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Found 382 results

  1. So... We have had Raboniel and Navani name the new combined light warlight, and that naming convention is unlikely to change. They could however, have an incomplete understanding of it's intent at this time, only revealed at the climax of either SL 5 or 10, with the formation of a new unified shard, who discovers the intent. I believe that Justice, or perhaps, Judgement Is a more fitting name for a combination of honor and odium. It is stated that Odium is dangerous because it is Adonalsium's divine rage, separated from the rules that gave it purpose, and meaning. I think that this is foreshadowing for the end of Stormlight. Honor is clearly about what is right, and odium is about destruction. Together, they might perhaps be the hard hand of justice. The rage of odium, channeled only at the unjust. This could play out interestingly, with perhaps altered skybreakers becoming the most attuned order to this new shard.
  2. Another theory here, so I was wondering if it would be possible for there to be a anti-version of investiture, shards, and Adonalsium. We see anti-light in RoW and its effect on normal light and invested beings, being capable of killing Heralds, Fused, and Radiant spren. This aligns with anti-matter in real life where, if it comes into contact with its opposite (like oxygen and anti-oxygen) it explodes in a massive explosion. This symmetry might suggest that there could be an ultimate foe in the form of some sort of anti-adonalsium which could be a reason that they need to bring the shards back together and reform adonalsium. What are your thoughts on this?
  3. So, I don't know if this has been thought of before, but I have had a theory for some time that we will eventually see more orders of the Knight Radiants-or at least sub-orders. Let me explain-we know that surgebinding is a result of Honor and Cultivation and that worlds with a invested shard have a magic system based at least partly off of the shard. Odium has now started investing himself more and more into Roshar and we've seen the effects in the Fused and voidbinding. Renarin, has bonded a spren corrupted by Odium and has manifested new variations (hence the sub-orders) on the original truthwatcher abilities. He is still a truthwatcher in that he accesses the same surges, he just manifests them in new and different ways. What are your guys's thoughts on this? Do you think that we could see sub-orders of the original Radiant orders?
  4. How will the Cosmere story end? Will there still be shards? Here is a list of possibilities for discussion. Adonalsium is re-formed with a new vessel. Adonalsium is re-formed without a vessel. The shards continue. The shards continue, but without vessels. The shards are splintered. All investiture, including shards, is destroyed, possibly by Nightblood. Any other possibilities? What do you think will happen?
  5. Hi all! Thought I would run this one by you, What if the Ten Fools (three of which we have names for) are real, and what if they are creations of Whimsy? Although we really know nothing at all about the Shard Whimsy, I feel that this is right up their alley- Honor creates his ten Heralds, and Whimsy sees their opportunity to parody these solemn and epically heroic individuals. Whimsy creates their own ten highly invested cognitive shadows, each of whom bears a comedic flaw in contrast to the mighty attributes of the Heralds. I am in love with the idea of these ten immortal, super invested, interstellar jesters. Spreading Whimsy, but not being all that helpful to the grand scheme of things. My ambition is to someday put this theory to Brandon to get his views on whether this has any merit. In the meantime, I really wanted to share it with you all! Thanks gang, stay silly
  6. Am re-reading Oathbringer and can't help but want a Total war game based off the Kholin conquest of Alethkar. They'd need to add new mechanics for the regeneration of shardplate, and for equipment and customization for more than just the army's general so you could have multiple shards in a single army (and ideally make the unit pathing less stupid but let's be honest that's just how Total War works). Extreme High Storm attrition would make places other than cities important to hold, and of course, capturing enemy shards and enhancing your own shardbearers would be a central mechanic. The Thrill would prevent armies from breaking when they fight near it and it would move to battles with high casualties, berserking units that are winning. Potential problems: The Blackthorn in full shards at max rank and accompanied by the Thrill could singlehandedly destroy the standard 2000 men most total war games allow armies to max out at. solution? smaller maps, but larger max army sizes with a 'reserve' mechanic that allows troops to be held back off the map until sent in. It would also be the first total war game to have a reasonable explanation for why your armies don't need supply lines because of soulcasters
  7. Shards who are bound, such as Odium, only seem to be able to directly interact with those who they are Connected to. So, hypothetically, let’s say that Taravangian got ahold of an Unsealed Feruchemical Duraluminmind and used it to create a strong Connection between himself and Jasnah Kholin. Would he, after ascension, be able to use that Connection to directly meet and interact with Jasnah as he could Dalinar?
