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Mistborn V.S. 3rd ideal Windrunner

Mistborn V.S. 3rd ideal Windrunner    38 members have voted

  1. 1. who would win a fully trained mistborn or a 3rd ideal windrunner. give reasons as for your answer. (New people, please vote after reading at least some replies)


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320 posts in this topic

1 minute ago, StanLemon said:

Can't Lash if their Stormlight has been Leached

Correct, but I don't believe it's an instant effect. The specific WOB says that they'd be 'fairly effective', not instantaneous.

That also doesn't negate the difficulty of reaching the Radiant, or the possibility of the Radiant touching the Mistborn first and Lashing them away prior to Leeching. 

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All cases of Leaching we have seen have been near instantaneous and comparable examples with the Larkin in Lift's pov have also been almost instantaneous 

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2 hours ago, Werewolff Studios said:
Quote

 

I re-read this scene in question (it's in Chapter 17) and found no mention of the horrible nausea you described. The disorientation that occurs is due to Marasi creating a small bubble with a 'pinch' of cadmium. This causes the stagecoach to lurch because it isn't massive enough for the speed bubble to follow Marasi, causing the occupants to knock about. This certainly causes disorientation, but no crippling nausea.

It's also a very specific instance of speed bubble shenanigan's on moving objects. Stationary bubbles don't seem to have this effect, otherwise it would be mentioned whenever Wax and/or Wayne leap out of their speed bubbles during combat. 

I knew there was something about them all jolting and being upset with her for doing what she did.  I thought maybe there was another scene where Wax went through a bubble and described it as being pretty horrible but I can't remember and likely am getting magics confused (my kid was way into apparition at the time.  That definately causes the nausea).  

 

Over all I can't help but agree that 1 shot kill is easier for the radiant... in the event the mistborn does not have atium.  Which leads me to reassess my initial breakdown.  

Radiant at 1st and 2nd oaths are mistborn fodder with or without atium.  No insta kill weapon leaves mistborn winning out 80+% without atium.  

Radiant at 4th ideal wins 80+% of the time even with atium on the table.  

Radiant of 3rd ideal specifically I think the presence of a blade gives it to the radiant 60% of the time without atium and 95+% of the time to the mistborn without atium.  

I think Roshars magic system has gone off the rails as far as power curve goes unfortunately.  As I read it I feel like radiants progressing through the ideals are exponentially more and more powerful.  Their downside is really the lack of ease with which they can mobilize and colonize other worlds.  (Hence my belief that it will be roshar defending against invasion when space travel becomes a thing.  They are made for it.)  

Perhaps the mistborns greatest weapon in this is emotional allomancy.  All radiants are emotionally damaged.  Its the only way to form a bond.  Those spren need cracked spirit webs to hold onto.  How would Kaladin hold up to the trick Vin pulled on Venture?  Even if the other windrunners we see on screen don't seem as broken... being broken to some degree is a prerequisite for spren bonding to you. 

But magic swords and magic armor is where all of that that is offered from other worlds falls off really. (The exception perhaps being Nalthis but the number of magically powerful people are lower due to innate investiture being handed out one breath at a time.)  

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7 hours ago, Werewolff Studios said:

The Windrunner could Lash the Mistborn away from them (stacking Lashings if need be), or toward the ground, making the grip easy to break. The Windrunner can also attack the Mistborn too, either by Lashing enhanced kicks (which we've seen are effective against Shardbearers, who I believe to be stronger than Mistborn) or perhaps by maneuvering their existing Sprenblade into severing a limb (this depends on the exact hold, angle and weapon of course).

Just to note, Shardplate enhances the strength circa 10-20 times, and also enhances speed, reaction times and agility. I.t. Shardbearer is kind of like A-pewter except far stronger.

4 hours ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

Radiant at 1st and 2nd oaths are mistborn fodder with or without atium.  No insta kill weapon leaves mistborn winning out 80+% without atium.  

1st oath Windrunner I agree, but for 2nd I disagree.
As @Werewolff Studios mentioned we have seen 2nd Oath Windrunner (thought it was Kaladin) effectively fight against fighters in Shardplate, which gives everything A-pewter does and more. Also while not possessing insta kill weapon, they would still have a weapon, and Mistborn cannot heal unlike Windrunner. So while Mistborn would still edge out without Atium, I think it would be more like 60-70% in favor of Mistborn.

