Scadrials Stars and the Cosmere

[Lyra]

Hello, this is my first post, and I made an account solely for this burning question I've had for ages.

So I have been under the impression that the Cosmere is a star cluster of 50-100 stars, which I've seen in multiple WOBs, but reading through mistborn, I noticed that on multiple occasions the stars in the sky are described as being as numerous as thousands or more. Is this a mistake? Are they just seeing planets? 

I'm genuinely stumped here, as I've seen contradictory evidence for the number of stars in the cosmere and it has been driving me up the wall.

 

Thank you for your time

[+Invocation]

There's only somewhere between 50-100 stars in the cosmere, true, but since it's just a mostly-distinct star cluster, there's nothing stopping the rest of the universe outside the active grounds of the cosmere from having comets, planets, and excess stars whose light and reflected light reaches into the cosmere eventually.

[Elegy]

It's confirmed that there are stars visible on the night sky that are not in the cosmere:

Quote

Argent

Do the constellations have actual names you can share with us?

Isaac Stewart

Clockwise from Threnody: the Mourner, the Dragon, the Fisherman, the Giver, the Lamp, the Knight, and the One Tree. The names are a bit generic, mostly because they are working names I used to refer to the different constellations during the process of painting the piece. It should be noted that the people from the spot in the Cosmere where the night sky does look like this would not see these pictures in the constellations nor give them these names. The pictures the patron saw in the stars here are based on their own observations and knowledge about the Cosmere as a whole. The locals would see entirely different pictures in their stars, for those who can even see the stars from their vantage.

One tidbit I should mention is that the lamp used to be a constellation called the Lover and was a man receiving breath from the Giver. I dropped it mostly because it's reference to Devotion wasn't working visually. Another thing to note: Not all the stars on this chart are physically within the Cosmere. Some are in the parts of Space beyond the Cosmere.

Footnote: This is from a private email exchange between Argent and Isaac Stewart.
Miscellaneous 2017 (June 1, 2017)

More relevant WOBs:

The WOB that mentions 50-100 stars:

Quote

Questioner

Is there a center to the cosmere?

Brandon Sanderson

There isn't a center in the cosmere... I keep calling it a dwarf galaxy but I think they decided it's a cluster, instead of a dwarf galaxy.

Overlord Jebus

Even a dwarf galaxy is still really big.

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, still too big. So we had to call it a cluster. Because we only wanted like what, we came up with 50 or 100 stars? So it's a cluster. Or a really dwarf galaxy.

Emerald City Comic Con 2018 (March 1, 2018)

It's part of a galaxy:

Quote

Peter Ahlstrom

The involved [cosmere] planets are actually in a rather small star cluster, much smaller than a dwarf galaxy. This star cluster is within a galaxy.

Miscellaneous 2015 (July 1, 2015)

And some have tried to (unsuccessfully) leave the cosmere cluster:

Quote

Questioner

Has anyone, Shard or otherwise, tried to leave the cosmere and will we see that on screen?

Brandon Sanderson

So far... yes, and I think yes, it's likely.

Footnote: Followup: https://wob.coppermind.net/events/379/#e13558
Starsight Release Party (Nov. 26, 2019)

 

[Dunkum]

so doing a quick bit of astronomy research (read: scanning wikipedia), it looks like star clusters can/usually are part of galaxies.  for example the Pleiades is a star cluster inside the Milky Way galaxy. notably, the Pleiades is visible from Earth, though we are not part of it, all of which is to say that the rest of the stars and such outside of the Cosmere cluster should be visible much the way other stars in our galaxy are visible to us.

[Lyra]

I thought as much too. But I never found any confirmation that the cosmere star cluster has anything beyond it, and if it does that just raises further questions. I could easily be wrong

[Dunkum]

8 minutes ago, Lyra said:

I thought as much too. But I never found any confirmation that the cosmere star cluster has anything beyond it, and if it does that just raises further questions. I could easily be wrong

fair enough.  that would have to go back to Brandon.  Star clusters definitely can have thousands of stars, but he hasn't described the Cosmere that way, so he'd either have to revise his descriptions or else those stars would have to exist outside the cluster, at which point, as you say, there are further questions

[Lyra]

5 minutes ago, Dunkum said:

fair enough.  that would have to go back to Brandon.  Star clusters definitely can have thousands of stars, but he hasn't described the Cosmere that way, so he'd either have to revise his descriptions or else those stars would have to exist outside the cluster, at which point, as you say, there are further questions

Guess I'll just have to ask him myself eventually. Thanks for the help 

[Onironte]

It is a good question, which I do not think has a clear answer. Two options occur to me:

As Brandon hinted on several occasions, the Cosmere has many systems that he hasn't talked...

We cannot rule out that they are planets, moons, stars... that are not Invested, so they have no relevance to the plot. (or aut the Cosmere)

Edited June 26, 2022 by Onironte

[Arsteel]

I'm actually kinda disappointed that the cosmere isn't everything... XD

[cometaryorbit]

On 7/3/2022 at 8:25 AM, Arsteel said:

I'm actually kinda disappointed that the cosmere isn't everything... XD

I actually think there might be ambiguity in the term. People in the books sometimes use it as roughly equivalent to 'universe'. But do they know that the Shards' influence doesn't extend infinitely*?

It might be ambiguous because the in-world understanding isn't advanced enough to draw the distinction.

Or it might just be like the inherent ambiguity of 'world' in English - it usually means the Earth, but in some contexts can mean the whole physical universe (eg 'many-worlds' in quantum mechanics, or 'this world' in a religious context as opposed to the afterlife etc.)

*Or, indeed, does it extend infinitely (distance is irrelevant in the Spiritual) and its just that all the planets the Shards 'settled on' and focused upon are in this one cluster?