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Found 61 results

  1. Brandon has stated in the past that a Shard's intent is filtered through the vessel, and the vessel can have an effect on how the Shard's intent is portrayed. My idea is that Honor's broad intent, without the filtering by Tanavast is that it wants to form Connections. We can see this in Surgebinding (an art which, while being of both Honor and Cultivation, seems to be mostly Honor) is initiated by forming a Nahel bond. I also remember hearing somewhere (although I don't remember where) that because Honor violated the pact the Shards made not to settle on the same world, that they mustn't have been clearly defined well enough. This seems to imply that Honor at least follows oaths and Connections by nature of its intent. If this is true, then I think it is a reasonable assumption that Odium, without the filtering by Rayse, is about severing Connections. If these both apply then I think that the method of initiation to becoming a Voidbinder requires you to severe a Connection of somekind. We also know that Voidbinding is usually related to the Unmade, so you might be able to come up with a more detailed theory including that. Note, I do not think that you necessarily have to break Radiant Ideals or severe a Nahel bond to become a Voidbinder, just that it requires some Connection to be broken.
  2. Know powers of void powers 1. Future sight (Renarin) 2. Passion control (the unmade, ulim) 3. Teleportation (ulim) 4. Connection (Venli) 5. Lighting (stormform) 6. Mindnight Essence 7. Surge binding mimicry (unmade) Any more I missed
  3. Hi! This is my first time ever posting on the Shard, I've been playing around with this theory ever since I learned about the Ashyn magic system. As a sort of preamble, I want to first just describe the overarching idea of this theory. 1) Voidbinding is a viral-based "hemalurgy" or spiritweb-stabbing magic. 2) The Shin have or had Voidbinding, practiced or no. As in, they are capable of being infected by a sort of viral disease empowered by Odium that attaches to one's spiritweb to give them power. Or at least, I believe that, originally, Voidbinding would do this. 3) Ashynians originally hoped to invade Roshar with the disease. 4) The Heralds were or are Voidbinders. We can blame the Ashynian magic system for their insanity, as well as Szeth's. Yes, okay. Now that we have my probably rather insane ideas. Let's dig in! Also a brief reminder all of this is insane speculation and a lot of it is me extrapolating information. I want to explain what I mean by Voidbinding, and how I describe the magic in this system. First, Odium sends a sort of proto-spren (a splinter of himself, potentially more like proto-Unmades) to attach themselves to a host. In order to "bond", the proto-spren begins a strong infection of the spiritweb in a way much like Hemalurgy. I believe this magic system was inspired by trunelife and the Sho Del on Yolen. A sort of extraterrestrial magic system that is capable of infecting anyone but also able to move between planets without forming a stable Connection. Essentially, it would corrupt as it spread to grant species of people incredible power, only to also infect them with Odium's powerful emotional control. Indeed, it could also explain why Ambition was first to go-- the Shattering was probably accompanied by a Dawnshard for Change to forcibly create a new power for himself. At the height of the system, Ashynians could use unrestrained Surges that were modeled after Yolen's own magic system (I also operate on the belief that Surgebinding comes from Yolen-- at least as a basic concept). I think Odium messed up a bit, and what ended up being created was a sort of Hemalurgic spike that'd destroy the spiritweb once it left the host, if it ever did. Indeed, we can later see how the influence of an Unmade on an area can disrupt one's spiritweb; I forgot the WOB, but it essentially stated that there was a relation to hearing screaming voices and Unmade influence. As a secondary theory, I also want to say that original Fused cognitive shadows are those who were initially Voidbinded. Essentially, they became infected enough that the disease attached to their spirits, making them Invested (Infected/Invested, same thing) enough to remain as Cognitive Shadows by Odium's desire. Of course, the constant cycle of rebirth has made the deeply spiritual disease continuously tear open their sanities. And then, and I know I don't have any information on this, once Odium realized that the humans were turning on him, he rescinded his powers from the cognitive shadows he had as his champions and turned them all into the Unmade we know today-- now Frankenstein's monsters of living beings. The remnants of this magical disease left on Ashyn has now evolved due to it not having access to Odium's power, now requiring the full absorption of the health of Ashynian people to survive. 1: The Shin had/have Voidbinding. Yes, I'm sorry, right off the bat I need to say that I think the people of Shinovar have Voidbinders, and that we'll finally see it in the next book. Not only is Shinovar the place most unlike the rest of Roshar, and due to it also being the one place where the Ashynians were originally supposed to be, I believe them to be inherently connected to the Voidbinding magic system. At the very least, the Shin have proven to be repeatedly war-like in the past, perhaps a bit Odious, at least to me. The fact that it is more of a throwaway line leads me to want to place even more emphasis on it. I think the fact that the Shin even attempted any sort of excursion into Roshar despite being isolationist in the present leads me to believe a large amount of influence was swaying their decision-making. Of course, it is also important, I believe, to note that the Shin also intone that there is a way to speak with stones in the same way that the Willshapers do (at least, Venli was able to do). Furthermore, Ashyn's magic had changed, and I think it is also different with the Shin-- especially since Odium seemed to have shifted his desires long after to focusing upon the Fused (which, by the fact that they kind of forcibly bond with beings, implies they, too, were kind of going through the motions of Voidbinding). Indeed, it seems odd that the Shin would have access to any sort of powers-- especially in going to reclaim the Honorblades for themselves, and having what seems to be quite a bit of cosmere awareness. So yes, they know a lot about what truly happened on Ashyn and the movement to Roshar, though the information is not completely accurate. Furthermore, without strong access to Stormlight (at least it was stated they don't use it much), I wanna assume they draw upon Voidlight to perform their magic. The Unmade influencing the Shin leaders is most likely also giving them these illness-like bonds, binding to their emotions and giving them powers. This influence probably leaves tears in the spiritweb, and Szeth's being in the higher echelon of Shin society would have inevitably given him access to the Ashynian illness. Indeed, this would leave a tear in his spiritweb, which would set him up for a Nahel bond, yada yada. 3: Ashynian offensive Okay, now that I've set up that the Shin could have this magic system's remnants floating around, I move to also explain how an invasion of Roshar could have went down. The humans crash down in Shinovar. The singers gave them the space to work with, but the Ashynians, probably influenced by the Ambition-side of their diseases, sought to spread out much further. To become Connected to Roshar, the Ashynian viruses spread out and infect singers left and right, subtly nudging them to Odium while also gaining a Connection to Roshar. I think it also may help to explain how the humans began to wane off of Odium's influence soon thereafter, probably due to the kindness of the singers, while the violence of their diseases affected the singers negatively. The two sides shifted due to the initial bonding of power. I think the reason why people think that mental disorders are requisite for a Nahel bond start here-- where the humans were afflicted with disorders upon removing themselves from the viral diseases. 4: The Heralds were Voidbinders I feel like this one goes without saying, but I want to say how it pertains to their insanity. If the Ashynian disease was a hemalurgic-sort of tear in the spiritweb, then anyone who forcibly removes themselves from it will become massively open to the influence of any Shard or Investiture like a spren. I don't think that the effects of it would kill the user, as it would mostly have torn at sanity and sense of identity. As such, it would explain why the Heralds and their agreement with Honor was formed; to fill in the holes left by them removing themselves from Ashyn's magic, Honor granted them Honorblades to mimic the powers they had on Ashyn. These blades, bonding with the spirit, allowed them to be generally safe from the influence of the Ashynian viruses as they fought against Odium. The Oathpact, being formed, hopefully was to also be used to give them sanity. However, these holes would only grow with more stress upon the spirit, and they began to become less and less sane. We can see today how most of the Heralds have ran away from their original personality traits, or have regressed. I think Nale is a special case because he was able to bond with a highspren; the opening of his spiritweb was filled up again by him also bonding himself with a spren and flying up to the Fifth Ideal to avoid the utter insanity associated with the savantism gained from being an Voidbinder. Furthermore, I think Taln was able to generally avoid giving in because he was both insanely based and badass but also because he never had the Ashynian sickness. He wasn't already broken down by the powers of the sickness, so he was generally able to avoid being torn apart as easily-- and in fact his connection to Honor was the strongest. I think he's still suffering from insanity induced by torture, but the fact that he maintained his oath is telling of a lack of Odium's effect. Sorry for making this so long. I have a lot of ways I could go with this theory, like, I'll probably post more later. But I just wanted to get this out there and discuss what I had made. Thanks