4 hours ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

Radiant at 4th ideal wins 80+% of the time even with atium on the table. 

I would argue that 4th Ideal Windrunner wins effectively 100% of the time, unless Mistborn has so much atium it lasts longer than all of Stormlight (i.e. enough atium for hour or more, as 4th Oath are more effective at holding and using Stormlight + Plate catches the run-off).
Plate negates rioting and soothing, Plate can be fully sealed to become airtight (so Mistborn has to break it first) and can be damaged only by Duralumin fueled pushes or Pewter hits (and those would be even more risky, as now Windrunner has physical abilities beyond Pewter).

With or without Atium, Mistborn simply lacks the tools to get through Plate properly, lose the edge of A-pewter, cannot leach Radiant (would leach Plate instead) and cannot use Soothing or Rioting with Duralumin to throw Windrunner of balance.

4 hours ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

I think Roshars magic system has gone off the rails as far as power curve goes unfortunately.  As I read it I feel like radiants progressing through the ideals are exponentially more and more powerful.

Well, there is a reason Odium went after Surgebinders for his Cosmere army :D
They are already beasts on the battlefield, now imagine what they would be like if they were supplied by light directly, like Odium can do with Fused.

4 hours ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

Their downside is really the lack of ease with which they can mobilize and colonize other worlds.  (Hence my belief that it will be roshar defending against invasion when space travel becomes a thing.  They are made for it.) 

Well they lack the ease now, but (SoTD sequel spoilers)

Spoiler

we have evidence they will get off-world with plate and everything working.

4 hours ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

Perhaps the mistborns greatest weapon in this is emotional allomancy.  All radiants are emotionally damaged.  Its the only way to form a bond.  Those spren need cracked spirit webs to hold onto.  How would Kaladin hold up to the trick Vin pulled on Venture?  Even if the other windrunners we see on screen don't seem as broken... being broken to some degree is a prerequisite for spren bonding to you.

Actually, while common, being broken is not per-requisite

 

Quote

 

Cody Skomauski

I've struggled with mental illness my whole life. Reading about your characters like Shallan, Kaladin, and Dalinar, that all have some degree of mental illness, start their path to recovery after forming a Nahel bond is very interesting to me. Is it a requirement for a Knight Radiant to be broken in some way prior to the bond? Where did you get this idea? Or was it just how it turned out?

Brandon Sanderson

...

It is not required in-world. A lot of people, even in-world, think that it is, because it was so common. My kind of external answer to that, even though they don't know this in-world, is that people who have struggled with these kinds of problems are more open to walking the path that one needs to walk to become a Knight Radiant. The two go hand-in-hand, the kind of self-awareness, and the ability to see yourself, to be reflective, just goes hand-in-hand with working on some of these issues. And at the same time, I felt it just worked really well with the themes of the story, the themes that Dalinar has of redemption. And also, I think that the extreme circumstances that a lot of characters put through stories like the ones I write do lead people to have some difficulties, right? Even PTSD, and things like that. There's just a lot that goes hand-in-hand together with this.

So the answer is, yes, it happened to be that way. But once I noticed it happened to be that way, I asked myself, "Is this a theme I'm doing on purpose, even if I haven't noticed it?" And the answer to that was, "Yes, it is."

YouTube Livestream 2 (Jan. 20, 2020)

 

 

but as it is common, I would say it is safe to assume some damage is there.
Definitely duralumin rioting/soothing would have an effect, but I wonder to what extent. Radiants holding Stormlight are much more Invested than Mistborn burning metals which will make them more difficult to effect, and on top of that holding Stormlight also has cognitive effects, so it would be like rioting/soothing someone who is already being affected by something. I wonder how that would interact.


 

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15 hours ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

I believe kaladin had to drop Syl each time he wanted to change to a different weapon)

I'm, like, 90% sure that isn't true.

 

one more thing about atium is that most mistborn wouldn't have swallowed it at the very beginning of the fight. they would wait to test the waters so they don't waste atium. then they would have to use a speed bubble or something to ingest the atium if they wanted it without giving the KR a free shot/free catch-up time. that would waste some metals too.

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1 hour ago, Ookla the platypus said:

I'm, like, 90% sure that isn't true.

