marsh can't find out because he's a terrifying monster who is also a mythological representation of death. He can't investigate because people will run away from him screaming.

[natc]

No rudeness intended, but which part of "Just have Marsh trail Wax while he investigates and finds her for the first time" did you ignore in that statement?

Edited October 9, 2015 by natc

[Sebarial]

It is quite likely that he was being controlled by Harmony as he tried very hard to push Bleeder about Wax because he needed to return to the city.  It is virtually a given that Bloody Tan was being influenced, or events were influenced. 

[Oudeis]

One thing I don't buy about Bloody Tan being part of the plan to send Wax back to Elendel... all the innocent bodies. I guess that was all just gonna happen anyway, and Harmony just manipulated the ending to kill Lessie and send him back to Elendel.

 

 

I'm not even convinced her goals were insane. An (not altogether benevolent) god is watching over the world, orchestrating their advancement and manipulating them all. I imagine a lot of people would react against that.

 

...except that that's not what happened, and not what a rational person would understand was happening. Harmony is upset at technological advancement; he wishes people were further along. Yet, he's not forcing them along. He could leave notes for inventors, drop a few Updated Words of Founding. He could simply turn Elendel into a desolate wasteland and FORCE people to learn how to irrigate. Yes, they are stagnated, and yes, that is because of a mistake he made, but it's flagrantly not true that he's "orchestrating their advancement," or "manipulating them all." Yes, he manipulates Wax; not the world. As MeLaan explains to Marasi at the end, when you're God, even your inaction is involvement. If someone falls off a cliff, catches themselves but can't pull themselves back up, and you just stand there and watch until the person's arms give out and they fall, can you later say you didn't affect the outcome because you didn't do anything? Harmony could control everything like a giant puzzle. He could also turn his back, divest himself of Scadrial and flee. He can stay, manipulating some things, letting others run their course. How much does he do? What does he leave be? If he knows a man is destined to accidentally be the cause of millions, does he kill that man? What of his daughter? Where is the line? What's right, what's wrong?

 

No rational person could look at Harmony, what his intentions are and what actions he has taken, and decide rationally that it's in the best interests of the people of Elendel that they burn their city and die by the hundreds to do something that will not, ultimately, change anything. They will be no more or less "manipulated" by Harmony. He didn't make Elendel; he just gave them the plans, and they decided to make it themselves. He didn't submit blueprints for Tekiel Tower. He didn't settle Covingtar.

 

Look at his actions regarding Wax. He sent Paalm; her romance with Wax was not his intention. Wouldn't it have been better if he had manipulated them? If he saw their growing fondness, "killed" her before they fell in love, and sent another kandra as a man? Instead, Harmony left them to their own devices... and as a result, Paalm grew to love him so much, she couldn't let him go to do what needed to be done. What if Harmony hadn't interfered, hadn't pressured her to fake her death and send Wax to Elendel? Dozens, if not hundreds, would have died at the Ostlin/Yomen wedding. Steris would have been kidnapped; the Vanishers, and the Set, would not have been stopped. More women would have been kidnapped. We don't even know their plans, yet, but we know Wax opposes them. All that... weighed against one happy couple.

 

She's not rationally looking at the big picture and coming to the logical conclusion that Harmony is in total control of everyone and everything, and that drastic measures are required to change this. She's a woman who was hurt terribly, has personally decided her pain was too high a price to pay to save the lives of hundreds of people, and has decided to burn a city to... accomplish nothing. Elendel's destruction would not have changed, in any way, the level to which Harmony is interfering with the world. What is it he's doing now that would be different after Elendel burned? Who is he manipulating that he'd stop manipulating? Technological stagnation isn't something he's upholding; quite the opposite, it frustrates him. He's just not willing to kill off hundreds of Scadrians just so the survivors can have radios.

 

That is why Paalm is insane. Her methods are calculating and brilliant, but they will not accomplish her stated goal, which is not itself a rational goal. She's trying to find a cure for pancakes. She cray.

[Moogle]

...

