Popular Post Shardcellist Posted July 14, 2015 Popular Post Report Share Posted July 14, 2015 (edited) A Rosharan Political Analysis: Secret Societies Ghostbloods, Diagramists, Skybreakers, Sons of Honor, Envisagers, Stone Shamans, Ardentia The following is intended to be a comprehensive guide on known secret societies on Roshar, especially ones interfering in The Stormlight Archive. Due to the complexity and excessive number of such societies, this will hopefully be a useful reference for newcomers, confused fans, and those that want to double check or reference any information. If you note any inaccuracies or things that I missed, feel free to let me know so that I can update the information to be as accurate as possible.The Ghostbloods:The Ghostbloods are the most encountered secret society with the least information given. As Mraize told Shallan at the end of Words of Radiance, we know next to nothing about the Ghostbloods or their purpose. We can, however, make some educated approximations, and codify the information we have been given.· Jasnah Kholin: She and the Ghostbloods seem to be engaged in a policy of mutual assassination; but unfortunately we don’t know the history or reasons behind this.· Sons of Honor: There seems to be a specific rivalry between the Ghostbloods and the Sons of Honor. The Ghostbloods have a keen interest in Amaram at the Shattered Plains, and Iyatil tried to assassinate him at the end of Words of Radiance (most likely, she has at least one nonlethal poison); Amaram also suspected the Ghostbloods of sending Helaran as the Shardbearer to kill him, though later evidence indicates that it was really the Skybreakers. Gavilar’s two suspects for his assassination were Thaidakar (probable leader of the Ghostbloods) and Restares (probable leader of the Sons of Honor). Both are also seeking maps and Urithiru.· Maps and Urithiru: The Ghostbloods have an uncanny interest in maps. (This is not singular to the Ghostbloods; the Sons of Honor, Parshendi, and others seem to have the same interest.) Either they (as well as the others) are putting plenty of effort into the search for Urithiru (as seems likely), or the maps have something else of interest.· Taravangian and Tukar: Mraize, in his conversation with Raspy Voice, seemed to indicate that he thinks Taravangian and the Diagram of little importance. Either he is unaware of the Diagram or its extent, or the Diagram is of less importance than we are led to believe. In the same conversation, he speaks of a “creature in Tukar” that is either not human or not of the local species. As pointed out, this is likely the "god-priest, Tezim," leading the Tukari in the conflict over Sesemalex Dar.· Worldhoppers: Secret conversations, key props, the Diagram, and Words of Brandon confirm that Mraize and Iyatil are worldhoppers. The conversation Shallan overheard in Chapter 54 of Words of Radiance seems to indicate that there may be at least one other. A person with a raspy voice. Conspiracy theory! Dreok Crushthroat! The Ghostbloods could, therefore, be a Cosmere-wide organization in either membership, expanse, or at least information.Significant Members:· Mraize: A man who, on first sight, reminds Shallan of Hoid. He is twisted an scarred, fixates on courage (in his first conversation with Shallan), and likes to use local weapons to learn of different cultures. He is the ward of Iyatil, and a worldhopper. In fact, Adrotagia wondered (in her annotations to the Diagram) if he was the “wanderer Taravangian spoke of.· Iyatil: She is considered the “babsk” of Mraize. The only other babsk we see is Vstim, and from Rysn we learn that the babsk is considered the parent of the apprentice, in charge of “rearing” them to be a full trader. I am not sure how this relationship works with the Ghostbloods. She has an orange carapace mask she refuses to remove, is a skilled actress, and is also a worldhopper.· Tyn: An expert con artist that took Shallan under her wing. She was in league with the Ghostbloods but may not have been an actual member. She was in charge of the operation to assassinate Jasnah Kholin. Shallan killed her with her Shardblade when Tyn discovered her identity and tried to kill her.· Thaidakar: This appears to be a leader or high ranking member of the Ghostbloods (he is spoken of in conjunction with the Ghostbloods in a way that implies he is the head of the organization by Amaram in The Way of Kings, and Words of Radiance reaffirms a Ghostblood position, with the term “Master Thaidakar” used by Mraize. Gavilar suspected Thaidakar for his assassination, telling him that he was “too late;” though Restares (a Son of Honor) and Sadeas were also suspects. We have no other information at the moment.Lin Davar: Father of Shallan and Helaran (along with three other siblings). He assumed the blame for the deaths of Shallan's mother and her friend in order to preserve the secret of Shallan's Radiancy and the fact that Shallan had killed them (albeit in self-defense). He grew politically ambitious, increasing House Davar's importance and preparing to make a bid for Highprince, but making enemies and alienating allies. His steward, Luesh, was his intermediary with the rest of the Ghostblood organization, which had been backing his bid for the Highprince succession and had loaned him the Soulcaster. He was killed by Shallan when he tried to kill Nan Balat during one of his rages.Luesh: Steward to Lin Davar and his intermediary with the Ghostbloods as they backed him politically. He was trained to use a Soulcaster. He (purportedly) died in his sleep after Lin's death, while Shallan was in Kharbranth.Kabsal: A Ghostblood posting as a Kharbranthian Ardent. He befriended and fell in love with Shallan, but his main purpose was to assassinate Jasnah Kholin. He died from poisoned bread during the assassination attempt after Jasnah inadvertently Soulcast the antidote.Shallan: Following Jasnah's "death," Shallan's encounter with Tyn, and her arrival at the Shattered Plains, Shallan infiltrated the Ghostblood organization under the alias Veil. She was ultimately admitted as a full Ghostblood member, but her true identity was ultimately discovered. Despite this, Mraize still offered her the membership. "Let Shallan Davar be a Radiant, conformist and noble. Let Veil come to us. And let her find truth."Interesting quote (from Mraize's conversation with Shallan at the end of Words of Radiance): "Your family [the Davar's] has a long history of involvement in these events."The Sons of Honor:The Sons of Honor are a group of Vorin extremists. Fortunately (or unfortunately), we see a lot of them through the interactions and investigations of Amaram, especially from Words of Radiance. (Ironically, the English singular – Son of Honor – is only one letter away from perfect Rosharan symmetry, a good Vorin name.) Their purpose is to return the Desolations in order to bring back the Heralds and restore the Heirocratic dominance of Old Vorinism. While obviously misguided and misinformed, and seemingly unimportant, they still manage to kick up quite the storm.Restares: We know little more of Restares than we do of Thaidakar. The apparent leader of the Sons of Honor, all we truly know is that he is Amaram’s superior, one of Gavilar’s murder suspects, and that his