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Found 83 results

  1. Do other types of investiture suffer/benefit (depending on how you want to view it) from overuse of their powers similar to misting savants?
  2. Just wanna spark the dead ashes; I know there have been discussions about the name. Wondering anyone has any new idea? For those who don't know: Senna is a name Leras mentioned in Secret History. He merely awed/sighed "Oh, Senna..." Some speculated she is an important one of Leras, or another Vessel. What if it's Cultivation's Vessel?
  3. It's been a little while since I read Secret History (can't wait for Arcanum Unbounded), but as I was thinking about Cognitive Shadows and such, I'm curious to hear some ideas about what exactly Leras was as we saw him in this story. He wasn't really dead, so he couldn't be a Cognitive Shadow, and he existed in the Cognitive Realm much like Sazed does, who is fully alive. Sazed didn't seem to understand all about the Spiritual Realm yet, so I'm not sure that the Vessel exists/has a presence in the Spiritual Realm (though they are able to channel incredible power from the Spiritual Realm). It seems via this power they can manifest themselves in the Physical Realm whenever they please (i.e. Ruin). Vessels' physical bodies appear back in the Physical Realm when the Vessel dies, but where do they exist until that point? 1. Do all Vessels of shards have a permanent presence in the Cognitive Realm? In other words, is this where they exist in realmatic space? In Secret History, Leras was literally falling to pieces (appearing fuzzy to Kelsier) in the Cognitive Realm. He gave up some of his power to invest in all of humanity, making him slightly weaker than Ruin, but from Vin's initial attempts to use Preservation's power to destroy Ruin, it didn't seem possible without completely destroying herself in the process. While I guess we can infer that this "slight disadvantage" in power over immense amounts of time could wear Leras down, I'm not sure of the mechanics of how this took place. The power of a shard seems to make a person functionally immortal, so would giving up 1% of a shard's power eventually cause you to lose your mind? That doesn't seem likely to me. 2. What actually caused Leras' death? 3. Is a Cognitive Shadow something intentionally created, or does this happen automatically? In other words, why wouldn't Leras just reappear in the Cognitive Realm fully whole again after he died? While he wouldn't have had his shardic powers any more, he surely would have had the knowledge to help Kelsier out in his questing. I apologize if these questions are simple and have been answered elsewhere. I shardsurf in my limited free time and don't always get to read all the past posts on stuff!
  4. Ruin and Preservation investiture as a Source of Feruchemy Hi everyone! This is my theory about the Feruchemy's development on the people of Scadrial, or at least on the Terris People. The key to this Metallic Art (for me) is the Atium or to be more precise, the Ruin's Investiture. But first of all, a little backgrond on the Feruchemy: The Feruchemy was the only of the Metallic Arts to be widespread before the Rashek’s Ascension. And from the beginning of the Books seems to be “only” a genetic ability of the Terris People. After this short introduction, I could begin with the theoretical part of my theory: Feruchemy is a manifestation of Investiture of Scadrial, from Preservation and Ruin using the Scadrial’s Focus. The metals. The Feruchemy is an art of balance between the two shards, therefore the two types of Investiture in the Human Beings is very important to access to this Metallic Art. The Scadrial’s Humans has both Preservation and Ruin Investiture but the first is greater. The Humans may develop Feruchemy by changing the amount of Preservation-Ruin Investiture thay have. An “easy” and praticable source of Ruin’s Investiture is the Atium. Now we come at the Core of the Theory: The Feruchemy could be “unlocked” by increasing the Ruin’s Investiture through eating Atium. (a piece of Atium very small compared to a bead of Atium I suppose). But at this point I am not sure about what the real requirements are, I have two plausible ideas and both of them have pros and contros. Balancing the powers: The Preservation Investiture and Ruin Investiture have to be very similar in quantity(percentage). Treeshold of the two powers: The Preservation Investiture must be at least X and Ruin