  4. theory

    First of all, I cannot take full credit for this theory, as the basic idea of “inverted Nahel Bond” comes from this post by @Seloun While re-reading Oathbringer I realized that it actually explains most, if not all, weird things and quotes about corrupted spren and Voidbinding, so I decided to write down all arguments in favor of it. The basic premise is that Voidbinding (at least the form shown in the Voidbinding chart) is an extension of Surgebinding and the Nahel Bond, caused by adding Odium's Investiture to the Radiant spren. As a result, a person gets two Surges from the bond, and the spren gets two matching Voidbindings, explaining the similarity between the two charts. This would make Voidbinding a magic system of all Rosharan Shards, with its name probably being a portmanteau of Odium/Void + Surgebinding Here are all the hints I was able to find: The Surgebinding chart shares the color theme with the map of Roshar, as beings from the Physical Realm get the powers; the Voidbinding chart using the colors of the Shadesmar map hints at spren being the ones to get powers Odium's Tone is now a pure Tone of Roshar, and Eshonai's last chapter in RoW implies that all Tones and Rhytms form a wonderful harmony. Spren getting powers and, by extension, a more equal footing with people, seems to be compatible with that way more than if Voidbinding was a separate thing purely of Odium. Also, spren now essentially share mortality with people, so getting powers would be a natural next step Voidbinding being the cousin of Old Magic makes a lot of sense now: people get Old Magic powers by being changed by the Nighwatcher, spren get powers by being changed by Sja-anat Corrupted Truthwatchers cannot control their visions, but their spren seem to have at least some level of control. Glys can record the visions to show to other people (possibly similar to how Lightweavers can capture Memories), and Tumi knows exactly what is going on during Rlain's first vision, even though Rlain is clearly surprised by the whole thing Glys having access to futuresight beyond what he shows Renarin would explain him talking in future tense and providing constant protection against Odium's futuresight Glys also wants to give his sorrow to Renarin, hinting at the reversal of typical roles in Voidbinding Tumi thanks Sja-anat for his eyes in her interlude in RoW, presumably referring to the futuresight We know about corrupted Truthwatchers and futuresight, which is most probably the Voidbinding of Illumination, but what about Progression? I believe that there might be some hints in Oathbringer about that. The quotes below were sometimes interpreted as Renarin having a gemheart: There's no way Renarin naturally has a gemheart, but what if Glys used his Voidish Progression to grow one in his body to have some place to hide? It wouldn't need to be big, as a cremling gemheart was enough for Tumi in RoW, and it would explain a lot, in my opinion
  5. Disclaimer: This theory is almost a copy paste from a post I made on Reddit, but with some extra things that i recently noticed to support it. Let me go straight to the point and develop from there. Voidbinding is from both Cultivation and Odium. So, the basis of this theory is what Fox exposes in this WoB Since there are three Shards in Roshar, there should be hybrid magic systems, like Feruchemy in Scadrial, between pairs of Shards. It has been theorized that voidbinding could be either Honor+Odium system or Honor+Odium+Cultivation system, but I don't agree. We know some things about voidbinding. It is a cousin of the Old Magic, it is related to see the future and Renarin ability, it usually, but not always, originates with the Unmade... And how does that relate with Cultivation? Well, first of all, it is related to the Old Magic. There is a connection there. It is also related to see the future and who is one of the best Shards in that field? It's not Odium, but Cultivation. And what about the Unmade? Well, Odium certainly had to cultivate them in order to create them. He did something pretty similar to what Cultivation did with Dalinar, cut some things to make them grow the way he wanted. Furthermore, if we look at the Unmade that granted Renarin the ability of seeing the future, Sja-anat, we can easily see that Enlightening is some kind of cultivation, like the one Odium did with the Unmade and Cultivation with Dalinar. You could maybe argue that Voidbinding sounds like Odium's pure magic system, but... Why does it have TEN surges instead of NINE, while when he hacked the Surgebinding system to give powers to his Fused, he created NINE types of Fused? Nine is his number, it wouldn't make sense that in a hacked system he has that number but in his own system he does not. And yes, ten is actually Honor's number, but... We cannot see any other thing that relates Honor to Voidbinding apart from that. Furthermore, I recently noticed that if you look at Surgebinding and Voidbinding charts, you will see that the glyph for the Windrunners is the only one with a different color in each chart. Here, in the Surgebinding chart, is blue. But in the Voidbinding chart... it is violet. You can see it better here. As we all know, Windrunners are the purest order of Honor, represented by the color of his Light (the Stormlight) and associated to Honorspren. Therefore, since in the Voidbinding chart the "Windrunners" have a violet color, much like the Voidlight color, we could easily afirm that there is no Honor in Voidbinding. Because the purest Honor's order "changed" its colors to match Odium's ones. And now, after RoW, we have Odium and Cultivation kind of working together. It would totally makes sense that Voidbinding was their magic system, so we would see it pretty soon, while if it was only from Odium we would have already see it and if it was from Honor and Odium, we probably would never see it or, at least, not soon. I hope you liked my theory and I look forward to read your opinions. See you in the comments ^^
  6. This may be an odd theory, but please hear me out. I think there is a third type of binding of Surges on Roshar, that I've been calling Lifebinding. It hinges around a not uncommon theory that Voidbinding uses the Surges, but expresses them differently than traditional Surgebinding. The Voidbinding chart in Way of Kings shows the glyphs for the Surges, but has half of the glyph flipped upside down. To me, this suggests that Voidbinding uses the same Surges but that something about them is different. Renarin is the closest we've seen to a Voidbinder, as far as I can tell. He's not a full Voidbinder, based on the below WoB, but seems to be half Surgebinder, half Voidbinder. Now, Argent Let's talk about Renarin, and Voidbinding. So, with that page we talked about, Renarin Voidbinds. I asked about visions, you pointed to Voidbinding chart, he Voidbinds. Is that using Stormlight to power abilities different from the Surgebindings we've seen? Brandon Sanderson Yes. Argent Is that what voidbinding is? Brandon Sanderson No, but close. You're on the right track. We are gonna get into that, I'm not gonna tell you what the chart means, and things like that. But yeah, something really weird is happening there. Footnote: The chart referenced is the back endsheet in The Way of Kings. Oathbringer Chicago signing (Nov. 21, 2017) Now, in the Ars Arcanum, Khriss notes that there should be something more esoteric than Voidbinding and that she did not think it is the Old Magic. Thinking of the other forms of magic we know about on Roshar, none of them fit as more "esoteric" than Voidbinding. Singer forms, Regals, Fused, Fabrials, Honorblades- none strike me as more esoteric. In my mind, that suggests that there is a third system that deals with the Surges, one that we've seen no hints of yet. I propose that this is Lifebinding- a different way of expressing the Surges, not matching traditional Surgebinding (Stormbinding?) or Voidbinding. Now, this is not to suggest that traditional Surgebinding is not of both Honor and Cultivation. Instead, I'm suggesting that it uses Honor's expression of the Surges, while Voidbinding is Odium's expression. That would make Lifebinding Cultivation's expression of the Surges. Lift, note, is NOT a Lifebinder. She seems to fuel traditional Surgebinding with Lifelight, in the same way Venli fuels Surgebinding with Voidlight. Surgebinding doesn't seem too picky with what Light fuels it- as long as there is a connection to get the Light, the binder can use it as fuel. (This reminds me of how a Returned can survive on Investiture other than Breaths.) Now, I admit, this is wildly speculative and relies on a theory of Voidbinding that is far from confirmed. But I think it's an intriguing possibility.
  7. I posted about this in the comments for the Surgebinding Shardcast episode, but I wanted to elaborate on it more. So, Adhesion, according to the Ars Arcanum, is the surge of pressure and vacuum. While it is more broadly the surge of connection, this is at least its physical embodiment. Now, we have Odium being described by Syl: Odium is described as a Void, a vacuum, drawing in emotion. Through pressure. It seems like this description of Odium is very reminiscent of Adhesion, supposedly Honor’s truest surge. We know all the other nine surges are a combination of two shards. Honor and Cultivation. What if Adhesion is also a combination of two shards. But not Honor and Cultivation. Honor and Odium. Additionally, this effect is reflected in Raysium. According to Navani talking about Raysium in fused weapon stealing Stormlight: Again, a pressure differential being a key factor in Odium magics. Raysium is an investiture pressure vacuum. Anyway, this could be pure coincidence, but it does open up some interesting questions, particularly about Voidbinding. Specifically because some of the abilities of Voidbinders seem linked to Connection, an ability of Adhesion.
