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THEORY IN BRIEF I believe the Surges keep Odium captive in the Rosharian planetary system. As part of his long-term plan, Odium causes the listeners to create the Everstorm. The Everstorm will block the Highstorms’ reinvestment of Stormlight on Roshar. Without that reinvestment, the Surges will not be able to renew themselves. Roshar will break apart, and Odium will be free to leave the Roshar system. While the Everstorm circles, the human and other survivors will find themselves besieged in Urithiru surrounded by the Voidbringer hosts. Urithiru’s Stormlight resources will be severely depleted. To restore them, Kaladin will break free of the siege, travel to the Origin, and bring back to Urithiru substantial new Stormlight reserves. Urithiru will then be capable of fighting the Voidbringers and holding out far longer than Odium expects. Odium, fearing he may lose this war, will be forced to accept the challenge of a duel of champions. Kaladin will defeat Odium’s champion, reestablishing Odium’s captivity. “TANAVAST’S DESIGN” OF ODIUM’S CAPTIVITY The Rosharian System Imprisons Odium The writer of the “second letter” claims Odium cannot leave the Rosharian system: “Rayse is captive. He cannot leave the system he now inhabits. His destructive potential is, therefore, inhibited.” (Epigraph to WoR Chapter 69.) The writer is unsure “[w]hether this was Tanavast’s design or not…” (Epigraph to WoR Chapter 70.) The Surges Form the Prison The WoR Ars Arcanum author believes the ten Surges – “thought to be the fundamental forces by which [Roshar] operates – are more accurately a representation of the ten basic abilities offered to the Heralds, and then the Knights Radiant, by their bonds.” (WoR Hardcover, p. 1084.) The in-world Words of Radiance author describes the Surges as “the bonds that drive Roshar itself.” (WoR Epigraph to Chapter 38, emphasis added.) If the Surges do not accurately describe the “fundamental forces” of Roshar, then Honor must have had some other reason for placing them on Roshar. Whether by design or not, the result of their creation was to imprison Odium in the Rosharian system. Evidence The best proof that the Surges imprison Odium is the action he takes to escape his captivity. That is the Everstorm. Honor fears the Everstorm will cause Roshar to fall into dust. (WoK Paperback, pp. 1244-45.). That is the expected result when the “bonds that drive Roshar itself” – that literally hold the planet together – are stripped away. Odium has no other reason to destroy Roshar. If he simply wanted to splinter Cultivation, he does not need to destroy Roshar to do so. He did not destroy Sel when he splintered Devotion and Dominion there and he did not previously destroy Roshar when he splintered Honor. The destruction of Roshar is simply the by-product of the elimination of the Surges. That is why I conclude that the Surges are the instruments of Odium’s captivity. ODIUM’S PLAN TO FREE HIMSELF Stormlight Reinvests Roshar’s Magic, Including the Surges Odium’s plan is to interrupt the cycle of magical reinvestment on Roshar, causing the Surges to fail. WoB (somewhere) states that magical investiture is generally a renewable resource. On Roshar, Stormlight is the means of that renewal. Kaladin describes Stormlight as “the Surges reduced to some primal form.” (WoR Hardcover, p. 469.) WoB analogizes Stormlight to the mist in Mistborn, It is the gaseous state of Honor’s (and Cultivation’s?) investiture on Roshar. Two Elements to Odium’s Plan Odium’s plan has two broad elements. The first is to soak up existing Stormlight through the creation of a horde of Voidbringers. Voidbringers, according to Szeth, can “hold [stormlight] in perfectly” (WoK Paperback, p. 13). The second element is to block the Highstorms’ reinvestment of Stormlight. The Everstorm accomplishes both elements. The Everstorm will gain strength with each of its revolutions around Roshar. Its next pass will convert the Parshmen into Stormform listeners. During future passes, these new listeners will add their song to what the Shattered Plains listeners started, increasing the size and scope of the Everstorm. In his dream Kaladin sees the Everstorm as “so enormous as to make the continent – the world itself – into nothing by comparison“ – much bigger than when the Everstorm began on the Shattered Plains. (WoR Hardback, p. 369, emphasis in original.) Because the Everstorm moves in the opposite direction from the Highstorms, as it grows in force it will first prevent the Highstorms from reaching the Rosharian continent. Eventually the Everstorm may prevent Highstorms from forming at all, blowing them away at their birth. WoB states Highstorms were initially a meteorological event, but at some point became magical as well, presumably through the addition of Stormlight. We don’t know how Stormlight gets added to the Highstorms, although it’s a safe guess that that occurs at the Origin. Regardless, it seems reasonable to assume that a catastrophic storm multiples larger than a Highstorm should be able to kill a Highstorm in its cradle. The Diagram’s Prediction Taravangian’s Diagram seems to agree that the Everstorm is Odium’s path to freedom: "destroy [the listeners] outright before [one of them] obtains their power. ​It will form a bridge." (Epigraph to WoR Chapter 89, reformatted and emphasis added.) I interpret this statement to mean the Everstorm (created by the listeners’ “power”) is the bridge by which Odium will escape the Rosharian system. Odium’s Plan to Destroy Surgebinders Part of Odium’s plan has been to thwart or destroy those who might oppose him – Surgebinders: the Heralds and the KR. Odium has used several tactics to implement this stratagem: First, he influenced nine of the Heralds to abandon the Oathpact (as many in this Forum have speculated). Second, I believe Odium caused the Recreance (whatever its apparent immediate cause) to break up the KR and eliminate them. Third, he influenced Nale to kill fledging surgebinders (as many in this Forum have speculated) so the KR could not reestablish itself. Fourth, he caused the listeners to create the Everstorm. If the Everstorm can eliminate Stormlight, neither the Heralds nor the KR will be able to surgebind, When Odium first set upon his plan, he was dealing only with the Heralds, inefficient users of Stormlight through their Honorblades. The spren, perhaps in anticipation of the Everstorm, created the Nahel bond with humans, a much more efficient means of using Stormlight and, hence, the Surges. This flaw in Odium’s plan enables the KR to hold out longer than Odium expects during the Siege of Urithiru. Odium’s Plan Began Many Millenia Ago Odium has been planning for the Everstorm a long time. The Stormfather tells Dalinar that the Everstorm is “a new thing, but old of design.” (WoR Hardcover, p. 1070.) The Desolations began as a war by one of Roshar’s native populations, the listeners, to repel the human invaders of Roshar. WoB states there were no Desolations before humans came to Roshar. The humans won these wars, evicting the listeners from more and more territory. Hatred of humans led some of the listeners to become “unmade” by Odium into his creatures. These listener “gods” introduced the forms of power. Through these forms, Odium began to wield influence among the listeners. Further losses to humans over the millennia led the Lost Legion to abandon their gods. Before the final battle of the Last Desolation, Melishi the Bondsmith developed his plan to enslave listeners by stripping them of their spren rather than destroying them (or so many suspect). I believe Odium influenced Melishi to adopt this plan so that Odium would have potential Stormform listeners available to him when the time came. There has been no Desolation for the past four millennia because Odium realized he didn’t need to cause one – that humankind itself was capable of sufficient hatred without external influence. Thus, Honor tells Dalinar that “[Odium]’s realized that you, given time, will become your own enemies. That he doesn’t need to fight you. Not if he can make you forget, make you turn against one another…” (WoK Paperback, p. 1246, emphasis in original.) Human forgetfulness has made them ignore Parshmen until the time comes for Odium to use them. Recent Events Gavilar came into contact with descendants of the Lost Legion a year or two before SA began. We can assume he found the black stone that he gave to Szeth at about the same time, since that is when Gavilar “changed” (according to several characters). WoB states that the light in that stone is not Stormlight and heavily implies it is a form of Odium’s investiture. Part of Gavilar’s changed behavior was to become more religious. He also joined/founded the Sons of Honor, with Amaram. Their goal was to bring back the Voidbringers so the Heralds would return. I believe Odium influenced Gavilar in these respects. I also believe Odium influenced Gavilar to share his plan with the visiting listeners, anticipating the listeners would assassinate Gavilar and start the War of Vengeance. (Perhaps it will turn out that Amaram suggested to Gavilar that he do this.) The war reduced the listeners to a state where they were willing to embrace the Everstorm. Odium influenced Venli to re-discover Stormform rather than the forms of peace, as Eshonai expected. We know the rest... HOW ODIUM WILL BE DEFEATED It begins with the re-founding of the KR and their re-occupation of Urithiru. I believe Honor’s plea to Dalinar to “unite them” has multiple levels: unite the KR, unite all humankind, and unite all of Roshar’s peoples, ancient and nouveau. Honor binds, hatred divides – a strong theme of SA. All will join in the war, including some of the Heralds, eventually finding their way to Urithiru. Honor says to Dalinar: “The sun approaches the horizon. The Everstorm comes. The True Desolation. The Night of Sorrows. You must prepare. Build of your people a fortress of strength and peace, a wall to resist the winds.” (WoK Paperback, p. 1242.) Urithiru is shaped with the eastward side flat and the westward side curved to withstand the Everstorm – “a wall to resist the winds.” Honor calls the Everstorm the “Night of Sorrows” because of the extended period of darkness the Everstorm will bring. Members of the New KR Not coincidentally, the KR we currently know or anticipate includes members of different countries and races: at least four from Alethkar (Dalinar, Kaladin, Renarin and Jasnah), one from Jah Keved (Shallan), one from the Reshi Isles (Lift), and one (probably) from Shinovar (Szeth). To these, I believe we can add the following characters (and maybe some others we haven’t met yet): Eshonai. Her fall into the chasms will find Eshonai reunited with her mother and the listeners who escaped Eshonai’s coup. Here her comet spren will finally chase away the stormspren and bond with her, making her a Willshaper – the first listener KR. (It’s hard to imagine her having a book otherwise…) Rysn. Whether or not Rysn (from Thaylenah) ends up a KR, she will be crucial nonetheless because of her Larkin. If she does become a KR, she will be a Releaser/Dustbringer because she is both astonishingly brave (foolhardy?) and obedient (to a fault). She already has had two Interludes… Ym. Since Ym (from Iri) had the Surge of Progression, I’m not convinced he’s dead. If Jasnah, without that Surge, could survive a stab through the heart, I think someone with that Surge should be able to survive as well. Though he was “killed” with a shardblade, so was Szeth, whom Nale resurrected with a Progression fabrial. Ym might have saved himself with his own Progression Surge. Probably a Truthwatcher. Zahel. As a Returned with Divine Breath and access to the Spiritual Realm, Zahel is an ideal candidate for a Bondsmith. By the time he reaches Urithiru, he may have recovered Nightblood. Nightblood will be ecstatic fighting the Voidbringers – so much evil investiture to consume, so little time…I’ll make a prediction here: Nightblood will be the means of destroying Odium, consuming every last bit of his Shard. I suspect that won’t be in SA though. Axies. I’m not sure whether Axies the Collector will be a KR, but if so, I believe he will also be a Bondsmith. Either way, his knowledge of spren will be enormously valuable to the anti-Odium faction: He will find a way to reverse the effects of Odium’s influence on the listeners who adopted the forms of power. Kaladin/Fleet Will Seek New Stormlight Reserves By the time we reach the last book in the series, the Everstorm survivors will be making their last stand at Urithiru, surrounded by the Voidbringer host. The Everstorm will have caused the near divestiture of all of Roshar’s Stormlight by interfering with the Highstorms. Urithiru’s Stormlight reserves will be almost gone, incapacitating the KR. Things will be looking bad for our heroes… In desperation, Kaladin will use the remaining Stormlight reserves to seek out the Origin. The KR will launch a sortie to distract the Voidbringers. Because Kaladin is Fleet, he will race out of Urithiru and make his escape. But where is the Origin? The Origin Is on One of Roshar’s Moons! I believe Kaladin will find Stormlight on one of Roshar’s moons. Here is a WoB on point: Q: “Do the moons relate to the Highstorms at all?” A: “The moons...at all? Sure! You'll love this. The star's age, at Roshar – Earth astronomers would say that is a star which could not have planets with life on them orbiting it.” I interpret Brandon’s oblique, but pertinent, answer in context to mean that the Stormlight that invests the Highstorms and brings life to Roshar comes from one of the moons. He tells us that Roshar should not have life on it, yet it does. He’s tells us in another WoB that “Stormlight makes plants grow” (written into a fan’s book). And his answer here comes in response to a question about the relationship between Roshar’s moons and Highstorms. Here’s another relevant WoB: Q: “If [a Windrunner had] enough heating fabrials and enough Stormlight, how high up could [he] go?” A: “He could theoretically break orbit if he has Stormlight for air, and he could manipulate gravity. They have actually figured how long it would take to make it to the various moons.” I don’t believe the Sanderson Crew did that calculation just for fun. It has to be relevant to the story line. Peter has said that the moons come very close to Roshar during the night: “Roshar's moons are much much closer than our moon. Their elliptical orbits bring them closer to Roshar's surface during the night…” (For an excellent discussion of the astronomy of the Rosharian moons, check out this thread.) It should take Kaladin about two hours to reach the moon that is the Origin (though it is still unclear which one it is). The Larkin Stores the Stormlight Kaladin will take Rysn’s Larkin with him to the moon, where it will store enormous amounts of Stormlight to bring back. Will this increase the Larkin’s size, perhaps turning it into some kind of Greatshell? Will it be able to fly back itself? Will Rysn give it a name…? (Personally, I like Lex Larkin.) Kaladin may suffer significant damage from his potential over-exposure to the Origin’s Stormlight, perhaps crystallizing him like one of Dalinar’s soulcasters. Syl warned him of Stormlight over-exposure in WoR. I suspect that the Larkin will protect Kaladin by absorbing the excess Stormlight from him. The Duel of Champions With the new Stormlight reserves, the Siege of Urithiru will hold out long enough to persuade Odium to agree to a battle of champions: “Vex Odium, convince him that he can lose, and appoint a champion…” (WoR, p. 76.) Kaladin will go up against something representing Odium, and Kaladin will defeat it. (It wouldn’t be much of a story otherwise…) The good guys win, and hatred is again put back in the bottle Some intriguing questions and observations: As a Son of Honor (a real one, not like Gavilar and Amaram), Kaladin will not cheat during the duel. But his opponent will, perhaps with help from other Voidbringers. Will Kaladin be restricted only to the Windrunner Surges? Will his trip to the Origin change him in any way, allowing him access to other powers or Surges? Can he be given the non-Jezrien Honorblades for other Surges, even if he only uses Syl as his shard-weapon? Will he have enough Stormlight to use them all? The End. Thanks for reading!