  8. I am posting this here as my theorizing mainly comes from Brandon's Q&A about Secret project #1: _________________________________ Kellyn The chat is very much reading into your use of "whimsy." Brandon Sanderson I know. They should, instead, read into something earlier I said in the stream. Secret Project #1 Reveal and Livestream (March 8, 2022) _________________________ So I re-watched the stream, and something popped out at me, as the word "pragmatc" was used multiple times. In addition, the way this world is structured has a very pragmatic feel to it. Each of the 12 moons is positioned over a different area of the planet (each with a different "proto-aether"), the moons being directly over what is likely the 12 habitable areas on the world. The rules, at least in this realm, seem focused on keeping things working (ie very pragmatic) rather than keeping people "happy". So I'm thinking a shard named Pragmatism is or once had influence over this system, is associated with the number 12, and is responsible for the aethers being slightly different on this world vs. the aether homeworld. Pragmatism also fits in very well with what we know of the survival shard . It is also in line with those who have guessed "wisdom" as a shard, of which Pragmatism is close. To survive can be a pragmatic choice, but recall Brandon also said recently that the Survival has come to recognize that surviving may no longer be the best option. _________________________ Paleo In May, in Germany, you told me that... or I asked whether Wisdom was a Shard, and you said it was or something like it, and that wisdom was close to an intent of a Shard, and you also told me that it has realized that survival isn't necessarily the most important thing for it. I wanted to ask whether it has realized that over time or was it from the get go? Brandon Sanderson Over time. Paleo Okay, so then naturally, my next question: Is it the survival Shard? Brandon Sanderson RAFO. Paleo And then somebody actually came up with another good probable name. Is Prudence close? Brandon Sanderson Prudence sounds an awful lot like a Shard name. That's some excellent theorizing there. Prague Signing (Oct. 26, 2019) __________________________ What do you guys think? Could Pragmatism be our final shard? Unless, of course, some group has gone out and created a new one (see: Secret History)
  9. I've been re-reading the Stormlight books and have been thinking about specific events along with the current conflict raging during the Last Desolation as well as the overarching conflicts across the Cosmere. It seems likely to me, though not definitive, that Odium is more or less a permanent problem. Certainly Rayse was (so far) unique in being both able and willing to destroy other Shards whether or not he required help to do so. That motivation may have been unique to Rayse, but his time holding Odium could also have driven that course of action even if Rayse was already amenable. Either way, even with the change in Vessel to Taravangian Odium is still very dangerous and potentially hostile to the other Shards. Harmony strongly implies this in the epigraphs to chapters 37, 39, and 40 of RoW: If we take these sentiments to be true (which may not be wise, as Harmony is new to the deity scene, though his holding two Shards may give him unique insight) then it's not unreasonable to conclude that the goal outlined in the epigraph of chapter 34 of RoW is driven by Odium itself and not so much the Vessel bearing it: So whatever changes might exist when Taravangian destroyed Rayse and became the new Vessel of Odium it seems like the threat to the Cosmere is unchanged, and therefore so are Hoid's efforts and the situation for the other Shards. Odium is deific, and so far we don't know of any other Shards which are capable of Splintering (or otherwise destroying) a Shard. At some point Odium became trapped on Roshar, and while that was a good-enough solution for several millennia it clearly isn't permanent. Permanence in resolving this danger seems important for otherwise (mostly) immortal beings like the other Shards. For these reasons the current plan of Dalinar and company is doomed to fail. Their victory in the contest of champions, if it even takes place, will only push Odium's efforts into the future to some unknowable extent. And the wording of the agreement is unclear as to what, precisely, will happen if Odium's champion loses. Therefore any conclusion to Odium as an antagonist, whether in Stormlight alone or in all of the Cosmere works, cannot be: 1. the contest of champions, 2. changing Odium's Vessel, 3. destroying Odium, or 4. persuading Odium to behave differently. So that leaves the question "what is to be done about it?" And here is my answer: the only way to deal with Odium is to combine it with another Shard, thereby modifying how it operates. Such a combination has seriously hampered Harmony's ability to act on his own, for example. The discovery of the titular Rhythm of War implies that the combination of Honor and Odium might work and be worthwhile; Odium and Cultivation would presumably also work and be locally available to the Rosharans, but seems (to me) more dangerous than Honor/Odium and would require two possibly unwilling Vessels be dealt with. I presume that Vessels don't typically want to combine their own Shard with others for the same reason Odium doesn't want to, that it would change the raw expression of the original, fundamentally distinct Shard. My specific prediction is that Dalinar will use his powers to reconstitute Honor's Shard somehow, foreshadowed by his ability to open Honor's Perpendicularity and Odium's response: If Honor can be reassembled, then it could (perhaps) be imposed upon Taravangian or Taravangian himself destroyed and Odium taken up by anyone that also takes up Honor. Maybe Dalinar, maybe Kaladin, or maybe someone we don't know about yet. The specific person that does it would be less important than the idea that instead of unbridled hatred running around we would have honorable hatred (whatever that might be). It's not necessarily an end to any threat from Odium at all but is the only way I can think of that might deal with the Shard in any meaningful way. I don't know if this will happen in Stormlight 5, in Stormlight 6-10, in a different Cosmere work, or at all (obviosuly, lol!). My money's on sooner rather than later, as I imagine the ultimate villain(s) of the Cosmere will be Autonomy, Thaidakar, Hoid, or some combination of them rather than Odium, the major confluence of Cosmere events will involve a lot of things happening on Roshar, and the ultimate conclusion will be a re-forging of Adonalsium anyways. But that's an entirely different kettle of wild speculation.