cronies were “close,” according to Mraize, presumably to finding Urithiru. He is usually mentioned in context with Thaidakar. He is the individual to whom Amaram sent his progress report at the end of Words of Radiance.Amaram: A devout Son of Honor, he has been seeking Heralds (namely the “person who calls himself Taln), gathering maps (presumably seeking Urithiru), and trying to get the Parshendi to transform into Voidbringers. While he has garnered much dislike in the novels and among fans for murdering Kaladin’s men and being generally dishonorable, I feel he is no worse (and absolutely no better) than many of the other misguided, semi-antagonistic members of such secret societies; while he is more misguided than most, he honestly feels he is doing what is best for Roshar, without regard to himself, but has a very destination-before-journey mindset that is common in similar individuals (Taravangian, Mraize, and even Hoid to an extent).The Diagramists:The most appreciated and generally understood secret organization, the society of the Diagram is the prime example of “Destination before Journey,” summarized by the Catechism of the Back of the Flowered Painting: Q: What cost must we bear? A: The cost is irrelevant. Mankind must survive. Our burden is that of the species, and all other considerations are but dust by comparison On the night of his death, Gavilar confided in King Taravangian of Kharbranth, telling him of his visions of the Almighty. Following this, Taravangian sought out the Nightwatcher, asking for the capacity to save humankind. The result? Daily intelligence fluctuations, inversely connected with compassion levels. Then came one “singular day of unparalleled brilliance,” “making connections no man had ever before made”: The Diagram. Information written in an alien script (devised by Taravangian that day to express information more clearly) all over Taravangian’s bedroom, with a key fortunately carved into his table; now codified (in its original form) for more practical use. Although Taravangian’s Interlude maintains that he did not truly see into the future, the Diagram has made “eerily accurate” (though not entirely infallible) predictions of the results of specific actions necessary to unite the world (under Taravangian) to resist the Desolation, as his interpretation of Gavilar’s visions required: “You must become king. Of everything.”Quotes: "They will come you cannot stop their oaths look for those who survive when they should not that pattern will be your clue." Coda of the Northwest Bottom Corner: Paragraph 3 77 "One danger in deploying such a potent weapon will be the potential encouragement of those exploring the Nahel bond. Care must be taken to avoid placing these subjects in situations of powerful stress unless you accept the consequences of their potential Investiture." Foorboard 27: Paragraph 6 78 "AhbuttheywereleftbehindItisobviousfromthenatureofthebondButwherewherewherewhereSetoffObviousRealizationlikeapricityTheyarewiththeShinWemustfindoneCanwemaketouseaTruthlessCanwecraftaweapon" Floorboard 17: Paragraph 2, every second letter starting with the first Clarifies to: "Ah but they were left behind. It is obvious from the nature of the bond. But where where where where? Set off. Obvious. Realization like apricity. They are with the Shin. We must find one. Can we make to use a Truthless? Can we craft a weapon?" 79 "Q: For what essential must we strive? A: The essential of preservation, to shelter a seed of humanity through the coming storm. Q: What cost must we bear? A: The cost is irrelevant. Mankind must survive. Our burden is that of the species, and all other considerations are but dust by comparison." Catechism of the Back of the Flowered Painting: Paragraph 1 80 "You must become king. Of Everything." Tenets of Instruction, Back of the Footboard: Paragraph 1 81 "The Unmade are a deviation, a flair, a conundrum that may not be worth your time. You cannot help but think of them. They are fascinating. Many are mindless. Like the spren of human emotions, only much more nasty. I do believe a few can think, however." Book of the 2nd Desk Drawer: Paragraph 14 82 "There is one you will watch. Though all of them have some relevance to precognition, Moelach is one of the most powerful in this regard. His touch seeps into a soul as it breaks apart from the body, creating manifestations powered by the spark of death itself. But no, this is a distraction. Deviation. Kingship. We must discuss the nature of kingship." Book of the 2nd Desk Drawer: Paragraph 15 83 "Obviously they are fools The Desolation needs no usher It can and will sit where it wishes and the signs are obvious that the spren anticipate it doing so soon The Ancient of Stones must finally begin to crack It is a wonder that upon his will rested the prosperity and peace of a world for over four millennia" Book of the 2nd Ceiling Rotation: Pattern 1 84 "1118251011127124915121010111410215117112101112171344831110715142541434109161491493412122541010125127101519101112341255115251215755111234101112915121061534" Book of the 2nd Ceiling Rotation: Pattern 15 A code. Decrypts to: "Hold the secret that broke the Knights Radiant. You may need it to destroy the new orders when they return."[1] 85 "But who is the wanderer, the wild piece, the one who makes no sense? I glimpse at his implications, and the world opens to me. I shy back. Impossible. Is it?" West Wall Psalm of Wonders: Paragraph 8 "(Note by Adrotagia: Could this refer to Mraize?)" 86 "One is almost certainly a traitor to the others." Book of the 2nd Desk Drawer: Paragraph 27 87 "Chaos in Alethkar is, of course, inevitable. Watch carefully, and do not let power in the kingdom solidify. The Blackthorn could become an ally or our greatest foe, depending on whether he takes the path of the warlord or not. If he seems likely to sue for peace, assassinate him expeditiously. The risk of competition is too great." Writings upon the Bedstand Lamp: Paragraph 4 "(Adrotagia’s 3rd translation from the original hieroglyphics)" 88 "1173090605 1173090801 1173090901 1173091001 1173091004 1173100105 1173100205 1173100401 1173100603 1173100804" North Wall Coda, Windowsill region: Paragraph 2 "(This appears to be a sequence of dates, but their relevance is as yet unknown.)" The dates are those of the final 10 highstorms preceding the arrival of the Everstorm. 89 "TherehastobeananswerWhatistheanswerStopTheParshendiOneofthemYestheyarethemissingpiecePushfortheAlethitodestroythemoutrightbeforethisoneobtainstheirpowerItwillformabridge" Floorboard 17: Paragraph 2, every second letter starting with the second Clarifies to: "There has to be an answer. What is the answer? Stop. The Parshendi. One of them. Yes they are the missing piece. Push for the Alethi to destroy them outright before this one obtains their power. It will form a bridge." · Inaccuracies: The Diagram, while startlingly accurate, has been off about a few things, more so the farther into the future it goes. Taravangian hopes for another day of equivalent intelligence to revamp the Diagram, but Adrotagia’s calculations declare this to be unlikely. Therefore, the current method is to use Death Rattles, little precognitive phrases uttered by the dying, created by Moelach (according to the Diagram, one of the Unmade) and powered by the “spark of life itself.” Two problems thus arise: First, that the Diagram is gradually decreasing in accuracy; Second, that the method of updating the Diagram is controlled by an evil, powerful being most likely a Splinter of Odium. These could have interesting future ramifications.