  8. I feel like one of the Ten Fools for not seeing this before. WoK Prime has the Double Eye chart on the twelfth page, showing ten Essences and ten Forces: I treated it as an early version of the Surgebinding chart, with Forces being an early attempt at Surges. However, after looking at it again for one of my new theories, I realized something: the topology of the chart is slightly off. The two Essences at the center are not connected to any Force. I doesn't look like a Surgebinding chart, but it's the same as the Voidbinding chart, just upside-down, with time manipulation / futuresight at the top. We know that Brandon cannibalizes a lot of elements from early books into later ones. Is it possible that the whole Magical Knight Magic (I don't remember the name, sorry) from WoK Prime became Voidbinding? That the Forces are the "set of abilities" Khriss calls Voidbindings? Something like a set of fundamental forces alternative to the Surges? There is actually one clue: in WoK Prime, using the Forces hurts the users somehow, which would indicate it might be an end-negative magic system. And we have this WoB from 2016, which possibly refers to Voidbinding:
  9. After watching the last few Shardcasts, I decided to play with @Argent's idea that Voidbinding might be about accessing the power of Odium directly, not about accessing Surges. It actually led to some interesting conclusions, which I'll try to present below Voidbinding doesn't use Surges The basic premise, obviously. There are some reasonable arguments that support this idea: The Knight Radiant, the Fused and fabrials all use Surges. Surges were also what destroyed Ashyn. Despite their ubiquity, we have not a single description of Voidbinding that mentions them explicitly. We only know about the ten levels and the existence of “Voidbindings”, whatever they are. Khriss is also unsure how they fit into the whole Orders/Surges/Essences paradigm Voidbinding is a cousin of Old Magic, which isn't Surge-based Renarin's futuresight isn't necessarily a Surge. He does have access to a separate, distinct version of Illumination, while his visions match what Tanavast says about his own futuresight (also, Renarin seems to see things that are of interest to Odium, not random visions). It seems possible that Renarin is accessing the Shardic power directly, rather then filtered through Surges In this WoB, Brandon describes futuresight as “dangerous territory, and drawing upon a Shard” The futuresight is described as “the soul of Voidbinding”. It's the only Voidbinding power that is widely known. It stands to reason that it might not be available to a single Voidish “Order”, but to all Voidbinders, possibly forming the first level of the magic system Additionally, per Taravangian's word, all Unmade have some sort of access to futuresight, despite having other distinct powers and roughly matching the KR Orders. Given that, futuresight doesn't seem to be tied to any single Surge Comparison with the Metallic Arts Comparing Rosharan and Scadrian magic leads to some interesting analogies that might elucidate the nature of Voidbinding: Surgebinding corresponds to Allomancy/Feruchemy, with 10 Surges / Orders / KR Spren types fulfilling the same roles as 16 metals Fabrials correspond to ettmetal-based magitek Old Magic corresponds to lerasium, as both can be used by anyone to change their spiritweb Voidbinding, finally, has the same role as atium There are two important thing about atium that I believe are relevant here (besides the obvious fact of providing futuresight): Atium requires the power of another Shard to work. Without Allomancy, Feruchemy or some magical ability to steal via Hemalurgy, atium is useless Preservation tweaked Allomancy, so that atium could be used against Ruin I'm not sure if Voidbinding can exist as a fully standalone magic system; it might require some other power (typically Surgebinding) to work. Based on this WoB: I think that what is called Voidbinding might actually stem from Surgebinding hacked (e.g. via spren corruption) to give people non-Surge powers, to Odium's detriment. It would also explain the name “Voidbinding”, which doesn't sound like something Odium's followers would use The Voidbinding chart If that is the case, the Voidbinding chart isn't a Voidbinding chart per se; it's more like a Surebinding + Voidbinding chart. My current theory is that it might have originated on Ashyn, and its history might have been more or less like this: People were experimenting with Surges provided by Odium and his Voidspren, creating a chart that is extremely similar to the one for Rosharan Surgebinding, but with different Surges / Orders (e.g. “Voidish” Illumination would be Renarin's balls of light) Two “Orders”, Bondsmiths and Truthwatchers, turn out to be special though: both have access to the Surges with the most Spiritual aspects they kind of match Dawnshards quite well: one on them can bind people and spren, which seems very Bondsmith-like, and the Change Dawnshard is a “will of a god to remake things, to demand they be better”, which fits nicely with Renarin showing people their perfected selves Sja-Anat has a weird affinity for Truthwatchers and BAM started exhibiting Bondsmith-like powers during the False Desolation; both happen to provide Voidbinding abilities, to Signers and humans respectively I believe Bondsmiths and/or Truthwatchers might have been the ones to figure out that you can use the magic to tap Odium's power directly, likely with the help of the Dawnshards – which is why they are surrounded by a red gem on the chart and not connected to any Surges. Odium wasn't very happy about it, so he pushed them towards the planet's destruction. Voidbinding was left unused and partially forgotten, until some Unmade started experimenting with it again during the False Desolation, possibly given some knowledge by Cultivation or a Herald starting to go mad. BAM sudden unexplained powers might actually be our only hint at the higher levels of Voidbinding
  10. tl;dr version: In this post I will try to convince you that Voidbinding is a nascent magic system of both Odium(“void”) and Honor (“binding”), and present a theory on how it was created Voidbinding doesn't make sense as Odium's magic system The name: we now know from multiple sources that Adhesion, the Surge of binding things together, is the one closest to Honor. The Fused don't even recognize it as a Surge; they talk about Surges, but don't seem to use the word Surgebinding. They are called Voidbringers (I'm sorry, Singers ). Why would Odium's magic have 'binding' in its name? It's pointless: why would Odium grant anybody the power of futuresight if it interferes with his own and ultimately leads to his downfall? 10-centric: Voidbinding has ten levels. Yes, there are nine Unmade and they lack the Bondsith one, but that's just happenstance – we know from the Sibling that the tenth Unmade can be created. Why would Voidbinding be based on the number associated most closely with Honor? Why is the Voidbinding chart so similar to Surgebinding and so unlike the Fused abilities? Lore: the first mentions of mortals using Voidbinding abilities we know seem to be from around the time of the False Desolation: Listener songs mention the Nightform (and BAM as a source of Forms of Power) and we see potential information about corrupted Truthwatcher spren in Urithiru Gem Archive. Besides that we only have the general idea that futuresight is of Odium, but that could have come from the Unmade alone (per Taravangian's word, they all can grant it). There's rich lore about the Unmade, but none about Voidish Surges besides Illumination. The Fused are surprised that Voidspren can bond with humans and they don't see anything weird with the fact that there are no Nightforms around during the Final Desolation. Previously I believed that Voidbinding might have originated on Ashyn, but BAM's deep ties to Roshar seem to disprove that Unexplained phenomena: what's the source of BAM's massive Connection ability? Why did her imprisonment caused so much damage to Roshar if she was just Odium's splinter? Why did the Sibling stop hearing Honor's Rhythm? How could BAM and Sja-anat rebel against Odium's will? Why was Warlight never discovered before? Surgebinding vs fabrials Before we move further, one more thing needs to be discussed: why are there two magic systems of Honor and Cultivation? The Rhythm of War finally gave me some idea about the difference. The fabrials are like feruchemy – they are a perfect balance between the powers of two Shards, as indicated by the nature of the Sibling and the Towerlight. Surgebinding is also of both Shards, but it's biased towards Honor. It uses more of his Investiture: it's powered by Stormlight, Honorblades are Honor's splinters, the most powerful and mystical Order is based around uniting, not growth. What happened with the surplus of Cultivation's Investiture then? It's simple: it became the basis for the Old Magic, a magical “appendage” originating from a single Shard Ba-Ado-Mishram is the source of Voidbinding I believe that's what Odium wanted: a simple set of magical powerful abilities to be used by the Unmade to do his bidding. That's why the Voidbinding was called the cousin of the Old Magic. It was always meant to be used by the Unmade only, not become a full magic system. I believe, however, that at some point something extremely important happened – BAM was infused with Honor's Investiture and completely transformed. I'm not sure how or who did it; we have several plausible suspects: Ishar, Honor, Cultivation and (Dawnshard spoilers) Whoever that was, as a result of their action BAM became deeply Connected to Roshar and turned into something similar to the Sibling. She was suddenly able to produce Warlight and use it to control the Singers, just like the Sibling controls fabrials. She was able to grant Forms of Power from a completely new magic system: full, 10-centric Voidbinding, whose relation to the original Unmade abilities is just like the relation between the Old Magic and Surgebinding. Her abilities (and newfound autonomy) extended, to some extent, to other Unmade, especially Sja-anat, allowing her to corrupt True Spren. The one thing she couldn't do in the days before her imprisonment, however, was to create spren that would grant full Voidbinding – there wasn't simply enough Odium Investiture on the planet. Now, however, the situation has changed: the Everstorm circulates Roshar and clashes with the Highstorm, providing the exact conditions that she needs, once she's released (most likely in Book 5). This will lead to unleashing the full power of Voidbinding, which will become a major plot point (and a weapon against Odium) in Arc 2