Investiture must be at least X (more investiture of P or R is right too). Now I will explain the global pros and contros in the theory and after the individual pros and contros of the case a and b. Pro: The Feruchemy could be “gifted” to the Terris People by Preservation through the Terris Prophecy directing some “patriarchs” to the Pits and give manipulating them to obtain the Atium (we know that the Pits was in the Terris land). In a close system, the initial catalyst of Feruchemy would be preserved quite good (while they began to cross the bloodlines, the power faded). Contro: The Hoid’s Feruchemy isn't easy to explain with this idea. Now examine the individual pros and contros of the case a and b. Case a: Balancing the Powers. Pro: Preservation may created the Terris People with the minimun quantity of his power to make them sentient. Therefore with less (if none) Allomantic’s potential and with a lower treeshold to develop the Feruchemy by adding Ruin’s power. A not Scadrial Human (like Hoid) has an very very low treshoold (or null). A bit of Preservation and a bit of Ruin could be enough, Ruin could be obtained through Atium and Preservation by the Mist (He could trick the Mist to obtain at least a tiny Preservation’s Power not enough for the Allomancy) The “Allomancy’s gene and Feruchemy’s gene don’t mix well together” are very likely to the opposite requirement to expression itself. The Ruin’s powers needed to a “not Terrisman” could be to much and lethal. A feruchemist could be the “best holder” to both Preservation and Ruin together. Contro: Rashek had an huge Preservation’s Power and mantained his Feruchemy, but maybe once you had the power, you can’t lose for just unbalancing the Investiture. Case b: Treeshold of the two powers Pro: Fullborn has no problem to exist. The “Atium’s Misting test” could be try to find a new potential Feruchemist as a source of Spike. Contro: Every nobles could potentially be a Feruchemist by eating atium (The Atium is very rare and expansive, but I think Rashek used this way to obtain Spikes for the Inquisitors). Hoid’s Feruchemy are less likely than the case a. Future Implication: With the Harmony’s Ascension now Scadrial has 2 type of Mists one of Preservation an one of Ruin and a new “god alloy”. By this theory the Harmonium could be use to became a Allomancer or Feruchemist (case a) or a Fullborn (case B ) What do you think about this theory ?
  5. I know that it is widely accepted that the power of Allomancy comes from Preservation. This makes sense in that in order to become an Allomancer you must either ingest, or be a descendant from someone who has ingested, Lerasium. This idea is given further weight by the fact that Preservation gave a bit of himself in order to make humans more preservation minded. However, the nature of the shards of Preservation and Ruin, and their combination in Harmony, reject this idea. The easiest example of this is Ruin and his magic of Hemalurgy, power is taken and the result is less than before. Mathematically put, if you have starting power X and received power Y you would say that X > Y. In Feruchemy you give power to receive it back when needed, while in Allomancy you expend power, by burning metal, giving you the the variable Z for expended power. Mathematically put, Feruchemy would be X = Y and Allomancy would be modeled X + Z < Y. When you compare these mathematical breakdowns of Scadrial's magic systems to the shards present their, a different reality becomes apparent. With Feruchemy being the only magic system involving the preserving of power, it must be of Preservation. Whereas Allomancy involves the sacrificing of some power in order to gain more, implying it is of Harmony or, more accurately, a balance of the powers of Ruin and Preservation. This idea is given further credit by the fact that even though Preservation gave up some of his power to humans, the only people who cared about preservation as an attribute were the Terrismen, while people in other areas appear to have had a stronger tie to Ruin in their hearts, regardless of the presence of Preservation's power. With that in mind, the ingesting of Lerasium would increase the person's devotion to Preservation, allowing for an equal devotion to both shards, as well as an amount of power that comes directly from a shard. Thanks for looking at my theory. If you can show me any place where Brandon Sanderson has said anything that proves me wrong, please add a link in your post.