· Death Rattles: “You've killed me. Bastards, you've killed me! While the sun is still hot, I die!”· —Collected on Chachabah 1171, 10 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed soldier thirty-one years of age. Sample is considered questionable.[7]· “The love of men is a frigid thing, a mountain stream only three steps from the ice. We are his. Oh Stormfather... we are his. It is but a thousand days, and the Everstorm comes.”· —Collected on Shashahes 1171, 31 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed pregnant woman of middle years. The child did not survive.[8]· It is estimated this came exactly 1229 days before the advent of the Everstorm. It is possible that these Rattles are less than fully accurate, or that whoever gave this death rattle valued poetry over technically accurate detail or, given the specific phrasing, that this was perhaps a foreshadowing to a time 229 days in the future when someone else would prophecy that it would be 1000 days until the Everstorm.· · “Ten orders. We were loved, once. Why have you forsaken us, Almighty! Shard of my soul, where have you gone?”· —Collected on Kakashan 1171, 5 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a lighteyed woman in her third decade.[9]· “A man stood on a cliffside and watched his homeland fall into dust. The waters surged beneath, so far beneath. And he heard a child crying. They were his own tears.”· —Collected on Tanatesev 1171, 30 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a cobbler of some renown.[10]· “I'm dying, aren't I? Healer, why do you take my blood? Who is that beside you, with his head of lines? I can see a distant sun, dark and cold, shining in a black sky.”· —Collected on Jesanach 1172, 11 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a Reshi chull trainer. Sample is of particular note.[11]· This rattle appears to reference Shadesmar, based on the description of the sun and sky, and a Cryptic.· · “I have seen the end, and have heard it named. The Night of Sorrows, the True Desolation. The Everstorm.”· —Collected on Naneses 1172, 15 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed youth of unknown origin.[12]· “I'm cold. Mother, I'm cold. Mother? Why can I still hear the rain? Will it stop?”· —Collected on Vevishes 1172, 32 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a lighteyed female child, approximately six years old.[13]· “They are aflame. They burn. They bring the darkness when they come, and so all you can see is that their skin is aflame. Burn, burn, burn...”· —Collected on Palahishev 1172, 21 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a baker's apprentice.[14]· “Victory! We stand atop the mount! We scatter them before us! Their homes become our dens, their lands are now our farms! And they shall burn, as we once did, in a place that is hollow and forlorn.”· —Collected on Ishashan 1172, 18 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a lighteyed spinster of the eighth dahn.[15]· “Ten people, with Shardblades alight, standing before a wall of black and white and red.”· —Collected on Jesachev 1173, 12 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject an ardent member of the the Silent Gatherers, overheard during his last moments.[16]· “Three of sixteen ruled, but now the Broken One reigns.”· —Collected on Chachanan 1173, 84 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a cutpurse with the wasting sickness, of partial Iriali descent.[17]· This rattle appears to reference the sixteen Shards of Adonalsium. Three of which, Honor, Cultivation, and Odium, are invested in Roshar.· · “I'm standing over the body of a brother. I'm weeping. Is that his blood or mine? What have we done?”· —Collected on Vevanev 1173, 107 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was an out-of-work Veden sailor.[18]· “He must pick it up, the fallen title! The tower, the crown, and the spear!”· —Collected on Vevahach 1173, 8 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a prostitute of unknown background.[19]· “The burdens of nine become mine. Why must I carry the madness of them all? Oh, Almighty, release me.”· —Observed on Palaheses 1173, collected secondhand and later reported to the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a wealthy lighteyes.[20]· This rattle appears to be from the perspective of the Herald Talenel, the only Herald to be return, through death, to wherever the Heralds went to be tortured between Desolations at the end of the Last Desolation.· · “A woman sits and scratches out her own eyes. Daughter of kings and winds, the vandal.”· —Collected on Palahevan 1173, 73 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a beggar of some renown, known for his elegant songs.[21]· This rattle is believed to refer to the Herald Shalash, the daughter of the Herald Jezrien, Herald of Kings and patron of the Order of Windrunners.[Citation needed] Shalash is also Baxil's mistress who destroys art, including depictions of a specific Herald, believed to be those of Shalash herself.· · “Light grows so distant. The storm never stops. I am broken, and all around me have died. I weep for the end of all things. He has won. Oh, he has beaten us.”· —Collected on Palahakev 1173, 16 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a Thaylen sailor.[22]· “I hold the suckling child in my hands, a knife at his throat, and know that all who live wish me to let the blade slip. Spill its blood upon the ground, over my hands, and with it gain us further breath to draw.”· —Collected on Shashanan 1173, 23 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed youth of sixteen years. Sample is of particular note.[23]· “Re-Shephir, the Midnight Mother, giving birth to abominations with her essence so dark, so terrible, so consuming. She is here! She watches me die!”· —Collected on Shashabev 1173, 8 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed dock-worker in his forties, father of three.[24]· “The death is my life, the strength becomes my weakness, the journey has ended.”· —Observed on Betabanes, 1173, 95 seconds pre-death, collected secondhand and later reported to the the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a scholar of some minor renown. Sample considered questionable.[25]· This rattle appears to reference the First Ideal of the Knights Radiant: Life before Death. Strength before Weakness. Journey before Destination.· · “Above the final void I hang, friends behind, friends before. The feast I must drink clings to their faces, and the words I must speak spark in my mind. The old oaths will be spoken anew.”· —Collected on Betabanan 1173, 45 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a lighteyed child of five years. Diction improved remarkably when giving sample.