Shardlet

Lerasium and Atium Theory (potential Mistborn spoilers)

47 posts in this topic

This theory is based on a http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/3901-feruchemical-puzzles/?p=61844'>post I made in the Feruchemical Puzzles thread.

 

So, atium is part of the body of Ruin and lerasium is part of the body of Preservation.  Allomancy is of Preservation, hemalurgy is of Ruin and feruchemy is a combination of the two.

 

If lerasium is burned (either pure or as an alloy), the burner becomes an allomancer of some kind.  Mistborn if pure, misting if alloyed.

 

A hemalurgic spike made of atium can steal any single power from someone with that power (in a messy and usually fatal manner).

 

It has frequently been theorized as to additional effects of burning atium or burning an alloy of atium and lerasium (i.e., such as becoming a feruchemist).  However, burning metals is an allomancy thing.  So I don't think that burning would be a part of gaining any investiture except for allomancy.

 

Alternatively, I posit that each god metal is universal for the metallic art of the associated shard.  In other words, lerasium is universal for allomancy in that if burned in it's pure form, one becomes a full powered mistborn.  Atium is hemalurgically universal in that it can be used to steal any power (not limited to allomancy and feruchemy). 

 

But what about Feruchemy?  I also posit that an alloy of atium and lerasium (likely 50/50 or something close to that) acts as a universal metalmind (i.e., any attribute may be stored within it).

 

So, to point out an area for speculation, one may become an allomancer by burning lerasium (no use of other arts to do so) and anyone can hemalurgically spike someone as per http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/3941-spocon-report/?p=62356'>WoB.  Again, what about feruchemy?  How can someone gain access to feruchemy without the genetic heritage (feruchemist bloodline) and without using any other arts (i.e., no spiking)?  Or rather, since allomancy and hemalurgy are both in some way universally accessible, in what manner may feruchemy be universally accessible also?

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Well, we know that Feruchemy was the only one used before the Ascension of TLR. It is passed on genetically, like Allomancy, and like Allomancy dilutes over time when bred in impure lines, and it can be possessed in the same ways as Allomancy (meaning possessing all powers or only one power). Thus, it is easier to draw parallels to Allomamcy's operation than to Hemalurgy's.

The first possibility is that Feruchemy cannot be obtained. Some of the first Scadrians had it, and passed it on. This is unlikely, I believe, based on other Investitures' operations.

The second possibility is based upon Allomancy parallels. I like the idea of a 50/50 atium/lerasium alloy being a universal metalmind. Maybe it can also work like lerasium does in Allomancy. The main act of Allomancy is the burning of a metal. When one burns lerasium, one's Spiritual DNA is rewritten (and, presumably, their normal DNA) to give them Allomancy. This is technically, as I see it, the act of burning lerasium: rewriting DNA, thereby creating an Allomancer, not just "making a Mistborn". When one attempts to burn lerasium, they become a Mistborn. Anyone can do it.

The main acts of Feruchemy are filling and tapping a metalmind. Only a Feruchemist can do so. But if the atium-lerasium alloy is universal able to be filled with any trait, maybe attempting to fill it as a metalmind makes one a Feruchemist (meaning rewriting DNA, as lerasium does, to make one a Feruchemist). This means anyone can fill this alloy with a Feruchemical trait. The moment one tries to fill this metalmind, one becomes a full Feruchemist. Let's assume that it doesn't matter what trait the person is attempting to fill the metal with. Merely the attempt makes them a Feruchemist. From there, the person can proceed to fill the metalmind with whatever trait they want, for they are now a full Feruchemist.

This seems fairly likely to me. It makes sense, as far as I can tell. The parallels between Allomancy and Feruchemy allow for it to be logically posited.

Now on to alloys. Lerasium alloys make one a Misting of the metal lerasium is alloyed with. I will say attempting to fill an alloy of the lerasium-atium alloy makes one a Ferring of the metal alloyed. (Wow, three metals in one. If the other metal were also an atium alloy i have no idea how that would work. Let's ignore that for now.) Makes perfect sense.

Thoughts? Criticisms?

(Wow. That is my longest, most involved post yet.)

 

Edit: syntax, clarity, diction

Edited by GreyPilgrim
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I still think it would be clunky for feruchemy to be obtained by burning.  It may actually be this, but I would respond with "Oh...ok" <said slightly despondently>, if it was.  

 

As for the filling method, I generally could go for that except that would be way easy in some ways (other than the obvious difficulty in obtaining the metals).  I try to fill it and now I am a feruchemist.  Then I pass it to my buddy who is now a full feruchemist, who passes it to...etc.  Before you know it, you have a room full of feruchemists with no expenditure of anything.  Whereas with lerasium burning, it's a one-off.  It's burned and then is gone into the ether.  With hemalurgy, anyone can do it, but its limitations are obvious.

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As for the filling method, I generally could go for that except that would be way easy in some ways (other than the obvious difficulty in obtaining the metals).  I try to fill it and now I am a feruchemist.  Then I pass it to my buddy who is now a full feruchemist, who passes it to...etc.  Before you know it, you have a room full of feruchemists with no expenditure of anything.  Whereas with lerasium burning, it's a one-off.  It's burned and then is gone into the ether.  With hemalurgy, anyone can do it, but its limitations are obvious.

