WoK Prime Deleted Scenes

[Kurkistan]

So, Brandon/Peter are putting up deleted scenes for the WoK, and I feel the need to discuss them.

First Scene

An interesting scene overall.

"Jek's" Truthlessness is definitely different from Szeth's, with WoK heavily implying that he can never be free, while this version suggests that a single kindly master could wish this genie out of the lamp. There is even the implication that the stone simply not being possessed by someone would be enough to free Jek. As noted here, Szeth is compelled (whether magically or by his honor) to collect his Oathstone when it is discarded by the Parshendi in WoK.

Jek also fails to display or even hint at Lashings or his Shardblade in this version.

I am interested to see how much of the Shin culture expounded (and expounded and expounded and expounded--I'm glad that Brandon has since learned that a little mystery never hurts) on in the deleted scene is retained at the end of the day. I didn't get that sense of superiority (eastern savages and all) in the final WoK, mostly just "they're a bit blasphemous what with their stone-walkery and jewel-wearing, but just a bit ignorant and strange."

The deleted scene also implies that Shinovar is chock-full of deadly assassins and cunning warriors (the comments about incompetent eastern assassins and how all easterners count as children as far as Shinovar's "Truth" warrior code is concerned), while warriors are the lowest of the low, "those who take," in the WoK. Perhaps "those who take" are particularly good at their jobs even in the WoK, but we also see that Shinovar is dangerously insular and, from what we can see, radically peaceful in the interlude in WoK. Not quite the aggressive, assassin-happy Shin of the deleted scenes, with Jek "trained through hours of practice beneath his father's tutelage" for what would--in the world of the WoK--essentially amount to being a despised slave.

Any other thoughts or insights?

Edited August 14, 2012 by Kurkistan

[Brendan]

Isn't he walking on the roof before he kills the guards, or is that just where my brain took me?

The Shin have obviously changed significantly since WoKPrime I wondered at the towers of the affluent Shin rising high, is the Shin area really that secluded from the highstorms that they can build wooden towers or are highstorms missing in WoKP?

[IvoryRoad]

What really caught my attention most was how Jek was sent to assassinate Shallan and her family, but not Talshekh. if she existed in the story at this point. Which she may very well not have. Hehe.

It's been a while since I read WoK, so correct if I'm wrong when I say Shallan's father was involved with the Ghostbloods. I wonder what, exactly, they're doing, and why Talshekh's family needs to die.

And Brendan, I thought the bit on the roof was written in a confusing way, but I got the impression that he just climbed up. And Shinovar is completely protected by mountains from highstorms - it doesn't surprise me that they can build tall wooden palaces. Might be hard to defend in a siege, though.

[ReaderAt2046]

Random tidbit: When I first saw this, I thought his name was JerksonVallanno

[CrazyRioter]

that is hilarious. Have an upvote.

[Dros]

None of this is canonical though, right?

This guy is definitely a lot different than Szeth. He's kind of a d!ck actually.

[Truthless]

Oh wow - I don't think I would have liked Way of Kings Prime at all. Jek is really annoying. His internal dialogue is just painfully expositiony, and the names start seeming silly by the middle of the excerpt. The whole section is hitting the bull's eye on cliche while aiming for originality. It's kind of blowing my mind how different the final Way of Kings is from this.

Edited August 14, 2012 by Truthless

[king of nowhere]

yes, the shin appear a lot different from the final wok. But I wonder how much they are different and how much it just wasn't revealed in wok. for example, even if they are peaceful, they may still have a tradition of trained assassins. in general, just because their warriors are slaves, it don't mean they are poorly trained. they may even be better trained than the alethi, that recruit soldiers among the poors and don't seem to put much effort in their training.

So this piece tell us that the shins may be more dangerous than it appears in the book.

but the most surprising thing is that szeth don't appear to have any powers at all. he climb the roof with grapples, kill the guards with conventional means. apparently surgebinding was conceived later, or szeth wasn't supposed to have it.

[PeterAhlstrom]

It shouldn't be considered canonical at all. For me, what's interesting about it are the obvious differences. For the things that this tells us that are not yet contradicted by the current version of the series, it's best to assume that they do not exist in the current version.

[Kurkistan]

^Ok, let's dig a bit more into thematic comparison (as opposed to canonical speculation), then.

I much prefer Taravangian's "disability" in WoK (his perceived low-grade not-smartness (as intelligent as a normal person, really [pg 64])) to that of "Taravangian Prime." As a modern reader, you can't help but heavily look down upon a culture which equates deafness with idiocy, unnecessarily alienating the reader from Alethi culture right off the bat. It also makes the WoKP Alethi nobility look like fools, not the cunning, backstabbing lot they are in WoK, since apparently the entire peerage has fallen for this transparent ruse. Taravangian works hard for his illusion of (permanent) mediocrity, while, as far as we can see, Ahven just behaves normally and everyone assumes he is mentally disabled because of how his voice sounds.

EDIT: On a re-read, I just saw that Ahven had "wide, innocent eyes" and was "smiling foolishly" during the party, implying that he is actively maintaining an illusion of mental disability. Still odd that he would be labeled as such in the first place, though, given that I'm assuming he wasn't quite this conniving as a small child.

I also like the (massive) buildup to the Taravangian reveal, while Ahven's plotting isn't surprising because we've known the character for all of five minutes.