  6. I've been intrigued by this WoB for a very long time. I had two theories but i kinda gets crushed with some thoughts as well. Theory #1 : Sazed didn't actually reclaim the rest of Ruin and left the Atium so that both Shards are balanced. Problem with this theory is that its clearly stated(WoB) that Marsh has the last set of Atium. And we would've heard about the Atium after his ascension but we didn't(or he just hid it really well). Theory #2 : Sazed using that extra chunk of Ruin's power outside of Scadrial. We know shards can poke around things and stuff (we know that Sazed has some knowledge over This post has been reported for attempting to skirt the rules is going on in Roshar(WoB) since it happened after his ascension ) and that a Shard could possibly influence outside his domain(Mr. Sanderson prolly just meant that through his agents not actually from his touch ) Theory #3: Could also count as theory 2 but to be more specific Sazed is using that part of Ruin's power to test out doing Hemalurgic testing on other cosmere planets. We know this is happening(WoB). I mean he's trying to learn about the Cosmere and he must be spiking people or trying to to infiltrate better and stuff. Theory #4 : It could also be that in a WoB it is mentioned that Sazed is not the seventeenth shard(the one where demoux and those dudes who are chasing) BUT whether he's a member of the organization is another question. Thoughts ? : )
  7. SPOILER ALL COSMERE related possibly Shards are considered as "gods" and most powerful thing in the cosmere as of the moment but out of all the shards that have been revealed through the cosmere novels Mistborn, Stormlight Archives, Elantris, Warbreaker, White Sand, even WoB's and whatever form of story that i missed that Mr. Sanderson produced that is cosmere related. So out of the limited information and exposure we had with the shards who did you find most interesting whether it'd be due to the intent, the vessel behind it, the shardworld he/she/it resides or interaction with the other shards, even the ire from Hoid counts too and/or just the things that shard has done so far ? Also some questions i'm curious about Do you guys think Odium has a big opposite shard not Honor and doesn't have to be like perfect opposite kinda like preservation/ruin ? Apparently Bavadin(Autonomy) is Mr. Sanderson's favorite shard, thoughts on the dude especially for White Sand readers ? Do you agree that he's a menace like Hoid suggests in his letter grouping him up with Rayse ? Would you count him as ally or enemy in general ? It seems that Tanavast mentioned in one of Dalinar's dreams that Odium tasted defeat too many times and would not wanna taste defeat again. Do you think that means that Rayse was actually losing between him and Tanavast before Honor got rekt ? Or it was just a stalemate. How many other malevolent shards are there apart from Ruin and Odium ? Possibly Chaos maybe Though we have limited knowledge about shards my favorite is probably Ruin, he seems earnestly thinking he could help people by ending them lol . I would've said Harmony but if only the dude acts more like Ruin than preservation, he feels like a caretaker more than somebody who is actually half Ruin tbh, i wish he was more malevolent since he still represents enthrophy/change/death/destruction. Well that's all . Thoughts?
  8. This theory contains not much spoilers, and I'm looking forward to any corrections or discussion: In HoA, Sazed implied that 16 is a signal Preservation left for mankind and it deeply revolved in the way cosmere functions. However, is it a conclusion Sazed speculated, or a confirmed information he got? (I prefer to use "he" on Sazed) The cycle of Well of Ascension is 1024 years. And it's 2^10. So it does not perfectly corresponded with number 16, which is 2^4 (2x2x2x2). Besides, the Allomantic metals are perfectly paired and distributed. So it's a little different from Shard distribution--- they are not definitely counterpart to specific another, even Preservation and Ruin, they are not absolutely objective to each other. But we can't confirm this yet, for other 7 haven't been known. However I still feel that Shards can't be paired as Metals do. So for reasons above, I suggest that what number Preservation represents is 2 rather than 16, though I had no positive evidence on 2. But several objectives on 16. If you think they are convincing. Any ideas?
  9. Ok, so I just finished rereading Secret History after it was brought up in another thread, and I'm not sure why, but I keep getting kind of vibes that Leras and Ati might have been a thing back on Yolen. I really want this to be true, because then it would be heartbreaking. So, in the letter it talks about Ati being really nice before he was corrupted by Ruin's intent, and I think it would be a really powerful story. We have these two people who loved each other, maybe Ati was given Ruin because they thought he was nice enough to counteract it, he and Leras go off together, but Ati is corrupted further and further by the shard, to the point where Leras had to keep him improsoned. Then, his Cognitive Shadow in secret history is vague enough that all it remembers is that it has to stop ruin. I don't think Brandon would have intentionally written it in, but did anyone else get that vibe? Maybe I'm just insane...