Learning about the Cosmere from my Mistborn beginnings has always seemed fascinating to me ever since I first went onto the Coppermind for the first time to discover the presence of Devotion as a Shard akin to that of Preservation and Ruin. I was sold on Sanderson since then. The idea that forces in the universe had a manifestation and bearer was inspired. What struck me as odd about the Stormlight Archive was the presence of Odium. All the Shards we've seen so far represent something fairly neutral (justifications are below, skip those if you don't need to read them). Ruin - Despite his depiction as an antagonist, Ruin is not 'evil' as such, he merely wanted to follow his intent to follow change and decay. It's just unfortunate that it would mean the destruction of the world. Preservation - Conversely, despite being shown as a force of good, Preservation could easily have been an antagonist if there was a revolutionary phase on Scadrial and somehow Preservation was moving to stop advancements in technology (just realised how fitting Rashek's work in the Final Empire was). Devotion - You can be devoted to anything, be it something of ill or good intent. Dominion - There's nothing wrong for a hierarchy in society, and that by itself shows some having dominion over others. Endowment - The act of giving something to something else in transference and exchange is one of the most neutral. As we see from Endowment's magical system itself, Awakening, giving something to someone is not always a good thing (Nightblood). Honor - A moral code, a belief to live by. If there's anything we learn from in the Stormlight Archive it's that despite believing what you do is right and following your own set of rules and living up to your promises and oaths, it's not always the right thing to do. Cultivation - One may cultivate any crop, be it the will to do good or the anger to revenge. And then bam, we've been shaken up by the last one: Odium It seems the odd one out. Hatred. How is it that the universe, in all of it's components have hate being one sixteenth of its entirety? From something so simple as the forces in the universe having life, we are confronted that hate has one as well. Scary stuff. It raises a question I find. Could Odium's existence be the reason for the Shattering in the first place? Shatter Adonalsium, remove Odium, then put the pieces back together without the corrupted piece - or Shard in this case. This would even tie in with Hoid's heightened activity in the Stormlight Archive where Odium is active. Maybe Hoid was the one to break Adonalsium. Complete speculation on my part, but I want to hear from you lot about it.

