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Found 80 results

  1. Hi all, apologies if this was asked, but I never explored the Warbreaker sections of the forum as this is my least favorite novel. I have some questions about giving away the Breaths. 1) Would a person born on Nalthis be able to give his Breaths to non-Nalthian if they were on Nalthis? (e.g. If Kaladin moved to Nalthis, could he receive Breaths?) 2) Similar case - Kal moves to Nalthis, can he give his Breath to a Nalthian? 3) Can a Nalthian give away his Breaths off-world to a non-Nalthian? E.g. Zahel to Kal on Roshar? 4) Can a non-Nalthian give his Breaths to a Nalthian on Roshar? After proper training, with Intent etc. E.g. Kal to Zahel on Roshar 5) Can two Nalthians exchange Breaths off-world? Like on Roshar? I think the answers would be 1)Yes 2)No 3)Yes 4)No 5)Yes but I am just guessing based on the fact that Awakening and Breaths are not planet-related like Elantrian magic but they are inborn, sDNA related abilities. This is only my speculations though. Obviously Hoid is Awakening and he is not from Nalthis, but he is an extraordinary individual so maybe not a best example.
  2. From what I understand, perfect pitch allows the user to hit any note they wish with flawless accuracy, as long as they have the breaths for it (second heightening I think is 200? Could be wrong) My question, how does perfect pitch know what notes the user needs to hit? Like if there were 2 songs basically identical other than one note, how would the ability know which note to let them hit? I propose it is a sort of connection between the cognative intension and the song itself. I believe it's confirmed music spren exist so I don't think this is too far fetched Lemme know what you all think!
  3. Based on WOBs, we know people not from Nalthis are not Drabs, but if someone not from Nalthis gets one breath and then gives it away, does this still hold true? Is the breath less intertwined with their soul than a Nalthian and this they have about a Nalthian level of soul, or just slightly less, even without a breath, or would having gotten a breath open them up to becoming a drab? I suspect the answer to that is know but I wanted to check to see if everyone agreed.
  4. Intro I have returned for yet another attempt to theorize and understand one of the many magics of the Cosmere. This time I am tackling breath, one of my favorite magic systems, though I do love them all. As many of you undoubtedly know, everybody's favorite wanderer has shown us a less than well known use for breath. While there was prior evidence of breath being tied to memory from two scenes in Warbreaker (the little girl, and the offer to Denth) this aspect has yet to be explored or explained much. I apologize in advance if their is a WOB that already talks about this, I keep forgetting to read them all. Some Background In very typical fashion for me, I felt compelled to try and understand this more. So I turned to the wonderful coppermind and Warbreaker itself. In it I found a most peculiar note, "If enough Breaths are collected, they can start to affect the personality of the person holding them. "Breaths do bring some things along with them,", but they are not "terribly individual" depending on their original owner. For example, Vahr's resolve was strengthened because of the similar mindsets of those he collected his Breaths from, but the effect only manifested due to the large amount of Breaths he had." The Theory one: How Breath Connects To The Bearer Now given textual evidence and assuming this is accurate I propose. Breath actually has an impact on a person in all 3 realms to a greater extent than the average magic system (which to me makes sense for Endowment). Though one could argue it is simply because one can acquire more of it more easily than most other Cosmere magic systems. The physical is easily seen, as many of the heightenings provide benefits that are at least tangentially physical (and arguably cognitive). As for the cognitive aspect, I think that like a cognitive shadow, breaths imprint slightly upon a person's spirit web and or their cognitive aspect. Hence how they can influence a person's personality if they collect a lot of it. However, due to the relatively small amount of investiture per breath this effect is greatly diminished. Likely only picking up a modicum of a person's thoughts and feelings that is only noticeable if those you get the breath from have a similar mindset. Finally, there is the spiritual aspect to consider. While there is really only one concrete example I think Susebron gives us some idea what this entails. Although he is no sliver, the sheer quantity of investiture bound to him would in my eyes on some level expand his soul in a similar if lesser manner. Given we do not know as much about the greater levels of