 

I dont think he droped her but I think she kinda dissipated for a second then reappeared.

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8 hours ago, therunner said:

Just to note, Shardplate enhances the strength circa 10-20 times, and also enhances speed, reaction times and agility. I.t. Shardbearer is kind of like A-pewter except far stronger.

1st oath Windrunner I agree, but for 2nd I disagree.
As @Werewolff Studios mentioned we have seen 2nd Oath Windrunner (thought it was Kaladin) effectively fight against fighters in Shardplate, which gives everything A-pewter does and more. Also while not possessing insta kill weapon, they would still have a weapon, and Mistborn cannot heal unlike Windrunner. So while Mistborn would still edge out without Atium, I think it would be more like 60-70% in favor of Mistborn.

A Mistborn with Chromium destroys 1st and 2nd Oath Radiants. One touch is all it takes

8 hours ago, therunner said:

I would argue that 4th Ideal Windrunner wins effectively 100% of the time, unless Mistborn has so much atium it lasts longer than all of Stormlight (i.e. enough atium for hour or more, as 4th Oath are more effective at holding and using Stormlight + Plate catches the run-off).
Plate negates rioting and soothing, Plate can be fully sealed to become airtight (so Mistborn has to break it first) and can be damaged only by Duralumin fueled pushes or Pewter hits (and those would be even more risky, as now Windrunner has physical abilities beyond Pewter).

Plate can be cracked with stone and a sling. It's by no means insurmountable. Szeth's scene in WoK shows it is possible for an Invested person without Plate to fight someone in Plate. Sure it would be a good deal harder fighting a Radiant in living Plate vs a skilled fighter in dead Plate but it does use Stormlight to repair every crack that forms in Plate. Sooner or later the Radiant will run out.

8 hours ago, therunner said:

With or without Atium, Mistborn simply lacks the tools to get through Plate properly, lose the edge of A-pewter, cannot leach Radiant (would leach Plate instead) and cannot use Soothing or Rioting with Duralumin to throw Windrunner of balance.

Per above, it's a cat and mouse game. Slam the Plate with Steelpushes until the Radiant has ran out of Stormlight. Unlike a Mistborn, Radiants lose their Stormlight even if doing nothing 

8 hours ago, therunner said:

Well, there is a reason Odium went after Surgebinders for his Cosmere army :D
They are already beasts on the battlefield, now imagine what they would be like if they were supplied by light directly, like Odium can do with Fused.

Odium doesn't directly supply Light, the Fuzed still need to either carry it in Spheres or spend the time necessary to do the chant that summons it

 

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31 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Plate can be cracked with stone and a sling.

Um, not really. The scene you are talking about(WoK 898-899) Has Dalinar hit twice by head-sized stones thrown by warform parshendi, and his armor only puffs stormlight on the first hit, and gets only tiny cracks on the second.

31 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Per above, it's a cat and mouse game. Slam the Plate with Steelpushes until the Radiant has ran out of Stormlight. Unlike a Mistborn, Radiants lose their Stormlight even if doing nothing

Coins can't even break wooden sheilds, shardplate wouldn't notice and since the plate is heavier than the mistborn they will be sent flying. And since living shardplate doesn't require stormlight to function there's no reason to constantly be expending it.

Edited by Ookla the Frustrated.
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3 minutes ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

Coins can't even break wooden sheilds, shardplate wouldn't notice and since the plate is heavier than the mistborn they will be sent flying. And since living shardplate doesn't require stormlight to function there's no reason to constantly be expending it.

This assumes that a Mistborn can't find any other metal. They only get sent flying if they are dumb enough to keep Pushing after striking the Plate. Your right it doesn't need Stormlight to keep functioning, but they are still going to keep losing Stormlight. Stormlight is lost just by them holding it.

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Just now, StanLemon said:

This assumes that a Mistborn can't find any other metal. They only get sent flying if they are dumb enough to keep Pushing after striking the Plate. Your right it doesn't need Stormlight to keep functioning, but they are still going to keep losing Stormlight. Stormlight is lost just by them holding it.

How would you keep them from making progress?

Windrunners are faster, so you can't outrun them, they have shardblades so you can't barricade yourself, and they have spren so you can't hide.

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15 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

This assumes that a Mistborn can't find any other metal.

they can't find any metal besides the stuff they throw down. It's a flat stone plain, remember?