[26]· This rattle appears to be from the perspective of Kaladin during the Battle of the Tower, moments before he swears the Second Ideal of the Windrunners. The "final void" is a chasm over which he is jumping. The "friends behind, friends before" are the members of Bridge Four behind him and the army of Dalinar Kholin trapped by Parshendi before him. The "feast I must drink" is Stormlight stored in the gemstones knotted into the malen Parshendi's beards. The "words I must speak" is the Second Ideal. The "old oaths" are the Immortal Words.· · “In the storm I awaken, falling, spinning, grieving.”· —Collected on Kakanev 1173, 13 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a city guardsman.[27]· “The darkness becomes a palace. Let it rule! Let it rule!”· —Collected on Kakevah 1173, 22 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed Selay man of unknown profession.[28]· “I wish to sleep. I know now why you do what you do, and I hate you for it. I will not speak of the truths I see.”· —Collected on Kakashah 1173, 142 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a Shin sailor, left behind by his crew, reportedly for bringing them ill luck. Sample largely useless.[29]· “They come from the pit, two dead men, a heart in their hands, and I know that I have seen true glory.”· —Collected on Kakashah 1173, 13 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a rickshaw puller.[30]· This rattle appears to refer to Kaladin and Shallan Davar returning to the Warcamps at the Shattered Plains following an ill-fated expedition. The "pit" is a reference to the chasms. the "two dead men" are Kaladin and Shallan, presumed to be dead after falling into a chasm. The "heart" is an emerald gemheart they harvested from a chasmfiend they encountered and killed on their return journey.· · “I see them. They are the rocks. They are the vengeful spirits. Eyes of red.”· —Collected on Kakakes 1173, 8 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed young woman of fifteen who was reportedly mentally unstable since childhood.[31]· “That chanting, that singing, those rasping voices.”· —Collected on Kaktach 1173, 16 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a middle-aged potter who reported seeing strange dreams during highstorms during the previous two years.[32]· “Let me no longer hurt! Let me no longer weep! Dai-gonarthis! The Black Fisher holds my sorrow and consumes it!”· —Collected on Tanatesach 1173, 28 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed female street juggler.[33]· The Silent Gatherers have noted a similarity between this death rattle and one they denote as "sample 1172-89".· · “They named it the Final Desolation, but they lied. Our gods lied. Oh, how they lied. The Everstorm comes. I hear its whispers, see its stormwall, know its heart.”· —Collected on Tanatanes 1173, 8 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was an Azish itinerant worker. Sample of particular note.[34]· “All is withdrawn for me. I stand against the one who saved my life. I protect the one who killed my promises. I raise my hand. The storm responds.”· —Collected on Tanatanev 1173, 18 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a darkeyed mother of four in her sixty-second year.[35]· “Above silence, the illuminating storms—dying storms—illuminate the silence above.”· —Collected on Tanatanev 1173, 18 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was an illiterate Herdazian.[6]· “He watches! The Black piper in the night. He holds us in his palm... playing a tune that no man can hear!”· —Observed circa 1172. Subject was Cenn, a member of Kaladin's squad in Brightlord Meridas Amaram's army.[36]· “They break the land itself! They want it, but in their rage they will destroy it. Like the jealous man burns his rich things rather than let them be taken by his enemies! They come!”· —Observed circa 1173. Subject was Gadol, a member of Bridge Four.[37]· “And all the world was shattered! The rocks trembled with their steps, and the stones reached toward the heavens. We die! We die!”· —Observed circa 1173. Subject was Maps, a member of Bridge Four.[38]· “The day was ours, but they took it. Stormfather! You cannot have it. The day is ours. They come, rasping, and the lights fail. Oh, Stormfather!”· —Collected circa Tanat 1173 by Taravangian. Subject was a young boy.[5]· “So the night will reign, for the choice of honor is life...”· —Observed circa Ishi 1173 by Taravangian. Subject was King Valam of Jah Keved.[4] · Sleepers: These are members of the Diagramist group, likely a term for a specific type of undercover agent. “Wake every Alethi sleeper we have; send every agent in the area.” These may include Graves and his men.· Silent Gatherers: These Diagramists are headed by Joshor and are in charge of murdering the terminally ill in the Kharbranthian hospitals in order to find and record as many Death Rattles as possible to augment the Diagram.Members:· Taravangian: King of Kharbranth and now Jah Keved, Taravangian was the confidante of Gavilar Kholin on his final night. After seeking out the Nightwatcher, he received the boon of intelligence fluctuation and created the Diagram on a day of unparalleled genius (as explained above). Through his occasional brilliance, he is able to interpret the Diagram and is the leader of the society. “Besides, in dealing with the Diagram, he might not remember what he had written or why – but there were echoes sometimes.” · Adrotagia: Head of Taravangian’s scholars and his boyhood friend. Following Taravangian, she probably knows the most about the Diagram. · Mrall: Taravangian’s bodyguard, in charge of determining his capacity to serve in public on a daily basis. A peculiar figure, he claims to be able to “change emotions on a whim,” such as ceasing to take pleasure in suffering. · Graves: A self-styled Alethi patriot and a Shardbearer, he was in charge of the group trying to assassinate King Elhokar. He is now fleeing the Shattered Plains. Through the assassination attempt, he recruited Moash to their cause. · Szeth-son-son-Vallano: Truthless of Shinovar, the Assassin in White. An explanation should be unnecessary. From the middle of The Way of Kings to the end of Words of Radiance, he is under the control of Taravangian and acts on his orders. The Skybreakers:The name originally applied to an order of the Knights Radiant. Whether they remain so, are the organizational remnant of what used to be Radiants, are Radiants ("This act of great villainy went beyond the impudence which had hitherto been ascribed to the orders; as the fighting was particularly intense at the time, many attributed this act to a sense of inherent betrayal; and after they withdrew, about two thousand made assault upon them, destroying much of the membership; but this was only nine of the ten, as one said they would not abandon their arms and flee, but instead entertained great subterfuge at the expense of the other nine."), or merely share the same name and Heraldic leader remains unknown. In any case, they are a group headed by Nalan, Herald of Justice. They do seem to “put the law above all else,” though laws are twisted to suit their needs, and they certainly have a proliferation of Shardblades; however, their actions do not seem Radiant-worthy and they seem to be trying to assassinate – pseudolegally, of course – Surgebinders along the path to Radianthood, all in the name of preventing another Desolation. The best knowledge comes from the Interludes of Ym and Lift, along with Szeth’s portion of chapter 88 of Words of Radiance. I hope for a vast increase of information with the release of the next book (such as the information and references in The Way of Kings versus those in Words of Radiance.)