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Deaths, Character Arcs, Couples, etc.


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I'd have a laugh if it turned out that Jesnah was homosexual. A good laugh indeed.

I honestly hope Kaladin remains in his current social status.

 

As for killing of characters. Love it. Might actually be the best thing about Ice and Fire - The antagonist has an honest chance.

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Honestly I'd find it more likely that Jasnah dies. We know she keeps journals, that seems like a really great way to do a flashback on a dead character. Shallan reads through her mentor's journals, trying to find the secrets she died for...

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If Jasnah dies, I hope her POVs continue on.

 

An atheist in the afterlife seems too good a set up for Sanderson to pass up and, with the Tranquiline Halls mythos built into Vorinism, coupled with the idea that Shards like Endowment can do things with dead souls before they're dead-dead... 

 

It could be more likely than we think. 

 

I think I said it in another thread, but when you consider conscious Shard against conscious Shard in a conflict where their intents don't cancel one another out... well, the afterlife seems a pretty good place to station your army. 

 

On another note, if Jasnah is revealed to be gay, I will also laugh. I will laugh low and satisfied chortles, because, like Kaladin, Jasnah is a strong and well developed character with no established sexuality in what is poised to be a very long, popular, and successful fantasy series. If Jasnah is gay, then that would a bold and appreciated move from Sanderson.

 

I don't think she is though. 

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On another note, if Jasnah is revealed to be gay, I will also laugh. I will laugh low and satisfied chortles, because, like Kaladin, Jasnah is a strong and well developed character with no established sexuality in what is poised to be a very long, popular, and successful fantasy series. If Jasnah is gay, then that would a bold and appreciated move from Sanderson.

 

I don't think she is though. 

 

I honestly would have no problem with Jasnah being a lesbian. She's got a very strong and independent nature which I think would lend well to taking an independent stance on sexuality, particularly because she's already considered an outcast. But I also agree here: I highly doubt that Jasnah is, specifically because Brandon said (in regards to a gay character in WoR) "I've tried to be more GLBT aware in recent years, but I want to be careful. Doing it poorly could be more insulting than doing it not at all. Having Ryan, the real world Drehy from Bridge Four, as a friend does at least give me access to someone who can give early feedback and tell me where I might be going wrong. So let's just say maybe."

 

In that light, I doubt that he'd make a main character gay so soon. Maybe he'll wait and Jasnah will come out in later books, once he has a better sense if he can write the situation well enough, but I have a hard time believing that.

His answer was here: http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/2383-qa-with-brandon-sanderson/?p=42475

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...

I think King Gavilar was gay, Navani says that she had plenty of reason to cheat and that Gavilar was not the man Dalinar thought he was but that she missed him. It would also explain why Sadeas was so loyal to him and then to Elhokar if he was in a secret relationship with him (and I can really see this revelation coming out in an argument about loyalty involving Sadeas, Dalinar and Elhokar) also Sadeas having children is never mentioned. Just a theory but I think this could be a good way for BS to introduce a gay character that is key to the plot.

 

I also think that Kaladin will return to Hearthstone because Amaram will tell Sadeas about Kaladin after their first tense meeting (can't wait for that bit  :)), and as a way to get back at Kaladin, Sadeas will send people to kill Kaladin's parents (or something). After finding out about this Kaladin will go back home and hilarity will ensue.

 

Dalinar will die at somepoint, most likely after book 2 but you never know with Brandon.

Renarin will be important, no evidence other than Hoid taking an interest and now that he has just plate he may be like Dalinar was in plate (glowing like when he fought the chasmfiend), as I think he will be a radiant (also Syl didn't seem bothered by plate, perhaps blades of Odium and Plate of Cultivation)

 

Can definitely see Kaladin/Shallan or maybe a  Kaladin/Laral after his return to Hearthstone (I also like a Renarin/Shallan/Adolin love triangle)

 

Some members of Bridge 4 will die (Moash?)

 

Sure Elhokar will die at somepoint 

 

Would love it if Jasnah eventually held the Shard of Honour, having a heretic become a God would be hilarious  :D

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Dalinar will die.

 

Kaladin will not return to Hearthstone any time soon. If he does there will be no lame vengeance.

 

Adolin will be Dalinar's replacement and will have all this angst about not being able to measure up.

 

Renarin will be uber cool in his Plate.

 

Shallan will not turn evil as people seem to think. She's a conflicted hero. She will be tempted to abandon her mission to save her family.

 

Rysn will hook up with Axies after overcoming her prejudice shown in the interlude.

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Sadeas lives. And lives. And irritates, but still just keeps living. He seems to embody everything wrong about the alethi people, and I just don't see him changing his ways or dying any time soon. 

 

Brightlord Amaram and Kaladin will get into a pissing match with accusations flying. House Kholin is insulted in the process. Kaladin won't be able to fight him for some reason. (Dalinar will forbid him / Amaram will refuse because he is darkeyed / Syl doesn't think its Honorable choice, etc)  Adolin FINALLY gets to throw down the gauntlet and have a real challenge in a duel.  Amazing pit fight ensues, Amaram dies without ever admitting that Kaladin was telling the truth, and his Shards go to Adolin's most recent girlfriend (since you know she is mad at him over something). Ok, ok, fine. They go to Kaladin who gives them to Rock who then starts manifesting as a Stoneward. 