There have been all sorts of theories regarding the origin and nature of the Stormfather and Nightwatcher. Mine is that Honor and Cultivation each invested the current incarnation of the Stormfather; and that Cultivation and either Adonalsium (though the “Old Magic”) or Odium each invested the current incarnation of the Nightwatcher. The Stormfather Both the Highstorms and the Stormfather pre-exist the arrival of Honor, Cultivation and humans on Roshar. Originally, the Highstorms were merely meteorological events. WoB states that at some point the Highstorms also became magical events. Our fearless WoB compiler RShara says she understands Brandon to mean “the stormlight part of the storm was added later, I'm assuming by a Shard.” Eshonai says the Stormfather is a traitor who was once a friend. This description suggests the Stormfather was the spren who personified the Highstorms to the Listeners. Eshonai also says the Highstorms and the Stormfather are involved in Listener form changes. Subsequent WoR events confirm that statement. The Stormfather now identifies himself as a sliver, a splinter and the spren of Honor. Humans personified Honor (the “Almighty”) as the Stormfather, by which the Stormfather became Honor’s spren. Though the Listeners claim the Stormfather betrayed them, it is unclear whether the Stormfather could have simultaneously remained a Listener’s spren. Eshonai’s comments suggest that the Stormfather may no longer be serving his function of overseeing Listener form changes, but we have no evidence of this. To the contrary, the Listeners continued to undergo their pre-stormspren form changes during Highstorms. The Stormfather’s failure to help Eshonai when she was being bound by the stormspren does not provide proof one way or the other. Throughout WoR, we see that the Stormfather has no autonomy regarding the bonding process. He accepts all KR oaths, and Syl says he has no power to stop the tightening of the Nahel bond if the KR “says the words.” This is no different than how he behaves towards Eshonai. The Stormfather states he is also a sliver of Honor. He claims he was present when Odium “murdered” Honor and fled. The following WoB provides guidance on how the Stormfather became Honor’s sliver: “Q: If Endowment were killed, would the Returned still come?” “A: Somebody needs to hold the magic. If no one holds the magic, the magic will gain sentience. Interesting and bizarre things happen then…” Odium (or rather Rayse) did not acquire any part of Honor’s splinters because other WoB says Rayse did not want to dilute his essence, his “hatefulness.” The only other sentient being in the neighborhood was the Stormfather. I believe the Stormfather absorbed Honor’s splinters and “fled.” Some indefinite time afterwards (immediately?), the Stormfather released Honor’s splinters, which greatly increased the number of Roshar’s spren (emphasis added): “Q: Were there spren bonds before Aharietiam?” “A: …The spren were around back then but they're not nearly what they are now. They've changed over the course of the book obviously…They are much more prevalent following Honor and what happened to him, but there were some spren on the planet before even that happened.” And, of course, the Stormfather retained a splinter of Honor as well. The Stormfather is thus simultaneously a spren, a sliver and a splinter of Honor, as he claims. But Cultivation has also invested the Stormfather. At a recent WoR signing, a fan asked Brandon to write something in his copy (emphasis added): “Q: For Words of Radiance, could you put a comment about something in the upcoming books, nothing specific, just something I can think about? Something like "Renarin has a spren" you wrote for somebody else in The Way of Kings? “A: [brandon wrote] ‘Stormlight makes plants grow.’" I believe the power of growth – Progression – belongs to Cultivation, not Honor. Cultivation is apparently the Shard responsible for stormlight, making plants grow and facilitating surgebinder healing. Thus, the Stormfather is a splinter of BOTH Cultivation and Honor. He may bring the Highstorms, but the stormlight the Highstorms contain come from Cultivation. The Nightwatcher We have not yet met the Nightwatcher and have much less information about her than we do the Stormfather. All we know is the following: Humans come to her for boons, which she dispenses together with a curse. Humans believe the Nightwatcher controls the “Old Magic.” Brandon has not explained what the “Old Magic” is. We believe the Nightwatcher selected Lift for Wyndle to bond with. This belief is based on Wyndle describing her as “Mother.” Since Syl and other spren call the Stormfather (and not Honor) “Father,” Wyndle’s designation suggests “Mother” means the Nightwatcher and not Cultivation. The Nightwatcher resides in the “The Valley,” which is located in the mountains between Emul and Greater Hexi. It is generally accepted in these Forums that the Nightwatcher is a rough analog to the Stormfather: Cultivation’s spren in the same way the Stormfather is Honor’s spren. This seems confirmed by Lift’s Nahel bond with Wyndle: the two surges granted Lift are Progression and Abrasion. Based on the surgebinding table and the concept of “cultivation,” these surges appear to stem from Cultivation. WoB states the analogy with the Stormfather is “on the right track” but not precisely correct. That statement suggests something else is part of the Nightwatcher. That may be why the Nightwatcher curses as well as grants boons. There are two other potential sources of Investiture in her: the “Old Magic” and Odium. According to the Coppermind Wiki, the “Old Magic” was the dominant religion on Roshar before the rise of Vorinism. Since Brandon has said that all Cosmere magic ultimately derives from Adonalsium, and we know Adonalsium has invested on Roshar, then the “Old Magic” may be derived from Adonalsium. If so, then the Nightwatcher is a spren of both Cultivation and Adonalsium. Alternatively, because the Nightwatcher curses her beneficiaries, Odium may have invested in the Nightwatcher. Both her name and behavior imply a darkness or meanness to her character. Human consciousness may have personified the uncertainties of growth and development in both beneficial and hateful terms, thus producing a spren comprised of both Shards. I find it interesting that the Nightwatcher’s curses seem unrelated to her boons: that would imply an almost schizophrenic or multiple personality spren whose two components don’t coordinate. We may not learn a lot more about the Nightwatcher until the second five SA books. That’s a long time to wait…

Brandon gives us plenty of spren descriptions, but the description of Angerspren seem to differ from place to place in the books. Humans get pools of bubbling blood. (that makes my blood boil) Parshendi get red lightning storms. It seems like there are two different types of spren called angerspren; angerspren and stormspren. Eshonai is not surprised in the first quote by the form of the spren, only that they appeared at her reprimand. Pattern confirms that stormspren are a type of voidspren. The stormspren seem to be hanging around the Listeners, just waiting to bond for stormform.

