Mid-Range Game 4: The Alethi War of Unification

[Wyrmhero]

So who's up for round two?

 

I believe there will be a QF game posted shortly, run by Jasonpenguin. There will also be an anniversary game run by Metacognition at some point as an additional game, based on the first game we ran here (LG1). So, just keep an eye out

[Araris Valerian]

Good game everyone! I finally proved that I was a guardsman!

[Kasimir]

Thanks to King for running this and everyone else who played!

Also, thanks Araris--really appreciate the save. I'd pretty much said, "Sod this" and thrown the personal victory out of the window because I just wanted to survive one game as a Team Good player. (For the record, I've played eight games so far, including this, and I die in all but two of them. And the last time I survived, it was by riding on Team Evil. So yeah, I really badly wanted to survive but thought that explaining it in-thread would be kind of awkward. As in, major awkward. King knows, I had major sads in the game PM. So of course, he was hoping I got lynched, just so I wouldn't survive. Thank you for helping me achieve that.)

 

One point of sadness for me is that I did figure Twei had the spanreed, thanks to having logged the base amount of time everyone spent in the Personal Messenger, and having been around to see her put in a really odd amount of time there in the cycle following Macen's death. And then I promptly forgot about it because that data table was lost somewhere in my notes >>

 

The funny thing is, with regard to paranoia in this game, Ren and Wyrm are the ones I feel I really can't trust. With Wilson, it's this intellectual notion that everyone who trusts Evil!Wilson generally gets chulled over pretty badly, but at the same time, it's distant knowledge. With Ren and Wyrm, the scars run deep. Very deep Probably explains why I generally spend a lot of time suspicious of Ren in most of these games. Sorry, Ren!

 

Most importantly, I'm saying it now: please don't expect this amount of activity from me in future games, much less assuming that it's my tell when I'm on Team Good Once my exams ended, I was in a pretty lucky period where I had the time to be a lot more active in this game than I really usually am. Otherwise, don't count on it! >>

[Alvron]

A great game Wyrm.  Thanks for GMing.

 

For those wondering why I was sure of Jasnahs innocence.  It was because about an hour after the game started that Wyrm set up a PM between Jasnah and myself.  He deleted it quickly afterwards but not before I saw it.  Given that in the last few games Jasnah didn't really reach out to anyone in PMs, I (wrongly) figured that they wouldn't set up a PM that early if they had a spy doc to talk in.  I am going to have to be a lot more careful now.

[A Joe in the Bush]

Oh come on! You chose to kill me? Ah well. Sani survived. Good job spies.

[Mckeedee123]

I believe there will be a QF game posted shortly, run by Jasonpenguin. There will also be an anniversary game run by Metacognition at some point as an additional game, based on the first game we ran here (LG1). So, just keep an eye out

 

Hmm...How long's it gonna be till the signup's posted? It's been... 6 hours since this game ended. How come JasonPenguin doesn't obsessively check this forum 200 times a day?

 

Imean, um... I'm not saying I do that but, um, I... Know some people who... might... Mflblvxk   

Edited December 15, 2014 by mckeedee123

[Metacognition]

Sign ups are coming, McKeedee, don't worry about that!

 

This was a great game, Wyrm! There were so many twists to keep track of and I think that's honestly why Kas and I butted heads so early (Sorry Kas, I really put us in that situation, so I don't lament my death there). 

 

Spies, you did an incredible job. You not only had to worry about being found, you had to worry about hitting your own and I think you guys did a great job of trying to balance the two. 

...Well, other than the first battle, but there was no way for you to know how that would turn out. If anything, you guys were forced into a "I think that they'd think" with that one and unfortunately you all thought the same! On the bright side, great minds think alike and you all at least considered the option of not attacking to throw off the count!
 

The greatest thing from this game, IMO, is how well our newer players showed of themselves. From this point on, I don't think anyone could easily claim that Eoldren, McKeedee, Jasnah, or any of the others that I've missed aren't devious within their own rights! You guys were amazing. 

Also, Jain... I'm sorry that your first time as evil ended so quickly (I know the feeling!). Hopefully, you won't have to wait as long for the next time!