  11. This is kind of a compilation of my thoughts about it. I'm sorry if it's hard to read but I couldn't get it to come together as a research paper so much as writing out outlined sections. (I made some edits for clarity.) I. The Case for Consumption Here, I talk about what I think Voidbinding actually is. Let's begin with the following WoB: My intent behind this question was to establish that the Unmade are using Voidbinding on some level. This has been a suspicion of mine ever since I came up with the model I will describe in a later section. The powers of the Unmade have not been mimicking established magic (Surgebinding or the Old Magic), so it seemed clear to me that they were doing something else entirely. As Splinters of Odium, it seemed the most likely that they were using Odium's magic to accomplish some of what they do. More on this is also in a later section, as I will be going into more detail on the powers of the Unmade there. I call this section "The Case for Consumption" simply because the term is heavily affiliated with the Unmade. Five of the nine (Yelig-nar, Dai-Gonarthis, Re-Shephir, Nergaoul, Ashertmarn) have all had the word directly used in some manner about them. Over half does not strike me as a coincidence. The Unmade are also believed to be "personifications of kinds of destruction" (The Way of Kings Ch. 45 epigraph), and consumption would be one way in which they achieve that. Note that I speak of Physical, Cognitive, and Spiritual destruction, as we have seen examples of some of those in how the Unmade afflict people. The other point I raise about consumption being the primary core of Voidbinding has to do with the nature of the Shard of Odium itself. "This was something so terrible that it consumed light itself." (Oathbringer Ch. 57) Presumably, this is Dalinar being given a glimpse of the Shard as it exists in the Spiritual Realm, but he nevertheless describes it as this all-consuming force of hatred. Voidbinding, therefore, sources from that key nature. Between the Unmade being likened to "kinds of destruction" and the Shard itself being likened to an all-consuming flame, putting two and two together shows that Voidbinding is a destructive art. Given the name, and how Odium is referred to as "the empty pit that sucks in emotion", it seems plausible to me to assert that "consuming" would be the basis behind an Odium-based magic. II. The Model / Known Levels Let's just dive right into it, shall we? Note that I am intentionally leaving out the mindless Unmade here. Level 1 -- Consumption This level draws power from an external source, depleting it, similar to how one draws power stored in a metalmind. In this level, Voidlight is the result. One synthesizes the depleted attribute into Voidlight, and this does cause damage to the afflicted, which would justify Voidbinding as a "dark and evil thing". This is the level I believe to be most commonly used by the Unmade (all nine, in fact). They Invest themselves by way of consuming a target attribute and use that power directly for one or more purposes. I also note that performing this act would make it akin to the Old Magic, which (if we assume it's what the Nightwatcher does) also causes a depletion in exchange for something else. Here, we have depletion in exchange for power. (n.b. I suspect they have a name for this that's somewhat euphemistic, similar to how corrupted spren are "Enlightened".) Unknown Level - Midnight Essence Re-Shephir is the primary source of this. I have more to say about Re-Shephir later on. Unknown Level - Surge Binding Yelig-nar performs this "service" for his hosts, at the cost of consuming their soul. I note that the aspects involved seem to be Spiritual. Unknown Level - Enlightening Here we have Sja-anat's touch. While this does not seem very consumptive, because we haven't seen the effect performed on screen, I note that it is possible to change an organism through consumption, and I refer everyone to virology for more information on the subject. A hostile takeover of the host's internal workings is one of the ways viruses propagate throughout the body, and white cells consume affected cells as part of its means of fighting off the infection. Now picture that in reverse: Sja-anat's Investiture is playing the roll of the white cell trying to "consume" the "infected" (not of Odium) aspects of Investiture of a spren. She thus replaces Investitures not of Odium with Investiture that is of Odium, resulting in a being that is comprised of multiple. It's like a transplant, in other words, except her ability suppresses the immuno response to it. III. The Powers of the Unmade It is my belief that the Unmade are doing more than merely Voidbinding, and that their massive areas of influence are not Voidbinding at all, but supported by it. Nergaoul, at the minimum, was heavily Invested with Voidlight (note the gem shining with it after his capture by Dalinar), and this was just after consuming a 10,000 strong army of soldiers while in the Physical Realm. Nergaoul was also very large in the Physical Realm, covering a good portion of Thaylen City, according to Navani's annotated map in Oathbringer, and was a "mountain of power" in the Cognitive Realm according to Shallan's observation. Additionally, we have Pattern commenting on another being below Kholinar's Oathgate that "is likely one of the Unmade. It must be very large on this side." I note the size of the Unmade for further discussion in a moment. One oddity that has struck me is that the Unmade have areas of influence that affect people in different ways. Nergaoul encourages violence, Ashertmarn encourages excess, to name two of them. I will not be going into specifics on what I think all nine do, but rather I will attempt to explain that some of them, such as Re-Shephir, are using Voidbinding and their own natures as a spren to project these influences over very large areas to achieve new effects, and even larger areas when in the Cognitive Realm. I will use Re-Shephir as my case study here, because of the following assertion: Re-Shephir uses Voidbinding to create Midnight Essence (presumably from living creatures). She then uses her store of Voidlight to project her nature as a spren to shape the Essence into a desired form. The shaping of Midnight Essence is not something I consider Voidbinding. My basis for this thinking is in how Shallan sees Re-Shephir as like a creationspren gone wrong. Re-Shephir has been directly observed to be making copies of "creatures she saw or consumed" (Oathbringer Ch. 110 epigraph), which is indeed similar to creationspren mimicking recently observed Physical Realm objects. Now suppose we were to trap a creationspren inside a gemstone and hook it up to a fabrial. While the effect may be unknown, I wonder if perhaps it might be possible to influence mutable substances (water, mud) into desired shapes by capturing creationspren that are mimicking such shapes. The point I am trying to make, is that spren project their natures when in the presence of stimuli and Investiture (the gem's Invested state). We've seen this most commonly with flamespren that make heat fabrials. Flamespren "evoke" the concept of heat to which they are attracted. Now imagine a spren that doesn't need to be both in a gemstone and subjected to stimuli to do this, but rather is a spren that has access to large quantities of Investiture and was, say, subjected to a certain Vessel of Odium making them be able to evoke this nature. In Re-Shephir's case, that's mimickry, an influence which can be applied to Midnight Essence. We know that Midnight Essence can be "extracted and used independently" (WoB), so the shaping of it is not exclusive to Re-Shephir. This is why I bring up the possibility of creationspren-based fabrials allowing for creating works of art with mutable substances. This projection of nature is how I see Nergaoul as capable of affecting people with the Thrill over a massive area of influence. He is so large in the Cognitive Realm, and so Invested, that like a fabrial emitting heat, he "emits" the Thrill on a very large area simply due to sheer size and power. Similar reasoning would apply to the other Unmade that influence the mind. Much like a fabrial evoking an effect, they are broadcasting specific states of being on a wide area, and it's for this reason that I think calling them spren is very accurate. We have seen something like this with Shallan and Re-Shephir, which in her case would be "twisted creativity". She created multiple drawings she can't recall doing, but were still in her sketchbook, and she also created multiple mimicries of herself without having the need to draw them first. This influence on Shallan's drawing is why I suspect Re-Shephir is projecting an influence whose effect is what enables her to alter the shape of Midnight Essence. So, with that established, I think we can say that all nine have similar influences, and that we can potentially name them _____spren for what kind of influence they project, and that because they are all Invested Splinters of Odium, they are actually affecting people much like a fabrial hypothetically could. So there you have it, a lot of words about my thoughts on Voidbinding and how it relates to the Unmade. I will be very interested to hear what everyone has to say about this work.
  12. Bondsmiths are special, we all know that. To quote the Stormfather: They get the most unique spren, which, apart from granting Tension and Adhesion, have some unique abilities or phenomena associated with them. Based on that, I always assumed that the Unmade would be the spren for the Voidbinding equivalent of the Bondsmith Order. What if that is not the case? I'd like to present some arguments why I believe the “privileged” Order of Voidbinding could be the Truthwatchers: Truthwatchers are opposite to Bondsmiths on the Surgebinding chart, symbolizing Odium and Honor as opposing forces Odium doesn't really care about uniting anyone. Spiritual Adhesion is a special, cherished power in Surgebinding. Amongst the Voidbringers, the Envoyform is granted by a lesser Voidspren and relatively low on the hierarchy Odium's signature moves are futuresight (Voidish Illumination) and corrupting Investiture/spren/people (spiritweb modification = Progression). These are also the most Spiritually oriented Voidish powers we know, just as Bondsmiths get the most Spiritually oriented Surges amongst the KR (WoB) Voidbinder's futuresight interferes with Odium's own and it would make sense for it to be available only to his very selected servants Odium's Champion, likely the most powerful Voidbinder possible, is described as surrounded by multiple shadows, a possible nod to (Mistborn spoilers) Futuresight, unlike other Voidish powers, is granted (directly or indirectly) by at least two Unmade: Sja-anat and Moelach. I would also add Ba-Ado-Mishram as a likely candidate for granting the Nightform somehow (we know from Pashendi Songs that the Unmade might provide them). Why? The Nightforms existed for the last time during the False Desolation and they apparently predicted the Everstorm (“A new storm will come, someday to break” line from Song of Secrets). That's seeing hundreds (thousands?) years into the future – a feat I can only ascribe to the influence of an extremely powerful Unmade Sja-anat seems to be the Unmade whose additional powers correspond to the Truthwatcher Order and she was the most feared amongst them. We've seen her corrupt two kinds of sentient spren: Truthwatcher and Oathgate spren. Of these, only the former get a new, distinctive Surge variant, which I think might be caused by their direct Connection to Sja-anat herself (she definitely has a Connection to her lesser spren “children” as she can communicate with people through them) Voidbinding is very mysterious, but (based on chart similarity with Surgebinding) I would assume that it requires a permanent bond with sapient Voidspren. We also know that Voidbinding typically originates with the Unmade and is somehow similar to the Old Magic. How could all of this fit together? Unmade being Truthwatcher spren offers a solution, I think: once you bond an Unmade permanently, your spiritweb and body gets seriously and visibly corrupted (think of Amaram and Aesudan) and you get a Spritual Progression ability to corrupt others in a similar way, allowing them to bond Voidspren permanently
  13. They bond a non-sentient voidpsren and are fueled by Voidlight (Ba-Ado-Mishram took over the supply during the False Desolation, so we know that). Red eyes are a sign of a Shard taking over another Shard's system. Why would that be the case if they were voidbinding? It cannot be explained by the Spren being somehow corrupted, as Renarin does not have red eyes. So I would draw the conclusion pointing at the missing link: They are not voidbinding. Odium can generate powers that are not Voidbinding (Yelig-Nar and the Fused). What does that leave us with? Regals are using the Old Magic and their eyes are red, because they are bound to Voidspren rather than the original Spren of the Old Magic.