Stuck behind "spoiler" just in case: Not saying I necessarily believe this, more that I'm looking for others' thoughts and opinions on the possibility.

At this point, I'd like to put some increased evidence forward for the idea that the Parshendi are the true inhabitents of Roshar, who initally went to war against humanity for reasons that were somewhat understandable. Perhaps they were even created by Adonalsium when it was on Roshar, but that is irreleveant. Firstly, I'd like to point out that the Parshendi are unable to bond with the Nahel spren. I interpret this to mean that the Parshendi were unable to bond with the Nahel spren because they were closer to the Cognitive Realm than other peoples. This allowed them their forms, but they were not well-rooted enough in the Physical realm to form Nahel bonds with the most intelligent spren. However, then for whatever reason, human refugees arrived, I believe fleeing an attack by Odium onto their home planet of Braize, in the company of Honor and Cultivation. And they could bond with the Nahel spren just fine. However, they also were doing what humans do and conquering the Parshendi land with the help of these powers, and powerful spren such as the Stormfather, who they called traitor. They beat the Parshendi and drove them back into Braize, which was now a hellish nightmare, thanks to Odium. They called this place Damnation. I believe some memory of this conquest can be seen in this Death Rattle. The Parshendi, who had been around for much longer, felt betrayed by the spren, who gave humans some fantasitc abilities. How could the Parshendi hope to match them? This is echoed here, with disturbing implications. At this point, I believe Odium saw what had happened happening, and realized that he had had a stroke of good fortune. His army was here. They were angry, they wanted their homes back. So, he and the Unmade made an accord with them. They would give them new forms, forms of power, in exchange for destroying humanity. The Parshendi agreed, without realizing the trick. Once they took on these forms and bonded with Odium's voidspren, they were his Voidbringers, scourge of Roshar. This is shown here. The Parshendi songs even claim that the gods gave them powers similar to the human Surges. Another quote again mentions that it was crafted by the Unmade. This also explains something else. The Last Legion may not have been able to remember a time when they were free to chose their own form, but it used to be so, before humanity arrived. So although time has dulled the specifics, the ideas of the forms themselves remain. There is one quote that seems important that I cannot make sense of, though. Ideas on what this means are welcome. All in all, I think this is a pretty solid interpretation of early Rosharan history and the conflict between the humans and the Voidbringers. Obviously some of the details may be wrong, but I think the outlines are on the right track.

I've been thinking a lot about the Unmade and their nature, given at how consistently they've been hinted at. They're assumed to have quite the connection with Odium / Rayse, and that makes me think they'll be a major factor in the lead up and eventual conflict between the Knights Radiant and the Voidbringers ... in some fashion or another. With that having been said, I wanted to document a few of the facts we have about the Unmade, as well as some theories or logical assumptions about each of the presumed Unmade. Oh, I'm also of the opinion that each of the Unmade either corresponds to one of the orders of Knights Radiant, or one of the Heralds, as symmetry is WAY TOO IMPORTANT on Roshar. As such, for many of the Unmade, I've got an educated guess as to where they might fall on the old double-eye diagram. I'd say this is pure theory at this point, so feel free to disregard as you see fit. General Unmade Knowledge We have some record / reference from Taravingian (an awesome source of Unmade factoids) that one of the Unmade is an "ancient, evil spren", I believe. A current theory that I subscribe to is that the Unmade are, for lack of a better term, powerful Odiumspren. I'm not sure if these spren need to bond to a person (listener or human) to be a "fully powered" Unmade, but it stands to reason that they may. I also believe that we have some recent Word of Brandon that there aren't necessarily ten Unmade. That would throw a monkeywrench into my Unmade-tie-to-KR-orders theory, but hey, that's okay. Yelig-nar (aka Blightwind) Yelig-nar is the only absolutely, positively, confirmed Unmade at this time. I mean if you can't trust Nohadon, who can you trust? Abilities: Yelig-nar apparently has the ability to kill, somewhat directly. It is the Unmade that is most personified, having broken into Nohadon's chancery (sounds like personification) and killed his wordsmen. Yelig-nar is also reportedly able to speak, though he "consumed" people and their wails accompanied him. Yikes. Association: As we'll discuss in some of the later sections of Unmade, Yelig-nar appears to be the most personified of the Unmade we currently know of, as well as one of them with the most direction and personal agency. So, given that and his nickname of "Blightwind", I'd say he's a good candidate to correspond to the Windrunners or Jezerien. Yelig-nar may not necessarily be the leader of the Unmade (if they have one), but it appears to be one of the more combat-focused Unmade at this time. Given what little we know about the Radiants still, this certainly could allow it to match up with the Radiants we know the most about. Moelach Thanks to Taravingian and his Diagram, we can say with almost complete certainty that Moelach is also an Unmade. Epigraphs 81 and 82 in Words of Radiance are two back-to-back paragraphs. While 81 talks about the nature of the Unmade, 82 talks specifically about one of them: Moelach. It's fair to say he's an Unmade. Abilities: Given what Taravingian has said, it appears that Moelach is responsible for the Death Rattles, which appear to be both precognitive and past-cognitive (wordsmith!) visions that take place at the moment before death. Interestingly, this doesn't necessarily appear to be a *bad* thing for the Radiants, etc. Where the abilities of many of the other Unmade (or projected Unmade) seem to be "evil" or "harmful" ... this one, not so much. It leads me to think that there's something else going on here that we're not aware of yet, or an additional ability. Also, Moelach is referred to as one of the Unmade with the most powerful precognitive abilities, which are shared by nearly all Unmade / Voidbringers. Interesting. Association: Welp, the precognition / visions aspect of this pretty clearly draws a line between Moelach and the Truthwatchers or Pailiah. We don't know much about the Truthwatchers (or anyone, really), but this seems to be a pretty seamless fit. Both focus very, very strongly on visions of the future. Nergaoul Again, due to Taravingian's meddling exposition, we learn of a potential Unmade. Nergaoul is referred to in the context of the Alethi Thrill, and that finding where the Thrill is strongest might help pinpoint Nergaoul. With that in mind, the way the Thrill can be seen as similar to the Death Rattles, and even the similarities in name composition between Nergaoul and Moelach (compounded vowels), we're not crazy to consider this another of the Unmade. Abilities: Nergaoul appears be responsible for, or at least have some connection to, the Thrill. The Thrill appears to be a feeling of battle-lust, or a drive to kill. WHAT A JERK. That pretty heavily smacks of Odium, and those whom we most closely align to Honor (Dalinar, Kaladin, etc.) seem to reject the Thrill, while Eshonai seems to embrace it with her stormform. Association: The first thing that came to me is how the Thrill seems to be the innate opposite of the dispassionate judgement of "Darkness". I'm inclined to place Nergaoul as linked to the Skybreakers or Nalan. Where the killing / judgement handed out by the Skybreakers appears to be logical, lawful, and in the best cases, just ... the Thrill's killing is wanton, indiscriminate, and furious. No thanks. Re-Shephir (aka the Midnight Mother) Watch, as we move from the realm of informed speculation to the realm of slightly-less-informed speculation. Re-Shephir is mentioned briefly in Epigraph 58 of WoK as the Midnight Mother ... but the Death Rattles have shared information (we think) about the Unmade in the past. Between that and the naming similarities between Yelig-nar, I think we have another Unmade here. Abilities: Re-Shephir's abilities are an open question still. The epigraph mentions giving birth to abominations, using her "essence", so it seems fairly logical to assume that Re-Shephir is responsible for creating the Midnight Essence. These strange, monstrous creatures are some that Dalinar fought during his visions of the past, and appear to be core enemies of the earlier Knights Radiant. Association: My first inclination is that the Midnight Mother's ability to create, albeit in a relatively non-creative fashion (the Midnight Essence appear to be roughly all the same), and create something totally black (as in, without light), makes me think of the Lightweavers or Shallash. Though, to be fair, a void-spun Progression surge might make sense here too. Again, knowing precious little about the Unmade, the Radiants, basically everything, this is only an informed guess. Dai-gonarthis (aka the Black Fisher) Again, we're using hints to assume that Dai-gonarthis is an Unmade, nothing more. It's name sounds like that of Yelig-nar and Re-Shephir. It is referred to in the Death Rattles, much like Re-Shephir. And that's all we've really got. Abilities: Oh, we know so very little. Something about holding sorrow and consuming it. Someone asking to "let me hurt, let me weep". Dai-gonarthis may do something to the emotions of a person, suppressing them, feeding off of them, something. It's all wild speculation, really. Association: Seriously, I've got nothing here. We simply don't know enough. I'm not convinced it holds any association with a few of the orders we seem to know the most about ... I'd be surprised if it's associated with the Windrunners, Lightweavers, Truthwatchers, or Edgedancers. But who really knows. If I had to hazard a rough guess, it may be associated with the Willshapers or Kalak. And that's mostly because the Willshapers order name seems to indicate something to do with an emotion / thought. Also, I don't know a thing about them either. So that matches up nice. Sja-anat Sja-anat is referenced in another of Dalinar's visions, mentioned by a soldier and a Radiant prior to the Thunderclast battle at the Purelake. Like Dai-gonarthis and Re-Shephir, this name has the unique dashes, and appears to be involved with Odium. Hence, it's a reasonable guess that we've got another of the Unmade here. Abilities: We don't know much about Sja-anat, Here's what we know: "Once Sja-anat touches a spren, it acts strange." The spren spotted by Dalinar had red eyes, and was referred to as "Sja-anat's spy". Ostensibly, this means that Sja-anat has the ability to change a spren by "touch", perhaps corrupting it. On a side note, the Thunderclast that appeared didn't have any direct reference to Sja-anat, it was more of a guardian, so I'm not taking it to mean anything directly associated to Sja-anat ... yet. Association: When we talk about changing things by touch, we're talking about Soulcasting, right? So perhaps Sja-anat associates to the Elsecallers or Battar. This actually makes a lot of sense ... the Elsecallers were the foremost intermediaries between man and spren, so changing spren through touch sounds very, very close to something a voidish relation to an Elsecaller might do. So that leaves us with, at this time, five six presumed Unmade. There are hints at others that may be possible, but not mentioned yet by name. For example, is Venli influenced by one of the Unmade? Are Thunderclasts associated with the Unmade? How about Gavilar's sphere? Is the "black piper" an Unmade as well? But as for right now, I think this is about all that we know about the specific Unmade. (Edited to add Sja-anat.) (Later edited to add general info.)