heightening I sadly cannot back this up with much evidence. Though I do believe the way in which the more breath you have makes you better at awakening when you first begin might tie into a spiritual connection with endowment and awakening as a magic system. Yet, I could see an argument for this being a cognitive not spiritual effect. Theory two: How This Connects To Memory Now assuming I am at least on the right track. Then the question is, how does this allow you to store memories in them? I would propose given the ties to multiple aspects of a person (particularly cognitive and spiritual) there is a way to exploit this to impact memory. When Vasher tells the little girl to speak a certain command, Vivenna notices her breath flickers. To me this implies a portion of the breath and the cognitive tie to that memory have been severed from the girl. As for Hoid using it as a memory storage, once again. Given the impact memory can have on your cognitive aspect, and how are memories shape our identity. It does not feel like a great leap in logic to assume that one could use those breaths to store those memories. As the breaths in question are tied to a person in just about every way. Though whether using them to awaken or storing the breaths in something like clothes would degrade or destroy the memories I do not know. Granted I imagine it requires a great knowledge of investiture to do this, but many things are possible with the right application of knowledge. Afterword Just wanted to say thanks for reading everyone. Happy to discuss further if you feel so inclined. Sorry if my thought process is hard to follow or I seem to be making too great a leap in logic. Also hope people like the new format I am using for my theories. Feel like it helps make them more digestible and easy to follow.
  5. Exactly how much investiture is in a breath? It's considered net neutral, so it has to contain quite a bit for it not to degrade over time.
  6. investiture

    huge fan of the cosmere and hopefully will have some cool discussions on here
  7. Okay, so I was having a thinky think in the shower and realized that Hoid was storing memories in Breaths like how a Feruchemist would store memories in a Coppermind. Useing one investiture for the use of another, kind of like compounding, using allomancy to get feruchemical traits. The metallic arts have the most crossover of all the magic systems, but they are by no means the only ones, and I think this is a nice example. I'm not sure if Hoid is a feruchemist (The coppermind doesn't say so, and we do not know any other way of getting it after birth. Maybe harmonium would grant it if burned, or Sazed can make people Feruchemist like he can make Spook Mistborn.) but it's still the same principle, instead of using metal to store memories, he is using breaths as its container. Thoughts?
  8. I wasn't sure whether I should post this on the warbreaker or mistborn forum, so here it is: If you gave a mistwraith enough breath for it to become sapient, would the result effectively be a kandra made without hemalurgy? If so, then Harmony would have no influence over it, but would Endowment?
  9. So I was wondering how you can get more breath without needing to have it given willingly. It’s a fairly simple question. But it is a complex solution. one option is taking it from a lifeless awakener’s stuff. This is a in-world cheat, but it has to be in a very particular scenario. So it’s not quite for the average person. another option is through blanking your identity or adopting another person’s spiritual identity. This will allow anything you make to be taken by anyone without need for consent if it is stored in an object, and possibly even taking it from other people’s objects, kind of like stealing metalminds. That one is a tough one, given that the only way we know how to do that (as far as I’m aware) is through aluminumminds. It is a tough thing to pull of for an ordinary person, again. A third option is nicrosil compounding. Sadly, it requires a very rare set of powers. It is definitely not for the average person, but it is the easiest way to get a TON of breaths with the least amount of effort. A fourth option is kind of cheating the system. This is using rioting and soothing. They still have to give it willingly, but you can manipulate their willingness to do it. Still not for everyone, but more common than the other three. this fifth one is the easiest for the average person to do, but it is the least effective. That is through drugging someone. This can be through normal alcohol or through more serious stuff. This will be doing what a soother or rioter can do, but more...diluted. It will not be a sure way to get it, but it makes it easier. that is the list of knowledge I know, but there is doubtlessly more. Can the grand beings of the shard come up with more?