  10. Just a heads up for all of you who have yet to read it, this deals with secret history content. So while Kelsier was discussing how preservation could be killed by ruin with Khriss and Nazh, Khriss expresses surprise that ruin does not simply splinter preservation. She wonders if ruin does not know how to splinter a shard, or if instead he simply lacks the power to. Instead, ruin appears to slowly strangle preservation, eventually killing Leras. We also know that ruin was quite anxious to gain access to the hoard of atium kept by the kandra, since this was the final piece of its power. So, to put it simply, does this mean that ruin would have used the splintering technique that we have seen odium use if it had managed to gain access to the atium?
  11. So as I've been listening through the books again and reading through the forums, I've been trying to figure out something. If magic comes from the Shards, then which Shard made Allomancy? According to Sazed, Allomancy is of Preservation, but look at most of what it does. Most of the applications are short term and often destructive. That sounds more like Ruins pervue than Preservation, yet the mists (which is of preservation) react to Allomancers. My theory is thus: Because Ruin and Preservation couldn't do much of anything without the other having a hand in it (read: the constant struggle for either to get anything done at the end of HoA) then all three Metallic Arts carry both within them, but favor one or the other. Feruchemy is the art of preserving, hands down. You store away your attributes for later use, either in a time of need or to supercharge what is already there. It's long term and deliberate, it's of Preservation. But, there is enough of Ruin in it for copperminds to suffer the same corruption as non-metallic recordings. Allomancy is the flip. It's short term, and often only for immediate or near to immediate use. It relies on metal as a catlyst to burn the investiture inside the person. It is closer to Ruin, which is easiest to see in the power Atium gives. Quick bursts of flashing insight in to the immediate world around them, making them better to kill. While we don't know if that notion of Atium helps to kill is a product of Atium itself or the world it lives in, Elends final chapters make the thought ambiguous. Allomancy favors Ruin, but is birthed by Preservation. That Lerasium burns for everyone says something. Hemalurgy is the most directly built by Ruin. It is destructive in nature. However, I find it ironic that it does, albeit not perfectly, preserves the power it stored. It's leaking, but it's holding in the power. This is me just trying to get my thoughts out and seeing how other people see it. I'm not sure if it's been discussed before.
  12. Brandon said that bad things would have happened if Kelsier hadn't been around to temporarily take control of Preservation's power after Leras died and hold it until Vin took it. I don't know if this topic has come up before, but I'm wondering what would have happened. Perhaps the following: Shard's power has no mind to shape/control/unify it The the various facets of the shard's intent gain a measure of sentience in order to compensate for the lack of a mind These facets disagree with each other and pull the power of the shard apart into a multitude of splinters. If that's the case, then splintering a shard is as simple as killing the shard's holder and then preventing it from finding a new one for a period of time.
  13. Since we know where allomancy and hemalurgy come from, I was wondering if anybody knows the origins of feruchemy.
  14. I'm reading Alloy of Law and I just thought of something. We know that Preservation tried to help Vin several times, but couldn't because of her earring, right? But why didn't the mists reach out to Elend like they did to Vin at the end of THoA? I mean.... Vin was using Hemalurgy, so I get why the mists couldn't help her. But they could have helped Elend in THoA, right?
  15. If Odium was able to splinter a shard, just how powerful was he? Wouldn't saved be able to easily destroy Odium, since he is Preserving people and yet he is Ruining Odium, and thus the intents are in Harmony? Seriously, I have no idea and all y'all are smarter then me so I'm interested in what you have to say.
  16. Why did the shards choose to go where they went? Ruin and Preservation were opposites, and they chose to go to the same planet. Why didn't they go as far away from each other as possible? Is there a pattern to where the shards chose to go?
  17. This is probably more appropriate for the Cosmere Theories board, but because I am relying on Secret Histories information, let's keep it here for the time being. So, I have a thought and a question. * We know that taking up a Shard required Connection to the Shard. * We now can parse, from Khriss's comment about the Shattering, and a very recent WoB stating that Adonalsium was Shattered because the Holder was killed, that the actual moment of Shattering probably looked very close to the "inverse" of the scene of Sazed's Ascension. In the latter case, Sazed was alone and there were two power sources which he, having Connection to both, was able to take up. * In the former case, I suspect that a similar progression occured: after being killed, Adonalsium Holder dropped a body; 16 people should have been *in the direct proximity* of the drop, they would have done the same thing Sazed did: stepped in and attempted to take up the power. As each of them had Connection to a specific aspect/Intent of the Power, they took that Intent and became a Shard. This begs the question: if a Shardholder (like Leras or Ati) dies, drops a body and TWO PEOPLE attempt to take up the power, will the Shard be split into "SubShards" with different "SubIntents"? Or, in general, what would happen? As an example: can I train two people to be (a) very active and be ( passively-aggressively hateful, kill Odium (heh!), and have Person (a) become Wrath and Person ( become Passive Aggression. (these are all examples - I actually do not know what Odium is made out of)?
