Hen

Tress is being told to...

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Brandon's newsletter said it wouldn't be that important, but since when do we listen to Sanderson. I've collected as many quotes as I could find that might hint at who Hoid is speaking to (there's not many).  Also this book is storming cool but more on that later.

   "The Locals worshiped the 12 moons as gods, which we can all agree is far more ridiculous then whatever it is you worship" (ch. 1) 

   "You should not find that so unusual. How many other planets have you visited? Perhaps they all sail on oceans of pollen, and your home is the freakish one." (ch. 1)

   "It was delivered by Hoid the cabin boy. (Yes that's me. what tipped you off? was it perhaps, the name?)" (ch 4.)

  ...That's really it, unfortunately. Although, I think it's also worth mentioning the Sigzil likely knows this story. Although he might not know its a true story, That would mean he knows some stuff about the cosmere without being aware of it. (also for the next couple months, that means he knows things we dont)

It's been a while since my last cosmere binge, so I'm rusty. All I can tell so far is that the listeners of the story are most certainly not on Tress's world, and they know Hoid by his real name. So that really narrows it down. When I started this post I thought there'd be more clues, but here we are. Thoughts? 

Edited by Hen
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This is pretty much confirmed by the endnotes. A story told by Hoid, with the implications of it being on a planet that has oceans of water, various earth animals and food. So it narrows it down but not enough given how much of the Cosmere we are unaware of

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Given the story is of a Girl breaking the mold to go rescue a guy, and that Brandon's hints seem to point to it being someone we know, Shallan, Sarene, Siri/Vivi seem likely candidates for major characters but I am sure there are probably smaller characters to point to as well.

Particularly that Tress sees herself as "Mundane" and has to break the social order of things to go rescue this person is probably the clues to point towards the audience.

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Since he names himself Hoid, it has to be someone who knows him by that name.  I.e. not someone from Roshar as he doesn't seem to use that name there.  Unless he's told Jasnah that name offscreen?

 

EDIT - As discussed below I think he did call himself Hoid when he was Sigzil's master.

Edited by the_archduke
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Since Renarin/Adolin's mother is Rira (and ethnically Iriali), I suspect this story is being told to Renarin in the in-world present. 

Edited by teknopathetic
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I wonder if its a story being told by Hoid to Sigzil, back when he was Sigzil’s mentor.

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8 hours ago, the_archduke said:

Since he names himself Hoid, it has to be someone who knows him by that name.  I.e. not someone from Roshar as he doesn't seem to use that name there.  Unless he's told Jasnah that name offscreen?

 

EDIT - As discussed below I think he did call himself Hoid when he was Sigzil's master.

I believe (been a minute, correct me if wrong) that he gave his name as Hoid to Kaladin as well, around the campfire, and was generally known as Hoid on Nalthis.

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From chatting on Discord, I have narrowed my opinions down to three sets of people who make the most sense to me story-wise as the listeners of this story. 

1. Realmatic discussions: Khriss (and perhaps Nazh listening on the side?)
Khriss wants to know more about the Cosmere, so listening to one of Hoid's experiences seem like a reasonable thing for her to do. I can also imagine the Ars Arcanum at the end to be a literary critique/analysis of the information within the story, which would be a fun thing to read. 

2. Marriage counseling: Siri and Susebron
Considering that the last book inspired by Emily was Warbreaker, it seems like it would be really cool for this to be a story that Hoid is telling to that married couple, perhaps to give them some encouragement as they go through a difficult spot in their marriage? 

3. Team Building: Jasnah and Design
From the information that was given, neither Jasnah and Design seem to fully fit. The listener's reactions to the Emerald Sea don't fit Design, who would have first hand knowledge of the cognitive realm, and Jasnah, whose Atheism doesn't seem to quite fit Hoid's descriptions of the gods. On the other hand, from relationship standpoint, these two make a lot of sense for Hoid to open himself up to, as he is trying to build a romantic relationship with Jasnah, and a part of growing in his Radiant powers requires him to tell truths to Design, which this could be a part of. That made me wonder, what if he's talking to BOTH of them at the same time? So some of the questions/comments he's getting would be from one or the other. 

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1 hour ago, zebobes said:

From chatting on Discord, I have narrowed my opinions down to three sets of people who make the most sense to me story-wise as the listeners of this story.

And you do not consider the likely audience somebody who has to deal with aethers for the first time and gets, willing or not, the background story?

EDIT: OK, here is the wild speculation. Hoid has to make sure his ally Harmony does not collapse on him. So he is on Scadrial during The Lost Metal. Marasi meets the military section of the Ghostbloods wielding Amberite. He tells her the story of the aethers.

Edited by Oltux72
add some really wild speculation to remind people that possibilities are endless
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Hoid could also be telling the story to some random person we've never heard of. It could be a child, from the way he talked about the ocean of spores.

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There is also honey and flax and wheat. All unknown to Rosharans. And frankly if you suggested to a Rosharan to eat an insect's predigested vomit, you'll get a reaction to is incompatible with a compliment.

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44 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

There is also honey and flax and wheat. All unknown to Rosharans. And frankly if you suggested to a Rosharan to eat an insect's predigested vomit, you'll get a reaction to is incompatible with a compliment.

