Jump to content

Search the Community

Showing results for tags 'knights radiant'.

  • Search By Tags

    Type tags separated by commas.
  • Search By Author

Content Type


Categories

  • Brandon and Book News
  • Events, Signings, & Giveaways
  • Columns and Features
  • Site News
  • Shardcast

Forums

  • 17th Shard
    • Introduce Yourself!
    • 17th Shard Discussion
    • The Coppermind Wiki
    • Arcanum Discussion
  • Brandon Sanderson
    • General Brandon Discussion
    • Events and Signings
    • Sanderson Fan Works
    • Arcanum, the Brandon Sanderson Archive
  • Spoiler Zone
    • The Sunlit Man (No Cosmere Spoilers)
    • The Sunlit Man (Cosmere Spoilers)
  • The Cosmere
    • Cosmere Q&A
    • Cosmere Discussion
    • Stormlight Archive
    • Mistborn
    • Other Cosmere
  • Non-Cosmere Works
    • Cytoverse
    • Other Non-Cosmere
    • The Wheel of Time
  • Related Works
    • Writing Excuses and Intentionally Blank
    • Reading Excuses
    • Sanderson Curiosities & Unpublished Works
    • TWG Archive
  • Community
    • General Discussion
    • Entertainment Discussion
    • Forum Games & Random Stuff
    • Creator's Corner
    • Role-Playing
    • Social Groups, Clans, and Guilds

Blogs

  • Chaos' Blog
  • Leinton's Blog
  • 17th Shard Blog
  • KChan's Blog
  • Puck's Blag
  • Brandon's Blog
  • The Name of your Blog
  • Darth Squirrely's Blog
  • Tales of a Firebug
  • borborygmus' Blog
  • Zeadman's Blog
  • zas678's Blog
  • The Basement
  • Addy's Avocations
  • Seshperankh's Blog
  • First time reading The Well Of Ascension
  • Zarepath's Blog
  • "I Have Opinions About Books"
  • Test
  • Which actors would you like to see playing the characters of Mistborn?
  • Drifted Mists
  • Jaron's Realm
  • Roshar Speculative Theories
  • ChrisHamatake's Blog
  • Paradox Flint's Blog
  • Deoradhan's Blog
  • Storm Blessed's Blog
  • Elwynn's Blog
  • firstRainbowRose's Blog
  • Rotabush ShardBlog
  • Hoid's Compendium
  • InterContinental Adventures
  • Claincy Creates
  • Theories, quotes, and details to keep it all straight.
  • WoR Thoughts and Questions
  • Blogfalcon
  • David Coppercloud's Blog
  • yurisses' notes and theories
  • Lark Adventures
  • LUNA's Poetry
  • Inspiration Board
  • Trying to be Useful for a Change
  • Cosmere Nerd Things
  • The Way of Toasters
  • An Elephant's Blog
  • Shhh Spoilers for Ronald.
  • Wyn's Adventures in Geekiness
  • Words With Ene
  • Dapper's Blog
  • Things to talk about, stuff to do
  • Zelly's Healthy-Accountability Blog
  • Dapper's Music Blog
  • GM Test Blog
  • Rhythm of War Liveblog
  • Zephy’s Art Blog
  • Axioms Idioms & Adages
  • Weather Reports
  • Unnecessarily Overcomplicated
  • 5
  • The Blog of Dubious Copyright Legality
  • Trutharchivist's Rambles
  • Xino's corner of insanity
  • The Perfect Space Opera
  • My Journey Through Roshar (A Liveblog)
  • Lost Metal Liveblog by ccstat
  • D&D campaign design.
  • My Depression Log
  • Story Ideas and Whatnot
  • deltarune AU concept.
  • How I Relate to Every Character in The Stormlight Archive
  • A thing
  • random jank and jabber.
  • FNF crem

Find results in...

Find results that contain...


Date Created

  • Start

    End


Last Updated

  • Start

    End


Filter by number of...