  10. Do we know what happened to Honor's shard? If he was killed should the shard be left behind? If I recall though it has been some time since I read The Final Empire, were Ruin and Preservation's shard left behind which allowed Saz to take hold of them? Sorry if this question has been asked, it just popped in my head.
  11. In order to pick up a Shard once its previous owner has either been killed or has released it, you need be congruent enough with the power for it to let you pick it up. So, if a Rioter Misting or a Mistborn were to enhance your emotions while the Shard of Odium was without a vessel, would that be enough to trick it into letting you pick it up?
  12. Are there humans in Ashyn during the Stormlight Archive timeline?
  13. Okay so I’ve been really digging into the whole creation of Nightblood. Could a splinter of Ambition be involved someone how? Thus amplifying it’s “destroy evil” intent? I also believe the theories that this was apart of Ruins involvement as well.
  14. Ruin + Preservation is called Harmony. Honor + Odium, it seems to be implied, would be called War. What do you think other shard combinations might be called, if they ever come into existence? You can do combinations of two shards, or combinations of more than two. Here are a few ideas: Mercy + Devotion = Love Devotion + Honor = Faithfulness Autonomy + Mercy = Magnanimity Invention + Odium = Torment Honor + Preservation = Civilization Ambition + Autonomy = Ego
  15. I'm not super good at making and explaining my theories, but here goes... I think that in the latter half of the series, Dalinar will become the Shard Unity (Honor, Odium and Cultivation combined) (or War (Honor and Cultivation), if Unity isn't possible). Dalinar has big ideals about unifying everything. I think that during the latter half of the series, the Stormfather will somehow become Honor, Dalinar will continue to be Bonded to the Stormfather, but in a different way--he's the Vessel of Honor. He's going to kill Taravangian and beat Odium, but I don't think that it will end there. Instead of attempting to Shatter Odium, he will try to take over the power, becoming the Shard of War. After that, he's going to continue to try to unify Roshar by taking over Cultivation's powers, becoming Unity. He won't stop there, and attempt to Unify the whole Cosmere (with Cephandrius' help, of course). Eventually, he will become the new Adonalsium unless the rest of the Cosmere has anything to say about it. I know I'm not providing evidence, but it just makes sense in my head and it's kind of hard to explain it. If anyone wants to improve and shoot down this theory, feel free (basically, feedback is very wanted, be it good or bad). If anyone can find more evidence, please tell me so that I can put that in. If anyone wants to just rewrite it but better, that's awesome. Thanks!
  16. I have been thinking a lot recently about the Shards and noticed that it is not just Ruin and Preservation that have to do with change over time, but Cultivation is also in that category. That made me suspect that there is a fourth Change over Time Shard and Invention seems most likely to fill that role. That made me wonder if all the Shards were set in four groups of four like the basic allomantic metals. If we start with the Time Shards as a template, here is the table I came up with. Time/Change Relationship/ Connection Power/ Determination Emotion/ Identity Growth Cultivation Devotion Ambition Valor Stability Preservation Honor Dominion Whimsey Decay Ruin Autonomy Mercy Odium Transformation Invention Endowment I am most confident of the left column and reducing confidence as it moves right. I have no confidence in the rows of the Emotion/Identity Shards, but they seem to belong in their column together. The Emotion/Identity column is possibly mislabeled, but I can't think of something better. Mercy, Endowment, and Autonomy could very credibly be in different places on the table. The entire Transformation Row is dubious to me as only Invention fits well as the Time Transformation Shard. I would love the 17th Shards help in organizing the Shards. If we can find the true order here, then we will know that the two missing Shards fit in the gaps. Knowing that a Shard is missing in the Power Transformation slot may help us identify it. One final thing I like about the table is that it breaks Adonalsium into his Power, Identity, Connection, and Change over Time. These feel like a way that a God might shatter. Thank you for your help. Chip
  17. What do you think will be the main conflict of the final Cosmere novel. Maybe it will be Harmony vs. War (with War being Honor+Odium like Harmony is Ruin+Preservation). Maybe it will be 8 shards vs the other 8 shards. Maybe it will be something else. What do you think?