 

A few things:

• Paalm's actions do in fact resist Harmony's manipulations. If nothing else, her reveal of the kandra manipulating everyone could have (did?) cause a backlash against Harmony. People would be eager to find ways to reveal kandra... for example, it might be possible to cause a custom where a Soother or Rioter attempts to take control of you to test whether you're a kandra. Destroying the city is probably not in their best interests, mind you, but if your goal is to erase all of Harmony's influence?
• I don't know if Harmony can leave notes or updated Words of Founding around anymore, or turn Elendel into a desolate wasteland. He implies to Wax that it is not within his power to just use Ruin and fry every murderer (even though he, Sazed, wishes to). Obviously the kandra could do it for him, though.
• He's not just manipulating Wax. He's manipulating Marasi and putting her in a position for her to do what Harmony sees as good. And these are just the people we see on-screen; how much is he doing elsewhere? It's an exaggeration to say he's playing puppet master, carefully planning every single person's move... but I don't know if Paalm was that far off. We simply don't know at this point.
• The choice is not "manipulate Wax or let hundreds die", that's a false dichotomy. It is within Harmony's power to turn a bunch of kandra (who in general don't mind being controlled) into super-assassins with powers similar to The Lord Ruler's and use them to deal with problems. Instead of having an assassination squad which moves around, killing people like Miles, freeing the women the Set have taken, and stopping people before terrible things happen, Harmony has taken a man, caused him great personal distress, and controlled the course of his life, and is using him to do these things. (And also, he hasn't informed him of where the Set is hiding, so he's willing to do this without making efficient use of Wax anyhow.)

[Oudeis]

1. I'm sorry... Are the kandra manipulating everyone? We see them direct the course of Wax, and the only other manipulation we see is when they come out in force to directly counteract Bleeder. What evidence do you have of large-scale manipulation which warrants her reaction? I guess you can assume it... but there's no reason to, just so you can then assume everyone who should, logically, know what her mental state is like is also wrong.

 

2. Why couldn't he? If he could do it once, he can do it again. What has changed since his Ascension that prevents him from using... literally any power at all? At the very least, we know he could control TenSoon and have him just physically write a book. (And now I see you address this... but then sorta ignore it? You admit that it entirely invalidates your first point, but you just go forward, anyway...) And what does he say that implies he would just kill every murderer, right then and there, if he could? At the end, he knows whether or not the Nobles are corrupt. All he'd have to do would be to let MeLaan continue impersonating Innate and point the finger. Or, alternatively, tell Marasi and Aradel, these Nobles are good, these are bad, only prosecute the bad ones. And he won't even do that. What gives you the impression that he wishes he could fry them with lightning?

 

3. You admit we don't know... but you nevertheless insist that it must be one way, just to prove your point that Paalm isn't insane. Yes, Harmony has manipulated events to draw her to a place where she can do good. Yet, he has to ask Wax to stop being mean to her, because apparently that's enough of a wrench to throw off his plans. If God's manipulation is so subtle that one guy being mean to her can change it all, I am not going to accept that we're into "elimination of free will" levels here. Did Breeze eliminate Spook's free will when he asked him to get some wine? Are grocery stores controlling your mind by doing studies to see how people shop and putting fresh produce to the right of the entrance? Is it logical, or sane, to decide that we need to burn every grocery store to the ground as the only rational way to free us from this tyranny?

 

4. This... is a partially valid point. But you're arguing both sides of the debate. For one point, you're saying Preservation is doing too much, that his control of humanity warrants a rational person concluding he's a tyrant who needs to be overthrown, and that stabbing a priest in the eyes will do this somehow. Then in your next point, you suggest Divine death squads killing everyone Harmony doesn't like.

 

Harmony's goal is the most choices for the most people. This, unfortunately, means giving people the choice to make bad decisions. Humans must have human justice. If Harmony handled all justice, humans wouldn't even bother with a government. They'd just trust that if someone was about to kill someone else, Harmony would kill the murderer moments before the knife fell. That's the problem he ran into with Elendel; his intent to keep the Originators from starving has made them so comfortable they just get along, not pushing boundaries.