  10. Okay, important. So if you get the fifth weighting, you cannot age whatsoever. What happens when you give up some of your breath and lose the fifth heightening? Does the age catch up or do you continue aging where they left off? Also, just because every time I hear functionally immortal I become suspicious, when they say immortal, they mean immortal right? They cannot age period? Just wanna confirm that, because me planning on something, and this is vital to said plan. (Also, does anyone know what the hell is the currency used in Nathline?) (Also, yes, i made the same thread in Cosmere Q&A. I wanted to increase my chances of getting answered, also, I'm impatient. Also, i swear nobody looks at Q&A)
  11. Okay, important. So if you get the fifth weighting, you cannot age whatsoever. What happens when you give up some of your breath and lose the fifth heightening? Does the age catch up or do you continue aging where they left off? Also, just because every time I hear functionally immortal I become suspicious, when they say immortal, they mean immortal right? They cannot age period? Just wanna confirm that, because me planning on something, and this is vital to said plan. (Also, does anyone know what the hell is the currency used in Nathline?)
  12. Prologue: How I got to this idea. Skip to Part 1 if you just want the speculations. Maybe you've read my post about Hacking Feruchemy and fueling it with the Investiture from other Key-based Magic Systems than Allomancy, namely AonDor. That got me thinking. Compounding, reduced to the Investitural workings, is: Powering End-Neutral Magic Release with another type of Investiture, an End-Positive one. Now, I've already speculated about the possibility of replacing Allomancy with AonDor as the End-Positive System, but what about the other half. And what other End-Neutral Magic do we know? Source: https://coppermind.net/wiki/Investiture#End-positive_Investiture BioChromatic Breath Like Feruchemy, BioChromatic Breath is End-neutral. No power is gained or lost, and both use the users Innate Investiture to do something rather than getting their fuel from elsewhere. However, that means that they are limited to using only the Innate Investiture. I'm not sure if we can count Returned as End-neutral, a) since they're not a magic system and b ) since they're part of BioChromatic Breath as a system. However, they have to use up one Breath per Nalthian week to stay alive. That said, we have confirmation that this only requires the amount of Investiture that is One (1) Breath rather than specifically a breath, as seen with Vasher/Zahel. Source: https://coppermind.net/wiki/Returned Fueling Awakening with Stormlight Returned can be categorized as Type I BioChromatic Entities. Sadly, we don't know if Vasher uses some kind of Conversion method, or if he is just able to consume Investiture in any form in the physical world to fuel his Awakening (aka his life). I write "in any form in the physical world" to make a distinction between something like the Dor or Preservation's Investiture and Stormlight or Breath. The former only enter the physical realm by activation and instantly take the form of whatever their key directs, while the other two are Investiture that is present without performing magic, sometimes even able to be stored in non-human carriers (see the broams on Roshar). Where am I going with this? If one Type of Awakening can be fueled by other Investiture, maybe others can too. Stormlight is basically endless, or alteast its a refilling ressource. On something like Scadrial or Taldain, Vasher would have a very hard time getting Investiture to stay alive. (He'd have to become a Metalborn to access Preservation's Investiture, for example), so Roshar is a good choice. Now, finally, what I'm trying to get at: I speculate that, with some methods that we don't yet know of or without, an Awakener holding Stormlight could use one or more Breaths in conjunction with their Stormlight to Awaken with a lot more power than they have Breaths. Imagine sticking a Hose into a Water container. The water won't flow upwards by itself, but if you suck on the hose until water flows out of the top, you can stop sucking and it will flow by itself for a while because the stream is established. (Yes, that's a very basic breakdown of how physics work, shhh.) That's basically how I imagine Awakening with more Investiture could work. I