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Shallan and Szeth are too obvious for going evil, and Shallan has already made progress away from being a thief/probably justified murderer.

 

How much detail do we have on the "one of them will destroy us" bit? Could it be an accident? Like 'oops, I accidentally unleashed the ancient evil through a series of totally logical/well meaning events' type thing; or is it set in stone that the one will be a full on intentional harbinger of doom type thing? To me, the first would be more interesting (especially if it is Szeth and it is the finally straw for him and his magic rock of ownership). 

 

As for shipping, all of the younger guys seem like pretty good men, even if Renarin is a little under developed at the moment, so I would be happy to see Shallan interested in any of them. The contrast between honorable Kaladin and somewhat less so Shallan would be interesting; while both Shallan and Aldoin are both working on the whole honor thing; brother number two maybe this will give him some character or they will be an action girl/nonaction guy duo. Shallan will get action girled next book, I'm almost certain of this. 

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I really want Sadeas to never die. His presence on the chopping block of redemption is glaringly obvious and I'd like that averted. So long as he survives I'm down for anything, up to and including him inheriting Honor (if Sanderson somehow managed that there'd be no minds left unblown). 

 

 

This. If this happens I would possibly be the happiest person on earth.

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  • 2 months later...

Kaladin could maybe fall in love with Shallan through her lying to him. If Shallan were to continue making bad decisions, I could see her pulling Kaladin down with her. She lies, and he believes her for some reason. Then Dalinar becomes aware of Shallan's descent into evil, and he kills her, making Kaladin, who has already become slowly compromised by his love for Shallan, shift into pure hatred for lighteyes. He then starts by killing Dalinar and becoming Odium's champion. Around the same time or prior to that, Szeth could cause a terrible accident that he has no way to blame on others, thus causing him to finally take his oathstone for himself. He could then be who he wants to be and become Honor's champion.

It's not completely thought out, but it's another possibility.

Also, first post!

Edited by ampman
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Welcome ampman, glad to have you here.  That scenario sure would turn Kaladin and Szeth on their heads.  But, forgive me if I hope you're wrong.  I would be very sad to see Kaladin give in to his hatred and anger and turn to the dark side.  I think that a truly good, noble and honorable character is a very good thing to have from time-to-time.  His depression and distrust of lighteyes are enough for me.

 

Edit:  Arrggghhh! your/you're.

Edited by Shardlet
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Kaladin could maybe fall in love with Shallan through her lying to him. If Shallan were to continue making bad decisions, I could see her pulling Kaladin down with her. She lies, and he believes her for some reason. Then Dalinar becomes aware of Shallan's descent into evil, and he kills her, making Kaladin, who has already become slowly compromised by his love for Shallan, shift into pure hatred for lighteyes. He then starts by killing Dalinar and becoming Odium's champion. Around the same time or prior to that, Szeth could cause a terrible accident that he has no way to blame on others, thus causing him to finally take his oathstone for himself. He could then be who he wants to be and become Honor's champion.

It's not completely thought out, but it's another possibility.

Also, first post!

 

Two things don't quite click for me here.

1. I can't see Shallan becoming evil so easily. She has reached a new level of openness with Jasnah and seems to be heading upward rather than down.

2. Given Dalinar's honour it would be very out of character for him to pre-emptively murder someone.

 

But it will certainly be interesting to see how Kaladin and Shallan react to each other when they do meet.

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/>Two things don't quite click for me here.

1. I can't see Shallan becoming evil so easily. She has reached a new level of openness with Jasnah and seems to be heading upward rather than down.

2. Given Dalinar's honour it would be very out of character for him to pre-emptively murder someone.

But it will certainly be interesting to see how Kaladin and Shallan react to each other when they do meet.

1. That's true. 2. I meant like after she starts a fight.
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Shallan's not the type to start a fight with somebody, and I also don't see her going off the deep end so easily, she seems to be learning some important lessons and I think Jasnah will be a good influence on her.

 

And I note that Odium's Champion doesn't need to be intentionally/willingly evil, Marsh ended up as Ruin's champion against his will because of the spikes, so Odium's champion doesn't have to be a Darth Vaderesque fallen hero turned card carrying villain.

 

And as far as romances I ship Shallan/Kaladin or Shallan/Renarin.

Edited by CrazyRioter
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So, one thing I wanted to comment on that I'm not so sure about...problem with jumping into a theory thread years after a book came out is that you miss all the confirmed facts. But, to me, the Knights Radiant are about protecting people. I could very much see Shallan being a KR as she is right now, because I don't see the Knights as an obsession with Honor, the Shard Honor notwithstanding. To protect people, sometimes you have to be underhanded. Right now, we don't know the reasons that Shallan killed her father...but I would not find it surprising that it was to protect someone in the end. Which, based on what we've seen of the Radiants, means that she's not quite out of the running yet.

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