· Nalan’elin: “Nin” to Szeth, almost certainly Darkness to Lift and the man in Ym’s story; Herald of Justice, Divine Attributes of Just and Confident. We don’t know what the years since Aharietiam have truly done to the Heralds, though they seem to be “doing worse.” This one has gained a penchant for assassinating Surgebinders and giving mentally unstable Shin Surgebinders Awakened pseudoShardblades. (Jezerezah only knows what else he’s been up to! I’ll leave it up to your imagination). · Szeth-son-Neturo: Once again, the Assassin in White needs little introduction. Now he has the Awakened sword Nightblood and a mission to bring justice to the leaders of the Shin, and he is learning at the feet of a dangerous Herald who may or may not be just as unstable as Szeth. · Helaran: Shallan’s oldest brother apparently “sought out the Skybreakers,” presumably where he received his Shardblade and Plate. Taravangian and Adrotagia considered him a possible tutor of Shallan in her Surgebinding. Nothing else is known, despite Shallan’s flashbacks (I am beginning to tire of saying that. I expect some good information from the third book!)The Envisagers:A cult, as Teft called them, that “believed in the Radiants, Heralds, and Old Vorinism; especially Old Vorinism.” They believed that if they could return the Voidbringers, it would bring back the Knights Radiant (comparable to the Sons of Honor in the preceding respects). They believed that if they put their members in mortal danger, they would manifest Surgebinding powers – a Snapping concept, of sorts. None did, but many (including Teft’s mother) died trying. Teft turned the Envisagers in to his citylord, who executed them all. If other groups exist, he (and we) is unaware.NOTE: This concludes the section on all known secret societies – at least, those known to be secret societies. The two following are potential candidates once more information is known; as things stand, any accusations of ulterior goals remain theorization. I hope the information is helpful, regardless.The Ardentia:The Vorin ardentia are the religious officials that remain after the Sunmaker destroyed the Heirocracy and Old Vorinism. While they lack the overwhelming political power they had previously, they are extraordinarily well placed to be a massive secret society in the Vorin nations of the East: ardents include cutting-edge scientists, scholars with access to practically all of the Eastern world’s knowledge (especially the Palanaeum), politicians (though they technically aren’t supposed to be), religious authorities and advisors, fighters, Shard-trained soldiers, and Soulcasters – in fact, they control all known Soulcasting fabrials. They seem too suspicious and well-positioned, especially with the fact that they once controlled the major Vorin nations.Stone Shamans and the Shin:I hesitated to include these, but the information, while mildly speculative and not truly a secret society, could still be of use.Stone Shamans seem to be the leaders of the Shin – certainly of their religion, which worships the spren of stone. They have the Honorblades and have kept them safe “for millennia” – likely since the Last Desolation. Szeth mentions eight of the nine, specifically (though he wasn’t terribly surprised with the fabricated news that one was stolen), and we have WOB that a Herald came back for his. Unfortunately, insofar as I know, we lack a time indicator – whether it was immediately following the Desolation, before Szeth’s expulsion, or afterwards is unknown, and the latter would mean that there is another unaccounted Honorblade. Presumably, the Stone Shamans use them, for they would have been able to retrieve the Honorblade following Szeth’s death in normal circumstances (whether they will try or succeed to regain the Honorblade from the new Knights Radiant remains to be seen) – though how this reconciles with the societal abhorrence of weapons and soldiery is unknown. Regardless, we know Szeth plans to “face enemies with Shards and with power.” Besides the ownership of the Honorblades (and potentially other Shards), however, is the potential knowledge, both generally held and that discovered by Szeth, leading to his naming as Truthless. Unfortunately, all that we know is very vague and will likely remain so until Szeth visits Shinovar or we see his flashbacks.Regardless, we can extrapolate from the few glimpses Szeth does give us, namely in Interlude 9 of The Way of Kings and phrases screamed while fighting Kaladin. Something made Szeth believe that the Radiants and Voidbringers had returned. He told others, probably the Stone Shamans, but was convinced or forced - despite what he claims his honor demanded - to become Truthless. (I am of the opinion that he was forced religiously, and he complied in the name of law and order, which Nalan claimed Szeth worshipped - “They told me I was Truthless,” emphasis added, and “There was no place for him in the Valley of Truth,” a name that seems to imply religious significance. There is also an interesting dichotomy following his acceptance of his station; while “his honor demanded” that the Voidbringers existed despite the fact that “his punishment declared that they did not,” the appearance of Kaladin as a budding Radiant made Szeth question his nature as Truthless until Taravangian’s explanation forced him to remain in his place.) Along with a possible knowledge of Radiants and Voidbringers, Szeth recognizes a Herald on sight (albeit by a different name than they are called in Vorin nations), and he knows more about Surgebinding than the Ars Arcanum from The Way of Kings and arguably that of Words of Radiance, despite Shinovar’s lack of access to Stormlight. They also had a knowledge of Urithiru. It will be very interesting to learn more of the Shin in future novels.Honorable mention:These are groups that deserve notice but lack requisite information for full consideration.Worldsingers: An order that travels across Roshar, "spreading knowledge of cultures, peoples, thoughts, and dreams; bringing peace through understanding." They claim that their charge to do so came directly from the Heralds. Related to the Worldbringers of Terris and probably founded by Hoid, Hoid is a member and was the mentor to Sigzil, graduating him during The Way of Kings.Veristitalians: A group of scholars that seeks to find the truth of what has happened in the past, such as finding natural explanations for supernatural phenomena and discovering unbiased history. Jasnah is a prominent member.Stormwardens: A group of make scholars finding loopholes in Vorin restrictions. They mathematically predict highstorms, use glyphs as a written phonetic script, etc. Several stormwardens have been involved with secret societies, but nothing indicates that the organization as a whole is.Vanrial: Am order of artists at Silent Mount in Jah Keved, responsible for preserving the full text of The Way of Kings throughout the Hierocracy. Each year they sing songs believed to be in the Dawnchant, of which Dalinar's visions seem to be giving a translation.Oldbloods: The descendants of the dynasty that once, long ago, ruled Alethkar. They mark themselves with blue tattoos on the cheek. Teleb, a Kholin highofficer and ultimately a Shardbearer, is an Oldblood."In Yulay, there are groups of people who talk of the Radiants. And wish for their return." This quote from Sigzil may refer to the Envisagers or a separate group.I hope that this compilation is helpful. If you note any inaccuracies or know of anything I overlooked, any and all help is appreciated – I mean this to be a full, complete resource for anyone that could use it. Thank you!Edit 1: Updated the Ghostblood information, switching Iyatil for Mraize (as the assassin fit Amaram), added nonlethal poison as an option, fixed ambiguity of worldhopper status for Mraize and Iyatil, fixed "creature in Tukar," and added Lin Davar, Luesh, Kabsal, and Shallan/Veil.Edit 2: Added Worldsingers, Veristitalians, Stormwardens, Vanrial, Oldbloods, and Yulay groups. Edited July 20, 2015 by Shardcellist 50 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yurisses Posted July 14, 2015 Report Share Posted July 14, 2015 What a very comprehensive, useful and accurate resource! I had forgotten that Helaran "sought out the Skybreakers"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelek's Breath Posted July 14, 2015 Report Share Posted July 14, 2015 (edited) Nice post! Thanks for putting this together. Some possible info you may consider adding: Major group you have missed: the Stormwardens. Lots to say about them. And Restares is a stormwarden. There is also another group, the Vanrial who are a group of people that have collected information (after all, they have preserved The Way of Kings book as well as the dawnchant). As for the Skybreakers, they could be hunting anyone that may bring about the Desolation, not just the proto-Radiants, so that is where hunting Amaram fits in. Although, Helaran's actions do not fit in with even a broken Nalan. Helaran, nonchalantly kills any soldier that is in his path. I don't think Nalan would sanction that. So Helaran being a 'Nalan Skybreaker' should come with an asterisk. For the Ghostbloods, don't forget to mention minor members such as Kabsal, Lord Davar and his steward Luesh. Maybe make a Wild Card entry, for people we know belong to some organization, but we can't decide which one. Like Shallan's mother and her friend, who may have belonged to either Ghostbloods or Skybreakers, or even another, yet unnamed group. In the TWoK, there is another group mentioned by Sigzil, somewhere in the West, that also has collected info on the Radiants and awaits their return. related to the Envisagers. But I can't locate their name. Edited July 14, 2015 by Kelek's Breath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormyAngel Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 The Stormwardens seem to be closely allied/joined with the Sons of Honor, as Kelek's breath has indicated above. Especially since Amaram's notes were in Stormwarden glyph-script and the stormwarden was complicit in the murder of kaladin's men. Also don't forget that Gavilar did seem awfully close with Amaram. I want to highlight the fact that at one point in TWOK, one of the ardents goes to great lengths to assure Dalinar that "they" hold him in high esteem. He then promises to be in touch. This is either another potential group, or an ardent who is part of the existing groups we know about. (As the parshmen are proving, slaves (the ardentia are too) who have their hand in everything make potentially dangerous groups...) Interestingly, the person in charge of Taravangian's "Silent Gatherers" is also an ardent. We don't know much about him, except that he supposedly discovered the diagramists on his own, then joined them. To me, that just reeks of a spy being planted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shardcellist Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Thanks, yurisses! Kelek: Unless I missed something big, the stormwardens are something different: a group of male scholars (the only such, due to Vorin restrictions) known for mathematically predicting highstorms and adapting glyphs as a phonetic written language. While there are certainly stormwardens involved with some secret societies, the organization itself is not one. There is also the group Sigzil belongs to, along with Hoid: the Worldsingers. Neither they nor the Vanrial are true secret societies, but since I gave notice to the Ardentia and the Stone Shamans, I should include those as well. Good catch! I'll work on updating the Ghostbloods. As for the Skybreakers, the only ones we saw Darkness going for were the Surgebinders. I'm trying to avoid speculation as such unless it's clearly noted and somewhat well substantiated, but your idea does have merit. Do you have any ideas on how we might phrase the first part better? As far as Helaran goes, there was some discussion a while back that might interest you about how since killing on the battlefield isn't considered murder, he could be justified as far as Nalan is concerned. Great idea on the Wild Card section, as you put it, for miscellaneous individuals! I don't recall another group like the last you mentioned. If you find anything, let me know. If not, I'm rereading The Way Of Kings right now anyway and I'll keep an eye out for anything about them. Thanks for the feedback! Edited July 15, 2015 by Shardcellist 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadoxicalZen Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Could possibly add the 17th Shard to either the Wild Card section or their own. Granted we haven't really seen any actions taken in regard to main storyline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TCshard Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) If I remember that scene right. The ardent was working for one of the high princes in political matters. During that point in the book, Dalinar was still largely shunned due to this episodes during high storms and I'm pretty sure that the "they" was the high prince he worked for(can't remember the name). He was probably suggesting that if anything were to happen Dalinar could find himself an ally. Edit: -.