assume you'd need atleast one Breath to perform this. The Breath would act as a kind of spearhead, enabling you to perform the Awakening / speak your command. Only afterwards would you pull Investiture from the Broams around you (/ The Stormlight inside you / your connection to Preservation that is open because you were burning a metal at the time of speaking your command / etc etc etc) to fuel enough Investiture into the object to perform the Awakening. First Question to the readers: Do you think I'm onto something? Do you think this could work? Actual Theory This one I'm throwing out there to present a theory of what this could enable. Lifeless are already super cheap breathwise, so Type III or IV Entities are what you might use this for. So here's my theory: I think Azure's blade might was made with not just Breath. It's similar to Nightblood, but "weaker" and probably with a different command. Azure hasn't made a name for herself on Roshar long before the siege of Kholinar so maybe it wasn't exactly Stormlight that was used to awaken her blade, but I assume we might see another (shard)world in the Nightblood novel. Whether it were the Scholars of Silverlight, experimenting to see what the least amount of Investiture needed to Awaken a Type IV BioChromatic Entity was, or users of a Magic System we haven't even seen yet - maybe Aether - I think Azure's Blade is more than just a Nightblood 2.0 with a better command and less Breath, but represents a new step in BioChromatic Scholarship: Entities that aren't only BioChromatic. And who knows... Maybe Vasher is stockpiling insane amounts of Stormlight somewhere to use them for a massive Awakening somewhere/sometime in the future. Maybe he wants to Return someone (Shashara?) with it, or something like that. Anyway, would love to hear others thoughts on this.
  13. From the album Aons

    Here's Aon Aha!
  14. Hello everyone, first Topic Post from me, As I reread Warbreaker, I came across the few pages where Vasher explains to Vivenna how little they knew about Awakening and the Commands that exist. A thought then occured to me and I haven't been able to find much about it. Could there be a Command that exists that transfers a Returned's breath to someone else like a regular breath, and we simply don't know what exactly it is? I did read a WoB saying that when a Returned gives up their breath, it turns to "Kenetic Investment", so it physically and mentally heals the recipient, but is that because that's the command that's being used? Or is it because that's just how Returned Breaths can only be used? I also read a WoB that said that it is mostly based off of what you're visualizing in your mind, so I'm not sure if it means that the Returned can only visualize healing the subject as they say the command since it typically is why they came back. I might have over thought this one, but I'd like to know if it's already been answered.
  15. So, fabrial are powered by stormlight which is a form of investiture and Breath is also a form of investiture. Could a fabrial be powered by Breath? If so, how much would it need? How long can a single Breath sustain a fabrial? Bah, this question may have gotten too big now and should be in another part of the forum - but whatever!
  16. People on Roshar view things differently. I imagine that this causes intangible phenomena (like fire, wind, and rain) to have enough Cognitive self-awareness that Breath could stick to them with a Command. Obviously this would take a lot of Breaths, but might be possible. The ramifications terrify me, but in a awesomely cool sort of terror! Could this be possible? What could be done to make it more feasible?
  17. Hi Folks! Not sure if this is necessary, but spoilers possibly....... I was just wondering if anyone knows/asked B.S. about how color could be drained from wood and stone for Awakening? I go under the assumption that the colors people have come from the Tears of Edgli which "drink" the investiture from the Perpendicularity that then provides the necessary addition to Investiture when performing Awakenings. Now that might be ENTIRELY wrong. But if that assumption is at all accurate, does anybody know how draining wood and stone of color would provide that since they are not "drinking" the Investiture like the Tears do? This whole thing might be entirely out of bounds, but I have been thinking enough about it to ask. Thanks!