Joined

  • Start

    End


Group


Website URL


AIM


MSN


ICQ


Yahoo


Jabber


Skype


Member Title


Location


Interests

  1. THEORY IN BRIEF I believe the Surges keep Odium captive in the Rosharian planetary system. As part of his long-term plan, Odium causes the listeners to create the Everstorm. The Everstorm will block the Highstorms’ reinvestment of Stormlight on Roshar. Without that reinvestment, the Surges will not be able to renew themselves. Roshar will break apart, and Odium will be free to leave the Roshar system. While the Everstorm circles, the human and other survivors will find themselves besieged in Urithiru surrounded by the Voidbringer hosts. Urithiru’s Stormlight resources will be severely depleted. To restore them, Kaladin will break free of the siege, travel to the Origin, and bring back to Urithiru substantial new Stormlight reserves. Urithiru will then be capable of fighting the Voidbringers and holding out far longer than Odium expects. Odium, fearing he may lose this war, will be forced to accept the challenge of a duel of champions. Kaladin will defeat Odium’s champion, reestablishing Odium’s captivity. “TANAVAST’S DESIGN” OF ODIUM’S CAPTIVITY The Rosharian System Imprisons Odium The writer of the “second letter” claims Odium cannot leave the Rosharian system: “Rayse is captive. He cannot leave the system he now inhabits. His destructive potential is, therefore, inhibited.” (Epigraph to WoR Chapter 69.) The writer is unsure “[w]hether this was Tanavast’s design or not…” (Epigraph to WoR Chapter 70.) The Surges Form the Prison The WoR Ars Arcanum author believes the ten Surges – “thought to be the fundamental forces by which [Roshar] operates – are more accurately a representation of the ten basic abilities offered to the Heralds, and then the Knights Radiant, by their bonds.” (WoR Hardcover, p. 1084.) The in-world Words of Radiance author describes the Surges as “the bonds that drive Roshar itself.” (WoR Epigraph to Chapter 38, emphasis added.) If the Surges do not accurately describe the “fundamental forces” of Roshar, then Honor must have had some other reason for placing them on Roshar. Whether by design or not, the result of their creation was to imprison Odium in the Rosharian system. Evidence The best proof that the Surges imprison Odium is the action he takes to escape his captivity. That is the Everstorm. Honor fears the Everstorm will cause Roshar to fall into dust. (WoK Paperback, pp. 1244-45.). That is the expected result when the “bonds that drive Roshar itself” – that literally hold the planet together – are stripped away. Odium has no other reason to destroy Roshar. If he simply wanted to splinter Cultivation, he does not need to destroy Roshar to do so. He did not destroy Sel when he splintered Devotion and Dominion there and he did not previously destroy Roshar when he splintered Honor. The destruction of Roshar is simply the by-product of the elimination of the Surges. That is why I conclude that the Surges are the instruments of Odium’s captivity. ODIUM’S PLAN TO FREE HIMSELF Stormlight Reinvests Roshar’s Magic, Including the Surges Odium’s plan is to interrupt the cycle of magical reinvestment on Roshar, causing the Surges to fail. WoB (somewhere) states that magical investiture is generally a renewable resource. On Roshar, Stormlight is the means of that renewal. Kaladin describes Stormlight as “the Surges reduced to some primal form.” (WoR Hardcover, p. 469.) WoB analogizes Stormlight to the mist in Mistborn, It is the gaseous state of Honor’s (and Cultivation’s?) investiture on Roshar. Two Elements to Odium’s Plan Odium’s plan has two broad elements. The first is to soak up existing Stormlight through the creation of a horde of Voidbringers. Voidbringers, according to Szeth, can “hold [stormlight] in perfectly” (WoK Paperback, p. 13). The second element is to block the Highstorms’ reinvestment of Stormlight. The Everstorm accomplishes both elements. The Everstorm will gain strength with each of its revolutions around Roshar. Its next pass will convert the Parshmen into Stormform listeners. During future passes, these new listeners will add their song to what the Shattered Plains listeners started, increasing the size and scope of the Everstorm. In his dream Kaladin sees the Everstorm as “so enormous as to make the continent – the world itself – into nothing by comparison“ – much bigger than when the Everstorm began on the Shattered Plains. (WoR Hardback, p. 369, emphasis in original.) Because the Everstorm moves in the opposite direction from the Highstorms, as it grows in force it will first prevent the Highstorms from reaching the Rosharian continent. Eventually the Everstorm may prevent Highstorms from forming at all, blowing them away at their birth. WoB states Highstorms were initially a meteorological event, but at some point became magical as well, presumably through the addition of Stormlight. We don’t know how Stormlight gets added to the Highstorms, although it’s a safe guess that that occurs at the Origin. Regardless, it seems reasonable to assume that a catastrophic storm multiples larger than a Highstorm should be able to kill a Highstorm in its cradle. The Diagram’s Prediction Taravangian’s Diagram seems to agree that