Again, great game everyone and I'm looking forward to the next!

Edited December 15, 2014 by Metacognition

[Newan]

Survive long enough to get a shardblade: a statistically terrible plan of action, but it somehow worked out.  Thanks everybody for a fun game!  And thanks for being so nice and encouraging me despite past hiccups.  It's all of you great people that keep me coming back to these games.  

 

Also, to the new people: thank you for sticking with it.  I hope to see all of you in future games!

[Kasimir]

So, does Aonar qualify for Most Lynchable?

 

For that matter, have I just confirmed my place as the Agro Magnet once again? With the distinction that I actually survived those? >>

[Eolhondras]

Thankyou all, this was a hell of a lot of fun.

 

To the spies, unfortunate is the word that springs to mind. There seamed to be a never ending sting of luck following the good guys with the kill on jain, then the first battle, and several lucky saves throughout. Regardless, very well played as I can honestly say I wasn't certain of any ones guilt until the names came up in Wyrm's fabulous write ups. (except maybe macen, but only after the trolling started )

 

I'm hooked. And I'm sure I'll see many of you next game.

[Wyrmhero]

I wanted another link between games .

Week 9

 

Bread, meat, cheese.

 

Not an appetising meal on their own, but they would last, they would give him strength. Wurum stopped packing, and for the moment just listened to the Highstorm picking up around his tent. He was the only one left, his was the only tent remaining. All the others with the army had gone into the shelter that had been Soulcast for him. He had not, much to the surprise and confusion of his peers. But what did they care? They probably wanted him to be dashed upon the rocks like that.

 

"Are you certain?" he muttered, asking the Spren again, hoping her answer had changed from the last time he asked, a mere ten minutes ago. "Are you absolutely sure, Hera?"

 

"I'm sure," Heranshay said, settling down to sit on top of his back. Her clothes had changed, from a long flowing dress made of the wind itself, to a rough approximation of travelling clothes. "You should trust me more," she added reproachfully. "We have to go."

 

Wurum shook his head as he scooped up a handful of spheres and pocketed them so they would get recharged in the Highstorm as he left. He waved Hera off his bag and then flipped it open so he could shove paper and pens inside. Some food, paper, and a few spheres. Not exactly the best way to start a new life. "You won't even tell me why."

 

"Something... dark," Hera said, floating where she did beside his bag. "Something harsh and cruel."

 

"A Voidbringer?" Wurum asked, surprise in his voice. She was always going on about them, though she wasn't sure why she cared about them so much or what they were. It seemed she'd forgotten quite a bit, though her instincts were superb.

 

"No," she shook her head, toying with one of her gloves. She'd attempted to approximate leather out of wind, and somehow she'd managed to get it pretty close to look at. "Not evil. Just dark. Uncaring."

 

"Storms," Wurum muttered, now somewhat more aware of why he shouldn't be cursing them, "you don't give a body much to go on, do you?"

 

"I'm sorry," Hera replied, folding her arms and looking sullen. "I can't help it if I don't know why. But you trusted me to predict the last Highstorm. You trusted me to predict this one. Will you trust me a third time?"

 

Sighed, Wurum closed the bag. A mere week ago, Hera had been saying that he should reveal his powers, that he should help Dalinar to unite Alethkar for the coming years. He had spoken the second ideal, yes, he had no problem with helping people like that, even if he was hesitant to reveal himself. But the sudden reversal in her opinion as to what they should do worried him. He was glad he had not gone that far now, if he had to flee in a Highstorm.

 

"Let's go," he said, nodding a little. He picked the bag up and slung it across his back as he exited the tent, into the Highstorm. Immediately he felt its power in a way that he had never felt before. He could understand why people hid and executions happened in a Highstorm, with this awesome power behind them. After just a second, he was completely soaked through. He opened his mouth and took in some stormlight, binding himself to the ground so that he could walk. Hera flittered around him, casting a pale light where she flew.

 

Lightning cast a bright light against the horizon, and in that flash, he saw a figure silhouetted against the sky. Hera was right, it was a dark figure. Tall and male, but otherwise he could not tell. The man seemed to be standing there, nothing more.