 

He can't just do everything. He has to let humans handle human problems, with gentle nudges to try to reduce suffering. He did not "control the course of [Wax's] life". Lessie was sent, at first, as a bodyguard. You saw Wax in the prologue; without Lessie he prolly wouldn't have survived. Was Harmony being "manipulative" by trying to keep Wax from dying?

 

Wax made most of his own decisions. He happened to be someone useful to Harmony, and he accepted the Path of his own will. He wants to be useful. He wants to help people. Harmony did not make him someone who wanted to protect people, he's just giving Wax the opportunity to actually help people. Marasi wants to use her knowledge and skills to better the city; it is not "controlling her life" that Harmony adjusted things to put her in the position to do so. If anything, he's granting their wishes. Working with them, though admittedly in an assymetric partnership.

 

Also, look at Wayne. John Deadfinger would have killed him. Wax said he wishes he could give everyone a second chance. Should Harmony just strike everyone in the Set dead? What if they're not really that bad? What if they can be rehabilitiated? What about that one young Vanisher who got caught up in something? Wayne gave him advice and saved his life. Not everyone would actually change... but should God simply decide, you're worth saving, you're not?

[SweetLift]

Wow, this is a lot of information. My thoughts are in line with what someone else mentioned. Lessie is a freaking Kondra. Why does she keep blaming Harmony for Wax shooting her? It didn't kill her. That is really bothering me. Wax is completely missing this fact at the end and I find it a little frustrating. Lessie never died so technically he didn't kill her in AoL. As far as theories of Tan and such, my thoughts are that Harmony whispered to him when he moves Lessie in AoL. Isn't it possible for Tan to have been visited by other Kondra on Harmony's behalf because he didn't have control over Lessie at that point? We really don't know exactly when Lessie removes her second Spike...

[Landis963]

Wow, this is a lot of information. My thoughts are in line with what someone else mentioned. Lessie is a freaking Kondra. Why does she keep blaming Harmony for Wax shooting her? It didn't kill her. That is really bothering me. Wax is completely missing this fact at the end and I find it a little frustrating. Lessie never died so technically he didn't kill her in AoL. As far as theories of Tan and such, my thoughts are that Harmony whispered to him when he moves Lessie in AoL. Isn't it possible for Tan to have been visited by other Kondra on Harmony's behalf because he didn't have control over Lessie at that point? We really don't know exactly when Lessie removes her second Spike...

She's not blaming Harmony for her death, she's blaming Harmony for breaking Wax's heart. Twice, by the time of her death.

[StormingTexan]

I guess I see Wax shooting Lesse as the possible catalyst for her removing her spike. Tan was also probably being controlled (or mearly spoken to) from his rants it seems pretty obvious (it's late but I think there is a WoB something about him being influenced). Setting aside the real death of Paalm the previous events even if manipulated by Harmony for the greater good of getting Wax to Elendel didn't really kill her she's a Kandra after all. It did however cause Wax a lot of pain which was mentioned at the end of SoS as being purposeful on someone that could bear it.

[SweetLift]

She's not blaming Harmony for her death, she's blaming Harmony for breaking Wax's heart. Twice, by the time of her death.

But my point is that she was not dead, the first time. In SoS she keeps telling Wax to ask Harmony why he did not step in, she is trying to make Wax angry at Harmony.  However, she was not killed by Wax's shot. She could have stood up and said, well that sucked but hey, I am still here, let's get lunch.  And so this probably proves the theory that she removed her additional spike after Wax leaves the Roughs, because she never would have allowed herself to be shot by Wax had she been in control of her body. I am just irritated that Wax doesn't see the connection between her being a Kandra and that he actually only killed her the once, by choice this time as Harmony's sword...

[StormingTexan]

^^ Agreed

[Sera]

As soon I learned about Lessie's identity I asked myself why didn't she just get up after getting shot by Wax the first time. Then it dawned on me.

