Fallen Rope Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Random thought. Would a bullet of the right metal work as hemalurgic spikes if shot through the heart. This could be a way to easy kill a gold compounder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiver Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Yes. More detailed, I believe WoB is that it could, conceivably work, IF the bullet went through the exact point, and IF the shooter knew what they were doing, since Intent is an important part of the magic systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurkistan Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 (edited) Here's the full details on that. Source: Shardlet: If you shot Miles with pewter bullets through the heart, would the bullets become hemalurgically charged and remove Miles’s bloodmaking ability? Brandon: Umm, you would have to get them in exactly the right place. Q: Oh, so it’s more than just the heart, it’s got to be the right place in the heart? A: Well, you have to, it’s like acupuncture. A hemalurgic spike has to be specifically placed. Q: Well, I don’t mean for placement. I just mean for making Miles a donor. A: You could hemalurgically steal Miles’s power. Q: With pewter bullets? A: I don’t know that bullets would work. But they might. How about this, it is theoretically possible to do what you just described. If you knew what you were doing, because intention is part of a lot of the magic system. Intention is involved. It’s tricky because Ruin did it to people who didn’t know what they were doing, but… Q: But, Ruin intended to do it, though. A: But, Ruin intended to do it and knows how to manipulate it so that intentions would happen. Intention is very important, if you read through the magics, to a lot of them. Q: It is part of the cognitive aspect. A: Yes. Edited August 25, 2014 by Kurkistan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oudeis Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 (edited) nevermind. Edited August 25, 2014 by Outis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurkistan Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 (edited) @Outis @FallenRope As to your original intent (killing Miles), it might not be so easy. We have just recently from Brandon that Feruchemical Gold can heal back stuff that's been removed by Hemalurgy: So if you shoot our his Feruchemy, he'll just burn a metalmind to heal it back. Shoot out his Allomancy, and he'll tap existing stocks of Health. That said, if you hit an unwitting Miles and took his Feruchemy he might not be on the ball enough to be burning a metalmind directly in the instant or two he'd have before dying—perhaps it either wouldn't occur to him or he wouldn't be able to because of shock or the like. He can burn any gold piercing his body, though, so he'll probably never not have the bare opportunity... Edited August 25, 2014 by Kurkistan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PorridgeBrick Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 It probably would take considerably more of his stored health than a normal bullet wound, however. If you managed to pull this off several times, he might not have enough to heal with, and you'll be in possession of several free spikes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ja Posted August 26, 2014 Report Share Posted August 26, 2014 It occurs to me that a Feruchemist that can store luck (I can't remember the name, I am a disgrace to the clan...) could tap loads of luck to shoot the bullet in just the right place if he knew what he was doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatebreaker Posted August 26, 2014 Report Share Posted August 26, 2014 Hmm, long range hemalurgy... I approve. It's not as personal as the traditional means, and lacks the same craftsmanship, but it does have it's upsides. You could do it successfully in three ways: Luck, a high precision(or sniper) rifle, or you could just grab a gatling gun and go to town. Or you could combine the traditional approach with the more modern one and use a harpoon gun. So many new possibilities to try. I'm gonna be busy this week. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowspren Posted August 26, 2014 Report Share Posted August 26, 2014 It can probably be assumed that by storing up luck they could shoot it through the right spot... but with using a bullet as a hemalurgic spike we have to remember that the size and placement of the spike determine the amount of charge it can hold. And most importantly if you planned to use it you would have to shoot it perfectly through Miles and into someone else and have it stick into them for it to work effectively. Because with the small size of the bullet it would quickly lose it's charge if you left it for long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shardlet Posted August 26, 2014 Report Share Posted August 26, 2014 @Outis @FallenRope As to your original intent (killing Miles), it might not be so easy. We have just recently from Brandon that Feruchemical Gold can heal back stuff that's been removed by Hemalurgy: So if you shoot our his Feruchemy, he'll just burn a metalmind to heal it back. Shoot out his Allomancy, and he'll tap existing stocks of Health. That said, if you hit an unwitting Miles and took his Feruchemy he might not be on the ball enough to be burning a metalmind directly in the instant or two he'd have before dying—perhaps it either wouldn't occur to him or he wouldn't be able to because of shock or the like. He can burn any gold piercing his body, though, so he'll probably never not have the bare opportunity... Is pewter the metal to use to hemalurgically steal Feruchemical gold and Allomantic gold? If so, multiple bullets could be used to steal both abilities, thus rendering Miles's currently charged metalminds wholly impotent for either tapping or burning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurkistan Posted August 26, 2014 Report Share Posted August 26, 2014 (edited) Pewter is used to steal Feruchemical Physical powers, but so far we've yet to see any "doubling up" on a metal's thefting of powers. We don't know the metal for it yet, but I doubt that it just so happens that pewter also steals the Allomantic Temporal powers. Besides that, there's the question of whether spikes might not only be able to steal one power at a time per spike. Edited August 26, 2014 by Kurkistan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killersquirrel59 Posted August 26, 2014 Report Share Posted August 26, 2014 It is noted in several places that each spike can only steal one power. That's why Inquisitors thought Spiking Mistborn was such a waste, since they'd only get one power out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted August 26, 2014 Report Share Posted August 26, 2014 It is noted in several places that each spike can only steal one power. That's why Inquisitors thought Spiking Mistborn was such a waste, since they'd only get one power out of it. Not necessarily: Kythis Q: [Didn't hear] A: Hemalurgy-when you spike, you place the spike in a place that determines which charge the spike gets. Q: Through the heart seems to pick up universally. A: It depends on where in the heart. It's like acupuncture. This is designed from acupuncture and you get very specific on which nerves you're hitting and things like that Q: So the spike will never pick up more than one power. A: Not the way they know how to do it. (source) Brandon doesn't say it outright, but I find it suggestive. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killersquirrel59 Posted August 26, 2014 Report Share Posted August 26, 2014 "Not the way they know how to do it" is a notably vague statement in that context. Well, in any case, at least in any known way, it is impossible to get more than one power per spike, even if it is somehow theoretically possible in truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyabi Posted August 27, 2014 Report Share Posted August 27, 2014 The biggest problem I find with this is the durability of some of the metals. Sure, some of this would work, though it wouldn't be nearly as effective as traditional methods for reasons sited by Zaci. Gold for instance, would probably not work, because it's entirely too soft. The amount of precision/luck that would be required in order to effectively and accurately attribute a Hemalurgic attribute to someone feels more like it would be a waste than it's worth. Unless your primary goal was simply to create a hole in someone's soul in order to help a Shard gain influence over them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer Posted August 27, 2014 Report Share Posted August 27, 2014 (edited) @FallenRope As to your original intent (killing Miles), it might not be so easy. We have just recently from Brandon that Feruchemical Gold can heal back stuff that's been removed by Hemalurgy: So if you shoot our his Feruchemy, he'll just burn a metalmind to heal it back. Shoot out his Allomancy, and he'll tap existing stocks of Health. That said, if you hit an unwitting Miles and took his Feruchemy he might not be on the ball enough to be burning a metalmind directly in the instant or two he'd have before dying—perhaps it either wouldn't occur to him or he wouldn't be able to because of shock or the like. He can burn any gold piercing his body, though, so he'll probably never not have the bare opportunity... How would he use his Feruchemical gold charge, if you just spiked out his ability to use said charge? Sure, the gold is still charged but he still doesn´t have the ability to use it anymore, Afterall, the compounder still needs a way to access the feruchemical charge to rewrite the Investure gained by Allomancy. Otherwise every Allomancer could use that charge, which we know isn´t the case. Edited August 27, 2014 by Edgedancer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted August 27, 2014 Report Share Posted August 27, 2014 (edited) How would he use his Feruchemical gold charge, if you just spiked out his ability to use said charge? Sure, the gold is still charged but he still doesn´t have the ability to use it anymore, Afterall, the compounder still needs a way to access the feruchemical charge to rewrite the Investure gained by Allomancy. Otherwise every Allomancer could use that charge, which we know isn´t the case. He'd have swallowed his own goldmind, which he could burn with just Allomantic gold. We have a WoB on that if you have an "unlocked" metalmind, or can you unlock your own metalmind, that you could burn it for a huge flash of health (though you couldn't store it without Feruchemical gold abilities - but Miles burning his own goldmind would heal those back). Edited August 27, 2014 by Moogle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer Posted August 27, 2014 Report Share Posted August 27, 2014 He'd have swallowed his own goldmind, which he could burn with just Allomantic gold. We have a WoB on that if you have an "unlocked" metalmind, or can you unlock your own metalmind, that you could burn it for a huge flash of health (though you couldn't store it without Feruchemical gold abilities - but Miles burning his own goldmind would heal those back). Maybe but we don´t know if a Metalmind you filled still counts as "unlocked" for yourself, after a spike ripped out his Feruchemical gold ability. His spirit web did get altered in a very significant way connected to said Metalmind after all. It could very well be and sounds rather likely from the WoB but it isn´t clear on this instance and neither is the phrasing if its proper owner messed with Identity in the right way 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted August 27, 2014 Report Share Posted August 27, 2014 Maybe but we don´t know if a Metalmind you filled still counts as "unlocked" for yourself, after a spike ripped out his Feruchemical gold ability. His spirit web did get altered in a very significant way connected to said Metalmind after all. It could very well be and sounds rather likely from the WoB but it isn´t clear on this instance and neither is the phrasing Metalminds are connected to identity, not whether or not the user has Feruchemical powers. Your identity shouldn't change too drastically when/if you're spiked, though maybe your identity does change enough for your old metalminds to stop working? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurkistan Posted August 27, 2014 Report Share Posted August 27, 2014 (edited) Well I would think that if Hemalurgists can access the metalminds of Feruchemists they stole powers from, then you should probably still be able to access your own after only a little bit of soul-loss; this if Identity is the key of the matter. -Evidence of Hemalurgists tapping old metalminds comes way of the dubiously-canonical Mistborn Adventure Game, but it's one of those parts where you can't imagine why they'd put it in if they didn't have Brandon's blessing on it. Edited August 27, 2014 by Kurkistan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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