  14. theory

    This theory started as a crazy idea in my head (that Voidbinding might be Odium's equivalent of fabrial magic system rather than Surgebinding), but the more I thought about it, the more sense it had, so here it goes: The nature of Odium's magic Based on what we can infer from the nature of the Unmade and the Fused, Odium's magic typically seems to be a twisted and corrupted version of something that already exists. The Fused (and most of the forms of power) were Odium's response to Surgebinders. From a recent reading of this Rhythm of War we know that the Nightwatcher is not a “natural” spren – she was specifically created by Cultivation to not be influenced by the perceptions of humans and given very specific powers (the Old Magic) – and the Unmade seem to mimic that. Although that might seem counterintuitive at first, I believe that Voidbinding and fabrials might be connected in a similar way. Fabrials originated on Ashyn We know that the magic on Ashyn wasn't always disease-based, but used Surges somehow. Given that: we have a WoB suggesting that fabrials existed on Ashyn the Dawnshards (originally from Ashyn) and Surge fabrials are both linked to Aimia, which doesn't seem like a coincidence I assume that fabrials are the original magic system of Ashyn, which was then somehow moved to Roshar. On the origin of Voidbinding We know that Voidbinding (in most cases) originates with the Unmade. They can provide it in an indirect way: Sja-anat can corrupt true Spren and Ba-Ado-Mishram could possibly have been responsible for some Voidbinding-related forms of power (e.g. the Nightform) that are noticeably absent on modern Roshar. That's not “pure” Voidbinding, however – not in the sense described by the Voidbinding chart. The Unmade are probably the Voidbinding's equivalent of Bondsmith spren, granting Voidish versions of the Surges of Tension and Adhesion. But what about the other Voidbinding “orders” (levels?) shown in the Voidbinding chart? They are not only missing (their spren imprisoned on Braize?) but completely forgotten – in popular consciousness Voidbinding is only associated with the Unmade and predicting the future. Why is that? Voidbinding has ten levels, so it cannot be originally from Braize – that leaves us with either Roshar or Ashyn. It was well understood by humans once (someone must have created the chart, assuming it's an in-universe document) but it's barely known by the ancient Singers (Turash is surprised that the Voidspren can even bond humans). That strongly implies Ashyn – which makes sense. If Voidbinding existed (alongside fabrials) long before Surgebinding and the Fused, the knowledge of both was probably partially forgotten and partially suppressed, as they both might have been part of Ashyn's downfall. Voidbinding Initiation and the Wheel of Time analogy OK, so how do you become a Voidbinder? We know that humans can be temporarily affected by the Unmade (the Thrill, death rattles etc.) and even temporarily bond some (probably lesser) Voidspren (Amaram's army). That requires a particular mental state (broadly described as giving your pain or control to Odium), but that alone doesn't constitute Voidbinding yet. We have, however, one example of an attempted bond that goes further – Aesudan's and Amaram's bond with Yelig-nar, which requires swallowing a gemstone and trying to control him. While the first part is probably not necessary for all Voidbinding spren, I believe that gemstones and trying to control the power might be, next to the right emotional state, crucial elements of Voidbinding Initiation (though predicting how a said gemstone could be used is very hard). Based on that, we can actually make an interesting analogy to the basic principles of channeling from Wheel of Time. The magic of Ashyn represent saidin. You have to capture and take control of the spren in order to use magic. An incredible amount of power can be held by individuals with the help of Dawnshards (equivalents of saidin-specific Sa'angreal) and it literally led to the destruction of the world. Roshar, on the other hand, is more about saidar. Magic systems that originated there require a submission to either Oaths or Voidspren possession. What is more, Singers, the original inhabitants of Roshar, have the natural ability to link their power (just look at the summoning of the Everstorm) and in large number might potentially act like a saidar-specific Sa'angreal (I wonder if the whole Singer race could count as a Dawnshard different from the rest...)
  15. I was looking at these two diagrams and noticed something I hadn't seen before. It was easiest to see when switching between tabs on the same browser on these pages: and The symbols for the surges (the little circles) have their left sides identical, while their right sides are vertically flipped versions. The surgebinding one they're symmetrical left and right, but the voidbinding one is based on the same symbol, but instead of being symmetrical, the right half is a 180 degree rotation. Symmetry is important on Roshar. I've never heard anyone talk about it (though I'm sure it's out there), but I think that symmetry is meant to represent the making and keeping of oaths. I think these voidbinding symbols where the second half is the first half flipped on its head might be meant to represent the breaking of oaths. Oddly though the symbols corresponding to the symbols for the Orders of Radiants (the big circles) remain symmetrical right and left, though they have very different styles to their surgebinding equivalents. Maybe because they keep different kinds of oaths? I'm also wondering who the woman on the outside is, where it has the heralds on the surgebinding one. I wonder if she might be one of the unmade. Sja-anat? Ba-Ado-Mishram? I don't know.
  16. theory

    Here is my take on Voidbinding. We know that Roshar is a very mathematical world (e.g. Julia set) and that spren are based on quantum mechanics. I assume here that, just like quantum field theory, Surgebinding and Voidbinding stem from basic principles: fundamental forces (Surges), symmetry and symmetry breaking. General overview I believe that Voidbinding is actually a fairly simple magic system based on 9 Surges and powered by Voidlight. It may, however, seem confusing because of several factors: A. Humans and Singers bond with Voidspren in a different way B. The Everstorm changed how Voidlight is obtained C. Voidbinding chart (TWoK rear endsheet) is an in–universe document and is not 100% reliable D. We actually see four different types of Voidbinders: Full Voidbinders – nine orders of the Fused, each with a full access to one Surge with two aspects: normal and corrupted Half–Voidbinders – the Regals, bonded to Voidspren, with access to one aspect of a Voidish Surge, normal or corrupted Half–Voidbinders, Half–Surgebinders – nine orders of Knight Radiants bonded to corrupted spren, with access to one Surgebinding Surge and a corrupted aspect of a Voidish Surge. Use Stormlight rather than Voidlight Humans (and probably Singers) bonded with the Unmade (effects vary depending on the Unmade) Voidish Surges Voidbinding is based on 9 Surges (Odium's number). Which Surge is missing? Progression. As described here, Voidlight does not provide the same healing abilities as Stormlight. What is more, each Voidish Surge has two aspects: normal, similar to their Surgebinding counterpart, and corrupted. For example, the Voidish Surge of Illumination comes in two variants: one akin to Lightweaving (“Smokeform for hiding and slipping between men. A form of power, like human Surges.”) and future sight (“Nightform predicting what will be, The form of shadows, mind to forsee.”), which have separate Forms of Power. Decayform seems to have access to a corrupted version of Division, able to destroy minds and break people (“Decayform destroys the souls of dreams.”), while Envoyform accesses Adhesion in a way similar to Bondsmiths (Spiritual Adhesion). I don't think we have enough information to tell exactly what kind of Surge Stormform uses (Transportation maybe, since they can summon the Everstorm from Braize). This version of Voidish Surges also works well on symbolical level: evil is sterile and can only imperfectly copy and twist what already exists (look at Re–Shephir or hemalurgy). As for the Fused, we know that they only have access to one Surge, and we only see the normal aspect of it. It would be very strange however, if Voidish Illumination Fused would be denied future sight when literally every other type of Voidbinder/Voidspren (Regals, Enlightened spren and Unmade) can have this ability. It's hard to tell if all the Unmade abilities count as Surges, but I believe they provide a tenth level of Voidbinding described by Khriss. Voidlight access I believe that every Voidspren is a conduit to Odium and has their own, restricted pool of Voidlight. Regals bonded to basic Voidspren have access to some abilities (Venli's Sipitual Adhesion in Envoyform, shooting lightning by Stormform) that seem to work without external source of Investiture. To achieve something more, however, either greater numbers (summoning the Everstorm) or external Voidlight is needed. The latter used to be provided by the Unmade (that's why it was said that Voidbinding originated with them), but with the Everstorm situation changed and now Voidlight is much more accessible. The Fused have more internal Voidlight than basic Voidspren, but much of it is probably used to maintain their life (situation similar to the Returned on Nalthis). Odium threatens Turash with removing this internal source of Investiture during the Battle of Thaylen Field. As a result of their particular status, the Fused rely on external Voidlight more than any other Voidbinders. Voidspren bond For humans, bonding with any Voidspren relies on specific mindset and environment (e.g. competition/battle for Nergaoul, death for Moelach) and is, by its very nature, temporary. If that wasn't the case, Moash/Vyre would probably bonded with a Voidspren already instead of relying on Jezrien's Honorblade. Unmade, such as Nergaoul, affect people's minds and can facilitate bonding with lesser Voidspren (another argument why Voidbinding originates with them). Because Singers have gemhearts and Forms of Power affect their emotional state, the bond is permanent. Humans can imitate this by swallowing a gemstone, like Amaram did, but it's very destructive. Corrupted spren We know Sja-anat always had the ability to corrupt lesser spren, probably by modifying their spiritweb. Given her willingness to defect from Odium and lack of malice observed in Glys, I don't think her recent ability to corrupt true spren is of Odium. Sja-anat was probably uncorrupted by Cultivation as a source of new agents to fight Odium, particularly those who (like Renarin) can interfere with his future sight. It would explain why Stormlight is used in this case rather han Voidlight. Each corrupted spren one Surgebinding Surge and a corrupted aspect of a Voidish Surge. Now, let's look at the Nahel bond table here. Truthwatchers have a corrupted version of Illumination (second Surge). Second Surge is also corrupted in the next four Knight Radiant orders. There are no corrupted Bondsmiths (you cannot corrupt a godspren), and then we go back to the beginning of the table – orders from Windrunners to Edgedancers have a corrupted first Surge. This way, nine KR orders can be mapped to nine orders of the Fused (by sharing the same corrupted Surge). Nine orders of the Fused can be then mapped (with some fuzziness) to the nine Unmade – that's why there's no Unmade corresponding to Bondsmiths, even though the left out Surge is Progression (which both Truthwatchers and Edgedances have in uncorrupted form). Also, we have 5 KR orders with a corrupted second Surge and 4 K orders with a corrupted first surge – and this kind of broken anti-symmetry would be considered unholy by Vorin standards. The Voidbinding chart (TWoK rear endsheet) seems to be an in–universe attempt to understand Voidbinding (an essentially asymmetrical magic system) in symmetrical, Vorin terms (a reason why modified glyphs are used) – that's why both Bondsmiths and corrupted version of Progression are present there, even though they shouldn't be.