- my brain works faster then my fingers, so many typos to fix. Edit2: actually nvm now that I thought it over it might have been another group. Edited July 15, 2015 by TCshard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Of note, though I'm not sure where you'd want to add it, there are nine secret societies on Roshar: http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6422-secret-societies-of-roshar-spoilers-likely/ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoser Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Excellent work! It would be nice if this thread could be pinned and the OP updated, in my opinion. A Rosharan Political Analysis: Secret Societies Ghostbloods, Diagramists, Skybreakers, Sons of Honor, Envisagers, Stone Shamans, Ardentia ... The Ghostbloods: Mraize tried to assassinate him at the end of Words of Radiance; I believe Iyatil blew darts toward him. The Ghostbloods have at least one nonlethal dart poison, so I don't know whether they wanted to interfere with his mission or kill him. Presumably, if they just wanted to abduct him, they would have done so before he was with "Taln," but we can't entirely rule out abduction as a goal. · Taravangian and Tukar: ... In the same conversation, he speaks of a “creature in Tukar” that is either not human or not of the local species. I believe that of the current choices this probably refers to Nalan, Herald of Justice, but it could also mean there is something else that we have not yet seen. Since Mraize refers to Heleran as seeking out the Skybreakers, Nale refers to his group as the Skybreakers and Nale travels widely, I find it unlikely that he is referring to Nale. It seems to me that it could be Restares or some unknown player. · ... Significant Members: · · Thaidakar: ... Shallan's father, the family steward and brother Kabsal seem to have been members also. The Sons of Honor: ... Amaram: A devout Son of Honor, he has been seeking Heralds (namely the “person who calls himself Taln), gathering maps (presumably seeking Urithiru), and trying to get the Parshendi to transform into Voidbringers. On the night of his assassination, Gavilar sent him on a mission whose nature he concealed from Jasnah. Was this mission the thing that made Szeth "too late?" The Diagramists: Quotes: "There has to be an answer. What is the answer? Stop. The Parshendi. One of them. Yes they are the missing piece. Push for the Alethi to destroy them outright before this one obtains their power. It will form a bridge." Could this correspond to the events at the end of WoR? Did the Parshendi singing form the "bridge" to bring the Everstorm to Roshar? If so, then this part of the plan has already failed. But in actuality the Diagramists actually tried to have Dalinar and Elhokar killed, which made the destruction of the Parshendi less likely. So the Diagramist's and Mr. T's actions apparently make no sense. Members: · Taravangian: ... Danlan: a part of Graves' cell, involved with Adolin briefly and one of Dalinar's scribes. The Envisagers: A cult, as Teft called them, that “believed in the Radiants, Heralds, and Old Vorinism; especially Old Vorinism.” They believed that if they could return the Voidbringers, it would bring back the Knights Radiant (comparable to the Sons of Honor in the preceding respects). They believed that if they put their members in mortal danger, they would manifest Surgebinding powers – a Snapping concept, of sorts. None did, but many (including Teft’s mother) died trying. Teft turned the Envisagers in to his citylord, who executed them all. If other groups exist, he (and we) is unaware. Sigzil refers to groups on the Yulay(not sure about name?) Peninsula as trying to bring back the Radiants, which could be similar The Oldbloods have distinctive tattoos. They once ruled Alethkar. If the people who grabbed the Radiant weapons deposed the previous leadership, would the previous nobility have been the Oldbloods? When was their rule relative to the Sunmaker's deposing of the Heirocracy? Shallan's mother was a part of some group, which led her and an associate to try to kill Shallan Ialai has a spy network Edited July 15, 2015 by hoser 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze1616 Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Recent WoB confirms that Mraize and Iyatil are worldhoppers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posaune Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 It seems likely to me that the ardent Pai, in the interludes was also part of a society. The way she specifically sought out the queen's ardents, and the chaos she caused almost screams that she is a diagramist. After all, who would be a better person to take control of a chaotic Alethkar that Taravangian? He supposedly cares for the people, as shown by his hospitals, and he would not let the people starve like Elhokar's wife. Even if she is not part of the diagramists, I highly doubt she acted alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cem Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 With regards to the "creature in Tukar," there's a snippet in tWoK: “The city’s pattern is central to the Emuli religion,” the ardent said. “They claim it is their ancestral homeland, a gift to them from the Heralds. And the Tukari are led by that god-priest of theirs, Tezim. So the conflict is religious in nature.” I expect Mraize is talking about this guy, and he's a future player. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoser Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 With regards to the "creature in Tukar," there's a snippet in tWoK: I expect Mraize is talking about this guy, and he's a future player. Good catch, and a pleasure to see your handle as the poster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navybrandt Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Wow! wish I could give you more upvotes! This is awesome. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Honor Spren Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Could I just put out there that I personally believe Iyatil is a parshendi? This seems as good a place as any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unhinged Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 One more group that might be worthy of note is the ring, the group that Wyndle mentioned. We don't know anything about them other than that they seem to be a group of spren who instructed Wyndle to bond Lift. Not sure if they qualify as a full blown society or not but I for one find the idea of a society of spren very interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccstat Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 I think hoser hit all of the points I was going to bring up. This is a very good, well written summary--I hope you incorporate it into the Coppermind articles once you are happy with it. (Or give permission for someone else to do it.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shardcellist Posted July 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 (edited) The Ghostblood section has been updated. It should be accurate now. Thanks, everyone, for your help! It seems I have quite a bit to fix and add - I am working on it, and I will get to it, but it will take a while before I am finished. Ccstat: I'm happy to work on the Coppermind pages, but it will be a while before I can. Anyone that wants to use this as a reference for the Coppermind is welcome to, but I will get to that eventually. Edited July 20, 2015 by Shardcellist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shardcellist Posted July 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Edit 2: Added Worldsingers, Vanrial, Veristitalians, Stormwardens, Oldbloods, and Yulay groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecohansen Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 One more society that we are definitely due to learn more about: the Devotary of Sincerity, the original followers of the Book of Endless Pages. I know they're a subgroup of the Ardentia, but they seem sufficiently distinct to merit mention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrakeMarshall Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 (edited) This isn't terribly important, but in the name of compiling the most exact set of information: Tyn: An expert con artist that took