  18. There's been a few "sorting the shards into quadrants" "sorting the shards into quadrants and trying to find matching Dawnshards" and similar posts recently, and while I absolutely love reading those, this post is here for less linear thoughts about Adonalsium and the missing shards, but missing shards nonetheless. Let's stop with the preambling and get to what I want to get to: ODIUM and what it means for ADONALSIUM. Let's start by looking at one of the (imho) coolest quote of all the cosmere: Emphasis mine. Source: https://coppermind.net/wiki/Words_of_Radiance/Epigraphs#Chapter_71. Refresher: this is from one of the letters in reply to Hoid, so probably from either a shard or another old, cosmere-aware figure like Frost. So, for the sake of argument, let's assume what they write can be treated as fact. This quote has stuck with me, among others because it makes Odium such an interesting foe and such a cool idea: The hatred of a God, without all the rest of God. I want to talk about this quote some more. Let's reiterate three things: 1. Adonalisum was shattered into 16 pieces. As far as we know, there's no Debris or anything like that left. They're 16 pieces of a whole. Those could have been split up differently, but weren't. It's not a little god with 1/16th of all of Adonalsiums properties, but with ALL of 1 of 16 properties (or 2, in Harmonys case). 2. Rayse Odium calls himself Passion and sais that that's what they are. Passion. Emotion. He even tells Dalinar that he's the only one of the gods that understands human emotion, that knows it. 3. Despite this, everyone else more or less agrees that Odium is first and foremost Hatred. The way he is described in text and in universe is as seething, hating, hot and burning and hateful. Now, what am I trying to say: What does this mean for Adonalsium? Well, one of multiple things. That depends on what the last two shards are. We know almost nothing about Adonalsium, yet, sadly. But here's my thoughts, which I hope to make understandable: I really hope atleast one of the last two shards is an emotion. Something like "Love" is a common guess, but even just something like "Care" or "Charity" (which the ancient greeks would argue was one of multiple forms of love anyway). Seriously. Because if there isn't another Emotion-Shard, then Rayse/Passion is right. In that it isn't just Hate, but all emotions/passions. Or rather, all the emotions/passions Adonalsium was capable of. It's why I refer to it as Passion in the title of this post. Let's look at the quote about it again: Virtues. Not "other emotions." Now, we can argue that Virtues are an emotional thing, but I think the semantics are clear. The letter doesn't say "without the other emotions." or, the very clear thing many religions irl share: "His Love" There's a few conclusion to be drawn from this, and I will list those in a second, but I want to first look at the shards again to underline this. Virtues: Honor, Autonomy, Ambition, Mercy, Valor, (Wisdom, Prudence) Divine Properties: Endowment, Dominion, Devotion, maybe Cultivation? Forces of Creation/Nature: Preservation, Ruin, maybe Cultivation? Uh, no idea: Whimsy, Invention. To be clear: This isn't supposed to be a sorting or anything like that. I don't think this is how the shards are grouped or even if they are grouped. The point of this list is to drive home the point that none of these are emotions. There sure are some Virtues, especially Honor and Mercy and Wisdom stand out as ones that sound like they would give Odium much needed context. But, again, none of these are emotions. (Is bravery an emotion? I wouldn't say so. Semantics, maybe) This leads me to a few possible conclusions: 1: One of the two so far unknown shards is also about emotions. Especially "Love" or one of its derivatives would of course fit a God the way we on earth imagine it well, and would make a good counter to Odium. I know there aren't clear pairs, but another shard of emotion would mean Adonalsium had atleast two different distinct emotions or emotional states. Because otherwise... 2a: (Odium is the only Emotion Shard and Rayse is lying about Odium = Passion) Adonalsium was a deeply hateful being. If it was shattered into 16 Aspects of its being, and only one of them is emotion, and that is pure Odium, Adonalsium must have been hateful in the same fulfilling, allencompassing way that Odium is. If Odium is "Just Adonalsiums Hatred without The Rest" and none of "The Rest" are emotions, then Adonalsium felt basically the same way that Odium does. Hate with a hint of Anger for a rare change. Even the better version of this isn't much better: 2b: (Odium is the only Emotion Shard and Rayse is right about Odium = Passion) Adonalsium was a deeply hateful being anyway. If Odium is the only emotion shard, and is not "God's own Divine Hatred" but rather "God's own Divine complex emotions", then well, Adonalsiums complex emotions must still have been hugely dominated by Hate. 3: Odium is all emotion that Adonalsium could feel and just got the way it is after the Shattering. Maybe "God's Divine Passions/Emotions" is up to interpretation the way Ruin could be slow decay or active Catastrophes, and it got interpreted into Odium. Then again, it sounds