Ranged Leaching

[StanLemon]

A short argument as to why Leachers should be able to use their power at range. 

We know that for a lot of metals, one of the biggest limiting factors is the perception of what can be done and the practice and intention to use it in another way. For example, Iron and Steel generally have single lines that point to the center of mass. But from Wax and Kelsier we know that that is far from the limit. 

Now the reason I make this argument. Primer Cubes. We see the Primer Cube used in conjunction with 3 metals, Steel Cadmium and Chromium. In the case of Steel and Cadmium, the cube acts exactly like the metal usually does, Steelpushes from the cube and time bubbles with the cube at the center. Leaching on the otherhand is different. It doesn't require the cube to touch someone but simply sucks out the Investiture of someone near it. This indicates that ranged Leaching is a reasonable assumption.

Spoiler

And then we have Stormlight where a Larkin with a comparable power has no problem sucking out Stormlight from a distance. 

 

[Frustration]

The primer cubes do a lot of things regular metalborn can't such as supress invested arts.

Now, it might be possible to use leeching at range, but I think that would require some hacks in the magic system to do.

[StanLemon]

46 minutes ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

The primer cubes do a lot of things regular metalborn can't such as supress invested arts.

Now, it might be possible to use leeching at range, but I think that would require some hacks in the magic system to do.

I doubt it requires a hack, the only times a Primer Cube acted differently to a metal is the Leaching and when it was hooked up to other machinery in the ships. Lack of other machinery implies it is entirely reasonable for Leaching to be done at range.

[Frustration]

Just now, StanLemon said:

I doubt it requires a hack, the only times a Primer Cube acted differently to a metal is the Leaching and when it was hooked up to other machinery in the ships. Lack of other machinery implies it is entirely reasonable for Leaching to be done at range.

No, it does things metalborn can't without the machine. If you charge it with aluminum it creates a bubble where you can't use Allomancy

Spoiler

Rodrigo

What would be the difference between an aluminum and a chromium grenade, and between nicrosil and duralumin grenades?

Brandon Sanderson

We're talking specifically about the Bands of Mourning ones?

*Matt affirms*

So, what would be the difference? Aluminum would create a sort of "You can't use Allomancy in this... nearby this" most likely, yeah. Duralumin would do the opposite. You would be able to use it and then enhance someone. I haven't played with the ranges on these things yet, and so that's where we get into kind of the question mark territory. Like, right now, I haven't really given them an area of effect unless the power itself has an area of effect. Does that make sense?

But, my intent is to get to the point where it's doing things like this, right. Where you could theoretically be an Aluminum Gnat, you could charge this thing up and throw. And hey, you know, you have... the Metalborn nearby are unable to use their talents. That's convenient, right? Like, I want more of the powers to be relevant and these grenades are a way to do that.

You know, Marasi's power is not the most useful on the planet to have herself. For those who don't know, she can slow down time... well, speed up time? Awkward how... the phrasing of how you do that. But basically she can make a bubble around herself where everyone outside of it moves super fast. That's not terribly useful, right? Unless you want to age, you know, really slowly.

[...]

Not really useful in combat, to be able to be like "Yeah, I'm gonna make all my enemies move really, really fast and I can't respond to them". But, she can charge up one of those grenades and toss it, it becomes real handy. For her, the grenades are more useful than the inverse, right, because speeding up someone is useful, but slowing someone down takes someone out of the battle essentially. Or a whole globe of them... globe is the wrong term, but yeah.

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/470/#e14829

 

 

 

[StanLemon]

In that same WoB he explicitly says he hasn't given them an area of effect unless the power had an area of affect

He brings up the Aluminum Gnat as a future hypothetical and it is to get to the point of doing that, not that that is what it does now

[Quantus]

9 minutes ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

No, it does things metalborn can't without the machine. If you charge it with aluminum it creates a bubble where you can't use Allomancy

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Rodrigo

What would be the difference between an aluminum and a chromium grenade, and between nicrosil and duralumin grenades?

Brandon Sanderson

We're talking specifically about the Bands of Mourning ones?

*Matt affirms*

So, what would be the difference? Aluminum would create a sort of "You can't use Allomancy in this... nearby this" most likely, yeah. Duralumin would do the opposite. You would be able to use it and then enhance someone. I haven't played with the ranges on these things yet, and so that's where we get into kind of the question mark territory. Like, right now, I haven't really given them an area of effect unless the power itself has an area of effect. Does that make sense?

But, my intent is to get to the point where it's doing things like this, right. Where you could theoretically be an Aluminum Gnat, you could charge this thing up and throw. And hey, you know, you have... the Metalborn nearby are unable to use their talents. That's convenient, right? Like, I want more of the powers to be relevant and these grenades are a way to do that.

You know, Marasi's power is not the most useful on the planet to have herself. For those who don't know, she can slow down time... well, speed up time? Awkward how... the phrasing of how you do that. But basically she can make a bubble around herself where everyone outside of it moves super fast. That's not terribly useful, right? Unless you want to age, you know, really slowly.

[...]

Not really useful in combat, to be able to be like "Yeah, I'm gonna make all my enemies move really, really fast and I can't respond to them". But, she can charge up one of those grenades and toss it, it becomes real handy. For her, the grenades are more useful than the inverse, right, because speeding up someone is useful, but slowing someone down takes someone out of the battle essentially. Or a whole globe of them... globe is the wrong term, but yeah.

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/470/#e14829

 

 

 

So it sounds like it won't change the Range (AoE vs Touch vs Self, etc) out of the box, but he might be open to that as a future tech development.  That might leave targeted Leeching with a contact object (Id go whip or Net over grenade) that could possible affect multiple targets at once but it would need contact and not actually radiate any distance.

Once they learn to play with Connection more like a Bondsmith they might be able to Connect the effect to other things or at range somehow, I envision metal particulate cloud grenades before they get to radius bubbles. 

 

Side question:  Consider the tactical use of a grenade that spreads powered aluminum over an area/Target.  I could see that being both a boon or a curse depending on the  circumstances.  Thoughts?

[StanLemon]

 

34 minutes ago, Ookla the Wandering said:

Side question:  Consider the tactical use of a grenade that spreads powered aluminum over an area/Target.  I could see that being both a boon or a curse depending on the  circumstances.  Thoughts?

It would be one heck of a boon on Threnody I'm sure