Now something to keep in mind, this is Hoid telling the story to someone from another planet who probably speaks a totally different language.  While telling this story he has to adapt the references to make sense to the person he is speaking to.  It is entirely possible that honey/wheat/flax don't exist on Tress' planet.

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18 minutes ago, dbulick said:

Now something to keep in mind, this is Hoid telling the story to someone from another planet who probably speaks a totally different language.  While telling this story he has to adapt the references to make sense to the person he is speaking to.  It is entirely possible that honey/wheat/flax don't exist on Tress' planet.

True, but they must exist on the planet of his audience.

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7 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

True, but they must exist on the planet of his audience.

I am curious why they have to exist on the planet of his audience. We have seen Hoid use words and phrases that the audience does not understand (like bunny) so I may be missing something. Sure the majority of the words will be understood through Connection but it is possible some are not (and so far we are just hearing one side of it). 

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10 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

True, but they must exist on the planet of his audience.

Yup!  It is interesting that reading this story you might learn just as much about the planet of the person that is speaking to, than the planet the story is taking place on.

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1 hour ago, StormingTexan said:

I am curious why they have to exist on the planet of his audience. We have seen Hoid use words and phrases that the audience does not understand (like bunny) so I may be missing something.

The occasional slip. But Hoid is not a fool and has a lot of experience telling stories. He is not going to do honey, flax, whale, elephant seal ..., if those animals mean nothing to his listeners.

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1 hour ago, Oltux72 said:

The occasional slip. But Hoid is not a fool and has a lot of experience telling stories. He is not going to do honey, flax, whale, elephant seal ..., if those animals mean nothing to his listeners.

Plus, in this story he specifically points out things that would be weird to his listener, like the spore sea. So agreed, the fact he's consistently and repeatedly referencing Earthlike (Yolen-esque?) plants and creatures without explaining a single one makes it seem like he does indeed expect them to know, versus his occasional slipups on Roshar where he only does it once or twice and usually explains what it is when he realizes.

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Hoid describes Tess as going to the docks "like a soldier facing cannon fire"; this is a methapor to explain stuff to the listener, so the listener knows what cannons are.

this suggests scadrial as the most likely location, as the only place in the cosmere with cannons so far. I don't know, maybe taldain darkside is also possible? but they have different plants

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2 hours ago, king of nowhere said:

Hoid describes Tess as going to the docks "like a soldier facing cannon fire"; this is a methapor to explain stuff to the listener, so the listener knows what cannons are.

this suggests scadrial as the most likely location, as the only place in the cosmere with cannons so far. I don't know, maybe taldain darkside is also possible? but they have different plants

I also am thinking Scadrial. The sarcastic comment Hoid makes about gods/religion that they worship, also made me think potentially of someone who follows Survivorism, since Hoid knows Kelsier and how that one started. So Marasi or Steris perhaps?

Edited by Dreamwa1ker
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3 hours ago, king of nowhere said:

Hoid describes Tess as going to the docks "like a soldier facing cannon fire"; this is a methapor to explain stuff to the listener, so the listener knows what cannons are.

this suggests scadrial as the most likely location, as the only place in the cosmere with cannons so far. I don't know, maybe taldain darkside is also possible? but they have different plants

The thing with Scadrial is it doesn't have a moon (unless for some reason Trell adds one in TLM lmao), so Hoid would have to explain what one is to them, but doesn't. Imo that makes Nalthis most likely, since as you note Taldain (Dayside and Darkside) have very different plant and animal life, seemingly.

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32 minutes ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

The thing with Scadrial is it doesn't have a moon (unless for some reason Trell adds one in TLM lmao), so Hoid would have to explain what one is to them, but doesn't. Imo that makes Nalthis most likely, since as you note Taldain (Dayside and Darkside) have very different plant and animal life, seemingly.

true, but they do have gas giants in the system, each one with several moons, and they surely do have telescopes. so someone from scadrial with a bit of learning would at least know what a moon is.

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Another thing to note is that Hoid says: "Whatever you worship" so either he is being intentionally insulting, which I wouldn't rule out, or Hoid doesn't know what religion the audiance follows.

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To recap: So, the audience likely isn't a world hopper, and is familiar with many Earth animals and foods. They either don't really worship anything in particular, they worship something Hoid thinks is weird, or Hoid is just being Hoid. They also know what cannons, moons, and ships are. Anything I'm missing/wrong about?

Edited by Mazman
Missed something.
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On 3/3/2022 at 9:17 AM, Hen said:

"The Locals worshiped the 12 moons as gods, which we can all agree is far more ridiculous then whatever it is you worship"

The phrase “we can all agree” implies an audience of multiple people. Either God doesn’t know their religion, or there are multiple religions represented by the audience.

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2 hours ago, Truthwatcher Artifabrian said:

The phrase “we can all agree” implies an audience of multiple people. Either God doesn’t know their religion, or there are multiple religions represented by the audience.

This is Hoid, who has bonded a Spren. Meaning that after Oathbringer he hardly can speak to one listener only, unless it were Design.

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