 

But now, closer to him, there were more men. These ones wielded swords and had them unsheathed, and all were watching him, and slowly advancing through the rain and the wind.

 

"He's here..." Hera said, surprisingly fearful for one usually so irreverant. She flew up to his shoulder. "We have to go."

 

"How?" Wurum asked, wishing he'd had the presence of mind to bring a spear or something with him. Not that it would matter though - He was a Stormwarden, not a warrior.

 

Before Hera could reply, one of the swordsmen advanced on him, readying his sword to strike. Wurum reached his arm behind him and Lashed his tent. It pulled itself free of its pegs, and enveloped the man, the pegs locking together and ensuring he couldn't escape.

 

The other followed suit, but this time, Wurum had nothing he could even improvise as a weapon. His would-be killer swung the sword at his throat, and Wurum dodged as best he could. He lashed out with the bag, but it wasn't fully enough to have any sort of weight behind it. Wurum started to Lash it similarly to how he had the tent, but the second swordsman cut the straps before he could do anything, and the bag fell to the ground at his feet.

 

Wurum managed to avoid the next few strikes, but it was difficult to keep it up, even if his body was energised by Stormlight. A cut appeared on his arm as the swordsman found his mark, but it healed almost instantly in a flash of light.

 

"The third ideal!" Hera shouted in his ear. "Say the third ideal!"

 

"...I don't know it," Wurum muttered, not sure whether he should be annoyed or saddened by that fact. "I'm sorry, Hera." Whatever strengths the third ideal would give him, he could not rely on them. He had no weapon and nothing to use as an improvised blade or club.

 

"You're a Windrunner!" Hera shouted above the noise of the wind and rain. "Use the storm!"

 

Wurum weakened his gravitational connection to the ground with a Basic Lashing, and used that chance to get a bit of distance. He barely had time to make another Lashing, this man was fast. At least he was not wielding a Shardblade. But regardless, he couldn't simply escape, that much was clear.

 

The next strike he deflected with his arm, and it bit deep. Blood mingled with the wind and the rain, a sacrifice to the Highstorm. But it gave him the purchase he needed. He reached out with his other arm, and Basic Lashed the swordsman to the tent that the other was still struggling to get out of. The attacker was flung backwards onto his companion, and Wurum used the chance to recover himself.

 

Lightning flashed again, and the dark figure started to walk forwards. He had a sword in his hands. No, a Shardblade.

 

"Run!" Hera shouted. "You can't fight him! Lash yourself to the sky and flee!"

 

Well, he was meant to be trusting Hera, wasn't he? Besides, he wasn't willing to risk fighting a Shardbearer without a weapon, even in a Highstorm. He had no wish to discover if Shardblade injuries healed as quickly as normal ones. Following Hera's advice, he Basic Lashed himself to the sky, and took off.

 

The figure watched him go, seemingly unconcerned. He pulled his two associates off each other and ripped the tent open to let the first one out. "He has gone," he said.

 

"Ah... Our apologies, sir." The first said as he stood up. "He surprised us with those tricks. Should we not go after him?"

 

A shake of the head. "No. It is impossible to chase a Windrunner in a Highstorm. But we will eventually catch up to him, when he becomes complacent. Whether it takes five, ten, or perhaps even fifteen years, we will find him again. He cannot run from the law forever."

[little wilson]

Great game, everyone. The spies did a fantastic job, despite things working against them as much as they did. I think, on top of the role numbers and distribution being somewhat easy to predict (except for the scout/squad leader fiasco) which we've already talked about, there were a few too many protective abilities for the spies to navigate around. The battle skip, surgeon, and guardsmen all made things pretty easy to keep the necessary people alive. Still though. Despite that, the spies did very well keeping themselves hidden.

 

Twei. What was that you said about being a terrible eliminator? That you can't manipulate at all? Never trusting you again. I scratched you off my list when you said that, recalling LG7, and that was a horrible mistake.

 

That said, though, I don't think I did too terribly, despite the incredibly rough start I had. One thing I noticed is that my gut is not a darkfriend. My gut is the reason I role-blocked Twei and Aonar (and suspected Macen early on). My head is the reason I roleblocked Odysa and killed Maill. So...yeah. Definitely need to trust my gut more than my head when I'm on Team Good.