like Odium went on his killing spree pretty quickly after the Shattering, so it's not like he started out loving and jolly and became bitter and hateful with lots of time. (4: Adonalisum wasn't a being in the same way that we humans are, its/their emotional state is not really understandable with human understanding of emotion. We don't even know if Adonalsium had a person/vessel/personality/anything, for all we know it could have been a machine or mechanism or a force of nature more than an entity. Does a poisonous plant feel hate when it kills you for eating it? Does a storm, or a robot that was tasked to protect something when it hurts those that try to interfere with its task? Maybe Adonalsium didn't feel much, so much of what it was was Creation, and to argue about Adonalsiums Emotional landscape is futile? The only things we can assume to know are that It experienced bravery, it showed mercy, it cultivated, preserved, and destroyed things, it dominated and was devoted, it invented, it was whimsical, it wanted to survive, it was ambitious, it was autonomous, it endowed things, and: It felt Hate/it hated.) I personally hope for the former for the sake of our heroes and everyone in the cosmere, but let's continue the thoughts based on 2a and 2b for now, because there's some thought that might make these ones more likely. Whether or not Rayse was right is kind of irrelevant. Whether or not Adonalsium felt only Odium or Passion, if that 16th of Adonalsium that was/is Passion was the way back then it is now, well, Adonalsiums emotional landscape was a bad one. Even with the "context", as in "the virtues that gave it context", it doesn't paint the nices picture of the Cosmere's old God. If it's Wisdom keeping Adonalsiums Hate in check then that sounds like they came to the conclusions it's not smart to destroy everything. If it's Honor, then Adonalsiums is sparing lives because of some Oaths or feeling of duty. Cool, I guess. Not kindness, though. Mercy is the biggest candidate for a counterweight, but that to me has bully-vibes still. "I want to kill you tbh but I'm sparing you because I'm so mercyfull" isn't exactly kind either, is it? If that's what Adonalsium was right, then no wonder that a group of people came to conclusion it had to be destroyed. (And if Rayse was an evil leaning person before the Shattering, then no wonder he wanted that Shard in particular. Sounds like one of the few they'd be sure to exist afterwards.) Long, long post. If you read this far, thanks for sticking with it. I'm intrigued if other people thing my argument is conclusive at all, an what your thoughts about this are. Will we get another Emotion Shard? Will we not, and Adonalsium was very hateful? Is it futile to imagine Adonalsiums Emotions the way neurotypical Human Emotions work? Or another possible answer?
  19. Welcome one and all, as I invoke the most potent of muses: half-baked rambling! Part one: Ground work It's probably for the best if I lay down some basic premises that I'm working from for clarity. Premise one: all arcana found on Roshar are, at their root, emanations of the Surges. Surgebinding, Voidbinding, fabrials, the "even more esoteric" system that Khriss theorises in the Roshar essay, the powers of the Unmade, the forms of the singers and whatever else there might be. The possible exception is the Old Magic, which Brandon himself has called its own weird thing. Premise two: Odium is fully capable of granting access to all ten Surges, the lack of Adhesion Fused is deliberate on Rayse's part. It makes more sense to me that he'd just copy/access the existing framework of Surgebinding, rather than building his own, separate 9/10 of Surgebinding. Premise three: there are Physical, Cognitive and Spiritual manifestations of every Surge, as well as "Radiant" and "Voidish" expressions of the same. Part two: What was Rayse afraid of? What do mean by that? Under my interpretation, Rayse deliberately withheld Adhesion from the Fused, which seems odd. Why would he want his servants to only have access to nine of the Surges? Are Bondsmiths not proof that Adhesion can be an incredible boon to your forces? Even if they don't have access to the level of power of a Radiant Bondsmith, they should still have access to the same Adhesion abilities, just weaker. Having a couple of Fused who could act as walking batteries for the extremely Light-hungy Nex-im, for instance, feels like a great force multiplier. We can also infer that Odium can grant access to Adhesion, as a limited expression of it is the simplest explanation for the abilities of envoyform, making the lack of Adhesion Fused even more glaring. You might at this point be wondering why I claim that Rayse was afraid of something, only to blather about why it's weird that there are no Adhesion Fused instead. Worry not, I'll get to that. So, what do we know of Rayse's goals? Rayse wants to be the top dog in the cosmere and he wants to remain Odium. Rayse wants to be free to go on his murder rampage, so he does not want to Invest Odium anywhere, so as to not anchor him to a system. We can even track a possible modus operandi, as the Unmade are implied to have been something else in the past and several Voidspren show the telltale red of