5th heightening and above savantism

[Tamriel Wolfsbaine]

If you gave a returned or other 5th heightening awakener do you think they could still become savants of another magic system?   Do you think the 2000 breaths would protect them from the side effects of constant use of metals if they had allomancy?   Or save them from the lows of not having stormlight once you hit kaladin levels of use?  

 

[Frustration]

The exhaustion of running out of stormlight isn't savantism, it's the body losing a ton of energy all at once.

As for protection, I don't think it would. So far as I know there isn't any way to be protected from Savantism.

[Spearguy]

The way savantism works is that it's a sort of warping in your spiritweb, caused by large amounts of investiture moving though you. 

I think that a high amount of breaths could make it take a bit longer, but not by much.

[Treamayne]

7 hours ago, Spearguy said:

I think that a high amount of breaths could make it take a bit longer, but not by much.

Or make it happen faster because you are constantly holding large amounts of investiture. . .

[Tamriel Wolfsbaine]

This all makes sense.  My brain was going down the rabbit hole of "they can avoid negative effects of alcohol maybe the negative effects of savantism would be less as well".   

I guess noones spirit web is going to be protected from continual kinetic investiture usage.  

Would you say that Vasher was or is a savant in awakening or is the innate investiture a lot harder to become a savant in using since you just always have that and it is attached to your soul more than temporarily being used by your soul?  

I feel like going off of kinetic investiture that a person is used to always having brings them way down and they feel what is basically the DTs of the cosmere.  But with biochromatic breath where you don't have to chase it necessarily you wouldn't have as much of detox from that thing that gave you the high.  Compare that to getting a rush of getting 50+ breaths all at once.  

Biochromatic breath seems to almost work the opposite.  

Then again what is a drab if not a savant without their fix.  Maybe it is just that everyone on Nalthis is a born savant but it is an always renewed source of investiture that doesn't have to be gathered up.  

[Rorzikel]

On 12/9/2022 at 10:20 PM, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

The exhaustion of running out of stormlight isn't savantism, it's the body losing a ton of energy all at once.

As for protection, I don't think it would. So far as I know there isn't any way to be protected from Savantism.

I guess it depends on your definition of protect, and if it is slightly looser than Brandon's, but nahel bonds help a bit. Prevents losing body parts from soulcasting, at least.

Quote

Questioner 1

Do all Soulcasters risk turning into the element or is it only those using the device?

Brandon Sanderson

All Soulcasters have an affinity but the ones using the device are locked down much more than the Soulcasters who are Knights Radiant.

Questioner 1

So they are protected from being turned into--

Brandon Sanderson

Oh no they-- I wouldn't say protected... *clarification* Protected is the wrong term but that event, the savanthood and how it affects them and things like that is much less pronounced if you are a [Knight].

Questioner 1

Or is that counteracted by the healing as well?

Brandon Sanderson

Healing doesn't have to do with it because-- in cosmere terms there's nothing wrong with your body, your spirit is actually drifting, and so it's not hurting you physically by what's happening with the magics. So it's not the healing but if you have an active bond with a spren it takes a little different path. Let's just say, in simple terms--

Questioner 1

You are not losing body parts to smoke.

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, you are not losing body parts to smoke. 

Questioner 1

What timeframe does it happen for the normal Soulcasters then?

Brandon Sanderson

For normal Soulcasters? It takes-- I mean, you've seen it happening in the books. We are talking [about] a process of years even decades, depending on the person. It happens to some--

Questioner 2

Depending on how often they Soulcast?

Brandon Sanderson

It depends on how often they Soulcast, and it depends on the person. 

Oathbringer Leeds signing (Dec. 1, 2017)

 

[Frustration]

6 hours ago, Rorzikel said:

I guess it depends on your definition of protect, and if it is slightly looser than Brandon's, but nahel bonds help a bit. Prevents losing body parts from soulcasting, at least.

 

It just means that their savantism manifests differently.

[Tamriel Wolfsbaine]

18 minutes ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

It just means that their savantism manifests differently.

I thought I saw a WoB about Kaladin being as near a stormlight savant as Vin was to pewter.   

Anyways that aside I always assumed savantism was a warping of the spiritweb and the damage or consequences of that manifest differently depending on what the magic is or who the person is.  

I would almost say that every person born on Nalthis is a savant as the magic is always with them and being drab is simply the consequence of that... in that their world is suddenly darker and less bright.  All of their movements are just a little bit less from others.  For someone like the godking to turn off 50000 breaths suddenly I am sure he felt it.  We know they feel it turn back on otherwise we would have Denth instead of Vasher as a recurring character.  

