The ultimate defense against chalklings?

[Kurkistan]

All I can recall about surface is that the durability of LInes of Forbiddance depends on the surface. We see chalklings moving across grass and human flesh, at the very least, so I think they might be all good once they're created.

[Observer]

Can they move across a chainlink pattern?

[Kurkistan]

I'm assuming it's a line that is the exact same thickness of the hole, so the chalklings cannot slip down the hole.

 

I don't think that would work. Since chalklings move entirely in 2D, the "force fields" of Lines' of Forbiddance don't really matter to them. I think we have fairly storng indications that chalkings only care about 2D and chalk, while the force-field effect is in the 3D world and is not really meant to interfere with chalkings.

 

Recall that the last Rithmatic student chalklingized drew additional Lines along the walls to stop the Chalklings from just climbing around his initial line and thus bypassing the line. If the force field was enough, then simply drawing one line that butted against he wall and had a high enough force field to reach the ceiling would do the trick.

 

Because of this, I think that the chalking could simply climb down the side of the trench and attack the Line from there, as they would have no problem being on the same plane as its edge.

Edited June 18, 2013 by Kurkistan

[Observer]

Makes sense, I guess.

 

How do chalklings interact with surfaces too small to fit them, even if all sides are used? Like, as I mentioned above, a chinlink fence, or a mesh pattern? Would they be unable to cross?

[Tarontos]

Also what about hopping to things that don't touch the floor, I am not talking about the space between atoms small, I mean things like a helicopter, how close to the ground does something have to be for the chalkling to reach it?

[Galavantes]

What about drawing a line of Forbiddance on a movable surface? Like say a plank of plywood. When I was reading the book I even imagined the Rithmatists standing in a circle just outside the huge circle of warding, holding planks with extremely think lines of Forbiddance on them, and slowly advancing towards the tower. Constricting the space that the wild chalklings could be in. Then maybe once it's small enough start tossing acid into the middle and killing hoards of them.

Edited June 25, 2013 by Galavantes?

[Observer]

As I said last page, I'm pretty sure Lines of Forbiddence anchor the surface they're written on, leaving it immobile.

[Phantom Monstrosity]

As I said last page, I'm pretty sure Lines of Forbiddence anchor the surface they're written on, leaving it immobile.

Then use Lines of Forbiddance to build a floating castle.

[Crysanja]

i think thouse lines of forbiddance are not realy a save thing.

just a few calklings can penetrate a line relativly quickly(just thouse few with shovels, remember), idk how many calklings there are at nbraska(?) if it could be in the hundrets, thouse lines could break even quicker. 

the strength of them is that you can propably draw them in seconds and breach them in a minute? -> useless for permanent fortifications against calklings, without oversight.

 

i guess they will fad away over time.

[Observer]

Well, lines of warding, by that logic, are even less safe.

 

@Phantom, I got the impression that you couldn't draw a line of forbiddence on something that isn't touching the ground.

[Shardlet]

Also what about hopping to things that don't touch the floor, I am not talking about the space between atoms small, I mean things like a helicopter, how close to the ground does something have to be for the chalkling to reach it?

 

 

Being 2D creatures that move across a 2D surface, I suspect that chalklings could not traverse a space lacking a continuous (constant physical contact) surface.

 

 

 

 

What about drawing a line of Forbiddance on a movable surface? Like say a plank of plywood. When I was reading the book I even imagined the Rithmatists standing in a circle just outside the huge circle of warding, holding planks with extremely think lines of Forbiddance on them, and slowly advancing towards the tower. Constricting the space that the wild chalklings could be in. Then maybe once it's small enough start tossing acid into the middle and killing hoards of them.

 

Interesting idea, but I expect that the chalklings could simply travel underneath the plywood (movable) surface. That is of course, unless the field extends both above and below the drawn line of forbiddence.  In the which case the moveable surface would no longer be effectively moveable.

 

 

 

 

As I said last page, I'm pretty sure Lines of Forbiddence anchor the surface they're written on, leaving it immobile.

 

What lead you to this conclusion Observer?  In the book, we have only seen lines of forbiddence drawn on fixed surfaces.  So I don't see anything to suggest an anchoring.  If the line extends below the line of forbiddence (This is really cumbersome.  From here on out, in my posts, a line of forbiddence shall hereafter be known as an LoF) then the field must penetrate solid material beneath the LoF.  Since the field interacts with the 3D world, I don't see how this could be reasonably possible without leaving a field shaped hole in the material.

 

 

Can they move across a chainlink pattern?

 

If they can move across a field of grass, I would expect that they could also move across a chainlink fence.

 

Wow, I liken this post to throwing a bucket of acid on a lot of peoples ideas.  Kind of a downer of a post.  Sorry for the negative vibes.

 

Here is some food for thought that will hopefully be a balm to any of those I may have harmed:

So, the wild chalklings are on Nebrask which is an island.  How could the chalklings traverse a fluid surface effectively?  Seems tricky.  Significant enough that I'm sure Brandon has an answer, though.

[Kurkistan]

In answer to your one point of positive input, Shardlet, it's stated in-book that they are afraid of chalklings riding fallen trees to get to other islands.

[Shardlet]

Now that you say that, I recall it.  It seems to me that such a threat would be somewhat limited in scope.  Clearly, keeping them on Nebrask is ideal, but how frequently would that problem present itself.  Clearly, if the Aztecs had substantial Chalkling wars, then log sailing and other methods are a substantial risk.  Though, I seem to recall a passage about driving all the chalklings back to Nebrask.  So it appears, they were once far more widespread. 