 

True, but think of it like this: the nature of Feruchemy is that in the end, there is balance. Once you have tapped a metalmind empty, it is you are left with what you started with, no more, no less, and now anyone can fill that metalmind. Once you have used my idea to become a Feruchemist, and the metalmind is filled and tapped, you are left with the same thing, able to be used by anyone to become a Feruchemist.

 

Just wondering, if one were to fill an atium-lerasium alloy with whatever trait and then burn it, what would happen? Would it Compound like any normal metalmind, or would you maybe get a super-mega-Compound? :blink:

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/>I still think it would be clunky for feruchemy to be obtained by burning. It may actually be this, but I would respond with "Oh...ok" <said slightly despondently>, if it was.

As for the filling method, I generally could go for that except that would be way easy in some ways (other than the obvious difficulty in obtaining the metals). I try to fill it and now I am a feruchemist. Then I pass it to my buddy who is now a full feruchemist, who passes it to...etc. Before you know it, you have a room full of feruchemists with no expenditure of anything. Whereas with lerasium burning, it's a one-off. It's burned and then is gone into the ether. With hemalurgy, anyone can do it, but its limitations are obvious.

Unless it's somehow tied to identity, as normal metalminds are. Perhaps the act of storing in it also stores an imprint of your identity and it's forever yours. Alternatively, such a metal may come with a finite charge already in it. No storing is necessary, but the first person to tap this divine charge becomes feruchemist.

Either way, I like it more than "burn metal and gain the ability to do something completely unrelated to the 'burn metal' system."

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This has probably been discussed before, but now that Harmony is basically one Shard, and the Preservation and Ruin mists mixed to make a gray mist, why don't we have sazedium, the god metal of Harmony?

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This has probably been discussed before, but now that Harmony is basically one Shard... why don't we have sazedium, the god metal of Harmony?

 

Harmony likely could choose to do this, but it would be up to him.  Same as he controls whether or not atium is released.

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This has probably been discussed before, but now that Harmony is basically one Shard, and the Preservation and Ruin mists mixed to make a gray mist, why don't we have sazedium, the god metal of Harmony?

 

The operative word there is "basically," yah Harmony can be thought of as a single Shard but Ruin and Preservation still exist as discrete entities within it.  There are still two kinds of mists during Alloy.  I think the reason there isn't a new god metal is the same as to why there aren't any new magic systems.  Though personally I think a 50/50 alloy should be called "sazedium."

 

I actually think burning sazedium to become a feruchemist makes sense.  Lerasium alloys are metals that anyone can burn, and have the side-effect of re-writing a person's sDNA.  Why come up with a new mechanic when there is one that is already suitable?

 

On a side note: Feruchemy wasn't the only metallic art used before Rashek's Ascension.  I wouldn't even call it the most used.  Hemalurgy, or at least the practice of metal piercings, was in fairly wide use at that point, Alendi had hemalurgic bronze in addition to being a seeker.  Feruchemy was limited to the Terris people, and really wasn't well-known.  Allomancy was incredibly rare, it was only when the mists started snapping people that allomancers appeared in any appreciable numbers.

Edited by WeiryWriter
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There's also this.

FIRE ARCADIA
Are there 50 Allomantic Metals?

BRANDON SANDERSON
Nearly. Does Harmony have a metal?

FIRE ARCADIA
Is that an alloy of Lerasium and Atium?

BRANDON SANDERSON
You're along the right lines.
Source

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The issue with burning sazedium (I will call it that because I can) to gain Feruchemy is that it just doesn't make sense. Why would one magic system be required to obtain access to another? As I said before, the parallels between Allomancy and Feruchemy seem to indicate that Feruchemy would be gained in a parallel to Allomancy.

About there being two mists in Alloy, is it just that they come out together? I thought they were described in a way to indicate they were darker than Preservation's mists and thus a mix of his and Ruin's?

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Well, it could be that anyone could burn sazium (my preference) in a similar manner to anyone being able to burn lerasium.  We are just spitballing afterall.  As far as parallels go, the same parallels exist between all three metallic arts.

 

It may be simpler to just go with the buyrning mechanism.  But, I think it would be inelegant.

 

The description of the mists in AoL would be expected to be different than in Mistborn.  There is an entirely different frame of reference for perception of color between the two.  Also, there is no description by someone who has seen mists both pre- and post-Harmony. 

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On your preference of sazium over sazedium, may I ask how you pronounce Sazed?

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Just to cite the two kinds of mists.

 

Also something I didn't think of for my last post.  It would actually be kind of balanced if you could get feruchemy by burning sazedium.  You can already get it by way of hemalurgy.  Burning would just be the way it is granted from the allomancy side of things.

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On your preference of sazium over sazedium, may I ask how you pronounce Sazed?

 

Like tazed or raised.  Which, incidientally, not that it really matters since he has said that he sometimes pronounces names different than the in-book pronunciation, also happens to be the way BS pronounces it.

