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A particular epigraph back in Era 1 that is suddenly very relevant regarding TLM


goody153

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"He shall defend their ways, yet shall violate them. He will be their savior, yet they shall call him heretic. His name shall be Discord, yet they shall love him for it."

Even Telsin mentions about Harmony becoming Discord like capital in one of her lines.

Ohhh boy Scadrial is gonna in fun times. Also the epigraph saying so much irony of Discord is gonna helluvah interesting this is how you end an era with a big question

Thoughts ? Theories ?

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I like this. I think Harmony is going to become Discord in Era 3. We'll see how that goes.

5 hours ago, lacrossedeamon said:

Given that the contents of them has been tweaked over time there is some wiggle room.

I'd bet this "Discord" part wasn't changed by Ruin, because he didn't even understand it, so he should've left it intact.

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1 hour ago, lacrossedeamon said:

The Shard's Intent was always Discord, it's just that the Vessel is fully succumbing to it's influence now. Puts the letter from Sazed in RoW in greater perspective.

That's not entirely the case

Spoiler

Argent

When Sazed picked up the Shards of Preservation and Ruin, did he actively choose to be known as Harmony (instead of, for example, Balance, or Equilibrium, or Stability), or is there some Cosmeric law that says Preservation + Ruin = Harmony?

Brandon Sanderson

He chose the name, but in part because it FELT right to him.

Argent

Is this similar to how a Shard's "personality" overwrites the Shardholder's over time?

Brandon Sanderson

Similar, yes.

/r/books AMA 2015 (June 17, 2015)

 

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7 minutes ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

That's not entirely the case

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Argent

When Sazed picked up the Shards of Preservation and Ruin, did he actively choose to be known as Harmony (instead of, for example, Balance, or Equilibrium, or Stability), or is there some Cosmeric law that says Preservation + Ruin = Harmony?

Brandon Sanderson

He chose the name, but in part because it FELT right to him.

Argent

Is this similar to how a Shard's "personality" overwrites the Shardholder's over time?

Brandon Sanderson

Similar, yes.

/r/books AMA 2015 (June 17, 2015)

 

Whether it felt right to him doesn't mean its necessarily the truth. Sazed stating the Ruin had ALWAYS been stronger implies never having actually been in Harmony.

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Just now, lacrossedeamon said:

 

Whether it felt right to him doesn't mean its necessarily the truth. Sazed stating the Ruin had ALWAYS been stronger implies never having actually been in Harmony.

It was Kelsier that said Ruin had always been stronger(TLM 486).

And it felt right to Sazed because that's what the shard wanted.

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3 minutes ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

It was Kelsier that said Ruin had always been stronger(TLM 486).

Don't have the novel in front of me at the moment but pretty sure it was Sazed thinking it.

4 minutes ago, Ookla the Frustrated. said:

And it felt right to Sazed because that's what the shard wanted.

That's your interpretation of the WOB.

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4 hours ago, lacrossedeamon said:

The Shard's Intent was always Discord, it's just that the Vessel is fully succumbing to it's influence now. 

One of the things that I enjoy about cosmere books is that future sight isn't set in stone - it works off probabilities, not certainties. Prophecies _can_ be circumvented, not just misunderstood. People have real agency, their decisions actually matter. 

We have already seen Shards "breaking bad" and will no doubt see more in SA, given Heraldic flashbacks planned for the second arc, whatever Cultivation is up to and, well, TOdium. But if it is all we see, it will become boring and repetitive. "Powers that  man isn't meant to wield", yadda, yadda, ad nauseam. So I  really hope that with Sazed and Harmony we'll get something different.

And "Sixth of the Dusk", ironically, gives me hope. Because "The Ones Above" are clearly trying to work around some non-interference rule that feels very vintage Sazedian. IMHO, the future of Scadrial will be shaped by the tension between Sazed's "freedom of choice" stance and Kelsier's "pre-emptive defense" one.  

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44 minutes ago, Isilel said:

We have already seen Shards "breaking bad" and will no doubt see more in SA, given Heraldic flashbacks planned for the second arc, whatever Cultivation is up to and, well, TOdium. But if it is all we see, it will become boring and repetitive. "Powers that  man isn't meant to wield", yadda, yadda, ad nauseam. So I  really hope that with Sazed and Harmony we'll get something different.

I do think Era 3 will deal with actually bringing Sazed's two intents into balance but I think from the get go they haven't. And I wouldn't say we really seen a "breaking bad" but already "broken bad" so exploring the actual process isn't repetitive.

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11 hours ago, lacrossedeamon said:

Wishful thinking. Rayse saying he is actually Passion probably felt right to him as well.

Odium is heavily related to Passion on some relevant level.

Spoiler

Valhalla

Ruin and Odium, they both talked about their passion, and it was italicized both times. Would any other Shards talk about passion in that same italicized way?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes they would.

Valhalla

Would any of them not talk about it that way?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. Excellent, good questions.

Idaho Falls signing (July 21, 2018)

 

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