Edited by Ookla the platypus
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Just now, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

Windrunners are faster, so you can't outrun them, they have shardblades so you can't barricade yourself, and they have spren so you can't hide.

Windrunners are only faster if they stack several Lashings, which burn through their Stormlight quickly. Electrum for defense, Bendalloy speed bubbles to dodge quickly if the Windrunner does close in, etc.

But this is getting off topic. Yes 4th Ideal Radiants have the advantage, I just heavily disagree that it is as insurmountable as so many of you believe. 

Without Plate though, as a 3rd Ideal Radiant is, the Radiant lacks their biggest advantage against a Mistborn. Chromium is decidedly problematic for a Radiant. 

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chromium is countered by their sprenblade. it'll be hard to get close with stormlight-enhanced movement and a sprenblade. What does electrum do again?

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1 minute ago, Ookla the platypus said:

they can't find any metal besides the stuff they throw down. It's a flat stone plain, remember?

Actually I forgot. Which is a battlefield clearly skewed in favor of a Radiant. Thing is, there is no such thing as a neutral battlefield.

But it doesn't matter anyway, the quote you referenced of mine was a Mistborn against a 4th Ideal Radiant, which was already outside the scope of the predicted battle. A Mistborn wouldn't need to run away against a 3rd Ideal Radiant like that

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Just now, Ookla the platypus said:

chromium is countered by their sprenblade. it'll be hard to get close with stormlight-enhanced movement and a sprenblade. What does electrum do again?

Mistborn have superhuman agility and dexterity, Kaladin already proved a Radiant can get grappled. Electrum sees your own future, so you can see if you would get struck by a Shardblade and correct your action

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4 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

they can't find any metal besides the stuff they throw down. It's a flat stone plain, remember?

Its also 3rd ideal and no plate anyways right?   These discussions always digress into who and how and where and they are always countered with "if you just give this side this one more thing then its gg for them".  

18 minutes ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

How would you keep them from making progress?

Windrunners are faster, so you can't outrun them, they have shardblades so you can't barricade yourself, and they have spren so you can't hide.

This is where atium is the key for mistborn.  The idea that the radiant will be relentless plays in favor for the atium.  And since its toggleable the mistborn doesn't have to use it until the radiant is in range to be a threat and then duralumin powered pewter head smash is an all to real possibility.  

 

2 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

chromium is countered by their sprenblade. it'll be hard to get close with stormlight-enhanced movement and a sprenblade. What does electrum do again?

Spren blade is countered by atium.  And to an extent electrum showing the mistborn where they die so they avoid those movements.  

 

3 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Actually I forgot. Which is a battlefield clearly skewed in favor of a Radiant. Thing is, there is no such thing as a neutral battlefield.

But it doesn't matter anyway, the quote you referenced of mine was a Mistborn against a 4th Ideal Radiant, which was already outside the scope of the predicted battle. A Mistborn wouldn't need to run away against a 3rd Ideal Radiant like that

Yes.  But then again luthadel would be skewed in favor of the mistborn because the radiant wouldn't have access to the majority of their kit given it is not on Roshar.  There are other metal rich areas and we see Vin using the same 2 horse shoes to travel long distances.   Remember all metals provide the mental ability to process their uses as well. 

 

 

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then how are they supposed to get away from the sprenblade? Chromium bubbles? they probably have the radiant in them when formed. Pushes and Pulls? they are slower than lashings. 

7 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Mistborn have superhuman agility and dexterity,

not as much as stormlight gives.

7 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Kaladin already proved a Radiant can get grappled. Electrum sees your own future, so you can see if you would get struck by a Shardblade and correct your action

only by someone with as much strength as they have and the KR could lash the Mistborn away.

7 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Electrum sees your own future, so you can see if you would get struck by a Shardblade and correct your action

only if they recognize what a Sprenblade corpse looks like. They won't know what will cause them to have their eyes burned and so they won't know what to dodge.

3 minutes ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

This is where atium is the key for mistborn.  The idea that the radiant will be relentless plays in favor for the atium.  And since its toggleable the mistborn doesn't have to use it until the radiant is in range to be a threat and then duralumin powered pewter head smash is an all to real possibility.  

the big problem is something i said earlier. the mistborn isn't going to eat the atium until it might be too late to save them. they would have to take it before the KR kills them but after they realize that the KR is a very powerful foe.