  18. It's a pretty straight forwards question. On the one hand he made the prophecy about the hero of Ages, which while vague was perfectly accurate, implying that he actually managed to predict Sazed taking up the Shards. On the other hand however, he did everything he could to keep Vin from releasing Ruin, which doesn't make sense if he knew about the events of book 3, after all why keep him in prision if the guy that will actually save them is out there? Was that vague description simply the best he could do, meaning he never realized he was actually talking about Sazed and that things actually played out this way was simply a lucky coincidence?
  19. I just finished a reread of all of Mistborn and in HoA, I came across an interesting line. “Preservation’s power remains, for power cannot be destroyed. His mind however, was all but destroyed-for this was the sacrifice he made to imprison Ruin.” “The sliver remains,” another reminded. “The shadow of self.” “Yes,” Haddek said. “But that is not Preservation, just an image-a remnant…” (The Hero of Ages Hardback pg. 507 Lines 1 and 3 added for context and emphasis is mine.) And I got to thinking… What is the connection to Shadows of Self? Is there a connection? Is book 5’s title a reference to Leras, Rashek, Kelsier, or Vin? Or all four? Or not of Preservation at all but of Ruin? Is Ati’s mind out their somewhere? Maybe somebody else? I’m gonna feel dumb it this has already been posted and explained. By the way, this is my first post so, howdy all!
  20. I can't remember if this was covered in the books or not, but where did feruchamy come from? We know that the Terris people had it long before Allomancy and Hemalurgy became some what common in the Mistborn world, but I don't think we know anything else. The only thing that I can think of is that it is a magic system that combines the elements of Ruin and Preservation, although why it was only given to the Terris people is beyond me.
  21. So the last week or two me and my good buddy(irl) Sirce Luckwielder have been having a discussion about Atium and how it is linked to the Lord Ruler's staying young. It led to some other discussions and I was wondering if any of what i suspect has been confirmed. Or maybe some of you who are smarter than I am can help credit or discredit this theory. I don't see how we will see Atium again at all and this is why. Atium was the physical manifestation of Ruin but it was either all used up to fight the Koloss or destroyed by Kelsier in the pits of Hathsin. He thinks that since Sazed has both shards there will still be Atium that will regrow. I disagree. Anyways, all of this discussion got me looking in to things that i haven't really cared about in the past (I'm a Roshar guy!) and I have firmed up in my conclusion that Ruin and Preservation no longer exist or are on the verge of no longer existing as two seperate shards. In The Emperor's Soul, Shai tries to teach Gaotona about the Physical, Spiritual, and Cognitive realm and she says this: All things exist in the three realms, Gaotona.... The Physical is what we feel, what is before us. The Cognitive is how an bject is viewed and how it views itself. The Spiritual Realm contains an object's soul- its essence- as well as the ways it is connected to the things and people around it.......Here is the point. The longer an object exists as a whole, and the longer it is seen in that state, the stronger its sense of complete identity becomes.. Do citizens of Scarial see Sazed as Ruin and Preservation? I do not believe so(my memory isn't perfect) They see him as Harmony. Sazed is seen as one entity, not to. So I believe that if the shards haven't already been merged, they are on their way. Anyways, I was wondering what people think about this theory. Sorry my post might seem all over the place, I have a hard time typing out the thoughts in my head. This is kind of new to me as I haven't spent a lot of time thinking about things on Scadrial, I've mostly kept to Roshar. So please forgive anything I might have misunderstood. Also, I'm sure when Sirce has a minute he can write our discussion better, he's a lot better with words than I am.