  18. What would giving Breath to spren result in? Breath is supposed to be more in the Physical than the Spiritual due to the nature of Endowment / to facilitate their transfer. Would the adaptability of Breath to different sDNA cause it to become more Cognitive in nature? Or would it make it easier for the spren to push into the Physical Realm and retain their coherence there? I assume that the rules of Awakening should still remain the same for them and they would still gain Heightenings if they acquire more Breaths, but would doing so change what kind of spren they are if they have more of Endowment's Investiture or would Endowment's nature mean her Investiture wouldn't change the inherent nature of the spren? If the spren was a Nahel Bond capable spren, would this count as Corruption assuming their nature does change? Would they still grant the same Surges? Could they grant the benefits of the Heightenings to their Bondmate? Seeing as the Nahel Bond is a melding of the Spiritwebs, to some degree, would transferring Breaths be easier between Bondmates or could a Bondmate use one another's Breath at the Fifth Ideal?
  19. So, I was watching a Youtube video about TWOK where spanish streamer Alexelcapo points out to the chapter 57 epigraph, which is this Death Rattle: "I hold the suckling child in my hands, a knife at his throat, and know that all who live wish me to let the blade slip. Spill its blood upon the ground, over my hands, and with it gain us further breath to draw." He then says the 'breath' could be refering to BioChromatic Breath. If this is right, then the POV character of the Rattle is about to kill a newborn to get their Breath. But there are some inconsistencies. We know that normally one can't steal Breath, nor even give it by accident, it has to be given with intent (Intent?), which is something a baby can't do. So, is it possible that the knife in the Rattle is to be used as a hemalurgic spike? The 'let the blade slip' part could mean 'pierce' instead of 'cut their throat'. What I imagine is a scenario in which a group is in dire need of magic to survive something that has already killed many, but their only source of Investidure is the Breath of a newborn who, unable to talk, is unable to use it. So the leader of the group faces the desicion of whether or not to take away their Breath through hemalurgy to save the rest.
  20. Hey folks! @Honorless has had a fantastic RP idea, wherein our characters are all new in T’Telir and have been conned or forced to give up their Breaths. As Drabs, they then try to get a Breath or more back. This allows us to RP weaker characters, and in a setting that is used less than others. Quote boxes for OOC from now on, be fair and don’t godmod, you guys all know the rules I’m sure. Active Characters: Inactive Characters:
  21. We all know that Hoid has a weakness . If he even thinks about causing harm to someone who is not a cognitive shadow he experiences incapacitating pain . So this got me wondering what all he could do if for example some Fused caught up to him . They are Cognitive shadows so maybe he could hurt them? I also wondered if the 17th Shard tried to take him prisoner could he indirectly fight ? 1. Could he use emotional allomancy to make them fear him so he could scare them off ? Or perhaps talk them into letting him go 2. Could he use Breath and say enchant his cloak and say defend me ? Could he create Lifeless and have them fight for him ? 3. Let’s say there is a pit in the floor and someone is chasing him , could he use lightweaving and make the pit appear to be solid ground ? Or would that cause him pain 4. Let’s say 4 Fused are attacking him . He used lightweaving to appear as a Fused and make another Fused appear as him . The other Fused unwittingly attack there fellow would Hoids weakness key in because he didn’t harm anybody what situations or powers do you think he could get away with and which can’t he . ? I had this idea that he is not helpless . I think he do Alot and get away with it if it’s indirect enough . My favorite is Hoid is in a bar up comes the 17 Shard . Hoid puts some poison in his glass . Then uses emotional allomancy to Riot everyone sense of thirst in the bar , he flairs it in fact and sets his cup of poisoned wine down in front of him as the 17 Shard surrounds him . If one of them drank the poison because he was so thirsty that’s not him harming them , they harmed themselves ... idk what do you guys think ?
  22. My question is simple: Brandon has said that Vasher has hacked Stormlight to make it work like breath to sustain him in Roshar. I presume he has a reasonable amount of breath so that he wouldn't die immediately without stormlight, but does he lose breaths every midpeace and weeping since they last long enough that every sphere and gemstone is done unless it's huge? Or does he have huge gems hidden for exactly this reason?
  23. From the album Quotes

    My life to yours. My breath become yours. The next try at handlettering. Bad quality due to scanning/photography-issues...