Edited by Ookla the platypus
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2 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

only by someone with as much strength as they have and the KR could lash the Mistborn away.

In a grappling match, a Mistborn would absolutely destroy a 3rd ideal Radiant. They just leech away the Stormlight from the squishy Radiant the break them with the added strength of Pewter

3 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

only if they recognize what a Sprenblade corpse looks like. They won't know what will cause them to have their eyes burned and so they won't know what to dodge.

I would think that it wouldn't be hard to want to avoid the massive, glowing sword being swung at you

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1 minute ago, Primeval Ookla said:

I would think that it wouldn't be hard to want to avoid the massive, glowing sword being swung at you

they might think that the grapple is going to cause it and escape the grapple.

 

1 minute ago, Primeval Ookla said:

In a grappling match, a Mistborn would absolutely destroy a 3rd ideal Radiant. They just leech away the Stormlight from the squishy Radiant the break them with the added strength of Pewter

just form a Sharddagger and cut their throat when the Mistborn comes in to grapple and KR wins, easy as that.

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2 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

then how are they supposed to get away from the sprenblade? Chromium bubbles? they probably have the radiant in them when formed. Pushes and Pulls? they are slower than lashings. 

Bubbles can be made smaller

2 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

not as much as stormlight gives.

only by someone with as much strength as they have and the KR could lash the Mistborn away.

Two things, Stormlight doesn't have a Pewter like affect. Kaladin explicitly says that it doesn't give strength and there is never narration except once by Teft in reference to Kaladin's skill with a spear, and there are multiple reasons to take that with a grain of salt

2 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

only if they recognize what a Sprenblade corpse looks like. They won't know what will cause them to have their eyes burned and so they won't know what to dodge.

What @Primeval Ookla said

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3 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

not as much as stormlight gives.

People think stormlight gives you abilities.  It perfects what you have.  Allows you to push to your absolute upper limit.  It doesn't, however, magically make you more than you are.  That is exactly what pewter does.  

 

5 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

only by someone with as much strength as they have and the KR could lash the Mistborn away.

That requires touching the mistborn in which case the radiant is leeched or pewter slapped to damnation.

 

2 minutes ago, Primeval Ookla said:
7 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

only if they recognize what a Sprenblade corpse looks like. They won't know what will cause them to have their eyes burned and so they won't know what to dodge.

I would think that it wouldn't be hard to want to avoid the massive, glowing sword being swung at you

I think it is less about "this thing killed me right here" and more about "I will die if I go right there thus I need to choose another course of action".  Unfortunately that leads to electrums biggest fault which is that it shows so many shadows it is hard to mentally take it in.  

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3 minutes ago, Ookla the platypus said:

just form a Sharddagger and cut their throat when the Mistborn comes in to grapple and KR wins, easy as that.

It's hard to cut someone's throat when they are way stronger than you and breathing down your neck

Not to mention that they could Push the Shardblade away

Edited by Primeval Ookla
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8 minutes ago, Primeval Ookla said:

In a grappling match, a Mistborn would absolutely destroy a 3rd ideal Radiant. They just leech away the Stormlight from the squishy Radiant the break them with the added strength of Pewter

Rosharans are easily almost a foot or more taller than Scadrians, even with pewter they would only be a but stronger, not enough to crush them.

23 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Windrunners are only faster if they stack several Lashings, which burn through their Stormlight quickly. 

No they aren't. Terminal velocity is much faster than any mistborn could achieve without duralumin.

23 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Without Plate though, as a 3rd Ideal Radiant is, the Radiant lacks their biggest advantage against a Mistborn. Chromium is decidedly problematic for a Radiant. 

If they swallowed a decent amount of gold beforehand they might be able to use that as a buffer as leeching takes non-invested metals before invested ones. The only question is whether or not it will burn away metals if someone can't use them.

13 minutes ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

 duralumin powered pewter head smash is an all to real possibility.  

I doubt they could get in range for that, especially with the radiant being taller.