  22. I was wondering if there was a way to artificially generate Lerasium and Atium. this question come from the fact that everything (except humans) on scadrial contains equal amounts of ruin and preservation, I was wondering if there is some way to separate the two powers that is contained in say, a rock, and condense them into equal amounts of Lerasium and Atium.
  23. So from what I understand, shard blades are blades formed from the power of a shard, examples being spren. For example, Syl is a piece of the Honor shard, and can form into a blade, thus the blade is essentially made from a shard. Honorblades were the original tool given to the heralds to allow them to use certain powers associated with the honor and cultivation shards. Now, this is a little silly and wouldn't fit well into the stories, but its WoB that Harmony is having issues doing anything because of the nature of his two shards. I want to see him make some preservation shard bearers and send them around to be his "hands" in the world. Like imagine an Honorblade that gives the powers of allomancy, a Preservation-blade. I think it would be pretty boss. None of this would necessarily fit well into the cosmere narrative but i think the idea of the Honorblades would mix well with some of the other magics.
  24. Each Shard has an intent. Many of these intents contradict each other, sometimes prompting battles between Shards. What was Adonalsium's intent? It might have had no intent, since the intents would have canceled each other out, or it might have had all 16 intents at once. This would cause Adonalsium to always be in conflict with itself. Given the strength of the intents of the Shards that we have seen, it would also be in extreme agony, and never actually be able to do anything. A solution to that situation would be for Adonalsium to shatter itself, hence my theory.
  25. I have this theory about the Oathpact and the reason for the torture of Heralds, the death of Honor, the reason for the Desolations, and the origin of Honorblades that I don't think anyone else has already stated. First, I'll start with a couple references from Mistborn: In Chapter 57 of Mistborn:HoA, Ruin says this: And throughout the book it's made clear that Preservation's sacrifice was only a temporary solution that caused him to give up his mind, but would eventually allow Ruin to escape his prison. Also, in chapter 81 of HoA, Vin was able to use the power of Preservation to push back against Ruin causing her divine body to tremble in pain and agony and eventually die. I know Vin didn't trap Ruin this way, but I'm just pointing out that she hindered Ruin and that fighting a god causes pain - at least when the gods are so opposed. To me, this sounds a lot like the Oathpact. It's called a bargain, instead of a pact, but they mean almost the same thing. There is pain involved. A god must give of themself. A god eventually dies as a result. A god is trapped/imprisoned or hindered in some way. It's a temporary solution. Now, what if Honor and the the Heralds figured out a way to trap (or at least hinder) Odium and make it closer to permanent? Instead of Honor suffering agony for thousands of years (just like Preservation), dieing, and Odium eventually escaping (or regaining full power), the Heralds agreed to endure the pain in place of Honor (how this was accomplished will be discussed below). And what if by doing so, they prevented/delayed Honor's death? There was some kind of bargain (Oathpact) between Honor and Odium that trapped/hindered Odium temporarily, but caused Honor to die, after a few thousand years of agony, in the process. Afterall, would it not be honorable to give up your life to save the lives of the entire world? However, Odium was tricked because of the intervention of the Heralds (this might be considered dishonorable though, so Honor would not be involved in the trick). Odium still escaped his prison (or regained his full power) every few thousand years and it caused a Desolation. He is defeated and re-imprisoned; the Heralds return to the place of torment; and Honor still lives as a result. Now, I know Taln was still being tortured after the "last" Desolation, but what if that wasn't enough to save Honor's life this time, so he died or splintered. There is speculation that this is what caused the Recreance. Finally, I think this original Oathpact is what forged the Honorblades - their origin being hidden in plain sight. Honor had to give of himself to trap/hinder Odium, and the Honorblades are the physical manifestation of Honor's power - much like the Mist is the physical manifestation of Preservation's power or Atium is Ruin's. These Honorblades were given to the Heralds to grant them great power during the eventual escape of Odium. But in the process, because they held pieces of Honor's "body," they endured great torture when they were in the place of torment. I believe that place of torment is one and the same as Odium's prison. Holding an Honorblade and being in Odium's prison at the same time is excruciatingly painful, but it saved Honor's life - until the Heralds (except for Taln) failed to return the last time. Any thoughts, flaws, additions? Edit: modified for clarity and to address some of the comments below