How did Ruin and Preservation create?

[+ShardlessVessel]

I'm having trouble understanding how that interaction could have worked. Preservation can keep things from being destroyed, while Ruin can destroy things that already exist.

How do they, together, create new things?

[Frustration]

Because early on they weren't as bound by their intents as they were during the books

[Quantus]

They made a Bargain, and a big part of Ruin's side was the promise that He'd get to destroy the whole planet eventually, while Preservation secretly hoped he'd be able to swindle Ruin and avoid that eventuality.  

Brief Coppermind writup:

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Originally, the two Shards were balanced [in the Scadrian star system] -- though they could create by working together, neither would be happy with the end result.^[36]

Eventually, Preservation's desire to make sapient creatures prompted him to offer a deal to Ruin. Together, they could create Scadrial and fill it with living beings; by endowing them with sapience, Preservation would give up part of himself. In doing so, he left himself weaker than Ruin, which formed the basis of their agreement that Ruin would be allowed to destroy the world some day.^[37]

However, Preservation broke the terms of the deal by sacrificing his mind to create a prison for Ruin, preventing him from destroying the planet. Furthermore, in an attempt to balance the two Shards, he sequestered away a portion of Ruin's power by condensing it into the metal atium.^[38]

 

 

[+ShardlessVessel]

19 minutes ago, Frustration said:

Because early on they weren't as bound by their intents as they were during the books

That raises more questions for me, actually. If they weren't bound by their intents, either of them could create on their own using the power of Adonalsium.

6 minutes ago, Quantus said:

They made a Bargain, and a big part of Ruin's side was the promise that He'd get to destroy the whole planet eventually, while Preservation secretly hoped he'd be able to swindle Ruin and avoid that eventuality.

I understand that they made a bargain to work together. What I don't understand is how they performed the creation. How do forces of destroying and preserving combine to create?

[Frustration]

29 minutes ago, ShardlessVessel said:

That raises more questions for me, actually. If they weren't bound by their intents, either of them could create on their own using the power of Adonalsium.

Yes, but it would have been much harder.

[Quantus]

25 minutes ago, ShardlessVessel said:

That raises more questions for me, actually. If they weren't bound by their intents, either of them could create on their own using the power of Adonalsium.

Yup, but (apparently) a single Shard has the power to create a Planet or a Sapient race, but not both.  Although, while we have another example of a shard creating the species (Nalthis) I cant actually be sure a single shard has the power to whip up a planet. 

25 minutes ago, ShardlessVessel said:

I understand that they made a bargain to work together. What I don't understand is how they performed the creation. How do forces of destroying and preserving combine to create?

At the scale and level of a Shard's actions, the magic itself doesnt have much in the way of hard limitations.  Instead they are in a constant Battle of Will's with their Shard's Intent, and so long as the act doesnt put them in such conflict with the shards Intent that they go crazy *cough*cough* they would be able to get away with it. In this case Ruin believed he'd get to Destroy a whole planet that was 1/2 another shard's power, while Preservation secretly believed he could trick Ruin because Ruin has/had terrible Future Sight.  

At that point Investiture is just Investiture, a Spiritual third side of the triangle with Matter and Energy.  And the Shards arent using some magic system mechanism to access it, they exist primarily in the infinite Spiritual Realm where everything comes from.

And at the lower levels of 'normal' magic, the role of the Shard influences HOW the magic is obtained rather than what you can do with it.  The flavor differences of Investitures (Breaths being "sticky", Stormlight being Leaky, Hemalurgy being End Negative, etc.) are the result of the Shard's involvement in that step. The Shards more or less bypass that and just have Are the Investiture.  Also seems to apply to a person that has Ascended via absorbing the Well without actually taking up a shard, like The Lord Ruler did.  

 

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Chaos

Allomancy provides many very dramatic effects, which some have noted is not very much like Preservation. Could you walk me through how Allomancy is of Preservation, though it does dramatic, dynamic things?

Brandon Sanderson

One of the 'basics' of the magic in all of the worlds is that the energy of Shards can fuel all kinds of interactions, not just interactions based on their personality/role. I did this because otherwise, the Magics would all be extremely limited.

The 'role' of the Shard has to do with the WAY the magic is obtained, not what it can do. So, in Preservation's case, the magic is a gift--allowing a person to preserve their own strength, and rely upon the strength granted by the magic. While Hemalurgy has a huge cost, ending in net entropy.

/r/fantasy AMA 2011 (Aug. 31, 2011)

 

 

 

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Chaos

It's a little odd that Preservation would inherently give up its power to fuel Allomancy, because you'd think he would preserve himself, you know? Does that make sense?

Brandon Sanderson

Preservation, as a Shard, is about preserving life, people, and the like. Not about self. No more than Ruin is about destroying self, or Cultivation is about growing herself.

/r/fantasy AMA 2011 (Aug. 31, 2011)

 

 

[NameIess]

I think that Preservation and Ruin were still bound by their intents as much as they were during the Mistborn era 1, but their minds were not warped by the intent yet. Thus they both had the drive to create something. However, with the powers that they had, creating on their own was impossible. Preservation could preserve life once it existed, but could never create life, as that would destroy the current state of things, going directly against his intent, which is basically stasis. Ruin could create, but could not stabilize that creation. He could not Preserve it enough to actually make a world. Because both of their minds were mostly clear of their shard's influence, they still wanted to create, but had a hard time doing so. Thus their agreement. They would create Scadrial, Ruin providing the ability to change, Preservation providing the stability. However, because of their Intent, Ruin made Preservation promise that Ruin could someday Ruin the creation they made Preservation planned to Preserve the world despite their agreement.