the Everstorm is Odium’s path to freedom: "destroy [the listeners] outright before [one of them] obtains their power. ​It will form a bridge." (Epigraph to WoR Chapter 89, reformatted and emphasis added.) I interpret this statement to mean the Everstorm (created by the listeners’ “power”) is the bridge by which Odium will escape the Rosharian system. Odium’s Plan to Destroy Surgebinders Part of Odium’s plan has been to thwart or destroy those who might oppose him – Surgebinders: the Heralds and the KR. Odium has used several tactics to implement this stratagem: First, he influenced nine of the Heralds to abandon the Oathpact (as many in this Forum have speculated). Second, I believe Odium caused the Recreance (whatever its apparent immediate cause) to break up the KR and eliminate them. Third, he influenced Nale to kill fledging surgebinders (as many in this Forum have speculated) so the KR could not reestablish itself. Fourth, he caused the listeners to create the Everstorm. If the Everstorm can eliminate Stormlight, neither the Heralds nor the KR will be able to surgebind, When Odium first set upon his plan, he was dealing only with the Heralds, inefficient users of Stormlight through their Honorblades. The spren, perhaps in anticipation of the Everstorm, created the Nahel bond with humans, a much more efficient means of using Stormlight and, hence, the Surges. This flaw in Odium’s plan enables the KR to hold out longer than Odium expects during the Siege of Urithiru. Odium’s Plan Began Many Millenia Ago Odium has been planning for the Everstorm a long time. The Stormfather tells Dalinar that the Everstorm is “a new thing, but old of design.” (WoR Hardcover, p. 1070.) The Desolations began as a war by one of Roshar’s native populations, the listeners, to repel the human invaders of Roshar. WoB states there were no Desolations before humans came to Roshar. The humans won these wars, evicting the listeners from more and more territory. Hatred of humans led some of the listeners to become “unmade” by Odium into his creatures. These listener “gods” introduced the forms of power. Through these forms, Odium began to wield influence among the listeners. Further losses to humans over the millennia led the Lost Legion to abandon their gods. Before the final battle of the Last Desolation, Melishi the Bondsmith developed his plan to enslave listeners by stripping them of their spren rather than destroying them (or so many suspect). I believe Odium influenced Melishi to adopt this plan so that Odium would have potential Stormform listeners available to him when the time came. There has been no Desolation for the past four millennia because Odium realized he didn’t need to cause one – that humankind itself was capable of sufficient hatred without external influence. Thus, Honor tells Dalinar that “[Odium]’s realized that you, given time, will become your own enemies. That he doesn’t need to fight you. Not if he can make you forget, make you turn against one another…” (WoK Paperback, p. 1246, emphasis in original.) Human forgetfulness has made them ignore Parshmen until the time comes for Odium to use them. Recent Events Gavilar came into contact with descendants of the Lost Legion a year or two before SA began. We can assume he found the black stone that he gave to Szeth at about the same time, since that is when Gavilar “changed” (according to several characters). WoB states that the light in that stone is not Stormlight and heavily implies it is a form of Odium’s investiture. Part of Gavilar’s changed behavior was to become more religious. He also joined/founded the Sons of Honor, with Amaram. Their goal was to bring back the Voidbringers so the Heralds would return. I believe Odium influenced Gavilar in these respects. I also believe Odium influenced Gavilar to share his plan with the visiting listeners, anticipating the listeners would assassinate Gavilar and start the War of Vengeance. (Perhaps it will turn out that Amaram suggested to Gavilar that he do this.) The war reduced the listeners to a state where they were willing to embrace the Everstorm. Odium influenced Venli to re-discover Stormform rather than the forms of peace, as Eshonai expected. We know the rest... HOW ODIUM WILL BE DEFEATED It begins with the re-founding of the KR and their re-occupation of Urithiru. I believe Honor’s plea to Dalinar to “unite them” has multiple levels: unite the KR, unite all humankind, and unite all of Roshar’s peoples, ancient and nouveau. Honor binds, hatred divides – a strong theme of SA. All will join in the war, including some of the Heralds, eventually finding their way to Urithiru. Honor says to Dalinar: “The sun approaches the horizon. The Everstorm comes. The True Desolation. The Night of Sorrows. You must prepare. Build of your people a fortress of strength and peace, a wall to resist the winds.” (WoK Paperback, p. 1242.) Urithiru is shaped with the eastward side flat and the westward side curved to withstand the Everstorm – “a wall to resist the winds.” Honor calls the Everstorm the “Night of Sorrows” because of the extended period of darkness the Everstorm will bring. Members of the New KR Not coincidentally, the KR we currently know or anticipate includes members of different countries and