Reading Excuses - 10/8/12 - Stroniax - Age to Age, We Fall [V]

[Glaring at the Survivor]

I know you know what already happened/will happen in this submission, because I sent it two weeks ago. However, I have revised both chapter 1 and the prologue, and I think it needs re-critiqued. This is the last time I plan on sending this back in until I am on Draft 2. Please critique!

Also Chapter 2 was sent, and it could be critiqued plz! (Sorry it took me a while to find that file, and I had a few things going on in between.)

Edited October 9, 2012 by Stroniax

[Ria Raen]

Ok I don't know why (perhaps I am not normal) but I really feel like you need to mention Ricks family earlier on. Because when I read the first paragraph for some reason my mind placed Rick elsewhere.... not with his family. In fact when I came to the sentence about him being in the car with his family I then went back and re-read the first paragraph and said "right ok, I get it" because before this point I didn't know who "they" were. This is probably because I am slow on the uptake.... or I have an over active imagination and jump the gun.

Using the Eiffel Tower as a height reference didn't really work for me, as it isn't all that tall in comparison to a lot of the high rise buildings across the world. I would personally use a famous skyscraper as a reference if its a feeling of immense height your after. Unless of course the Eiffel tower in the future is massive

I'm not going to lie.... and it could just be me.... but I did not understand what this paragraph meant at all:

"If he was able to consciously be able to think about the assassination, remaining

unknowing of the others who were assassinated, he would have assumed it was because he

hacked into every electronic device able to be hacked into, disconnected communication with

Earth when the EEST Traveler I was near asteroid belt—causing them to believe the ship had

blown up—and deactivated all HelpBots on board, with a code only he knew able to reactivate

them. When he explained it to his wife, he told her, "People are getting too lazy."

His wife, parents, and brother, along with 1/4 of the rest of the ships population,

originally 10,000 people, were killed."

Ok well I kind of understand it... but trying to deconstruct the sentencing really confused me. It could do with being a lot simpler.

It felt strange to me that the initial introduction of Panther was tacked onto the end of the Prologue, when it felt like it should be part of chapter one.

I am a little confused about whether Panther can communicate to Valcar through thought? It seems in their initial interaction that Valcar can hear the thoughts Panther is throwing at him, but later as they discuss the saboteurs Panther is writing his thoughts down...... Aha ok that point is cleared up much later on. I would maybe lift that to the first interaction they have, so it is clear from the beginning.

When Panther initially hears the saboteurs they believe Panther knows of their plan, yet Panther seems utterly clueless. I didn't really understand why they would think this. It also seems to put Panther in a position of authority on the ship (to me) which of course is then disregarded when he has to pretend to be a hostage at the end of the chapter.

There doesn't seem to be much speculation at the end of the chapter as to why they were trying to blow up the ship. This seemed to me to be the big plot question, What was driving me forward to read, an unsolved mystery etc etc yet no one really seems to care.

But I enjoyed the story, I think there are lots of little quirks you have worked in that are original and fresh. I would definitely read more. I hope what I have said helps in some way.... I don't have much knowledge of sci-fi (other than stargate SG-1!) so it isn't really my area!

[Glaring at the Survivor]

Thanks. This is now the first paragraph:

"Can anyone tell me where we're moving to?" asked 13-year-old Rick from his back-seat of the car. A few days before had been his birthday, and his sole gift had been a piece of paper saying, "We're moving. Pack up." No congratulations, as usual.

So now you hear he's in the car earlier on.

[Guest Odium Reigns]

The newer version is better than your last, I'll say that much.

[cjhuitt]

This is (some of) what I replied to the prologue and chapter one for the previous version.

On the prologue, my biggest issue is that most of it doesn't seem like a prologue at all. The first chunk, with Rick, felt more like a proper prologue in that it was set well before the rest of the action and apparently had not much to do with the start of the story proper. [...]

For the part with Rick, I wasn't ever feeling a connection with him.

These are still a problem.

About the tech: the reference to specific phone types[...].

The specific types have mostly been excised, but I'm not sure it improved the function any. The iPhone 9 is still referenced as a vastly outdated piece of equipment, but if it was that outdated, how would it even still work? I mean, not even the most out of date retail store would have one available to steal -- it would be like a store keeping punch cards around today, just because nobody had bought them yet. Even if he got one, however, what would it connect to? Would he even be able to charge it?