Okay. This is borderline a joke, but it just fits. This epigraph has always bothered me because it doesn't make sense with what we know. Three of sixteen ruled, but now the broken one reigns implies four entities of Shardic power, with Odium as one of the three. I believe I might have solved it. It all chalks down to basic human error. These death rattles are the ones recorded by Taravangian, so we have no way of actually knowing whether or not they had the right word. The one I have in mind is "reigns"... What if, the dying person actually meant, "Three of sixteen ruled, but now the broken one rains?" Dalinar describes the Stormfather as broken many times, and the spren just seems... off. Throughout many situations in both WoK and WoR, he does things that don't seem particularly smart or honorable. And the Stormfather is in charge of the highstorms. So, whaddya all think? Silly coincidence, or possible theory? (Also, if anyone has said this before, I'm sorry).

In searching for some other quotes, I came across something that might be an interesting tidbit. The wording is what sparked my mind. Hypothesis: The Desolation is a world-hopping event, and either creates a breach directly to Braize, or transfers things from Braize to Roshar. Evidence: • Odium is suspected to be located on Braize, also called Damnation by Vorinism • The Heralds are tortured in Damnation, or Braize • The return of the Heralds occurs at the same time as the Desolation • The Desolations are preceded by the arrival of a previously unknown on Roshar creature known as the Midnight Essence, seemingly unrelated to the Desolation • The True Desolation is related to a giant storm, the Everstorm, which could have investiture powers on the same scale as the Highstorms • The Spren are particularly wary of the Desolation, and sensitive to it's arrival. Spren live in the cognitive realm, the known method of worldhopping • The Voidbringers were said to be cast back to the 'Tranquiline Halls', a Vorinism belief that corresponds potentially to Yolen (the origin of humanity) • The Odium spren began to appear around the time of the Desolation, and Odium is believed to be on Braize Possible Conclusions: It seems likely that the Desolation itself, in whatever particular form it takes, is a worldhopping event. It is possible that the Desolation is simply the opening of a corridor between Braize and Roshar, causing a variety of creatures to appear in Roshar to wreak havoc. As we have very little specifics about what the Desolation itself is, a more complete conclusion cannot be drawn. Edit: Colloary It strikes me that I missed a vital implication. If the Parshendi are in fact Voidbringers, and the Voidbringers came/were driven to another world at the end of most desolations, it seems logical that the Parshendi were in fact the native race of Braize, not Roshar as some have theorized. They crossed during the world hopping event of the desolations. That would leave the Aimians (confirmed by WoB to be not-human) as the native people of Roshar.

“True Wit is Nature to advantage dress’d What oft was thought, but ne’er so well expressed” [ASIDE: In the Spirit of Sanderson, I thought I’d begin with an epigraph of my own, this one from Essay on Criticism, the 1709 poem by Alexander Pope. Unlike our Wit, Pope was a hunch-backed asthmatic dwarf. But, like Wit, Pope was the leading satirist of his time. His jibes earned him the enmity of many. Tupac and the Notorious B.I.G. were not the original “gangstas”; when Pope wandered the London streets at night, he took with him two loaded pistols and his two Great Danes (what an image!) You’ve all heard many of the lines from Essay on Criticism, but might not have known their source. Here are a few: “Fools rush in where angels fear to tread”; “A little learning is a dangerous thing”; “To err is human, to forgive, divine.” ASIDE OVER – thanks for reading this far!] On WoR’s last page, Wit says to Jasnah, “You’ll find God in the same place you’re going to find salvation from this mess…Inside the hearts of men.” Of similar import is this phrase from the epigraph to Chapter 71, from the Second Letter: “[Rayse] bears the weight of God’s own divine hatred, separated from the virtues that gave it context.” [Second aside: Does that mean the Second Letter writer considers Adonalsium to be God?] I believe these statements capture the theme of The Stormlight Archives, and perhaps all of the Cosmere novels: the importance of balance. Not necessarily of “harmony,” which assumes perfect equilibrium, but of balance, offsetting characteristics that temper the edges of each. The shattering of Adonalsium upset the balance of the Cosmere by giving primacy to specific aspects of Godhood: Honor, Hatred, Growth, Ruin, Preservation, etc. Maybe it’s the imbalance of each Shard holder that causes them to lose their humanity, since each Shardic Intent operates within them unopposed. I think Wit’s statement to Jasnah means that to defeat Odium, men’s hearts must return to honor – doing what’s right and not only what’s legal. That doesn’t mean that people won’t hate, but that hate cannot be allowed to dominate them – balance is necessary. Sadeas and Nalan appear to be character devices to illustrate what happens when imbalance captures the heart. Adolin may end up showing us balance despite his lapse. As I’ve said in other posts, Honor binds, Odium divides – centripetal and centrifugal forces. To find the place in the middle, they must be combined – not the harmony of Mistborn, but a complementary tension. I think the Battle of Champions in Book 5 will be fought by Kaladin and Eshonai (not Szeth, who is clearly unbalanced in every meaning of that word and will likely continue his story into the second five books). Halfway through her bonding with the stormspren, Eshonai tried to halt the process. This may have caused an imperfect bonding and may explain why the rhythms of peace still try to assert themselves within her. I predict that during the Battle of Champions, her desire for peace will defeat her desire for destruction. Eshonai and Kaladin together will form that unity, that bonding of honor, that will enable them to halt Odium’s gains – the Everstorm may or may not continue at that point, but Odium will be temporarily thwarted. In the second five books, he will seek another approach: hatred among men. Odium is already a long way towards reaching that goal (see Jah Keved and the wars in the West). One last observation: before WoR was released, I speculated on another post what Odium gains by the Desolations and the Everstorm. Based on the Second Letter, epigraph to Chapter 69, we now know that Odium is bound to the Rosharian planetary system: “Rayse is captive. He cannot leave the system he now inhabits. His destructive potential is, therefore, inhibited.” The natural inference is that he seeks to destroy Roshar to free himself from his bonds. The Second Letter writer further states (in the epigraph to Chapter 70) that this binding might have been by “Tanavast’s design.” One can envision that either the Oathpact or Tanavast’s splintering might have had the effect of causing Odium to be so bound. How interesting, then, that Hoid/Wit, who has “never been a force for equilibrium” and who “tow chaos behind [him] like a corpse dragged by one leg through the snow” (epigraph to Chapter 74) should be the one who seeks to re-establish equilibrium by focusing on “men’s hearts.” He may be (reluctantly) content to destroy humankind on Roshar if necessary to triumph over Odium, he tells Dalinar. But if humankind is to save itself, it must find balance within its own hearts.