races: at least four from Alethkar (Dalinar, Kaladin, Renarin and Jasnah), one from Jah Keved (Shallan), one from the Reshi Isles (Lift), and one (probably) from Shinovar (Szeth). To these, I believe we can add the following characters (and maybe some others we haven’t met yet): Eshonai. Her fall into the chasms will find Eshonai reunited with her mother and the listeners who escaped Eshonai’s coup. Here her comet spren will finally chase away the stormspren and bond with her, making her a Willshaper – the first listener KR. (It’s hard to imagine her having a book otherwise…) Rysn. Whether or not Rysn (from Thaylenah) ends up a KR, she will be crucial nonetheless because of her Larkin. If she does become a KR, she will be a Releaser/Dustbringer because she is both astonishingly brave (foolhardy?) and obedient (to a fault). She already has had two Interludes… Ym. Since Ym (from Iri) had the Surge of Progression, I’m not convinced he’s dead. If Jasnah, without that Surge, could survive a stab through the heart, I think someone with that Surge should be able to survive as well. Though he was “killed” with a shardblade, so was Szeth, whom Nale resurrected with a Progression fabrial. Ym might have saved himself with his own Progression Surge. Probably a Truthwatcher. Zahel. As a Returned with Divine Breath and access to the Spiritual Realm, Zahel is an ideal candidate for a Bondsmith. By the time he reaches Urithiru, he may have recovered Nightblood. Nightblood will be ecstatic fighting the Voidbringers – so much evil investiture to consume, so little time…I’ll make a prediction here: Nightblood will be the means of destroying Odium, consuming every last bit of his Shard. I suspect that won’t be in SA though. Axies. I’m not sure whether Axies the Collector will be a KR, but if so, I believe he will also be a Bondsmith. Either way, his knowledge of spren will be enormously valuable to the anti-Odium faction: He will find a way to reverse the effects of Odium’s influence on the listeners who adopted the forms of power. Kaladin/Fleet Will Seek New Stormlight Reserves By the time we reach the last book in the series, the Everstorm survivors will be making their last stand at Urithiru, surrounded by the Voidbringer host. The Everstorm will have caused the near divestiture of all of Roshar’s Stormlight by interfering with the Highstorms. Urithiru’s Stormlight reserves will be almost gone, incapacitating the KR. Things will be looking bad for our heroes… In desperation, Kaladin will use the remaining Stormlight reserves to seek out the Origin. The KR will launch a sortie to distract the Voidbringers. Because Kaladin is Fleet, he will race out of Urithiru and make his escape. But where is the Origin? The Origin Is on One of Roshar’s Moons! I believe Kaladin will find Stormlight on one of Roshar’s moons. Here is a WoB on point: Q: “Do the moons relate to the Highstorms at all?” A: “The moons...at all? Sure! You'll love this. The star's age, at Roshar – Earth astronomers would say that is a star which could not have planets with life on them orbiting it.” I interpret Brandon’s oblique, but pertinent, answer in context to mean that the Stormlight that invests the Highstorms and brings life to Roshar comes from one of the moons. He tells us that Roshar should not have life on it, yet it does. He’s tells us in another WoB that “Stormlight makes plants grow” (written into a fan’s book). And his answer here comes in response to a question about the relationship between Roshar’s moons and Highstorms. Here’s another relevant WoB: Q: “If [a Windrunner had] enough heating fabrials and enough Stormlight, how high up could [he] go?” A: “He could theoretically break orbit if he has Stormlight for air, and he could manipulate gravity. They have actually figured how long it would take to make it to the various moons.” I don’t believe the Sanderson Crew did that calculation just for fun. It has to be relevant to the story line. Peter has said that the moons come very close to Roshar during the night: “Roshar's moons are much much closer than our moon. Their elliptical orbits bring them closer to Roshar's surface during the night…” (For an excellent discussion of the astronomy of the Rosharian moons, check out this thread.) It should take Kaladin about two hours to reach the moon that is the Origin (though it is still unclear which one it is). The Larkin Stores the Stormlight Kaladin will take Rysn’s Larkin with him to the moon, where it will store enormous amounts of Stormlight to bring back. Will this increase the Larkin’s size, perhaps turning it into some kind of Greatshell? Will it be able to fly back itself? Will Rysn give it a name…? (Personally, I like Lex Larkin.) Kaladin may suffer significant damage from his potential over-exposure to the Origin’s Stormlight, perhaps crystallizing him like one of Dalinar’s soulcasters. Syl warned him of Stormlight over-exposure in WoR. I suspect that the Larkin will protect Kaladin by absorbing the excess Stormlight from him. The Duel of Champions With the new Stormlight reserves, the Siege of Urithiru will hold out long enough to persuade Odium to agree to a battle of champions: “Vex Odium, convince him that he can lose, and appoint a champion…” (WoR, p. 76.) Kaladin will go up against something representing Odium, and Kaladin will defeat it. (It wouldn’t be much of a story otherwise…) The good guys win, and hatred is again put back in the bottle Some intriguing questions and observations: As a Son of Honor (a real one, not like Gavilar and Amaram), Kaladin will not cheat during the duel. But his opponent will, perhaps with help from other Voidbringers. Will Kaladin be restricted only to the Windrunner Surges? Will his trip to the Origin change him in any way, allowing him access to other powers or Surges? Can he be given the non-Jezrien Honorblades for other Surges, even if he only uses Syl as his shard-weapon? Will he have enough Stormlight to use them all? The End. Thanks for reading!