The same technology concerns carry over to getting a note on paper (possibly, but unlikely that far in the future), his mother driving the car (ditto), or even "animated movie" vs "video", even presuming he'd have watched something as old as Brother Bear.

I also think the Eiffel tower reference was off-putting.

For the rest of Rick's part, the explanation of the EEST seemed like an unnecessary info dump, although quite quick. The line about dying on the trip seemed like it was trying to be a hook, while the assassination line definitely was. I assume the dying part was indicating some sort of generation ship, or cryo/revival, or something like that. When you start talking about the assassinations, the scope pulls way back and goes directly to telling the reader rather than showing. This especially includes the paragraph about hacking.

Finally, the last line in this part generally confuses me. I'm kind of used to this in a certain type of science fiction stories, though I don't often read ones that have really steep learning curves. However, given the other problems already present in the start of the story, I would tend to chalk this line up to poor viewpoint/narrative phrasing, rather than the possibility that Rick is both still alive and assassinated, which I kind of guess is what you are going for.

It is more clear now that Rick "survived" his assassination somehow, but the rest of these issues remain, and have even become stronger in some cases (there is more here that is directly told to the reader).

On the other hand, the reveal that ends the part of this action that is in the prologue doesn't grab me at all. Right off the bat I have problems with it. The first is the coincidental nature of the discussion happening right when he could hear it.

This needs smoothed, but at least the explanation is there (and later where it happened again).

Right when Panther starts running, there is what I think might be a POV error. The perspective changes to that of Valcar as he gets out of breath trying to keep up with Panther and then watching him run off. [...]the perspective shifts back to Talon right about at the explosion.

Still there, and this time even stronger in that it is clearly a POV error.

The fight was good enough, but I also had problems with the computer interface portion.

[...]

Panther gets off too easily for being present where the saboteurs were also.

[...]

Also in this last part, we get more maid-and-butler dialog explaining to each other that there are still problems remaining from what the saboteurs did.

I don't think these changed at all, really, so they still stand.

For chapter 2, right at the beginning I wonder what the first paragraph is supposed to be? It's possible it's meant to be one of those little chapter heading texts, and the formatting just isn't there. Even so, I'm not sure that there's any part of that paragraph that we need to know at this point in time.

I filled in the way I parsed the pronoun antecedents in these sentences: "Fallout walked down the dark hallway, toward the Emperor of New Rome. A few recent problems had occurred with him[Fallout[, and he[Fallout] had reportedly been killing citizens of Rome." You probably want to clarify which him/he is being referred to.

Another confusing part, at first I thought "coding guards" might have to do with Fallout's ability or something, but I think it was probably just a typo.

In that same paragraph, the rest of the paragraph is basically telling the reader again, instead of showing. The same with the following paragraph. You could instead show his concern with being touched by showing him moving to avoid the people. At this point, we don't need to know how the invisibility is happening.

(By the way, have you read L.E. Modesitt's Recluse series? In it, one or more mages (I can't remember exactly) learn to bend light around themselves to become invisible. The problem is, if you are bending light around yourself, then none is getting to you, right? So, the mages can't see anything when they are doing this. It makes me wonder if Fallout shouldn't have the same drawback.

Fallout approached the throne room doors, waited motionless ("as if a robot"), then stood and followed the advisor. However, my mental image for someone waiting robot-like does not generally include them sitting or reclining.

When Fallout uses light to wrap up the advisor, I thought he was capturing the other man in order to follow the advisor back. One of the reasons for this is prior to this point, it was always "the advisor", not "the man".

The numbers don't mean much to me at all in this chapter. I assume it's showing Fallout's reserves, but I think there could be better ways of showing this. Unless his ability to measure the amount of light something takes is important later in the book, and you need the precise numbers to demonstrate the ability, I'd recommend tossing them for more relative descriptions.

On a larger scope, there doesn't seem to be much to connect the first two chapters together except for following the actions of two people with special abilities. It would be nice if there were a few more things that are similar between the chapters,, in setup or something. Not necessary, just nice in that it helps build a sense that all these scenes and actions are connecting in some way.

[Glaring at the Survivor]

This is (some of) what I replied to the prologue and chapter one for the previous version.

These are still a problem.