[Mailliw73]

I believe there will be a QF game posted shortly, run by Jasonpenguin. There will also be an anniversary game run by Metacognition at some point as an additional game, based on the first game we ran here (LG1). So, just keep an eye out

 

An anniversary game? That's cool!

 

Thanks, Wyrm! I really enjoyed this game. And good job to all those who played, especially Mek and Eoldren. I'm echoing Meta, but you two did really good for your first game.

[Wyrmhero]

So, analysis. There are three main areas I want to focus on here, I think, as there are three 'different' parts to this game.

 

Firstly, the Lighteyes mechanic. I am pleased to say that the voting mechanic was used by almost all the Lighteyes. The only issue I had with it was that it was, more often than not, a throwaway vote to prevent the Spies from taking hold of it. Without the Spies being able to co-ordinate their own easily, it essentially gave the village another vote to add to the leading lynch target's lead. However, I don't think this is a problem with the mechanic itself, but rather more because we had rather quiet Eliminators here, who did not try to lead votes in certain directions. In another game, I think this would have worked, but more testing may be needed with these behind-the-scenes mechanics (as I'm dubbing them).

 

The problem with Lighteyes was that the Combat Skip gave them slightly too many ways to avoid being killed. Only two Lighteyes skipped combat, but the only one of them that really mattered was Kas in the first Battle, as it decreased the number of kills expected by one (the other being luckat when she was likely to be protected). It's pretty clear that even one skip was too many to see, and Shardbearers getting it just made their abilities even stronger, particularly when you could skip and still Shardblade someone. In retrospect, I should have made skipping similar to the Scout ability. However, I would say that if I ran this again, this time around I would not let Lighteyes skip combat all.

 

The other issue is one that I noted with my House War game, and should have taken cues from a more from it. When you publicly divide players as I did with Dark- and Lighteyes, then it gives the Village an easier time of guessing the GM. When two Lighteyed Spies were found, it meant that the Village could pretty much trust the rest, as three would seem to be too much (though I did think about it). There is little that could be done about this without changing the whole setup of the game, unless I hid each player's eye colour, but I am loathe to do that. I think this could be best solved by being more daring with Eliminator role assignments to shake the Village out of its prediction mode, as I did just a little by removing Scouts and the Squad Leaders from the game.

 

Secondly, the Eliminator team idea. Nice in principle, but perhaps a little lacking in execution. The fact that the Eliminators did not know who each other were made it difficult to balance the game, hence why I gave two teams Guardsmen, to lessen cross-faction fire a little bit. As Meta mentioned, the Eliminators' strongest abilities is their ability to discuss and collaborate with each other and work with trusted people, and this game took a little of that away. I would be curious to know whether the Spy teams enjoyed trying to figure each other out or not.

 

However, it is still a core part of this game, the multiple teams. I think that in the future, I would try either Eliminators working in threes (apparently Spanreeds don't even exist at this point in time, so it's not as if pairs are necessary ), or I would give each Eliminator team the names of each other Eliminator, but not let them talk. This would let them know who they're working with, but they'd still have to figure out their plans. They would also know who to contact to get plans rolling. As this would be via PM, it would not be too fast a communication. I think that the latter is a better idea here to remain in the spirit of the game.

 

Also touching on dividing players, there is the nature of Roles within an Eliminator team. It's all very well to say 'well, the Eliminators will probably have these Roles...', but the problem with this game is that you can simply cross people off a lot easier than in most, partly due to the divisions, but also because of the Messenger Role, which is very useful for the Eliminators. This Role is the only one that cannot be used while being hidden, and that hurts it a lot when it comes to voting based on Role division. I used the Role in this form, as with my Tineye back in LG7, because I did not want to allow open PMs. It's difficult to know how to fix this without making it flat open again. Off the top of my head, all I can think of would be to get PMs passed anonymously through the GM, but this is somewhat difficult to do due to timings - in particular, with most people being on the forum when I'm asleep. If anyone can think of a way to get closed PMs to work as a Role without hitting these issues, I'd be very interested.