I think the duel excerpt shows us Adolin's evolution and challenge. It is theorized that a form of the Thrill is of Odium. I imagine the fight for Adolin's soul going on in the duel. He is being tempted by Odium's influence, but is starting to see another way. In tWoK Dalinar moves from feeling an unholy Thrill to fighting while regretting the necessity. Is Adolin going through the same evolution? Dalinar at the Tower: Adolin in the duel: What do people think? Is Adolin's behavior in the duel influenced by Odium? Is he being tempted? Is the sudden fading of the Thrill due to another, more Honorable influence? What does he mean when he says that "he'd never before felt like this"?

For the longest time I've only had the audiobook of The Way of Kings, so for my birthday I decided to get a signed copy. Since I heard that you could ask a question when you got it personalized I asked: "Is the Rear Endsheat about Cultivation's or Odium's magic system? Does it involve Fabrials, Gemhearts, or Voidbringers?" This was my response: For the record I don't think the current theory about it being Odium's system for Voidbringers is correct. I think that it is Cultivation's magic system, involving the use of gemhearts from certain greatshells to create the fabrials that replicate the various surges. Unfortunately, when I tried to make my question fit within the character limit on the personalization, I left the question a little to open ended. I'm trying to decided if this tells us anything new, so I'm posting it here for help. There is also a mark on the top of the book near the Interludes between Part 3 and 4, but I don't think that means anything. If Peter or Brandon reads this, I would like to say Thank You. I know asking for this right near the release of WoR couldn't have made things easier, so I really appreciate you taking the time to do this for me.

I wonder if one of the important Shards on Roshar might actually be named Desolation, instead of, or in addition to, Odium. In the preview chapters for WoR, there are several instances where characters (mainly Darkness) refers to Desolation coming. Not "a" desolation, not "the" desolation, but Desolation, as in a proper-noun type entity. So, maybe Odium has evolved to Desolation, ala Harmony=Ruin+Preservation? Or Desolation is another Shard in the Greater Roshar area, coming to team-up? Curious as to what everyone's thoughts are. ***** EDIT: Thanks for the feedback! I posted below (http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/5897-odium-or-desolation/#entry94384) with an updated theory, and updated post title from "Odium or Desolation?" to "Odium, Desolation, and Recreance"

I did a quick search but didnt see these ideas, at least in concise form so my apologies if I'm repeating. This involves a theory on how mortals and spren interact.

Hi guys! I've done a bit of searching, and I don't think this has come up before... (I have been wrong in the past, though) I think that Odium combines elements of music and chaos to produce an intent/being that is focused on change, possibly for the sake of change. The thought that sparked this was comparing Odium to the character of Loki (specifically from the Marvel universe - the turning into a horse thing was a bit weird in the actual mythology). In the Marvel Universe, Loki is the go-to bad guy, especially in the movies, but for someone so smart, he is always thwarted by heroes, and will generally net a positive result. (Thor movie: Thor realises his destiny, becomes better person; Avengers: Avengers are formed to fight high level threats, etc) With Odium in play, I can see his purpose as to bring about change and oppose stagnation. Honor's ideals would probably lead to a civilisation where everyone acted the same, spoke the same and generally got along great. Boring, right? You wouldn't have any growth or true creativity in that world. So, Odium starts smashing toys. The actions of Odium may not be inherently evil, like the actions of Ruin. They just serve a purpose. If Honor were to turn around and start destroying things everywhere, I think Odium would oppose him by trying to bring order. Just as it would seek to make Cultivation's life difficult. When it comes to Odium shattering other Shards, this could be an extension of that opposition, or an influence by it's human host. Now, for some reason these ideas make me think of music. Over the years, you can observe trends and ideas that recur in music - boy bands will always crop up, no matter how hard we try to educate youth in how terrible they are. Country music will never die, and sometimes singers leave a huge impact, like Elvis, The Beatles, or Queen (foreshadowing my own post!) Throughout these common aspects, there is always change - dubstep, techno, and eventually inserting Christmas beetles into one's ear canal have all cropped up to produce new concepts that push the definition of music. Over time, Odium is producing new ideas regarding life and how it should be lived. Some will stick, and leave an impact, but others will fall by the wayside. This theory is why I believe that the Parshendi are of Odium, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. Their WoR chapter talks about how music influences their forms and pushes them to new highs or lows, much as music will produce an emotional response. Once we get a good look at the timeline since the Oathpact, I think we'll see a sort of rhapsody - a composition that shifts style frequently, yet it's beauty can be derived from this constant flux. Each individual piece may not make sense on it's own, but as a part of the whole... One last note: the name Odium is one that I assumed was a nonsense word, but if you split it, you'd get Ode-ium ("of music?") Seeing as the last few paragraphs started with "O" I was going to go back and change them all so they'd do the same. But I think the chaos flowing into consistency helps my point. What do you all think? Have I finally come up with a solid theory? Hopefully there's some discussion points in there!

I was rereading Hero of Ages, and I began to wonder about something. Why did Honor/Tanavast decide on using the Oathpact in the first place? Shouldn't he have done the honorable thing and sacrificed himself to kill Odium? Even if Odium had somehow become more powerful than him, couldn't he have attempted to imprison him by sacrificing his mind, as Preservation imprisoned Ruin? Any thoughts on why he didn't go with either of these strategies?