  2. While looking at the WoR “Ars Arcanum,” chart, a thought occurred: it seems that each KR order’s primary Divine Attribute is what attracts the requisite spren to that person in the first place (the “input”), and the secondary Divine Attribute is the “output” – how that person behaves once the Nahel bond is in place. Here are the Divine Attributes for each order: KR Order Primary Attribute Secondary Attribute Windrunners Protecting Leading Skybreakers Just Confident Dustrbringers Brave Obedient Edgedancers Loving Healing Truthwatchers Learned Giving LIghtweavers Creative Honest Elsecallers Wise Careful Willshapers Resolute Builder Stonewards Dependable Resourceful Bondsmiths Pious Guiding Here’s what I think happens: A Windrunner’s protectiveness attracts an honorspren, after which the Windrunner leads (Honor’s “binding” nature). A Skybreaker’s innate sense of justice attracts a highspren, after which the Skybreaker is more confident in making his or her judgments. A Dustbringer’s bravery attracts its spren, after which the Dustbringer tempers his or her courage (which can often be foolhardy) with adherence to others (“obedience”). An Edgedancer’s love, post-bond, enables him or her to heal. The benefit of a Truthwatcher’s erudition, post-bond, is given to others. A Lightweaver’s creativity, post-bond, allows others to see their true selves. An Elsecaller’s wisdom, post-bond, makes him or her more careful. A Willshaper’s resoluteness, post-bond, enables him or her to build. A Stoneward’s dependability, post-bond, makes him or her more resourceful. A Bondsmith’s piety, post-bond, helps guide others. With some of these, its hard to distinguish whether the KR always evidenced both Attributes, contrary to my suggestion, or whether the secondary Attribute kicked in after the bonding. In others (Edgedancers and Lightweavers, for example), I think my suggestion works pretty well. This probably lacks much significance, but I still found it interesting.
  3. This is referring to the 'Front Endsheet' diagram that shows the relationship between the KR Orders and the surges. We know that: 1) The diagram represents the 10 orders (through the large glyphs), and that the order's heralds are in the boundaries radially associated with their sponsored order. The color of the Order glyph corresponds to the color associated with the Order and the gem associated with the Herald. 2) The Surges are represented by the smaller glyphs, and have an edge to two adjacent Surges as well as an edge to the two Orders that use that Surge. Observations: 1) All of the Orders have at least 3 edges connecting to other Orders. The Order graph exhibits point symmetry around the center. The 3 common set of Order edges are 2 edges to Orders sharing a Surge and 1 edge to the point-symmetric opposite Order. 2) 4 Orders have 4 edges instead of 3. These are the Windrunners, Edgedancers, Lightweavers and Stonewards. These 'extra' edges are plane-symmetric relative to the horizontal line (the axis parallel to the double-eye's long axis), i.e. Windrunners <=> Edgedancers, Lightweavers <=> Stonewards. 3) Note that this means all of the Orders have a connection across the horizontal axes; for the 4 Orders outside of the 'box' it's one of their adjacent-Order edges, while for Bondsmiths and Truthcallers it's their point-symmetry edge. 4) All of the Heralds above the line are male. All of the Heralds below the line are female (I also have a meta-theory on this relationship for the modern Radiant archetype character). Hypotheses: 1) The vertical axis is the Honor-Cultivation axis. The Orders closest to Honor are Stonewards and Windrunners, and the Surges closest to Honor are Adhesion and Tension. The Orders closest to Cultivation are Lightweavers and Edgedancers, and the Surges closest to Cultivation are Progression and Illumination. 2) The horizontal axis is the Cognitive-Physical axis. The Orders closest to the Cognitive are Willshapers and Elsecallers, and Transportation is the Surge closest to the Cognitive. The Orders closest to the Physical are Skybreakers and Releasers, and Division is the Surge closest to the Physical. 3) The Heralds are/were associated with Honor and Cultivation as appropriate based on their position on the chart. The genders are not coincidental but related to their Shard association. 4) The point-symmetry edge is indicative of the relationship of the associated Order's spren (e.g. Windrunner <=> Lightweaver). 5) There's some connection between the Orders horizontal symmetry edge still not explored. I'm assuming that this related picture might be the Voidbinding equivalent, but I'm not sure if there's been any information about that diagram (anyone know?).