 

This line of thinking causes me to wonder about the extent of wild chalkling sentience and intelligence as well as the nature of wild chalkling reproduction.  Are wild chalklings born or simply drawn by a Forgotten?

[Crysanja]

something to think about.

 

what happens when a line of forbiddens is drawn on the ceiling.

does the "wall" go downward?

if it is the case, and we assume it will reach the floor, will it prevent calklings from crossing?

can calklings only attack the actual line or the wall too? - or would there allways be space between the floor and the wall?

can calklings clime a line of forbiddens?

[Shardlet]

I expect that the field formed by a LoF will extend from the line perpendicular to the surface upon which the line is drawn.  So if on the ceiling, the field would extend downward, if on a wall (and parallel to the ground), the field would extend horizontally.

 

It depends on the width of the line.  While we were given this information in the book, we weren't given an example of the height of a LoF field.  I suspect a typical line would not reach the floor since I did not see any indication that the lines which were drawn on the floor reached the ceiling.  But this may be due to a flawed idea on what would happen if a LoF was drawn in a place where something was above the line at a height that would be lower than the height of the formed field.

 

The chalklings attack the line at the ends of the line as seen in the book.  The field is like a repulsor field rather than a wall.  In other words, you cannot touch it directly.  It has been described to feel like pushing to magnets together at the same pole.  Thus, the chalklings also cannot climb the field. 

[WeiryWriter]

Chalklings wouldn't be able to attack the field (which would extend downward from where it was drawn) but they would be able to climb up the walls to the ceiling to attack the Line there.  Chalklings aren't constrained by gravity.

[Observer]

Somebody a page or two back theorized that Chalklings are only blocked by lines themselves, not the walls they produce. Considering how chalklings and the 3D interact, it seems a more reasonable theory.

[Allonsidra]

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The scale would be challenging, but not insurmountable.  As to the chalklings filling in the moat, I wonder how it is that two-dimensional (entities?) could interact with a three-dimensional objects.  Clearly it is somehow possible since chalklings are used to wind the sprinds for the springrails.  But I wonder how?

To wind the springs takes a lot of strength, but really it's just two handles that work like a pair of muscles or bicycle pedals. I guess a chalking would move to each of the handles and, because they're cylindrical, wrap themselves around it. If they're both attached to a tether it'll work like a pulley system: as one goes down, the other goes up. I guess for the chalkling to force its handle down it needs to have the main part of positioned on the outside so it can move towards the inside by the bottom of the handle, forcing it out and in an arc downwards. Eventually, they'd get some momentum going and it'd be a finely tuned operation, so long as the chalklings are kept under control.

[Allonsidra]

Chalklings wouldn't be able to attack the field (which would extend downward from where it was drawn) but they would be able to climb up the walls to the ceiling to attack the Line there.  Chalklings aren't constrained by gravity.

Drawing a line on the ceiling, then the floor, and alternating would slow them down a lot as they'd have to keep moving surface, and offensive chalklings are slow.

[Crysanja]

not that i know about, but maybe calklings arent effected by the field of the line, but only by the calk.

[junior]

It's not just the chalk or the chalk line.  The two leads have a mock chalk duel mid-way through the book so that he can teach her a new combat strategy.  He draws lots of lines on the ground during the course of their mock duel, but her chalklings completely ignore the lines.

[Shardlet]

I think Crysanja meant that perhaps it is not the three dimesional field effect that stops the chalklings, but rather a two dimensional rithmatic effect similar to the effect of a line of warding (only stronger) that interacts with the chalklings.

[akasketch]

I also thought of the acid moat.  Remember though, the chalklings Morsk refers to are actually transform Rithmatists.  At the time of the book, the only chalklings known to be hazardous to people are the wild chalklings and chalklings that Rithmatist who drew them lost control of.  therefore, it stands to reason that acid is permanent against wild chalklings.

 

 

 

The scale would be challenging, but not insurmountable.  As to the chalklings filling in the moat, I wonder how it is that two-dimensional (entities?) could interact with a three-dimensional objects.  Clearly it is somehow possible since chalklings are used to wind the springs for the springrails.  But I wonder how?

 

 

 

I would expect that the wall of the line of forbiddance would be almost perpendicular to the surface upon which the line is scribed.  I say almost because if the width of the line determines the height of the wall, then I could readily envisage that the field forms an excedingly acute triangle (in cross-section) with the width of the scribed line as the side opposite the smallest angle. In other words, a field generated by a line of forbiddance has two non-parallel sides which angle towards each other until they meet (forming the top of the field) and the angle of incidence between a side of a field to the line of forbiddance is constant from line to line.  This would result in the height of the field being precisely determined by the width of the line from which it is generated.    

 

It is interesting that the scribing of lines on a portable or movable surface is unexplored in the book.  I suspect we will see it addressed in the next.

Ok, more Trig stuff. I think that that makes the most sense so far.

[Curiosity]

I also thought of the acid moat.  Remember though, the chalklings Morsk refers to are actually transform Rithmatists.

 

Somewhat unrelated, but if Rithmatists have a special bond with a Shadowblaze, sort of like the Forgotten with Harding, then those chalklings might be Shadowblazes which are bent out of shape or something. Driven mad maybe. But they can't be destroyed by acid because of their human "host" which is trapped inside of the chalkling. 

[Lightsworn Panda]

Hmm... I've always wondered what would happen if a chalkling (a 2D creature) met a tesseract (the 4D version of a cube).