"They were suddenly dangerous. Like a calm day that became a tempest." "...I believe it may reference the Voidbringers" page 471: Chapter 30: Darkness Unseen. "They changed, even as we fought them. Like shadows they were, that can transform as the flame dances. Never underestimate them because of what you first see." page 499: Chapter 33: Cymatics. "Born from the darkness, they bear its taint still, marked upon their bodies much as the fire marks their souls." Page 553: Chapter 38: Envisager First Theory: Odium will take control of the peaceful Parshmen and suddenly change their form and they will be very dangerous. (Possibly used as Voidbringers or just one piece of a much more complex puzzle.) Second Theory: This was a plan that Odium has had for a long time (possibly after the Last Desolation or thereabouts). He foresaw that humanity could not pass up on perfect obedient slaves and somehow tampered with regular Parshendi to make them like Parshmen instead. Now humans took the Parshmen as slaves and spread them across Roshar (Odium did not do this himself rather knew it would happen due to man's nature). Third Theory: These new parshmen will be able to utilize stormlight in some fashion or another. (Not so sure about this one.) Now to combine the theories: Parshmen have been strategically placed (see the second theory for what I mean by this) all over Roshar by Odium, and that in a moment Odium will utilize their telepathic ability and change them into a very dangerous form and then use them as "Voidbringers" or tools of them to accomplish his purposes. Odium or a servant of his will have complete control over them and use them in whatever way he sees fit. I think this is part of the reason why Jashnah has discovered that Parshendi are possibly the Voidbringers. Perhaps it is not the Parshendi race rather the parshmen. Some other quotes that might help this theory: (The green are my comments) "Death upon the lips. Sound upon the air. Char upon the skin." Page 567: Chapter 40: Eyes of Red and Blue. (The sound upon the air could be the way Odium or a servant issues his commands to the Parshmen who have been changed into something much more dangerous.) "They take away the light, wherever they lurk. Skin that is burned." Page 676: Chapter 48: Strawberry (They will be able to take in stormlight and use it for evil) "Flame and Char. Skin so terrible. Eyes like pits of blackness." Page 696. Chapter 50: Backbreaker Powder. (The dark eyes could reflect that they do not have have control over themselves but are rather animated by Odium or a servant of his) ------------------- From another book where this sort of thing occurred: Spoiler from the book A Fire Upon the Deep by Vernor Vinge. If anyone has read the book Fire Upon the Deep by Vernor Vinge then you will be familiar with this concept as demonstrated with Skode Riders and the Blight.

I'm sorry if this all comes out as rambling, it goes against several other theories about shardblades, and may be a bit weak, but I'm sort of just building off something I came up with. *Spoilers follow* We know from the Well of Ascension plot twist, that Brandon Sanderson likes a good plot twist, especially in relation to corruption, so is it possible we're meant to have one here? The Knights Radiant wielded shardblades given to them by the heralds (agents of Honor) in the last desolation, but yet Syl (and Honorspren) in referring to Dalinar's forfeited shardblade remarks: "It just feels wrong to me. I hate it. I'm glad he got rid of it. Makes him a better man" Now is it just me, or is hate a fairly strong emotion, an emotion that would be more at home with someone affiliated with Odium rather than Honor? Now I understand that Odium provokes hatred from others, so if the Shardblades are of Odium, they would provoke hatred from someone affiliated with honor, like Syl and like Kaladin when he passed up on the blade earlier. But in the alternative could Odium seek to triumph on Roshar by corrupting the now splintered Honor to make the spren of the Knights Radiant 'hate' the shardblades the Knights Radiant so effectively wielded, and separate the Knights Radiant from their weapons.

Thesis: Darkness has been corrupted by Odium. I suspect that his scar may be involved in the corruption, but that is not essential to the theory. This is something that happened sometime after the events of the Prelude. A. Support: Undocumented theory: Odium has corruption magic Support for undocumented theory that Odium has corruption magic: Dalinar's vision includes the following snippet which could indicate corruption: “Just keep your eyes open, once Ja-ana touches them they are different. They act strange. ...” Hemalurgy is a magic that changes other investiture. Ruin and Odium seem somewhat similar. Corruption seems like a tool that fits Odium's intent. There are at least several references to Voidbringers possessing people. Possession seems like a form of corruption. B. Darkness attempts to murder people who are doing good things. C. Darkness is described as having "Dead eyes" by Lift. D. Darkness is described as an "abomination" by Wyndle, who also says that "There is something very wrong with that man! He is not right, not right at all." E. Baxil's mistress, also widely considered to be a Herald, is described as "amazing. Wonderful, intoxicating, overwhelming." The reporters are obviously different and Darkness' indifference could be a perversion of confidence. The deadness of Darkness seems stronger to me than can be explained by corrupted attributes. Prediction is the test of a theory: I therefor predict that any Heralds that are described as dead or abominations will turn out to have been corrupted by Odium post-Prelude. Please note: This theory is meant to be completely compatible with Darkness=Nalan, Argent's Fallen Heralds theory and Isomere's "Heralds and Intent" theory. Basically, I claim that Darkness is corrupted beyond warped heraldic intent and survivor guilt. This corruption could have occurred in conjunction with the prominent scar on his face. Edit: Baxil's mistress point, clarify that influence occurred after Aharietam, prediction.

This quote, to me, must refer to the Shards. Honor's focus is on the sky when he says them. This is then accentuated by the fact he says that 'he' (Odium) is coming for him (Honor). So the first they is the Shards. I would assume then that the lights disappearing are Shards being shattered by Odium, before coming for Honor. However, we've only seen one shardworld where Shards have been shattered (Sel). I'd say one light would be from Sel. Though there were two shards shattered on Sel, I would have thought that the lights would be of shard worlds. Thoughts? Are there any WoB on this?

I've been rereading the Way of Kings and posting questions as I read regarding mysteries and details I never noticed before, you can read all that on my other thread. However this is for something entirely different. I want to posit a theory about the nature between the conflict between Odium and Honor. What if the conflict between Odium and Honor is actually some kind of test or wager? There are several things that lead me to believe this: 1) When the Heralds die they are sent to a place that is presumed to be a domain of Odium there enduring torture before being sent back to die again in a conflict. They are sent there even if they win the battle. Wouldn't it make more sense that they would be sent to another place less hellish? In fact the place of chains and hooks is stated to be the reason for why the Heralds no longer have a will to endure the seemingly endless desolation. 2) Dalinar and Kaladin are both tested severely over the course of the book. When Dalinar finally goes on a plateua assault against the Parshendi, he is filled with the Thrill and then with disgust for the violence surrounding him. Kaladin on the other hand is constantly besieged by a melancholy that tells him that he can't save those around him only to push through it and finally succeed in saving his bridge crew. In Mistborn there were subtle hints early on that Ruin was whispering in Vin's mind and influencing her thoughts. 3) One of the major themes of the book is living up to commitments and doing the honorable things even though it would be easier and more profitable to not do so. Most of the characters seem to experience periods of darkness when an inner voice causes them to doubt while another inner voice encourages them. 4) Several characters and groups are shown voluntary giving up objects of power only to have it turn out better for them in the end. Kaladin gives up his Shard Plate and Blade to take care of his men. Dalinar gives his Blade to purchase the lives of Saddeas' bridge crews and the Radiants give up their weapons and armor by the hundreds in Dalinar's visions. This action of giving up an important piece of something precious is eerily familiar to the actions taking by Preservation against Ruin. The nearest analogue that I have for this scenario would be the story of Job about how God and Satan agreed beforehand that Job could be tried in all things to prove his commitment and honor to God. However this being a Brandon Sanderson novel, the model has to be tweaked. One possibility is that Odium and Honor struck a deal which has Honor lost or is very close to losing. Honor being the embodiment of living up to his commitments willingly allowed himself to be splintered and killed if he promised to do so. Going back to the Heralds in the prologue, they mention that they hope that having Talanel still bound to the Oathpact will be "enough." Enough for what? Enough to keep Odium from completely winning the deal? Does that mean that if Talanel fails in his duty the Oathpact will be completely shattered and the Last Desolation will begin? Why do I think this is a plausible theory? One of the things that Mistborn showed us was that all Shardholders are equally matched, they are unable to destroy one another. Ruin was only imprisoned by Preservation when he sacrificed his cognitive self to imprison Ruin's mind. The only three ways that I can think for a Shardholder to actually take down another Shardholder: 1) The Shardholder willing allows a part of himself to be weakened or invested thereby making him weaker and easier to take down. 2) For a Shardholder to gain an additional Shard essentially doubling his power (However this might cause someone to become non invasive in their actions like Harmony seems to be). 3) For two Shardholders to actively pursue and engage a single Shardholder. If this is the case, that means that Odium can only kill Shardholders and splinter Shards with the help of someone else. Brandon has mentioned that there is an as yet unrevealed Shardholder who simply wants to survive, could this possibly be a Shardholder who is helping Odium splinter other Shards in exchange for living just a little while longer? Or is it that Odium is simply better at using the Shard's own influence against their Holders? Honor could be easily manipulated into splitting himself or making a personal sacrifice. He would always strive to do the right thing and live up to a commitment, even if that commitment meant his own destruction. The same could be said for the other splintered shards on Sel and Nalthis.

