A "Late-Breaking" Report

[Tamzin Ashevai]

OMG! Where do I begin? There's so much I don't know! It's not like I'm the kind of person who feels that she needs to be the expert on anything ... but I feel like I'm the in-expert on everything! While there are some things that I know, I really don't know so much that, it seems, everyone else does. I have to admit that I'm not a data-whore. Neither am I a horder of information. Given both of these fats, just where do I proceed from here?

[Zas678]

Where to begin? I know just the place to begin.

The Brandonothology.

Most of our information, guesses, theories, and assumptions are based on information that we have in there, from various Brandon interviews. Later, they were moved into the Theoryland Database for a more comprehensive source, but the Brandonothology is a good place to just start at the beginning and it's got Brandon's cosmere-interviews up until about a year ago.

[shinigamisid]

Feruchemy is about multipliers. The more the Lord Ruler aged, the less "multiplier" he could store in his metalmind. And the more he aged the more he would need to Compound to stay alive. There could exist an upper bound to the amount of time the Lord Ruler could survive off this trick.

Yes, so, this happened at Alloy. There's no excuse for this level of lateness. Don't kill me. Meep.

Can't he just use a new metalmind?

[Landis963]

Can't he just use a new metalmind?

 

The problem doesn't exist in the metalmind.  The problem exists in the person.  TLR's spirit "knows" that it should have died X years prior.  As X gets larger, the more youth he needs to tap in order to stay in his 20s.  

[shinigamisid]

The problem doesn't exist in the metalmind.  The problem exists in the person.  TLR's spirit "knows" that it should have died X years prior.  As X gets larger, the more youth he needs to tap in order to stay in his 20s.  

I'm sorry. I don't get it. Why should he tap more youth? Isn't he still Connected? In fact, I think the Connection increases over time, so I'd think he'd need to tap atium less. Because more Identity=easier for him to exist in all three realms, right? (In Secret History, they say Allomancers can stay longer in the Cognitive Realm because they are more Connected to the Shard, so...)

[Landis963]

I'm sorry. I don't get it. Why should he tap more youth? Isn't he still Connected? In fact, I think the Connection increases over time, so I'd think he'd need to tap atium less. Because more Identity=easier for him to exist in all three realms, right? (In Secret History, they say Allomancers can stay longer in the Cognitive Realm because they are more Connected to the Shard, so...)

 

But tapping youth strains that connection, which wants to think that TLR is much much older than his appearance and health shows (and it's correct, which doesn't help).  And the connection is to a singular point (namely, the point at which TLR's natural lifespan "should" have ended), instead of a continuum.  Strengthening that connection makes it harder, not easier, to remain unchanging.  

 

EDIT: Have you read The Emperor's Soul?  Whenever Shai (the protag) needs to work her magic on something she needs to comply with a couple precepts:  the changes she makes to something's history 1) must be plausible (e.g. a famous painter could have stayed in a specific room long enough to paint a mural), and/or 2) must be acceptably familiar to the thing she's trying to change (e.g. someone could be temporarily induced to take on another's memories and mannerisms, so long as the other is known inside-and-out by the original person).  TLR continually tapping youth is in non-compliance with the first precept, and since it's his youth being recycled and augmented with Allomancy, there's nothing for his spirit to compare it with.  

Edited April 9, 2016 by Landis963

[shinigamisid]

But tapping youth strains that connection, which wants to think that TLR is much much older than his appearance and health shows (and it's correct, which doesn't help).  And the connection is to a singular point (namely, the point at which TLR's natural lifespan "should" have ended), instead of a continuum.  Strengthening that connection makes it harder, not easier, to remain unchanging.  

 

EDIT: Have you read The Emperor's Soul?  Whenever Shai (the protag) needs to work her magic on something she needs to comply with a couple precepts:  the changes she makes to something's history 1) must be plausible (e.g. a famous painter could have stayed in a specific room long enough to paint a mural), and/or 2) must be acceptably familiar to the thing she's trying to change (e.g. someone could be temporarily induced to take on another's memories and mannerisms, so long as the other is known inside-and-out by the original person).  TLR continually tapping youth is in non-compliance with the first precept, and since it's his youth being recycled and augmented with Allomancy, there's nothing for his spirit to compare it with.  

Yeah, I read The Emperor's Soul just yesterday. I think I kind of understand.

Now I have another question. Let's say you're immortal by default, like Hoid maybe. And you ingest Lerasium. Would you eventually lose Allomantic powers?

[Landis963]

Yeah, I read The Emperor's Soul just yesterday. I think I kind of understand.

Now I have another question. Let's say you're immortal by default, like Hoid maybe. And you ingest Lerasium. Would you eventually lose Allomantic powers?

 

Good question.  The major use of lerasium differs from compounding atium in that it forges a new connection between the soul and Preservation, instead of stretching a preexisting one.  Once the lerasium is burned, the soul thinks "I'm a Mistborn now" and, much like TLR's soul thinking he should have died by now, it's correct.  The difference is mainly in that (with lerasium) the soul is working with the mind, instead of (with TLR) the two being at cross-purposes. In this way, Hoid will retain his Mistborn powers indefinitely.  

[Erinzard]

What does it mean that your shardblade can be willed down? Why would that be different from just willing it to stay in the Physical Realm when you let someone else borrow it or leave it in a rock? Could you drop it into some soft soil so it just keeps going down through Roshar's crust until the rock is hard enough to impede it? 

[Ethan_sedai]

On 3/16/2012 at 10:57 PM, Chaos said:

I don't remember what prompted me to write this, or what impression I had that made me write this, but I wrote: Anyone can take up a Shard. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. I would not have written this if it was not crystal clear to me that this is what Brandon meant.

See if you can get out of him why Kelsier was unable to take up Preservation without the Ire's Orb thing if this is true. 

edit: does he mean that anyone is connected enough to at least one shard to be able to pick it up?

Edited October 28, 2017 by ethan_sedai

[The One Who Connects]

26 minutes ago, ethan_sedai said:

See if you can get out of him why Kelsier was unable to take up Preservation without the Ire's Orb thing if this is true.

It's because he was only a cognitive shadow, rather than a full person. Ruin says so himself during their discussion.

[Blightsong]

14 hours ago, The One Who Connects said:

It's because he was only a cognitive shadow, rather than a full person. Ruin says so himself during their discussion.

Ruin says that Kelsier doesnt have the full capabilities of a non-Cognitive Shadow Vessel, not that that is why he needed the Orb. Kelsier was not Connected enough to preservation to take it up (same with the living Ire, that's why they made it).

[The One Who Connects]

6 hours ago, Blightsong said:

Ruin says that Kelsier doesn't have the full capabilities of a non-Cognitive Shadow Vessel, not that that is why he needed the Orb. Kelsier was not Connected enough to preservation to take it up (same with the living Ire, that's why they made it).

So he did. Serves me right for not rereading the scene and going off memory.