  4. Hello! Long time lurker, not-so-long-time poster. I'm doing a very slow (I have 3.5 yo twins, so EVERYTHING I do is slow) re-read of The Way of Kings and when I was reading the scene where Dalinar was fighting the Chasmfiend, it became really apparent that he was instinctively surgebinding. Points of evidence (although without quotes as I am at work and my book is at home): 1.) As he is sliding / tumbling, his shardplate seems to "know" which way it should be oriented and helps him land on his feet. No other users of shardplate seem to comment on this. 2.) From Adolin's viewpoint, he notices that Dalinar is moving with a strength, speed, and grace even more than would be granted by plate alone - this seems like Kaladin's enhanced skill with the spear. 3.) Adolin also states that Dalinar's shardplate seemed to be glowing. This is similar to how KR had glowing shardplate in the Highstorm flashback. And all of this was happening when Dalinar was LIVING the ideals of the KR as fully as possible - Going to rescue Elkohar - instead of when he felt the Thrill. It all seemed too much like when Kaladin was training with the spear and Syl was initially drawn to him to not be a similar parallel. There were hints all through WoK that Kaladin was going to be a KR, and I think this was a big clue that Dalinar was headed the same way. (Of course, now with WoR, this is probably obvious. I haven't read it [YET], and I have been TRYING to stay away from spoiler threads, but alas, I am weak and the internet is omnipresent.)
  5. My very first Theory! After reading that WoB about an unpublished KR Ideal: "I will stand when others fall," I had an idea for a new one: "I will guide/be a light for those in the darkness." I think this one would be good for whichever order is the pious/guiding one. Thoughts, suggestions, or thrown tomatoes?
  6. We've seen that a modern day Surgebinder who tries to use Shardplate just has their Stormlight sucked away, but we've also seen that the historic Knights Radiant had no such problem. They could also summon and dismiss their Plate to at least a partial extent. So obviously they were capable of doing things with Plate that a modern Shardbearer simply cannot, just as they can't do the things with a Shardblade that Kaladin and Shallan have learnt to do. My theory is that one of those functions of Shardplate was to serve as a reservoir for Stormlight. The KR have an elegance and ease to their powers that the modern day characters still lack, and one of the clumsiest things remaining is the need to store Stormlight in gems. A Surgebinder needs to carry around gems or hold their breath to maintain their supply of Stormlight, but if a KR could truly summon their Plate like their Blades then they might be able to access their reservoir of Stormlight at a moment's notice. It'd also save on unnecessary glowing. I think the reason that modern Shardplate sucks up Stormlight might be that it's not properly bound to the Surgebinder, so the Plate is trying to siphon it off for its true owner, kind of like how people can summon Shardblades by putting a gem on the Blade and tricking it into thinking they have a proper Nahel bond. Of course as a theory this is probably completely wrong. And good night.
  7. What I want to know is if Vasher could awaken his own Divine breath into a shardblade without dying? I assume conventional thought is if Divine breath leaves the body, the Returned dies. Maybe that only happens if the Divine Breath is consumed like it is when used to give divine healing. But on Roshar, you have a connection to investiture that is maintained spiritually without physical contact. Kaladin does not need to have Syl perched on her shoulder to surgebind. A bonded shardblade can be given to another and be used but still belongs to the Bondholder, and can be called back ten heartbeats later. So knowing something like that is possible, could Vasher use his Divine Breath to Awaken, and still be connected to it to maintain his Heightenings and his life? Could he solidify it into a shardblade he was still bonded to with the right command? Inquiring minds want to know! ALSO! In regards to investing a invested object, at the very least the power of Endowment can do so. When Breaths are given, not stored, or used to attempt to awaken, they always seem to transfer, even if the other side is unwilling. You may not be able to awaken a honorblade/shardblade, in a way that you could retrieve them, but if you used a command closer to the breath giving command than a awakening one, it should work. We know that there is some information stored in the breaths themselves, based on how WoB has said Divine Breath Healing works, where there is a bit of an Ideal contained in the breath itself. WoB is there is something in the "dead" shardblades that was broken and needed to be repaired when the Knights Radiant caused the Recreance. I see three possible ways to repair what was broken. 