  17. "Unless maybe Brandon is playing with words (we've seen those things, but we haven't seen them doing magic)." is this something that brandon said? well if so, then there is one instance that comes to mind where this is possible. During the battle of Thaylen City, the Amaram's army appears to have bonded with Voidspren. it was said also by i think one of the fused that lord, have you learnt to bond voidspren with humans? to which odium replies that it was always possible but it requires a specific mindset and environment to achieve.. i think, what those soldiers were doing were forming the equivalent of Nahel Bond with voidspren. they probably were capable of voidbinding. but we never saw it onscreen because they were very newly formed and knew not how to.. moreover, the moment dalinar trapped thrill, the environment + mindset changed and they may be kind of lost their bond to the voidspren and are left crying. i think some were even heard crying that why have you abandoned me so!!
  18. Wow! My first big theory! Feels good! I can't wait to see how Book 4 disproves all of this with a single paragraph. So, let's get into things. Some Background Most of this speculation comes from a small argument I had on our lovely Discord about magic systems and methods of access. Yknow, stuff like Bonds and Oaths and breathing in Stormlight. So, at the tail end of this discussion, I had a thought. What is Voidbinding's method of access? Well, you might say Voidlight, but I don't believe the Fused are Voidbinding (yet). But even if that's the case, I assume Voidlight would only be a key, similarly to Stormlight. Not everyone can Surgebind, you need to have a Nahel bond with a Radiant Spren, and you need to say Oaths. So that's what I'm going to call a "method of access" for this theory. With that, let's begin! The Nightwatcher, the Unmade, and providing external powers So, two big parts of my theory are these two nuggets of information. First up is the information that Voidbinding usually originates with the Unmade. The second nugget is that Voidbinding and the Old Magic are "cousins", as stated by Khriss in the Ars Arcanum: So, how does the Old Magic work? As far as we know, it's just the Nightwatcher chucking Investiture at people to facilitate a change. So, if Voidbinding and the Old Magic can be considered "cousins", perhaps the similarities lie here. The Unmade provide an external form of Investiture, either in the form the ability to use Voids/Surges/Voidsurges (terminology unclear), Voidlight, or both. But unlike the Old Magic, Voidbinding seems to be a much more rigid magic system standard of Brandon. It was used (at least in some form, since we can assume that Voidbinding has not been fully explored) frequently enough that the Vorins were able to make a (probably incorrect) chart for it. So, if it's a rigid, Sanderson-brand magic system, how's it work? What's the key? The focus? The method of access? Well... The empty pit that sucks in emotion I can't fully confirm what Voidbinding does once it's activated, whether it's Surges used in a crazy new light, to simply corrupted Surgebinding, to something entirely out of left field. But I can ask you a question: why does Surgebinding love bonds so much? I'd think it's because Honor likes bonds and oaths. It's his "thing". Gravitation even works the way it does in Surgebinding because Honor loves bonds. He likes to make them, he sticks by them, and he uses them for all his crazy magic (sealing away Odium, establishing the Oathpact, etc). So what's Odium's "thing"? What does he do? From what we've seen in Oathbringer, and that ominous quote from the Eila Stele I put before this paragraph, Odium "takes away pain". His followers (this is especially apparent in Moash) throw the blame on someone else. They relieve themselves of their pain, and as a result they feel a depressive void. When Dalinar abuses the Thrill, he becomes unable to be sated by anything but Thrill-infused carnage. There is no emotion unless he is accessing Odium's power. While this is obviously a metaphor for drug/alcohol abuse, I do think it still relates to Odium magically. So, how does this relate to Voidbinding? Well, if we go forward with the idea that the method of access for magic systems is related to the Modus Operandi of their Shard of origin, than perhaps in order to use Voidbinding, you have to drain yourself. Possibly of emotion, possibly of a variety of things that the Unmade ask of you, maybe both, but I believe that Voidbinding requires the user to drain themselves of something. Once they give up their "pain", the Unmade can step in, and provide that internal Investiture source, whatever that may be. I'm not quite sure how it works, but one possible way might be like this: Some person has Voidlight. They breathe in the Voidlight, and focus on their "pain". The Voidlight gets to work and takes the person's pain. Some Unmade steps in, and forges a quick connection with the person, filling them up with Voidy Juice. Ta-da! You've got yourself a Voidbinder! This might not be exactly how things work, and it might not even need Voidlight at all, but that remains to be seen. I will give you my sorrow There's still a chasmfiend in the room: Renarin. He's obviously related in some way to the Void, due to Brandon's chart-pointing and the fact that his Spren is "Enlightened" by Sja-Anat. Since he seems unable to produce illusions (this remains to be seen, but he does seem to have an abnormally difficult time producing them, even accidentally), many people have considered the idea that his Surge of Illumination has been coopted and replaced with the Void/Voidsurge of Illumination. But Voidbinding originates with the Unmade, right? Well, only usually, whatever that means. So, Renarin bonding a corrupted spren. That might be one of the less common methods of obtaining Voidbinding. Now, according to Brandon, Renarin is "weird' and not really fully Voidbinding. What does he mean by this? Well, there are a lot of theories, but one I think works is that Renarin isn't really doing much - Glys is facilitating everything. It's definitely possible for spren to access Surges. Syl does a bit of it, and Fabrials obviously work that way in some form. And now, this might be a stretch, but consider, Right before Renarin sees his final vision in OB, this little line shows up : "I will give you my sorrow". And then the next time we see Renarin, boom. Vision time. I might be completely reading too far into this, but if Voidbinding does require giving up "pain" or emotions, than perhaps to use Voidish Illumination, one must give up their sorrow. And since Renarin either doesn't want to or doesn't know how, Glys has been facilitating it for the time being? Can Renarin Voidbind on his own? Does he need an Unmade, or will his strange bond suffice? That remains to be seen. Ending And with that, all my weird speculation comes to a wrap! Thanks for reading, and feel free to tear into this in the replies. I think it holds some water, and even if I'm mostly wrong, this might be a piece to a larger puzzle. See you all soon!
  19. So I’m greatly interested in how the Fused power their surges . Logic would have us thinking it work Like stormlight . Yet the Fused don’t carry spheres .we know that everstorm does not recharge spheres with stormlight . So I’m going to come up with a theory and see what u guys think . The everstorm brings Voidlight with it when it comes . The Voidlight is captured in the Fused gemheart , gems woven into the Fused hair, and possibly even its skin . We have seen the Fused glow constantly with Voidlight . I think the Fused are extremely efficient with their use of Voidlight . We see the Flying Fused that lash constantly Float around to where they hardly ever walk . So when it comes to surges they are extremely efficient or it cost little to anyvoidlight . it could possibly cost more for Healing as we saw a Fused survive a shardblade tp the stomach. It wasn’t until the Gem heart was destroyed and possibly the source of its Voidlight healing did the creature die ! as the everstorm comes more often than a highstorm , they usually have enough to last until the next everstorm . If u ask me the Fused have more efficient powers . KR have to have constant stormlight and it runs out way too fast. And the high storm does not come around enough . What do u guys think
  20. Do we have any idea whether voidspren can be materialized as "voidblades"? I cannot see a reason why not, but if it would be possible, why don't Odium's forces use the possibility?