 

One wonders how the god-metals received their names.  The names Ruin and Preservation were known to the pre-acscension Terris.  How did they get names based upon the names of the individuals holding the shards? 

Edited by Shardlet
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I feel obliged to bring this up again:

 

We know that one of the functions of buring Lerasium is to make someone a Mistborn, and everything I've seen assumes Feruchemy can be gained in a similar way (so forgive me if someone else has already thought of this). What if Feruchemy is gained not through burning but through tapping?

 

Perhaps Lerasium*, or an alloy or it, or some other (god) metal carries a Feruchemical charge which can be drawn by anyone on Scadrial, and which when drawn makes you a Feruchemist?

 

Or perhaps, fitting even further with the nature of Feruchemy, just as burning Lerasium fits with the nature of Allomancy, it requires first a Feruchemist to store their Feruchemy in the metal. They are weakened in the short term (or permanently) in order to create a Feruchemist.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

 

*I realise that Feruchemy is the power of balance between Ruin and Preservation, and Lerasium is only Preservation... the reason I suggest here it might be only Lerasium is because Lerasium has the "rewrite Spiritual-DNA" ability. This is just a possibility, as is the possibility a "Sazedium" is the key... obviously I'm leaving the metal open here, and am more interested in the idea that a Feruchemist-wannabe has to tap something, rather than burn something to ascend.

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Kadrok:

I'm new here, and hadn't seen that in my previous lurking. I didn't mean to cannibalize your idea.

Shardlet:

I suspected you pronounced it that way. Sazedium doesn't sound very good that way. I used to say Sazed that way too. I can't remember why I changed, but I now pronounce it say-ZED, which flows better in sazedium.

Re how Ati and Leras ended up in the metal names: I always figured Ruin and Preservation entrenched their names into the language somehow. Harmony probably wouldn't be able to force sazedium.

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Grey Pilgrim: Wasn't intended as a jab at you. My post didn't get that much attention, so maybe no one really noticed it.

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Kadrok: Didn't even really see it as a jab, just wanted to apologize out of respect. Well, hopefully the idea will take off a little more now.

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I like the tapping idea rather than the storing.  This would allow for a one-time use and would provide proper balance.  I am still inclined to lean towards an alloy of lerasium and atium since feruchemy is of both Ruin and Preservation.

 

@GreyPilgrim- My wife also says Say-zed, so you are in good company.

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So anyone can fill a, sazedium metalmind, but the person is not a Feruchemist until they tap it? I guess that does make more sense than what I was saying, with the storage creating the Feruchemist.

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Re: two types of mist.  It always seemed apparent to me that the 2 types of mist are regular, mundane mist (now that it's earth-like and not a scorched ball of ash) and Sazed Mist.  I never even considered 2 magical mists.

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Not that anyone can fill it (as only a feruchemist could fill it right).  What I meant by universal is that it can be used by a feruchemist to store any feruchemical trait (even more than one at a time, conceivably).  The idea I like for gaining feruchemy is an inherent one-time-use feruchemical charge in a chunk of atium-lerasium alloy (which must be a particular alloy for the charge to be accessible) which can be tapped by anyone thus granting full feruchemy.

 

If we all agree, then we should email Brandon and let him know what he decided so he can use it in the next books. :P    

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Not that anyone can fill it (as only a feruchemist could fill it right).  What I meant by universal is that it can be used by a feruchemist to store any feruchemical trait (even more than one at a time, conceivably).  The idea I like for gaining feruchemy is an inherent one-time-use feruchemical charge in a chunk of atium-lerasium alloy (which must be a particular alloy for the charge to be accessible) which can be tapped by anyone thus granting full feruchemy.

 

If we all agree, then we should email Brandon and let him know what he decided so he can use it in the next books. :P    

 

Combine this with the idea that Atium and Lerasium are real elements under a layer of spiritual wrapping, and tapping the charge of such an alloy could turn the alloy back into a mundane metal, and we would have a truly balanced way of gaining Feruchemical abilities.  One time tap, and then wham, it's just steel!  Or something like that.

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Interesting idea my happy friend.  Makes good sense.  I admit though, I am fond of the idea of tap to feruchemist and now you've got a rockin, metalmind to boot.  But, one can't always get what one wants.

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Is it possible that Feruchemy was always available to the people of Scadrial, and at some point in the past Allomantic lines started being created, wiping out the pure Feruchemy lines similar to what has happened in AoL?

 

To put the timeline more clearly, Ruin and Preservation create people on Scadrial. These people are all potential Feruchemists, but that is all. At some point prior to Rashek's time, Allomancy is introduced into the populace, perhaps through an alloy of Lerasium and an Allomantic metal (since WoB is no Mistborn prior to Ascension). The Allomantic lines dilute Feruchemical potential until only a specific ethnic group that shunned outside marriage maintains it. These people come to be known as the Terris people. Meanwhile, the minor Allomantic lines wipe out the potential Feruchemical lines, and the Feruchemical potential weakens the Allomantic lines enough that the mists are needed to Snap people.

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