 

Now, thirdly and finally, Shardblades. The hope I had with them would be that they would be balanced by the number of people dying during a Battle. Again, I was also expecting a little more direct Eliminator manipulation, and because of that was expecting the Shardbearer to go somewhat vigilante and hit an ally or two in their rampage. This did not come to pass, and due to previously mentioned factors, the Shardblades were used as hard confirmation of players' loyalties at the end, Meta-style.

 

The other issue with Shardblades is the fact that it confirmed players as innocent, thus shrinking the area that the Eliminators had to hide in. My hope was that the Eliminators would rush to take the Shardbearer out, but that was a little too difficult with the number of protective capabilities that the Village had. I think in the future, I wouldn't use it as confirmation, relying on a combination of the higher probability that it would be a Villager who got it, and the fact that the wielder and the kills are public to keep it fairly in check. I would also increase the chances for Spearmen and Swordsmen to get the Shardblade (by twice as much as everyone else), to balance out their 'lack' of Roles.

 

To prevent players hoarding actions (luckat Guarded a player, skipped a Combat, Shardbladed someone and Lighteye voted, for instance) I would also consider just giving players one action, since most people did indeed have one action. This would only really affect Spies and Shardbearers.

 

The final important question to ask is whether the game contains too much probability, in the players chosen for a kill, the event during the Cycle, and the player who wins a Shardblade. Unfortunately, removing a lot of the random elements does make it impossible to play this game. I think the only thing I would change here is that, due to removing many of the ways for players to be taken off the kill list (only Scouts remaining), I would pick an Eliminator team to make the kill each Cycle in a pattern rather than pick a random player off the list.

 

As an aside mention, The Wit. Our little Jester/Fool-type Role. Was this effective? It depends on the player. The worry about this Role is that they tend to be Mafia-light in other games, as their intention is to get themselves killed. I countered that in this game by making it so that they only won if they got lynched if the Army won as well, and that the other players didn't lose if The Wit was lynched. This did lead to The Wit asking to get lynched at the end of the game though, which is rather against the spirit of the Role. I'm not sure how I would change this, but as a first attempt at this type, it went fairly smoothly.

 

So, to sum up the changes I would make when running this a second time:

• Lighteyes lose their ability to skip Combats.
• Spy teams are furnished with a list of the other Spies at the start of the game, but not their Roles, nor can they discuss with other Spy teams without extra aid.
• Each Cycle, a Spy team gets to make a kill. The order is chosen randomly at the start of the game and only known by the Spies.
• Players have one action each Cycle. It is up to them to chose whether to use their Role, Spy ability or Shardblade. Note that the Lighteyed Vote is not an action.
• Potentially a complete overhaul of the Messenger Role.
• Shardblades can be won by any player, regardless of Alignment. Both the winner and any kills they make remain public.

But regardless of the issues that cropped up when playing (many of them only coming up because of how it unfurled), the feedback I'm getting is that people seem to have enjoyed themselves playing this game. I'm glad to hear it, and it was fun to watch as well. Particularly when you all wondered where the Scout was . I hope to see you all at the next game I GM, if I haven't scared you off yet.

Edited December 15, 2014 by Wyrmhero

[Alvron]

Was just updating my Table of Evil Stats and noticed that Aonar has joined the ranks of Most Evil.  Congratulations and Welcome.

 

So far the highest number of times someone has been evil is 4.  A Smart Guy has the best Evil ratio at 3 good : 4 evil

 

A Smart Guy    Played:7     Evil:4    Evil in:MR1 MR2 LG7 QF4

Tulir                 Played:9     Evil:4    Evil in:LG4 MR1 MR2 LG9

The Only Joe   Played:13   Evil:4    Evil in:LG3 LG4 MR2 LG8

Alvron              Played:14   Evil:4    Evil in:QF1 LG5 LG8 QF4

Aonar Faileas  Played:15   Evil:4    Evil in:LG2 MR1 QF4 MR4

 

Note:  MR1 sharders, LG9 SK and Fain from LG6 are included as eliminators as they are hidden factions.

[little wilson]

or I would give each Eliminator team the names of each other Eliminator, but not let them talk. This would let them know who they're working with, but they'd still have to figure out their plans. 