  21. On Roshar, the people believe seeing the future is evil. The few instances we've seen of foresight are associated with Odium. At a recent signing, Brandon said this: I find the bolded part where he trails off to be amazingly fascinating. Given the rest of the conversation, I propose that seeing the future is dangerous because of the following possibilities: 1. It draws the attention of the Shard (or its agents as explained below) that is powering the foresight. 2. It is heavily influenced by the intent or motives of the Shard that's powering it. 3. It's an ability granted by the Shard on purpose in order to manipulate events toward a future that the Shard (or its agents) desires. 4. It aligns you to the intent or motives of the Shard. This can be short-term (see atium below) or long-term. Repeated uses may cause a more lasting efect. 5. There's also the always-present conundrum of trying to change the future after you've seen it. Without context, you have no idea if changing your actions will cause that future or if not changing your actions will cause that future. The true answer could be any of the above, none of the above, or some combination of the options I've given. In order to evaluate possibilities, I've discussed the instances we've seen of people seeing the future, either as a summary, or as specific text, or links. Atium: We know how atium fuels Allomancy. It lets you see a few moments into the future. It also increases your mental and physical capabilities in order to take advantage of that knowledge. Sazed speculates in one of the HoA epigraphs that This appears to correlate to possibility 4--That seeing the future via atium temporarily aligned a person toward Ruin, the essence of entropy toward destruction. It might also explain why, after using atium as a metal mind and burning it for so long, TLR had such Ruinous impulses--mass slaughters, willingness to let the nobility destroy each other, etc, etc. After a thousand years of compounding atium, it's likely that he was very Connected to Ruin. It might also tie into possibility 3, assuming the possibility of Ruin wanting Rashek to become such a despot that he's overthrown just as the Well is about to fill, opening the way for Vin to take and release the power. Endowment: Endowment appears to be able to see some of the future, and sometimes her Splinters, the Returned, can pick up on this as well. We see this in Warbreaker, when Lightsong has his dreams and visions of T'Telir burning. She appears to send her Returned back in order to do a specific task (or set of tasks) based on what she sees, giving rise to possibility 3. Endowment apparently wanted the Hallandren and Idrians to persist, and sent back some of her Returned to help prevent the coming destruction. She probably has multiple contingency plans for if one of them dies before his or her task is accomplished. Wyrn: In the Elantris Annotations Brandon says: And Given that the Seons are Splinters of Devotion, (Love) and the Skaze are Splinters of Dominion, it seems like the Skaze are manipulating Wyrn in order to achieve their goals (Goals hinted at in the new epilogue in the 10th Anniversary Edition of Elantris) , tying back to possibility 3. Devotion and Dominion are both splintered, but the Skaze may retain enough of Dominion's intent to want to have complete dominion over the world (or maybe re-assemble Dominion?). And we come to the Stormlight Archive! We have more examples of foresight in SA than we have in any other book. There are three primary examples of it: Moelach: On the bridge between life and death, Moelach grants visions of the future, that the person utters in a cryptic and strange way, a phenomenon coined as Death Rattle. We don't really understand much about how this works, but the Death Rattles have been startlingly accurate, if incredibly obscure, so far. However. Moelach is a Splinter of Odium (along with the other Unmade). The Death Rattles we've seen so far all seem to be related either to the conflict between Odium and most of Roshar, or related to the people that are in that struggle. I have no absolute proof of this, but it's not a wild assumption (imo) to think that Odium, via Moelach, is using the Death Rattles to affect people's behavior. I realize this is putting conclusion before evidence, but I feel that it's a credible conclusion. Moelach is one of the mindless Unmade, as far as we know, so he's unlikely to have motives of his own. As a Splinter of Odium, Odium must have created him for a reason. We know Odium has a pretty good grasp of possible futures. Creating an Unmade to give people glimpses of the future (in a rather morbid way) to get them serving his purposes isn't beyond the realm of possibility. Renarin: We know very little about how Renarin's abilities work, and what types of things he can see, or how they will affect events. We know that his spren, Glys, is a Truthwatcher spren corrupted by Sja-Anat, another Splinter of Odium, and that Glys is likely what grants Renarin the ability to see the future. Renarin has seen Jasnah killing him. This would end him as a Radiant and as a Kholin. I confess, I am unsure what purpose his death would serve in Odium's cause. However, Renarin also saw Dalinar turning into Odium's champion. This would obviously be quite a desirable outcome for Odium. Given that Renarin has done a few things in order to try and warn about or prevent the things he sees, did he, consciously, or subconsciously, take actions that helped to bring that set of events into reality? We don't know yet what effects this might have, so I'm unsure which of the above categories this could fit into. The Diagram: Taravangian believes that he wrong the Diagram out of pure human capability and insight, rather than foresight. However, according to this WoB: As we know, in the Spiritual Realm, all times and places are essentially one. Seeing into the future in all other instances has been seeing into the Spiritual Realm. If Taravangian was closer to the Spiritual Realm than the Cognitive Realm, then he's likely incorporating at least some parts of what he sees in the Spiritual Realm into the Diagram. What we've seen him do so far has seemed to align him toward Odium's desires and motives. However, he was granted this ability by Cultivation, who is at odds with Odium. There was a lively discussion in this thread about the Diagram being a plant (pun intended) put in place by Cultivation. That T's actions, although they seem at odds with Dalinar+co, actually are meant to help them; and that T himself is unaware of this. As you can tell, I subscribe to this theory myself. This would fit in with possibilities 2, 3 and 4 above. Cultivation seems very crafty and careful, playing the long game with Dalinar, with Lift, and probably with T. And finally, we have Hoid. He has an ability to know where he needs to be at any given time. We don't really know most of his motives, so there's no way to determine what "where he needs to be" means, exactly. We're also very unsure as to how he knows to be in those places. We do know he uses something similar to Chromium Feruchemy in order to tap Fortune, but possibly isn't Feruchemy itself. We don't know what Shard he draws on, what intent that Shard might have, or if it's even a Shard at all. If someone can manage to tap directly into the Spiritual Realm without intervention from a Shard, it seems like Hoid would be the one. I'm also sure he's self-aware enough to know when/if he's being manipulated by whatever power he's using. So in short, I have no conclusions to draw about Hoid's abilities, other than a reiteration of his own speech to Shallan: There's always the risk, in seeing the future, of bringing about the exact consequence you want to prevent. That might be the simple answer to this entire question. Won't my face be red if it is! So, there is my long winded theory about the dangers of seeing the future. Please feel free to add to it or rip it to pieces, and thanks for reading!
  22. We know that humans from the Rosharan system came to Roshar from Ashyn. When they did so, they brought odium with them. They also brought surgebinding, as mentioned in the Aila Stele. But radiants and surgebinders as we saw them are a result of bonding spren of honour and cultivation, where the fused utilise voidbinding by bonding with spren of odium. So basically, would it not make sense that surgebinders on Ashyn were more like the fused in that they use voidlight and voidbinding as granted them by odium? This would then discount concerns about radiants destroying roshar because it's surgebinding granted by powers not prone to deatruction as odium is. I welcome any input.
  23. Could the Unmade be something like Honor's Heralds, but of Odium? And if they could be, wouldn't it be interesting if they were the "Patrons" of the Voidbinding "Orders"? If Ba-Ado-Mishram could grant Voidlight, maybe she was the "Patron" of the Voidbinding equivalent of the Bondsmiths. I would love to hear your opinions on this!
  24. Hey team, I apologise in advance if this post isn't particularly well laid out - I have little time at the moment and a thought just struck me so I wanted to get it down before I forget about it, and I don't know if this has been discussed before or already theorized (I had a quick look and couldn't find a mention of it). I agree with @Calderis that there are three specific magic systems that operate in three different ways. I also agree that the fused have not been Voidbinding currently. Essentially the theory is that how magic on Roshar works is that: A) Surgebinding is the system of magic through which the fundamental forces of nature are manipulated through the filter of Honor and Cultivation Fabrials is the system of magic through which these forces of nature can be trapped, stored and then used (this one I am less confident about and would be interested C) Voidbinding is the system of magic through which the fundamental forces of nature are manipulated through the filter of odium. This, especially the Voidbinding postulation, I base on the WOB below. Linked to this, if we consider that Voidbinding is the accessing of the fundamental laws of creation and forces (as per the quote) through Odium, then because humans were originally of odium, and we know that they destroyed their previous home, I believe that humans used Voidbinding to destroy Ashyn. This fundamentally would suggest that humans were the original Voidbinders. This would also tie in nicely to them being the Voidbringers. So to conclude quickly: Voidbinding is the accessing of the forces of creation through the filter of odium and humans were the original voidbinders who used voidbinding to destroy Ashyn.