 

Have you ever done (or didn't do) something and deeply regretted it later?

 

Paalm had always been a good girl. Not only she did as she was told, but she made the possible to ensure success in her missions. Seducing Wax was her idea. He'd both be more willing to let her stick around and hear her if he fell for her. But she also fell in love, and she wanted to protect him. Wax loved the Roughs and was free there.

 

Paalm refused to do as Harmony said, but she took no action either to alert Wax. She didn't want to antagonize Harmony, that would be unthinkable. She thought she could just keep living with Wax, perhaps she kept herself from thinking about the future, just wishing things would remain as they were if she didn't do what Harmony said, if she did nothing.

 

But Bloody Tan happened. Harmony still needed Wax in Elendel, and he couldn't make Paalm change her mind. He didn't want to take over her either. I don't think he guided Bloody Tan from the beginning, at least he didn't led him to a murder streak on purpose. However, that happened anyway, and Harmony saw his opportunity. He used it.

 

Harmony certainly saw or heard from Paalm herself that Wax and her had been held hostage against each other in the past. All he had to do at this point would be whisper "She's sneaking behind you. Catch her.", "He'll shoot. Move her." in Bloody Tan's ear when they set after him. It's the perfect solution to his dilemma. No innocent would actually die, and Paalm would be cornered: Rebel against God and also risk terrifying and grossing Wax out (besides the trauma of him having just shot her), or be a good girl and play dead? She chose inaction again. The deed was done already, she couldn't go against her "Father", who knew everything.

 

I suspect that the intense emotion that "frees people" she kept talking about was regret in her case. She regretted not alerting Wax to Harmony plans in first place, and regretted buckling under pressure and playing along when she was shot. She wished she could turn back in time and take different decisions, but no matter how hard she wished it was impossible. She'd never have the same life she had at Wax's side, he probably would be angry at her, at her failure to do something, for "playing" him. She couldn't undo, and she was so furious at herself for making the wrong choices, at Harmony for placing her in this situation. She was furious for having thought Harmony was a good God, only to see him doing something so horrible to Wax she no longer trusted him. How long would it take for him to decide to take control over her? How better than Lord Ruler was him? What about her previous missions, were they truly the better choice? Or had she been doing terrible things as she just did to Wax all this time? She couldn't undo what happened, but she still could to something, a last thing. She could keep one step ahead of Harmony in this grotesque chess game, avoid him ultimately taking control over her. She took out her spike.

 

...then, she went mad.

We don't know how proud Paalm was (putting the blame exclusively on others is a self-preservation mechanism), or how the mystery spike affected her, but I wish we had seen more of her internal conflict besides her anger against Harmony.

Edited October 12, 2015 by Sera

[jturner]

At the end of the book, Hoid's comments say "[t]here are sixteen base metals that work, though two others -named the "God Metals" locally- can be used in alloy to craft an entirely different set of sixteen each. As these God Metals are no longer commonly available, however, the other metals are not in wide use." ie, the alloys.

 

Tan was an atium misting (apparently not, see below)....has an atium granting hemmalurgy spike

Lessie (or the agent of odium) found Atium on Tan (given by Marsh/harmony for use in his crime)

Odium formed a metal from himself  (a third God Metal) and makes an odium/ruin (odium god metal/atium) Alloyed spike. OR one of the hitherto unrevealed alloys (atium plus something else) is formed from knowledge given by odium.

 

This gives her access to new and different powers (or possibly an 'effect; see below), including speaking through other's through hemallurgy spikes. 

 

Under Hoid's notes for "combinations": ""...the mixing of different types of investiture has curious effects. One needs look only at what has happened on Roshar to find this manifested - two powers, combined, often have an almost chemical reaction. In stead of getting out exactly what you put in, you get something new." Later...."Not just two powers, you could say, but two powers....and an effect." That's also why Wax can suck in the mists and get strength/endurnace from them, perhaps?

Edited October 13, 2015 by jturner

[Oudeis]

It's been considered, and confirmed not. However, as the man says, good question.