Shallan under her wing. She was in league with the Ghostbloods but may not have been an actual member. She was in charge of the operation to assassinate Jasnah Kholin. Shallan killed her with her Shardblade when Tyn discovered her identity and tried to kill her. It is known that Tyn was not a full member. Mraize tells Shallan this when he first brings up making her a member. Tyn was only an associate of the ghostbloods. This is a very, very good overview though. I found it interesting to read through all the death rattles juxtaposed. Many of them seemed to be referencing things. Sometimes from the perspective of the person themselves, sometimes from the perspective of somebody important in the future. Two possible meanings of rattles that popped out to me: I see them. They are the rocks. They are the vengeful spirits. Eyes of red. This is almost certainly a description of stormclasts in the desolations. All is withdrawn for me. I stand against the one who saved my life. I protect the one who killed my promises. I raise my hand. The storm responds. I bet this is about Eshonai. It fits quite well. "All is withdrawn from me" probably references the fact that she was basically possessed by odium. This is also in line with her attacking her friends (alternatively her closest parshendi friends she killed or perhaps the humans she tried to make peace with), and standing for a cause she would have previously thought as evil. Also, the most obvious reference, "I raise my hand. The storm responds" is almost certainly a reference to the effects of storm form. Edited February 1, 2016 by Drake Marshall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oversleep Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 “All is withdrawn for me. I stand against the one who saved my life. I protect the one who killed my promises. I raise my hand. The storm responds.” I bet this is about Eshonai. It fits quite well. "All is withdrawn from me" probably references the fact that she was basically possessed by odium. This is also in line with her attacking her friends (alternatively her closest parshendi friends she killed or perhaps the humans she tried to make peace with), and standing for a cause she would have previously thought as evil. Also, the most obvious reference, "I raise my hand. The storm responds" is almost certainly a reference to the effects of storm form. Actually it's Kaladin protecting Elhokar from Moash. Moash saved his life during some bridge run. Kaladin protects Elhokar who "killed his promises" (the chapter "The one who killed promises" is the Dalinar visiting Kaladin in prison and telling him about Elhokar sending Roshone to Hearthsone what ultimately effected in Kaladin breaking his promise about bringing Tien back home). Raising hand is stretching the arm out for Shardblade and storm responding is Stormfather accepting the words or Syl turning int Shardblade and falling into Kaladin's hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrakeMarshall Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 Actually it's Kaladin protecting Elhokar from Moash. Moash saved his life during some bridge run. Kaladin protects Elhokar who "killed his promises" (the chapter "The one who killed promises" is the Dalinar visiting Kaladin in prison and telling him about Elhokar sending Roshone to Hearthsone what ultimately effected in Kaladin breaking his promise about bringing Tien back home). Raising hand is stretching the arm out for Shardblade and storm responding is Stormfather accepting the words or Syl turning int Shardblade and falling into Kaladin's hand. Possibly. The link between protecting your foes and standing against your friends definitely makes the most sense with Kaladin. The line about storms responding makes the most sense with Eshonai, on the other hand, given that she literally did control thunder and ultimately summoned a highstorm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geralt Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 What a useful read this was, OP! Thanks for taking the effort to do this, as I learnt many things from it. Anyways, I have a few questions on certain points. About the Diagramists, if Graves was really part of it, I would have expected him to give the information about Kaladin being/becoming a radiant to Taravangian, especially because the latter was looking for the man Szeth had met during his assassination attempt. Also, I find it awfully strange how the Skybreakers are so effective in finding potential radiants and even more so, how they were able to find out about any crimes they have committed in the past. Are there any theories on how Nale is capable of that, like maybe he possesses some sort of power that can read in their conscience or something? Finally, is there any speculation on the following quote from the diagram? Hold the secret that broke the Knights Radiant. You may need it to destroy the new orders when they return The fact that Taravangian knows the reason for the recreance will probably play a huge role in the story in the future, so here's hoping the secret doesn't end up being the betrayal of the Heralds. Oh and one more thing, Gavilar was affiliated with the Sons of Honour, wasn't he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrakeMarshall Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 (edited) What a useful read this was, OP! Thanks for taking the effort to do this, as I learnt many things from it. Anyways, I have a few questions on certain points. About the Diagramists, if Graves was really part of it, I would have expected him to give the information about Kaladin being/becoming a radiant to Taravangian, especially because the latter was looking for the man Szeth had met during his assassination attempt. Also, I find it awfully strange how the Skybreakers are so effective in finding potential radiants and even more so, how they were able to find out about any crimes they have committed in the past. Are there any theories on how Nale is capable of that, like maybe he possesses some sort of power that can read in their conscience or something? Finally, is there any speculation on the following quote from the diagram? Hold the secret that broke the Knights Radiant. You may need it to destroy the new orders when they return The fact that Taravangian knows the reason for the recreance will probably play a huge role in the story in the future, so here's hoping the secret doesn't end up being the betrayal of the Heralds. Oh and one more thing, Gavilar was affiliated with the Sons of Honour, wasn't he? The in-world book Words of Radiance notes that the skybreakers had an almost supernatural sense for divining whether a person was guilty or not. Nobody was quite sure why but it was a very real power. Kind of like how lightweavers were said to have flawless memories, something that Shallan proves to be correct. Their sense of who is guilty may be quite similar to that of nightblood. Nightblood is very well suited to the order of skybreakers, when you think about it. Also, it may be possible that Graves didn't really grasp that Kaladin had actually become a radiant. Edited February 6, 2016 by Drake Marshall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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