Really, the whole chapter just goes to make the Alethi look absolutely terrible and incompetent, preening fools who deserve anything that they get--this perception is not just a result of Jerk's skewed viewpoint: that viewpoint (the savagery of the East) is reinforced by the objective fact of their highly irrational prejudice against the disabled, the apparent foolishness of their guard placement (as helpfully pointed out by Jerk), and the apparent foolishness of their nobility. The Alethi in the WoK are a fallen people--though they don't know it--great and glorious, but misguided. The Alethi in WoKP are just misguided.

EDIT: Oops. As helpfully pointed out by Peter, it's the Vedens, not the Alethi. That makes a substantial portion of my analysis less useful, though I suppose the same criticisms could be applied to the implications about Jah Keved. We don't have as much to compare directly to the WoK though, so still less useful overall.

I guess my memories of the first scene of the WoK are stronger than the memory of something I read a day ago. That's a good sign, right?

Edited August 14, 2012 by Kurkistan

[PeterAhlstrom]

It's not the Alethi in the Prime scenes. It's the Vedens.

I do agree that the Taravangian reveal is infinitely more effective.

Edited August 14, 2012 by PeterAhlstrom

[Kurkistan]

It's not the Alethi in the Prime scenes. It's the Vedens.

I do agree that the Taravangian reveal is infinitely more effective.

Well don't I feel sheepish.

Okay, new analysis, then:

Oh, so Ahven is at least doing something to maintain his illusion, what with his "wide, innocent eyes" and "smiling foolishly" at the party. Strike two.

Moving on again:

Brandon's skill writing fight scenes has definitely improved. I really lacked a sense of location during the fight, starting with Jerk's (that variation on his name brings me undue pleasue) location in relation to the guards. Also, how big is the balcony? Where are the guards on the balcony? Which way are they facing?

Jerk was on the roof, then suddenly a guard goes down (silently?) with a stiletto in the back (falling down silently too, apparenlty, since Jerk still took care to set the other guard's body down gently). Then Jerk is choking the other guard (with both hands, presumably? Then why isn't the guard attacking him back? What kind of weapon did he have anyway? Oh, it was a sword? Well thanks for telling me that after the fight scene was over!). Then Jerk (still choking the guard with both hands?) "whipped out his chokecloth [using his third arm, presumably], spinning behind the man and wrapping the cloth around [the guards] neck." Either Jerk grew an arm or he was subduing a trained guard to the point of complete silence and near immobility using one hand.

I might be being ungenerous here, since the scene does give an impression of a fast Stab->Choke->Chokecloth sequence ("The guard got in a single claw at Jek's arm before a twist of the chokecloth..."), but that begs the questions of how far apart the guards were, how big the balcony was, their facing, obstacles in Jerk's path, just how slow the reaction time of the guard was, and so on. Even if we do allow for this to be a plausable sequence (Jerk is very close to the second guard and stifles him for just a moment with one hand while simultaneously pulling out the chokecloth with the other [an interpretation which would have been helped by a semicolon or conjunction between the two actions rather than a full stop], with the choke->garroting sequence all taking place in the same moment), it's still rather confusing.

That was a bit harsher than I intended, but I really mean this as praise for how well Brandon's writes fight scenes now; they all seem so simple, but it really is frighteningly easy to mess them up. With Brandon nowadays, the reader never even has to think about these kinds of questions.

Edited August 14, 2012 by Kurkistan

[Cheese Ninja]

Yet, he had never performed this one heresy: the murder of one whose mind had been taken by the Shanalakada. The Idiot King was more than just a child, he was a child with no opportunity. An invalid.

Jek closed his eyes. Another slaughter. He had been so close . . . four masters, now, and the Shanalakada had not seen fit to release him from his penance. Perhaps they never would.

Seems like the Nightmother was combined with the Stone Warden's religion in the WoK Prime, or something like that. That's odd. He still knows his Oathstone (Bondstone) on sight, and there's no indication here that it has magical properties either.

I agree with the other statements in this thread about Brandon being a much better writer now.

[Djando Je]

I like the "Important men liked windows." line. I think Brandon should use it again later on.

[Truthless]

I like the "Important men liked windows." line. I think Brandon should use it again later on.

I liked that too - really made me think. When I read a broad statement like that, I usually ponder it for a sec before I accept it. It's really fun when I realize it's a great observation.

Also: I think what put me off so much about this piece is that the structure seems to be designed to show off all the clever plot twists. Really doubt that that was Brandon's intent, but with a pet project like this, I guess it's possible. And clever plot twists are fine. Obviously Brandon pulls them off all the time. But they need to serve a much greater purpose than impressing the reader, I suppose.

[ReaderAt2046]

Also: I think what put me off so much about this piece is that the structure seems to be designed to show off all the clever plot twists. Really doubt that that was Brandon's intent, but with a pet project like this, I guess it's possible. And clever plot twists are fine. Obviously Brandon pulls them off all the time. But they need to serve a much greater purpose than impressing the reader, I suppose.

I think there are two reasons for that. First, this is a much older piece of Brandon's work, so it will be lower quality than his published work. Second, this was Brandon's "I'm-going-to-give-up-trying-to-impress-the-market-and-just-write-what-I-want" book, so it will be uniquely vulnerable to that effect.

[Truthless]

I think there are two reasons for that. First, this is a much older piece of Brandon's work, so it will be lower quality than his published work. Second, this was Brandon's "I'm-going-to-give-up-trying-to-impress-the-market-and-just-write-what-I-want" book, so it will be uniquely vulnerable to that effect.

Oh, that's right. This would predate his first published novels, I suppose. And I don't mean to lash out at Brandon, it's just interesting how very different this is from the final product and even Brandon's other work.

Also! I love the keteks in your signature.

Edited August 20, 2012 by Truthless