corrupted Investiture, which suggests to me that Rayse would typically twist existing things to serve him, rather than creating those things himself. We can also see this in his actions as tempter on Ashyn and his goal to make Rosharan humanity his army, after the cycle of Desolations has toughened them up enough. We also know that prior to the False Desolation and related events Roshar had two Pure Tones, after it had three. This implies to me that something that happened there Invested Odium on Roshar. Something we can guess didn't happen at Rayse's volition. Now, you might ask "why would being Invested be a problem to Rayse? Surely he'd not be morally conflicted at reclaiming any part of his that got Invested somewhere?" And no, I don't think he'd have a moral problem with taking back his power, but I don't think he can, or at least it's hard for him. As other people have already noted, for instance the thread speculating that Division is Odium's Truest Surge, Odium generally stands for something divisive, just as Honor can be seen as uniting. And yes, both can switch places, but hatred generally pushes you away from people and following some form of framework generally makes you part of a group. As just one example, we can see these thematic elements of Odium and Honor in the Surgebinders: Knights Radiant are a union of spren and humans (traditionally), working together to do things neither can do alone. Fused are solitary, forgoing even the normal relationship between spren and singer, as well as casting out the soul of the singer whose body they inhabit. And Odium's forces have other thematic divisions or separations as well: Most of the Fused have lost track of their original goal, being unlikely to relinquish rule to the common singers if they actually won. They are no longer fighting for their stated goal and are thematically separated from themselves. The former parshmen have been denied both the opportunity to make their own future and the ties they gained to the various national cultures of Roshar, they are separated both from their own self-determination and cultural roots. Moash/Vyre is very straightforward, he's separated from his emotions. The Unmade are separated from whatever they were before they were Unmade. And, while he's not known to be on Odium's side, Renarin's bond to an Enlightened spren sets him apart from normal Radiants. So, Odium is a (generally) separating force, so what? Well, that, along with the idiosyncracies noted by robardin, I believe, last week, points to that Odium might have a hard time reclaiming his Investiture. -Oathbringer, chapter 118 -Rhythm of War, chapter 112 -Rhythm of War, chapter 111 For all Rayse's threatening he apparently can't make good on the threat to force the Fused to stay away or to punish a traitor? It seems to be a lot of bluster. So what would Rayse be afraid of? Becoming Invested somewhere, hindering his murder-athon and, by extention, someone else being able to manipulate Odium's Investiture freely. Thus my conclusion is that Rayse wouldn't risk having Bondsmith-alike Fused, on the off chance that they'd so something Bondsmith-y, resulting in some of his power going where he doesn't want it. This might also be why the Everstorm doesn't infuse gems, though I do believe that Voidlight naturally cycles back to Odium, even if it can't be actively reclaimed. Also that Rayse seems like a blithering idiot for not following the Returned design philosophy, but then again, it's entirely possible he couldn't tweak that to run only on Voidlight, rather than Investiture over all. A side-note at the end of this is also that I think it could be possible that the Fused getting a passive and an active effect from their Light might be a conscious design descision on Rayse's part, as an attempt to make less of Odium's Investiture circulate. Part three: Unmade, Surges and cousinspren So, what's the deal? Well, there's this WoB: Which has of course had people trying to find which one maps to which Order, though note that Brandon says it's not a perfect match. I have personally thought that the Unmade should fill the Bondsmith spot, being parallel to the Stormfather and Nightwatcher. I'm fully prepared to accept that this might be the case, that bonding an Unmade produces a Bondsmith, even though the power of the spren itself isn't in the same slot. However, I recently encountered something that shifted my perspective and made me think that this might not be the case. Now, as I stated in part one, I believe that whatever the Unmade powers are, they fully fit within the context of the Surges. I also favour the cousinspren method of parallels, as each cousinspren seems able to manifest the primary Surge of the associated Radiant Order, e.g. windspren known to stick things together, a manifestation of Adhesion. (I do think that properly what I call the primary Surge would be denoted secondary Surge, as otherwise the Radiant Order that lacks a corresponding Fused Brand is Windrunners, not Bondsmiths. But I'm gonna use primary, since that's the order they're listed in.) Now, we need to be conscious of that there are three Unmade we don't really know anything about; Ba-Ado-Mishram, as all her Connection and Bondsmith-seeming shenanigans