 

One thought I had while reading this bit is it could be interesting to try this in a game with no PMs at all. So each pair of eliminators can still plan and coordinate, and they know who the other eliminators are, but they have no way to communicate with each other outside of the thread. But then, Team Good can't communicate privately at all, so it sort of balances out.

 

Was just updating my Table of Evil Stats and noticed that Aonar has joined the ranks of Most Evil.  Congratulations and Welcome.

 

So far the highest number of times someone has been evil is 4.  A Smart Guy has the best Evil ratio at 3 good : 4 evil

 

A Smart Guy    Played:7     Evil:4    Evil in:MR1 MR2 LG7 QF4

Tulir                 Played:9     Evil:4    Evil in:LG4 MR1 MR2 LG9

The Only Joe   Played:13   Evil:4    Evil in:LG3 LG4 MR2 LG8

Alvron              Played:14   Evil:4    Evil in:QF1 LG5 LG8 QF4

Aonar Faileas  Played:15   Evil:4    Evil in:LG2 MR1 QF4 MR4

 

Note:  MR1 sharders, LG9 SK and Fain from LG6 are included as eliminators as they are hidden factions.

 

You should do a list by percentage too. I feel left out.

[Alvron]

You should do a list by percentage too. I feel left out.

Who says I haven't?  My Chart of Evilness has you near the top with lots of warnings.

 

Wilson: Evil 42.857% Subtle manipulator.  Mastermind planner. Troll.  Bloodthristy as hell.  Kill with fire!!!

 

Edit: As of the end of this game, there has been a total of 77 different SE players.

Edited December 15, 2014 by Alvron

[little wilson]

Wilson: Evil 42.857% Subtle manipulator.  Mastermind planner. Troll.  Bloodthristy as hell.  Kill with fire!!!

 

You have no idea how delighted I am to read this. Particularly the bolded part. However, I feel I should warn you: fire only makes me stronger.

[Alvron]

I shall update accordingly.  Care to tell us what will kill you?

[little wilson]

I shall update accordingly.  Care to tell us what will kill you?

 

A Shardblade, apparently. And an Awakened sword. So....Invested weapons, I guess.

[Wyrmhero]

Speaking of, I really need to update my stats docs... But time is an issue for me at this time of the year, annoyingly, with exams and coursework and trying to look for stuff to do after uni and blargh. Maybe I'll have a look at it as a break from revision or something. There's only 6 games for me to add. That's not much... right? >>

[little wilson]

Speaking of, I really need to update my stats docs... But time is an issue for me at this time of the year, annoyingly, with exams and coursework and trying to look for stuff to do after uni and blargh. Maybe I'll have a look at it as a break from revision or something. There's only 6 games for me to add. That's not much... right? >>

 

I can help, if you want to get the base outline up. I was looking at them right after LG9 got over, and I would've done it, but I'm like "Dude. I have no idea how he wants it" because I have an entirely different organizational pattern.

[Wyrmhero]

I can help, if you want to get the base outline up. I was looking at them right after LG9 got over, and I would've done it, but I'm like "Dude. I have no idea how he wants it" because I have an entirely different organizational pattern.

 

Nah, it's fine. Just need to get down and start it, really. Thanks for the offer of help though.

[Lightsworn Panda]

I can't believe I died so early on my first game as an Eliminator...

 

WHY CRUEL WORLD WHY!!!!!!!

[twelfthrootoftwo]

 

Oh come on! You chose to kill me? Ah well. Sani survived. Good job spies.

Sorry. Perhaps the Random Number God I consulted was out to get the original lighteyes?

 

Twei. What was that you said about being a terrible eliminator? That you can't manipulate at all? Never trusting you again. I scratched you off my list when you said that, recalling LG7, and that was a horrible mistake.

Well, if you check that post, you'll notice I carefully defined manipulation to exclude cases of self-preservation. For example, attempting to cast suspicion on you would be manipulation - and that resulted in an untimely roleblock. Attempting to not get lynched afterwards (seriously, why was I still alive by the end!?) would not. So what I said is technically still applicable 

 

Well played, Blackthorn loyalists, and thank you Wyrm!