Okay so I've been thinking recently, we know that the agreements made by gods are things that mere mortals have difficulty understanding (see Sazed's reference to Leras and Ati's pact about creating and destroying the world). We also know that Odium and Honor came to an agreement of some kind, one where each of them is bound by specific rules. That means that there is something which governs interactions between the gods of the Cosmere. So my specific thinking is this, Odium and Honor had an agreement regarding something martial (as evidenced by Honor's reference to a champion) and it clearly had something to do with the Desolations. I also think that the Heralds torture between Desolations was apart of that. Then the Heralds breaking their oath was something which fractured the pact between Odium and Honor, which may have freed Odium from whatever rules were governing their interactions, which in turn allowed him to kill Honor. My personal theory is that a Shard's power is what would force these agreements to matter, or at least a Shard's intent would have to be bent to it. Does this make sense? Any thoughts?

Maybe more baseless speculation, than theory, since we don't have much evidence available here, but I've always wondered how Odium was responsible for the splintering of at least 3 shards. Honor, you can kind of understand, in that Odium spent a lot of time in the Rosharan system, and probably invested less of himself in the population than Honor did, or somehow got the better of Honor with the Oathpact. I guess we will find out in the Stormlight Archive. But Devotion and Dominion? He managed to splinter both of them, despite not being long on Sel (in relationship to his time in the Rosharan system, anyway). You would think Devotion and Dominion together could've beat Odium on their home turf. The most logical conclusion I can make is that Odium somehow was able to pit Devotion and Dominion against each other. They are not opposites in the manner of Ruin and Preservation, and may have some natural conflict, but I think that Odium (perhaps by his very nature, and/or by clever manipulation of world events) somehow amplified and/or set them against each other. Hoid's letter says that Aona and Skai are both dead, not that Odium killed them, which Hoid probably would've said outright, if it was true. Odium was responsible, but did not act directly against them (as he could not have overcome them directly, especially in so short a time on their homeground, given how long it took him to kill Honor). This could also have led to the split between Shu-Korath and Shu-Dereth. I realize that split occurred after the splintering, but the societal forces that Odium set in motion earlier could have made such a split inevitable, even far later in the timeline.

One of the mysteries presented to the reader in the prelude to the Stormlight Archive is the nature of the Oathpact that is broken by the Heralds. A possible reason behind this pact occurred to me recently and it relates to a particular well known story from the Bible, the story of Job. To those not familiar with said story: Job is a very prosperous man who is both righteous and pious. God is very proud of Job but Satan claims that Job is only righteous because he is so sheltered. Satan wagers with God that if he were to take everything away from Job then he would not be so pious. God takes the wager and allows Satan to do what he wants short of taking Job's life. Satan tries everything but fails to get Job to curse God. The possible parallel with the Oathpact lies in the deal between two deities with people caught in the middle. In the Almighty's last message to Dalinar he says that it might be possible to get Odium to choose a champion. This implies that it is possible in some circumstances to make deals with Odium and so it might not be ridiculous to conjecture that deals have been struck in the past. There is also precedent for deals between two opposing Shards in Brandon's other Cosmere books. If the Almighty is Honor as many suspect then maybe Honor and Odium made a wager on whether humans could be broken and made to discard their honor for selfish reasons. This would explain why the Heralds had to endure torment between desolations, this was a test of how long they could last. Furthermore, if Honor and Odium made this deal then, presumably, a lot rode on the outcome. Possibly even the fate of the Shards and of Roshar itself. If this was the case then that would mean that 9 out of 10 Heralds forsaking the Oathpact would deal a crushing, possibly fatal, blow to Honor. I have seen it noted that, curiously enough, the Heralds don't mention Honor and only mention the Almighty in passing. Comparing this to the story of Job then this might mean that the Heralds were unaware of this wager and only thought that they were defending humanity from the desolations when the real battle was for their virtue. This only just occurred to me and I couldn't find any mention of this parallel being drawn anywhere so I decided to post it. I hope I'm not just reposting something that has already been discussed.

I have been wondering for a long time just what has become of Cultivation and I've come up with a new theory for us to sink our teeth into. In the Tanavallah I claim this image represents Odium's magic system. There are many aspects of the picture that lead me to that conclusion, and I'll summarize the main points to support that. The real goal though is to discuss the parts of the image that don't fit with Odium and to follow those down the rabbit hole. The symbols of fire and shadow are everywhere, including the outstretched arms of the woman, the swirling flames on top and the ribbons of darkness on bottom, the fireballs in all four corners, the lightning bolts and shadow bolts between Voids and Orders, and the dramatic contrast between red shard and swirling darkness. These all point to Odium since his minions are invariably described with fire and shadow. The Void Glyphs are another hint. They are formed by partially inverting the Surge Glyphs from the Knights Radiant Table which ruins the perfect symmetry. Violating symmetry fits with Odium upsetting the balance created by the Almighty. Also, the inversion may represent negative interference in the Surge itself. We know the power of creation is a wave with pulse length and frequency. If you hit this wave with its inversion the two would obliterate each other similar to noise cancellation headphones. But instead of destroying sound this unravels creation itself, leaving nothing but an empty Void. Now to the parts that don't fit with Odium. Instead of Honorblades, all of the Orders are represented by different animals. The red one in the bottom right is a crab. The red one on the left has six legs and bunny ears. The green one in the middle is almost certainly a lurg. The purple one on the left has horns. Each of them is either a whole body picture or a face depicting an animal. Using living creatures as your Order icons just doesn't strike me as very Odious. Another big problem I see is gender. We know from Hoids Letter that Rayse is a man, yet the only person in this chart is female. That seems incongruous. Why would a chart designed to represent a man have four images of the same woman? A third point against Odium is location. The adjacent image is a map of Shadesmar, with the same woman motif surrounding it. We know Odium is on Braise, a different planet in the Roshar system. Why then is the chart linked to Shadesmar? This suggests that something other than Odium is being referenced. Many people believe that the chart is about Cultivation's magic system. That provides a nice parallel, with Honor linked to the physical world and Cultivation linked to Shadesmar. The animals fit as her symbols, and the female motif makes more sense if it is representing Cultivation. Unfortunately, if this is Cultivation's chart then the fire and shadow references and the glyph asymmetry are terribly out of place. So how do we reconcile these seeming contradictions? Lets take a closer look at the woman depicted here. When I first studied her I saw the right hand representing fire and left representing shadow, both symbols of Odium. But now I see something else. The entire image is a mixed message, combining symbols of both Odium and Cultivation. Perhaps the right hand represents cultivation in her natural state, and the shadowed left hand represents some imprint of Odium. There is evidence both on Roshar and Sel that odium can command dead souls to possess humans and force them to do evil acts. Is it possible this was done with the holder of a Shard? It would explain why the chart for Cultivation's magic would be so dark and foreboding, and reconcile the symbols of odium that pervade the image. There are many many places where cultivation could be, but I'd like to add "possessed by evil spirits and fighting for control of her shard while hiding in Shadesmar". EDIT: Renamed the thread and added spoiler warning.