1. Hardest. The KR had a bond with their spren, So do modern shardbearers. I think it is the same bond, just broken by the KR, and that is why is takes a gem to establish and does not grant much. Also because modern shardholders to not actually offer anything to the bond at all. I think if you could identify the type of spren in the shard, and uncover the concepts behind all five of their oaths, and live a life by those oaths, possibly including saying them out loud, this would repair the damage caused by the previous bearers breaking them. Pros: no magic required. Cons: Living with all the downsides of being a KR, but none of the perks for an extended period. Also without a spren on your shoulder pointing you on the correct path. Finding the ideals you need to follow is hard without an existing five oath KR of the same order. 2. Moderate difficulty. Giving some amount of regular breaths to a "dead" shardblade to fill the gap caused by the broken oaths, either healing the damage completely, or mitigating it enough to allow them to begin to form a mutual bond there they can benefit from their human's "human-ness" and begin to heal themselves, which spren cannot do on their own. Pros: I think this is possible, and it could allow results much sooner and easier than in #1. As number one requires the equivalent of a 5 oath KR to heal the break, but this could begin healing by someone who was only capable of keeping the first oath currently. Cons: While WoB has said Breaths are very versatile, and much more is possible with them than is currently known, The specific command to do this is not known and would need to be researched. Breaths will also be permanently divested during research finding the command procedure, and to revive every dead blade, because you are giving them away as a effect to a living (but brain dead/thought locked) spren. They are alive enough not to be recoverable to you tried an awakening command, and are also investiture, which normally resists conflicting investiture. Which is why you have to use the properties of Endow breath to them to get around this, permanently giving them away. 3. Easiest Have a Returned expend their Divine Breath to instantly heal whatever damage the Recreance caused. Pros: The Divine Breath is a powerful splinter of Endowment, seemingly designed for this sort of thing. Using a Divine Breath defaults to perfectly healing the recipient. Cons: Only a Returned has a Divine Breath, and they are created on another world by a different shard. Choosing to do this kills the Returned. This is not actually giving away the investiture but using it so it returns to endowment, so there may be investiture vs investiture conflict. Since this is a specific specialized function of the divine breath, and is not detrimental to the recipient, I think it will work, but am not sure. edited for tags.
  8. So, many of you probably noticed the Larkin from the Rysn Interlude, a strange little creature with silver eyes, the same creature Darkness used to drain Lift's Awesomeness. Now, did you notice that there are two Larkin in the background of the Knights Radiant surge chart? I sure did. Any thoughts as to their relevance to Knights Radiance would be nice. We know they drain Stormlight, maybe they can also re purpose it? Are they the opposite of Lift? They take Stormlight and slowly digest it? If so, then they could be used as a pretty big Stormlight storage device. Thoughts? Opinions? Edit: Woot, this is post #100!
  9. The chart that Issac Stewert created, showing the ten orders of Knights Radiant and the ten surges shows lines connecting the various glyphs. Below I have a picture with the lines highlighted in different colors: Green = Surges for each of the different orders Blue and Orange = A "racetrack" type of organization for Orders and Surges respectively - - (Although, I'm not sure. If that were the case why not keep all the Orders on the outside, and Surges on the inside? If it were rearranged that way it would look like a wheel with the red lines becoming the spokes.) Red = ...No idea. Decoration perhaps? Anyone have any thoughts on this?
  10. To be a Knight Radiant and gain a Shardblade, you need to bond a spren. To gain a Shardplate, does that mean you need to bond another spren again, or your single spren will just expand to include a Shardplate? Seems to me that a Shardblade and a Shardplate is independent from each other. Say for example the modern Shardbearers who are using the Blades and Plates discarded by the Lost Radiants: It's not necessary that you're a Full Shardbearer. Some has only the Blade others only the Plate. I've read in the thread, Words of Brandon (compiled) that multiple spren bonding is possible. If a Knights Radiant bond different sprens, for example an honorspren and a cryptic, does that mean he's both a Windrunner and a Lightweaver or he'll just have to choose one order? If it's the latter option, I think a lot of politics will come at play. The orders will convince the Surgebinder to join their order... Any thoughts on this?