Edited by Ookla the Frustrated.
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1 minute ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

People think stormlight gives you abilities.  It perfects what you have.  Allows you to push to your absolute upper limit.  It doesn't, however, magically make you more than you are.  That is exactly what pewter does.  

sorry if I wasn't clear, i was saying that it "gives" (for lack of a better term) the ability to continue using strength past when they should have to stop. and I believe that it does give some bonus to your natural strength, simply by perfecting what you have.

 

1 minute ago, Primeval Ookla said:

Not to mention that they could Push the Shardblade away

Shardblades (let alone SprenBlades) are way too invested to Push away.

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1 hour ago, StanLemon said:

A Mistborn with Chromium destroys 1st and 2nd Oath Radiants. One touch is all it takes

Similarly, Windrunner Lashes them in the air, one touch is all it takes? Can Mistborn survive fall from thousands of feet?
And before they can touch Windrunner, they need to get in melee range, and again Mistborn cannot heal. One good stab is all it takes to kill Mistborn.

1 hour ago, StanLemon said:

Plate can be cracked with stone and a sling. It's by no means insurmountable. Szeth's scene in WoK shows it is possible for an Invested person without Plate to fight someone in Plate. Sure it would be a good deal harder fighting a Radiant in living Plate vs a skilled fighter in dead Plate but it does use Stormlight to repair every crack that forms in Plate. Sooner or later the Radiant will run out.

Slings are surprisingly powerful weapons. Also those were boulders the size of human head, thrown by slings wielded by Warform, which are typically 2-3x stronger than humans.
And as @Ookla the Frustrated. pointed out, it did barely any damage.

Also don't assume 4th Windrunner is just standing there, they can fly and move in general faster than Mistborn.

1 hour ago, StanLemon said:

Per above, it's a cat and mouse game. Slam the Plate with Steelpushes until the Radiant has ran out of Stormlight. Unlike a Mistborn, Radiants lose their Stormlight even if doing nothing

How much metal does Mistborn have around?, Also only duralumin pushes would break Plate, regular ones cannot even get through wooden shields. Also Reverse Lashings. Also Plate catches the run-off.
Windrunner is faster and more maneuverable, and in plate also comparably agile, they will catch Mistborn faster than they run out.
 

1 hour ago, StanLemon said:

Odium doesn't directly supply Light, the Fuzed still need to either carry it in Spheres or spend the time necessary to do the chant that summons it

No he does, It is described in Oathbringer. Also by singing Song of Prayer any singer (or arguably anyone with connection to Odium) can generate Voidlight.

16 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Windrunners are only faster if they stack several Lashings, which burn through their Stormlight quickly. Electrum for defense, Bendalloy speed bubbles to dodge quickly if the Windrunner does close in, etc.

Not really no, as stated previously just spheres carried on person were enough for 12 hours of non-stop flight for over a thousand miles. Apply 12 lashings non-stop and you still have enough Stormlight for an hour, and that is 3rd Oath.

Electrum is of limited ability, it shows you only the one immediate future. Also against area attacks or attacks which are faster it would do little, and blade would not cut flesh on first hit anyway.
And bendalloy burns really fast, so you cannot spam it to dodge things. Also the bubbles are ~12 feet across.

13 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Mistborn have superhuman agility and dexterity, Kaladin already proved a Radiant can get grappled. Electrum sees your own future, so you can see if you would get struck by a Shardblade and correct your action

So do Radiants, and Plate improves upon that further.

10 minutes ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

This is where atium is the key for mistborn.  The idea that the radiant will be relentless plays in favor for the atium.  And since its toggleable the mistborn doesn't have to use it until the radiant is in range to be a threat and then duralumin powered pewter head smash is an all to real possibility. 

Can the Mistborn have hour worth of Atium?
Also if the Mistborn is not burning it all the time, they can misjudge or not notice danger and get killed.

3 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Bubbles can be made smaller

With a lot of experience, Wayne has only learned that after what, 20 years?

3 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Two things, Stormlight doesn't have a Pewter like affect. Kaladin explicitly says that it doesn't give strength and there is never narration except once by Teft in reference to Kaladin's skill with a spear, and there are multiple reasons to take that with a grain of salt

Stormlight is occasionally described as providing superhuman strength. It is definately not as pronounced as pewter, but the effect is there.

14 minutes ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

Spren blade is countered by atium.  And to an extent electrum showing the mistborn where they die so they avoid those movements. 

Electrum would show nothing, the blade does not cut flesh on the first hit.

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