Mostly I was thinking down the road of 5th heightening lessens alcohol and poison effects but would it also lessen the dramatic on off switch that would exist after savantism levels of time burning allomantic metals or using savant levels of stormlight.  

[Frustration]

2 minutes ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

I thought I saw a WoB about Kaladin being as near a stormlight savant as Vin was to pewter.   

Anyways that aside I always assumed savantism was a warping of the spiritweb and the damage or consequences of that manifest differently depending on what the magic is or who the person is.  

I would almost say that every person born on Nalthis is a savant as the magic is always with them and being drab is simply the consequence of that... in that their world is suddenly darker and less bright.  All of their movements are just a little bit less from others.  For someone like the godking to turn off 50000 breaths suddenly I am sure he felt it.  We know they feel it turn back on otherwise we would have Denth instead of Vasher as a recurring character.  

Mostly I was thinking down the road of 5th heightening lessens alcohol and poison effects but would it also lessen the dramatic on off switch that would exist after savantism levels of time burning allomantic metals or using savant levels of stormlight.  

Savantism is permanent, baring resetting the spiritweb, via means only shards currently have.

So Nalthinians are not savants, they just have lower natural investiture than other Cosmere worlds, unless they have their breath.

Edited December 14, 2022 by Ookla the Frustrated.

[IlstrawberrySeed]

Aluminum gnat savants can de-savant themselves from other magics or metals.

[Frustration]

4 minutes ago, IlstrawberrySeed said:

Aluminum gnat savants can de-savant themselves from other magics or metals.

Theoretically, we don't have confirmation on if it could do that or not.

[trav]

On 10/12/2022 at 4:20 AM, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

any way to be protected from Savantism

If you were able to restamp your Spiritweb through Forgery you should be able to reverse an effect on it. Done enough it may even last.

[Frustration]

43 minutes ago, trav said:

If you were able to restamp your Spiritweb through Forgery you should be able to reverse an effect on it. Done enough it may even last.

No, you might be able to reset yourself back to before but it wouldn't last. And depending on what your investiture is it might reject the soulstamp.

[Wits instant noodles]

On 12/9/2022 at 8:20 PM, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

The exhaustion of running out of stormlight isn't savantism, it's the body losing a ton of energy all at once.

I understand that savantism messes with you spirit web and stuff but this seems like an early stage or at least a step towards savantism in the same way that burning pewter for to long leaves you really messed up,

[Frustration]

20 minutes ago, Wits instant noodles said:

I understand that savantism messes with you spirit web and stuff but this seems like an early stage or at least a step towards savantism in the same way that burning pewter for to long leaves you really messed up,

No not really. Ending a pewter drag isn't savantism. It's closer to the effect of giving up breath, than messing with your spiritweb.

[trav]

4 hours ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

No, you might be able to reset yourself back to before but it wouldn't last. And depending on what your investiture is it might reject the soulstamp.

Additionally if your Spiritweb can be altered one way it can be altered back to its original form aswell.

Use ability often enough to stretch it out and become a Savant. 

Use Forgery enough to press it back into ita original bounds. 

Edited December 15, 2022 by trav

[Frustration]

44 minutes ago, trav said:

 

You have some spoilers there that aren't allowed here.

[trav]

56 minutes ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

You have some spoilers there that aren't allowed here.

edit. Even though I fail to see how this could still be considered a spoiler. 

 

[Frustration]

1 minute ago, trav said:

edit. Even though I fail to see how this could still be considered a spoiler. 

 

Anything TLM isn't allowed outside the spoiler boards until six months after release

It's found here.

 

[trav]

Just now, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

Anything TLM isn't allowed outside the spoiler boards until six months after release

It's found here.

 

Fine by me. Rules are rules. 

In fact I only got pulled back by it. 

Rest of the argument still stands. 

If the Spiritweb can be altered one way it can be altered back again. 

[Frustration]

1 minute ago, trav said:

If the Spiritweb can be altered one way it can be altered back again. 

 

1 hour ago, trav said:

Additionally if your Spiritweb can be altered one way it can be altered back to its original form aswell.

Use ability often enough to stretch it out and become a Savant. 

Use Forgery enough to press it back into ita original bounds. 

While yes this is true Soulstamps don't stick without an additional source of investiture fueling them, and using investiture of your own would likely break the seal.

So you could in theory undo Savantism, but it would only work as long as you never use the power again.