don't seem to have been a thing before the False Desolation, going by the Gem archive, that being her only known abilities makes it hard to line her up with anything, as it's apparently not her base powerset, Dai-Gonarthis, who is an almost complete unknown and Chemoarish who is much the same. That in mind, let's make a list! Windrunner/Surge of Adhesion Unmade: Yelig-nar I personally believe that Yelig-nar's ability to grant all Surges possibly comes from an application of Adhesion, similar to the Bondsmith ability to manipulate the Surges of other Radiants. He also fits thematically, being known as Blightwind. Skybreaker/Surge of Gravitation Unmade: BAM/Dai-Gonarthis/Chemoarish We have not seen the influence of any Unmade that I would assume uses a form of Gravitation, leaving only the three unknowns. Dustbringer/Surge of Division Unmade: Nergaoul Nergaoul's power could well be a Cognitive manifestation of Division, it both breaks down resolve and discipline and causes people to fight like individuals, not soldiers. Thematically the total loss of control of the Thrill is absolutely counter to the Dustbringer theme of self-mastery. Edgedancer/Surge of Abrasion Unmade: BAM/Dai-Gonarthis/Chemoarish Not much to say here, again I don't think an Unmade we've properly seen the influence of lines up. Thematically Chemoarish might fit, being known as Dustmother, but that is tenuous. Truthwatcher/Surge of Progression Unmade: Moelach Moelach's power to grant access to glimpses of the future might be a manifestation od the Surge of Progression, a Cognitive/Spiritual application of Growth, granting further access to the Spiritual at the Realmatic transition of death. Thematically Moelach grants access to looking at what can or will be, instead of the present truth of what is. Lightweaver/Surge of Illumination Unmade: Re-Shephir Shallan directly compares her to a creationspren, confirmed to be the cousinspren of Cryptics. Thematically she makes tangible darkness where Lightweavers make ephemeral light. Elsecaller/Surge of Transformation Unmade: Sja-anat Sja-anat changes spren, the most straightforward cause of which would be Transformation. Thematically she's also semi-present in both the Physical and Cognitive Realms, in addition, she's called Taker of Secrets, contrasting the scholarly characterisation of the Elsecallers, she aquires the knowledge of others rather than making new knowledge. Willshaper/Surge of Transportation Unmade: BAM/Dai-Gonarthis/Chemoarish The last Surge which no Unmade seems to have exhibited thus far, making it hard to guess. Stoneward/Surge of Cohesion Unmade: Ashertmarn Ashertmarn could be placed in a few different spots, and I myself have previously gone with Abrasion, but after some consideration I think that the power of the Heart of the Revel is possibly a Cognitive manifestation of the Surge of Cohesion, making people soft and pliable. Thematically the hedonism of Ashertmarn can also be seen as an inversion of the Stoneward theme of being where they need to be. Well, that took absolutely forever to type, if you made it here, thanks for reading. I hope it's all (fairly) clear and possible to follow, though I know I tend to ramble. Discussion both welcome and encouraged. ¤_¤
  20. I have a theory: Two people will become the vessels of Odium, Cultivation and Honor, with Honor divided between the two of them. For instance, Dalinar might ascend to Odium and half of Honor, becoming an Odium-heavy shard of War. Someone else would ascend to Cultivation and the other half of Honor. Maybe Lirin would be Honor-vation, as he’s got Edgedancer vibes but is honorable to a fault. Each would be an active shard, unlike Harmony, especially War. War might be even more motivated to take over the cosmere than Rayse was, because of the Intent of the new shard. Cultiv-honor (can anyone come up with a real name?) would have the potential to be a very “good” Shard, depending on who the vessel is and how the two shards combine. I am only raising this as a possibility. I wouldn’t bet on it happening.
  21. I just thought of a easy explanation of why Shards get tied to loactions. Let me know what you guys think! Premise: Investiture is "self" Shards are everything in the Cosmere. All energy, matter, etc... is them. Any direct creation or investment done by them is just effectively making them a body. And just like a human mind/soul is tied to its physical body. A Shards self is tied to its "body"(whatever they've created/invested) in the physical That means,as an example, that Scadrial was/is the literal body of Ruin and Preservation. And whenever they were in the Physical/cogntive realm doing work(as Shards reside mostly in the Spiritual) they were tied to their body just like a human is. To leave they would have to destroy their body(which was exactly RuinAti's plan before he died)
  22. So we know that stormlight echoes the tone of Honour and when taken through a vacuum it can be infused with the opposite tone. Would the light be capable of being infused with the tone of another shard? Would Odiums tone make it into voidlight? Cultivation into lifelight? If so, would using Preservation's tone make it into mist? Is this how you can change investiture without corrupting it?