The specific types have mostly been excised, but I'm not sure it improved the function any. The iPhone 9 is still referenced as a vastly outdated piece of equipment, but if it was that outdated, how would it even still work? I mean, not even the most out of date retail store would have one available to steal -- it would be like a store keeping punch cards around today, just because nobody had bought them yet. Even if he got one, however, what would it connect to? Would he even be able to charge it?

A collector who never used it. He had the cable to.

The same technology concerns carry over to getting a note on paper (possibly, but unlikely that far in the future), his mother driving the car (ditto), or even "animated movie" vs "video", even presuming he'd have watched something as old as Brother Bear.

Yeah, I may have to make it a Holograph version.

I also think the Eiffel tower reference was off-putting.

It is more clear now that Rick "survived" his assassination somehow, but the rest of these issues remain, and have even become stronger in some cases (there is more here that is directly told to the reader).

Okay. 1 kilometer, then?

Still there, and this time even stronger in that it is clearly a POV error.

Valcar, who had still been talking, looked at Panther in shock. "Where are you going?" he asked, unaware that Panther could not hear him. Panther darted through a door, and from what he could see, Valcar was cluelessly following.

From the perspective of any watching, Talon would have looked like a larger form of Panther, more menacing and stronger. Deadly. But that was all based on perspective: as some knew, it was solely based on the way Panther stood—or, in this case, ran.

Better?

I don't think these changed at all, really, so they still stand.

Yeah...

I filled in the way I parsed the pronoun antecedents in these sentences: "Fallout walked down the dark hallway, toward the Emperor of New Rome. A few recent problems had occurred with him[Fallout[, and he[Fallout] had reportedly been killing citizens of Rome." You probably want to clarify which him/he is being referred to.

Okay. I thought "Fallout walked down the dark hallway, toward the Emperor of New Rome. A few recent problems had occurred with the Emperor, and he had reportedly been killing citizens of Rome." sounded off for repetition.

Another confusing part, at first I thought "coding guards" might have to do with Fallout's ability or something, but I think it was probably just a typo.

Typo, fixed it.

(By the way, have you read L.E. Modesitt's Recluse series? In it, one or more mages (I can't remember exactly) learn to bend light around themselves to become invisible. The problem is, if you are bending light around yourself, then none is getting to you, right? So, the mages can't see anything when they are doing this. It makes me wonder if Fallout shouldn't have the same drawback.

No, i havent read those books. If the object they see is lit, he can see it. Same as with us: if we are in the dark, but we see an object that is lit, we can see it. That's how flashlights work—you light up the object, not you.

Fallout approached the throne room doors, waited motionless ("as if a robot"), then stood and followed the advisor. However, my mental image for someone waiting robot-like does not generally include them sitting or reclining.

As if a statue. Better?

When Fallout uses light to wrap up the advisor, I thought he was capturing the other man in order to follow the advisor back. One of the reasons for this is prior to this point, it was always "the advisor", not "the man".

He originally suspected the advisor. But after seeing the play against Saldear, he knew otherwise.

The numbers don't mean much to me at all in this chapter. I assume it's showing Fallout's reserves, but I think there could be better ways of showing this. Unless his ability to measure the amount of light something takes is important later in the book, and you need the precise numbers to demonstrate the ability, I'd recommend tossing them for more relative descriptions.

On a larger scope, there doesn't seem to be much to connect the first two chapters together except for following the actions of two people with special abilities. It would be nice if there were a few more things that are similar between the chapters,, in setup or something. Not necessary, just nice in that it helps build a sense that all these scenes and actions are connecting in some way.

The relativity will be more distinct during the next chapter with Fallout's POV.

[Trizee]

Better than the first time, but still needs some work.

First off, I agree with everything said here, that being said...

Unrelated things- You sometimes talk about things that have absolutely nothing to do with the stroy. You don't really have a reason to talk about Rick's phone or Doctor Phor.

POV- There is stil a PoV error in what you mentioned about Valcar. The chapter is from Panther's POV, so you can only tell us things that Panther s aware of them. Therefore, you can't tell us what Valcar said when Panther couldn't hear anything because Panther couldn't hear it.

Eavesdropping- I'm not sure why Panther had to listen in on that conversation during the meal, couldn't he use his Partial Gift?