  25. theory

    *EDITED* See bottom of OP for Potential Problems with this theory. These have more or less been resolved by the WoB about Rosharan Shard colors, added below. Grab some popcorn, this is a long one, but well worth the read. The primary thesis of this theory is that 3 primary modes of distribution of Investiture existed on Roshar prior to the shattering of Adonalsium, and that Voidlight as it is used to power the voidbinding of the Fused is a hacked magic system and is not Odium's actual manifestation of Investiture. An extension of this thesis is that the 3 pre-shattering modes of distribution of investiture (previously splinters of Adonalsium) translate to the post-shattering 3 primary god spren that the Bondsmiths are able to bond. 2 of these splinters have been absorbed into the intents of Cultivation and Honor, while the 3rd god spren is separate and is possibly still a composite of different shardic investiture, but is not of Odium. All WoBs are going to be in spoiler tags so you can read them if you want to or not. We know from a couple WoB's that after Adonalsium was shattered, all pre-existing investiture was assigned to a shard but also there wasn't a 1 to 1 correspondence, rather the investiture was proportionally assigned to different shards based on the nature of the pre-existing investiture and the intent of the shard. Also what has been previoulsy referred to as Voidlight I will be calling violet light, because I think voidlight implies a causal link that is not there. You can see by this WoB that Brandon is somewhat cagey about linking this violet light to Voidbinding: I believe these were the 3 means of distributing Investiture that existed before Adonalsium was shattered: The highstorm (distributes storm light, post-shattering was invested by Honor) The ecological system for maintaining life on a rocky soil-less system and general distribution of life based magic across Roshar (distributes crem, minerals, etc to plants, helps life-based spren become sentient and creates magic purelake fish. I believe the vehicle for distribution of this investiture is the high storm as well and is invested by Cultivation. Further I think this god spren is the gigantic spindly legged glowing form seen walking in the highstorm) The force that allows gemhearts to be created, and allows gemhearted life to bond with spren by creating an invested focal point for the other two forms of investiture (this is the shardicly unaligned force, and the conversion of stored investiture to energy (i.e. the burning away of the gemheart), presents as violet light, while the natural coalescing of this investiture results in the creation of the gemheart itself). FOUNDATIONAL FACTS (Rosharan Ecology and Investiture Pre-shattering) We know from this WoB that the Highstorms are a pre-shattering phenomena on Roshar: And further we know that the Parshendi were created pre-shattering from this WoB: And that they bonded spren pre-shattering as well from this WoB: We also know, post shattering, that the Parshendi can only change forms during a Highstorm (prior to the Everstorm), this implies that Stormlight investiture is necessary for the transformation and further that Stormlight investiture was distributed by the Highstorm pre-shattering. From these data points we know the following: Highstorms and the means of distributing stormlight existed pre-shattering Investiture was used to faciliate life on Roshar pre-shattering Gemhearts and mechanisms to affect life (physical transformation) existed pre-shattering. SUPPORTING DETAILS The three moons are highly symbolic, and we know that Adonalsium created the Rosharan system before the arrival of Honor, Cultivation and Odium, so it seems somewhat safe to assume that the Rosharan moons existed pre-shattering as well. Salas the violet moon which rises first in the night time sky (possibly representing the force of investiture that allows the growth of the gemheart vessel that can house the renewable form of investiture, i.e. stormlight) Nomon the blue moon which rises second and is, according to the Natan origin myth story, the most powerful of the moons (makes sense because it is possibly the most active vehicle for distribution of investiture in the form of Stormlight) Mishim the green moon that according to the same myth is the cleverest of the moons. The color associated with Honor and the direct investiture of the Highstorm is blue (Honorspren are blue, stormlight breathed out or leaking out of skin manifests as blue light as well). The color associated with Cultivation is Green (the color of lifespren, the color of the Nightwatcher) The color associated with Odium is yellow-white (the color of voidspren, the color of the metal of the Dagger Moash uses to kill Jezrien) I think, meaningfully, the color violet does appear but not with any specific association to any of the 3 shards. It's the color of greatshell blood and also is the color of the carapace of Chasmfiends. Also, I think that the one real clue that we've gotten about voidbinding, namely the Voidbinding chart in the endpapers of TWoK shows two different colors of connection between each order of Voidbinder and the surges that they access, yellow and violet, and I think this explains a lot. Here's the chart: Note the yellow lines in the chart connect the orders of Voidbinders together, but don't connect to the surges themselves, those are all violet connections. Also note how the two god's eyes orders of Voidbinders don't have any direct violet connections, they instead show violet energy radiating out from the gem that they are contained in. I think that this is the strongest proof that Voidbinding uses a separate investiture to access the surges, and that further, as we see voidbinding working with the Fused, they are converting the gemhearts of their Singer host's from stored material investiture into energy to access a particular surge. The energy comes from the conversion of the gemheart, the focus comes from the voidbinding. Also, interesting to note, the two god's eye surges suggest that their could be two Orders of Voidbinders that are able to convert and distribute violet light investiture to other Voidbinders. We know from a WoB that Renarin uses Stormlight to fuel voidbinding (specifically seeing into the future), so voidbinding isn't only fueled by violet light investiture: I think that if Renarin's eyes glowed red when he was seeing the future that it would have been mentioned in the scene where Jasnah almost kills him. The fact that his eyes don't glow red, shows that this use of Voidbinding is not a hacked implementaton (unlike for the Fused whose eyes glow red, or the storm form Parshendi who's eyes also glow red). This implies that the conversion of the stored (violet godspren) based investiture in the gemhearts of Singers is a hacked system and therefore the violet light based investiture IS NOT of Odium. If this is true, this would also explain why the Fused use violet light investiture so cavalierly, if they can convert the gemheart of their host into violet light investiture, they could use this perpetually until the gemheart was consumed. This would kill their current host, but they would just fuse a different host when the next Everstorm passes. I don't think that the Everstorm functions as distribution system for violet light investiture, I think rather it is a conduit from the Cognitive realm on Braize to Roshar to allow the Singers to bond either Voidspren or the Cognitive Shadows of ancient Singers. SPECULATIVE THEORIES BASED ON THE ABOVE: I speculated in the [OB] Third Bondsmith and Urithiru thread that Ba-Ado-Mishram might be the third godspren, and might be the Sibling that the Stormfather talks about in OB: The formulation is a little looser than this post, but I think the theory is actually quite sound. Especially looking at the Voidbinding chart, where one of the god's eyes order might be instrumental in controlling BAM to distribute non-destructive violet light to the armies of Odium. The other god's eye order of Voidbinder is likely Odium's Champion (with such a strong connection to Odium, it would be highly probable that this particular Voidbinder could channel and direct Odium's actual investiture and possibly convert gemhearts in the followers of Odium to violet investiture. It might have been one of the responsibilites of the 3rd bondsmith, keeping BAM from going over to the side of Odium and being bonded by a Voidbinder. Melishi might have made the determination after BAM was Unmade that it was safer to seal the Sibling away in a perfect gem prison than to try and fix BAM so that BAM could again be used to power Urithiru. I think we haven't really seen what Odium's investiture is capable of. I think we have seen it being used inefficiently to hack a separate magic system (that predates the shattering of Adonalsium) and that we really won't know what true voidbinding is until the Army that emerges from the Origin with light in pockets (mentioned in the Puuli interlude) arrives. @Wit Beyond Measure, @Varion, @MonsterMetroid put some really good work in building up evidence that Thuderclasts are formed by mindless fused bonding gemhearts embedded in stone in the [OB] Secrets to Parshendi Forms, Thunderclasts, & Urithiru thread. If the theory that violet light investiture is created by conversion of gemhearts to energy, then I think that this is one more point in favor of the Thunderclast theory. I also think that the gemstone that Eshonai got from Gavilar contained the unmade Sja-anat. We know from revelations at the end of WoR that Venli and her fellow scholar form listeners had all tried out stormform before Eshonai did, and the red color of the spren implies corrupted investiture. My guess is that Venli got the sphere from Eshonai and released Sja-anat, and Sja-anat created voidspren by corrupting windspren that allowed the Parshendi to assume stormform. There were a lot of Listeners that assumed storm form, and we know that windspren are plentiful, and before I was always wondering how they found so many of these stormform spren around the shattered plains and why they hadn't bonded them before. But thinking along the lines of this theory it's obvious, the corrupted windspren allowed the listeners to create the Everstorm, which acts like a functional bridge between Braize and Roshar. The reason no listener used violet light investiture before the Fused arrived is because it consumes the gemheart of the host. A cognitive shadow joined to a host wouldn't die as their gemhearts were slowly consumed, but a non-fused Parshendi probably wouldn't last long converting their heart into investiture. Another point in favor of this theory is that Renarin bonded a corrupted truthwatcher spren at the shattered plains, which wouldn't have been possible if Sja-anat wasn't also at the shattered plains. **************************************************************************** POTENTIAL PROBLEMS WITH THIS THEORY **************************************************************************** Thanks to @Darvys, @RShara, @Wit Beyond Measure and especially @StrikerEZ I know that some of the foundational principles of this theory have proven to be just plain wrong. This is the place that I will use to highlight all of the erroneous assumptions, and highlight compelling counter arguments to the main premises of the theory. As @StrikerEZ and @Darvys pointed out, reading too much into the significance of color is problematic, and it leads to oversimplifications that confuse the issue. The theory really hinges on the fact that the color associated with the shards is a compelling causal link, but Stormlight is NOT blue, it is in fact white. We haven't really seen enough of Cultivation to associate anything with her Investiture (other than an ability to manipulate the spirit web/minds of people who specifically sought her out) and Voidspren are not just yellow-gold, Ulim who helps Venli find Eshonai's corpse in the Part 1 interlude is a Red spren. *EDIT* Most of the apparent problems with this theory had to do with the colors not corresponding correctly, but the assumptions of color matching the 3 different types of Investiture on Roshar holds, after this WoB (spoilered below with emphasis added) that explicitly states that Odium is associated with Red/Gold, Honor is Associated with Blue/White and Cultivation is associated with Green. The obvious color missing is the Violet, like the violet moon Selas and the black-violet antiglow of Voidlight. Also there's a WoB that implies pretty strongly that no Spren is completely derivative of a single shard, but is more a proportional mixture of different Shardic investiture, so inferences based on the coloration of spren are most likely more complicated than stated in the OP, and don't prove a causal connection: *EDIT* This really has no bearing on the matter upon further reflection. As @StrikerEZ pointed out, Voidlight looks to be the proper term to use to refer to violet investiture. There is a reference in the Gem Archive that states that Ba-Ado-Mishram was able to provide Voidlight to Odium's followers: *EDIT* This is not really a salient issue, Voidlight is the proper term. Gemhearts are most likely not consumed in order to provide voidlight, but there is a WoB that they are physically manifest Investiture: *EDIT* This still remains to be seen, the examples of Yelig-nar consuming his host and the Fused Taking over the body of their host provide countervailing arguements that this might indeed be true, that Gemhearts can be consumed to produce Voidlight in the absence of an alternate source of Voidlight. It's more likely that gemhearts are created from Investiture "leaking" from all the Invested shards on Roshar (given the fact that gems of all different types exist on Roshar and that they are keyed to different fabrials and correspond to the 10 essences in relation to soulcasting). This doesn't preclude the fact that there could be another loose source of Investiture on the Rosharan system, but it makes it less likely that gemhearts are solely composed a single type of Investiture. *EDIT* I No longer agree with this statement. I think they are a particular expression of the 3rd flavor of Investiture on Roshar, I will link to my BAM theory when I've posted it. I still think the Voidbinding chart is information rich and worth scrutinizing. It still feels like there is something hiding in plain sight, something revelatory and amazing. If anyone has anything else to add to this Mia Culpa disclaimer, please let me know. Wild speculation is fun, but good information is better.