  23. So, we know that the relationship between a Shard and its Vessel is a contest of willpower against the Shard that, over time, is very hard to resist (Brando's exact words). Which means that how long it takes for a Vessel's Intent to be overpowered, and to what extent it is, depends on at least three things: how much time has passed, how much willpower the Vessel has as a person, and how much he is willing to fight back. (since you can have high mental endurance but choose to not exercise it) My question is whether there is also a fourth factor, innate to the particular Shard we are talking about, everything else being equal. So, for example, let's say we have two people, one the Vessel of Invention, the other the Vessel of Whimsy. They have both held the power for the same amount of time, they are both equally strong-willed, and they both equally want to resist their respective Shard's intent. Would those two Vessels be equally "overpowered", or is there something concretely relevant about which Shards we choose for this question that directly changes the answer? I don't feel strongly either way, tbh. What are your thoughts?
  24. All people have a Cognitive Aspect which is formed of Investiture (as technically everything is). Upon death this Aspect begins to dissipate, just as the body begins to decay. An infusion of Investiture to the body will heal it and an infusion of Investiture to the Cognitive Aspect will maintain it. Living people are effected by other people’s perceptions. The effect is simply minimized for unknown reasons. In contrast, the Cognitive Aspects of objects and non-sapient creatures do not have whatever safe guard minimizes this effect on living sapients and are strongly effected by perceptions. Shadows seem to fall into an in between area. They’re less effected by perception than non-sapients, but they’re more effected than living sapients. Whatever safeguards living sapients appears to be damaged, though a strong enough infusion of Investiture or exposure to the Spiritual Realm may help. What’s even more interesting is that there’s some indication that the whole problem is tied to memory and the limits of human capacity for it. It’s possible memory is the safeguard. There are some indications that an ordinary living sapient who lives too long will begin to have the same issue as a Shadow. And others that indicate natural immortals may avoid the issue. It’s also worth noting that Vessels seem to have a similar problem and some take advantage by trying to shape perceptions of themselves in particular manners. (Note that most Vessels are alive.) To me this indicates that the problem is less of perception and more a matter of Spiritual Connection. If the body is the physical function, and the Cognitive is the consciousness, it seems like the Spiritual is the totality of our lives experiences: the web of memories and connections we form throughout our lives that define who we are. It seems to me that as the Cognitive Aspect reaches its natural threshold for recall, it begins to lose its ability to access portions of that web, almost like a magical version of Alzheimer’s disease. It’s as though the Connection between Consciousness and Experience begins to fray, leading to the weakening of the Self. I’m going to call this the recall threshold: the point past where a Cognitive Aspect can access the sum totality of its Spirit Web. If something happens to expand the Cognitive Aspect’s ability to ‘recall’ or if something stimulates this, the Cognitive Aspect will ‘remember’ itself. In the absence of a whole link to the Spiritweb, I think perception takes its place. That’s a type of Connection too, but it’s one formed by the collective experiences and memories of other people. If you don’t know who you are, then you have to take it from other people. Imagine someone with amnesia, being told ‘You are X. You work as a Y. This is your family.’ etc. and determining who you are based on that. Except on a much broader and unconscious scale. In this hypothesis, as the ties from the Cognitive Aspect to the Spiritweb fray, the collective Consciousness, the perceptions and Connections of and with other people, act to shore up the fraying supports. Over time, as the ties between Realms continue to weaken, this collective consciousness becomes a pseudo-Spiritweb shaping the way the Cognitive Aspect defines itself while still allowing that self to maintain some definition. This has little to do with whether it’s the original person, or soul, or not. It’s not a problem of perception - indeed, perception would actually be acting as a symptom reducer - but a problem of Connection between Realms. The problem that Shadows face would simply be a result of those ties being damaged by having died. Just as a person loses their Connection to the Physical, they also lose their Connection to the Spiritual upon death. When a Shadow has their Cognitive Aspect stabilized, it stops the severing process and may even reverse some of the damage. But it seems reasonable that these Connections between Realms are no longer whole. The Connection to the Physical, for example, needs to be intentionally restored. If the tie to the Spiritual remains damaged, then it would be more vulnerable to breakdown than that of a living sapient. So while both living and Shadow will experience the recall threshold problem, a Shadow will experience the effects much sooner. This effect would apply to all Shadows over time. In fact, it would apply to all non-natural immortals. Even natural immortals could, in theory, eventually hit their (presumably much higher) recall threshold and experience the effects of the loss of Spiritual Connection. In conclusion, whether or not a Shadow is the original person’s consciousness/soul is immaterial and remains a philosophical problem (as per WoB). The problem is one of Realmatic Connection that would ultimately effect all sapients, with the closest Physical Realm equivalent being something like Alzheimer’s or other disorders of memory. The fact that increasing the recall threshold or decreasing the distance between Realms can heal this damage would be indicative of this problem not being tied to original personhood of a Shadow, but to a greater Realmatic effect to which Shadows are simply more susceptible due to their weakened ties to the Realms.