Light- What happens when you see something is that the light hits the object, certain parts of the light are absorbed in the object and certain parts "bounce" back into our eye, and our brain forms the image out of that light. Therefore, Fallout wouldn't be able to see if he's bending the light about him because no light gets to his eyes, the same way you can't see through a wall.

You have some cool things going on in these chapters, but I can't appreciate them because I don't know why they're happening. If you can tell us why the saboteurs tried to blow up the ship, and why Fallout is following the advisor, we could appreciate the events a lot more.

Aside from that, I can tell that this book is well thought out (Partial Gifts are interesting), and can only say keep writing!

[Glaring at the Survivor]

Better than the first time, but still needs some work.

First off, I agree with everything said here, that being said...

Unrelated things- You sometimes talk about things that have absolutely nothing to do with the stroy. You don't really have a reason to talk about Rick's phone or Doctor Phor.

It's important later.

POV- There is stil a PoV error in what you mentioned about Valcar. The chapter is from Panther's POV, so you can only tell us things that Panther s aware of them. Therefore, you can't tell us what Valcar said when Panther couldn't hear anything because Panther couldn't hear it.

Okay. How about, "Valcar's mouth moved, as Panther cold see, but he heard nothing." Better?

Eavesdropping- I'm not sure why Panther had to listen in on that conversation during the meal, couldn't he use his Partial Gift?

That is a very good question, to which I have a relatively simple answer. First of all, let me say that Panther could have used his Partial Gift, but it was set to tell him anything that would lead to danger. He could have changed this, yes, but the Partial Gift, as all others, drains the energy of the owner. Panther, Fallout, and Thorn (who appears later), all are "strong" enough that they could easily use there Gifts and Partial Gifts for long periods of time. And you never know when danger might come.

To the topic of energy-drainage, (which will be explained in more detail in chapter three, giving Valcar's POV,) Fallout's invisibility may come into question. Again, Fallout has increased "strength" and "energy". But the energy/strength that is used is decreased the more the Gift/Partial Gift is used, and the more it is used, the more energy/strength the user has. Fallout is older than one would think, when seeing him, and he has used his Gift (Bending Light) daily ever since he came to Earth, and therefore has a massive storage of energy.

Light- What happens when you see something is that the light hits the object, certain parts of the light are absorbed in the object and certain parts "bounce" back into our eye, and our brain forms the image out of that light. Therefore, Fallout wouldn't be able to see if he's bending the light about him because no light gets to his eyes, the same way you can't see through a wall.

I wasn't thinking thoroughly, because I did know this. Hmm... Well somehow he still sees things, but I can't think of a way. Suggestions?

You have some cool things going on in these chapters, but I can't appreciate them because I don't know why they're happening. If you can tell us why the saboteurs tried to blow up the ship, and why Fallout is following the advisor, we could appreciate the events a lot more.

Hmm. I'll explain that, then. I'll tell you (Reading Excuses) in the next email.

Aside from that, I can tell that this book is well thought out (Partial Gifts are interesting), and can only say keep writing!

Thanks!

[cjhuitt]

I wasn't thinking thoroughly, because I did know this. Hmm... Well somehow he still sees things, but I can't think of a way. Suggestions?

If he has an affinity for light, maybe he can somehow know what it is doing near him? I would suggest that (along with what Brandon and others say) the limits of what they can do can be more interesting than the abilities themselves, and trading being able to see well for being able to be invisible sounds like an interesting trade-off to me.

Hmm. I'll explain that, then. I'll tell you (Reading Excuses) in the next email.

As I mentioned in the post about your table of gifts, it's good that you know what is going on and can explain it. However, I'm not sure that explaining it to your readers in a separate document (the email) is exactly the best way to get good reactions for what is in the book. It might help us give better feedback, or it might make it so we can't see the story with fresh eyes and point out the problems. You'll have to decide which way is likely to give you more useful information during critique, but in the end the only thing the reader will get is what's in the book.

[Glaring at the Survivor]

I'll add it to the Proglogue, Chapter 1, and Chapter 2, but I'll just tell you guys unless you want the two chapters again.

[cjhuitt]

I'll add it to the Proglogue, Chapter 1, and Chapter 2, but I'll just tell you guys unless you want the two chapters again.

If you think it's something the reader should/would know by now (in the final draft), then go ahead, and I would indeed prefer it via email,