  11. I'm coming off a high of the Taravangian-esque diagramming happening in the "Hidden Things in the Map of Roshar" thread. So on that note, let's look at some cool things. I looked at one of the endsheets for Way of Kings, and I found this funny little glyph (rotated): I realize that there's speculation that this endsheet relates to Cultivation and has little to do with Honor and Surgebindings, but the two diagrams align so beautifully--lines and everything--that I figure that it has to be more than that. Also, the same lady hinted at being Cultivation is also found in the Shadesmar map, and as Shadesmar definitely has to do with more than Cultivation, I don't think I'm necessarily off the mark. If you overlay the colorful diagram with the Knights Radiant diagram--especially as highlighted and labeled by an earlier user--you'll notice that this corresponding Surge is that of Cohesion, which is shared by the Stonewards and Willshapers. You'll also notice, on the glyph that I highlighted, that it has a passing resemblance to Roshar's geographic makeup. I don't know exactly what the Stonewards and Willshapers did, but they were together capable of Cohesion, Tension, and Transportation. Dalinar's visions have ordered him to "unite them," and we ended Words of Radiance with the idea that he needed to unite the Knights Radiant--their different orders. I believe that the different orders, working together, were capable of doing much more than flying through the sky, healing mortal wounds, or just generally being "awesome." I believe that they might have had a role in the creation of Roshar itself--or that the powers they eventually wielded may have been utilized in its creation. Of course, someone might come along and say "that glyph doesn't mean anything like that." Still a cool thought.
  12. This theory is a simple one. Unlike the other orders of Knights Radiant, the Skybreakers never abandoned their oaths and disbanded. They have remained active, albeit covertly, under the control of Nalan. Firstly, I want to present evidence that one of the orders of Radiants never disbanded, at least entirely. This epigraph makes it quite apparent to me that one of the orders of Radiants stuck around for quite some time. Nalan offers Szeth a place in their ranks, and Helaran was apparently attempting to join them. It seems evident to me that for whatever reason, the Skybreakers refused to abandon their Blades and their oaths to stick around. As one final piece of evidence, I'd like to look at the spren. First, I'll establish the type of spren the Skybreakers were bonded to. Given Nalan's penchant for laws and one of the divine attributes of the Skybreakers being "just" this makes me fairly certain that the highspren belong to the Skybreakers. Now, lets look at who Jasnah goes to see for information while she is in Shadesmar. Why would she go to see the highspren? While I'm sure that they are knowledgeable, would not the spren of other orders be better? Why not see the spren of the Willshapers or the Elsecallers, her own spren? They are associated with knowledge and wisdom, surely they would be better equipped? But here, Pattern provides a clue. The answer is clear. She went to the highspren because they are the only spren who survived the Recreance because the Skybreakers did not abandon their oaths. They are the only ones who were alive during the Desolations.
  13. This isn't exactly a theory per say, but over the last few days I've been mulling over how Nahel Bonds develop, and compiled what we know about it in this list. I've tried to provide examples from the books for everything, but some stuff is a little iffy. Stages in the Nahel Bond: 0.5. Person goes through a traumatic (soul-breaking) experience that allows them to form a nahel bond. (Kaladin losing Tien, Shallan killing her father.) 1. Something about a person's cognitive aspect attracts a spren that is capable of bonding to them. a. At this stage, some very limited surgebinding ability develops. (Shallan’s first journey to Shadesmar.) 2. Inciting incident that solidifies the bond. (Kaladin rejecting the Shardblade (Maybe), Shallan admitting that she killed her father.) a. Spren begins to assume a Physical form. (Shallan begins seeing her Cryptic soon after this.) 3. Continued behaviour in line with what originally attracted the spren. a. Spren gains more control over its form, and starts to become more cognizant. (Syl making herself known to Kaladin.) Surgebinder slowly gains some increased skill and manipulating their Surges and utilizing Stormlight. (Kaladin begins to instinctively discover new abilities.) 4. Internalization/Vocalization of the Ideals a. Each one grants some sort of boost to the Surgebinder’s powers; greater Stormlight retention, more control over surges, perhaps even giving them access to Shardplate/blade. (Kaladin post Battle of the Tower) 5. Full Knight Radiant, fully bonded to their spren, having spoken all the Ideals for their order. Going by this, Elhokar (and maybe Dalinar) would be at one, Shallan at two, Ym at three, Jasnah would be four (maybe three, we don't know for sure if she's spoken any Ideals), Lift at four, and Kaladin would also be at four. Anything I missed? Anything I have completely wrong? Any crazy theories people want to make? EDIT: Ouch, just fixed the typo in the title now. That's embarrassing. EDIT #2: Made some changes based on the suggestions below.
  14. It seems to me that there is a marked difference between Kaladin and the reaction his Ideals invoke and the other Radiants. When he says the second Ideal: When he says the third Ideal: We don't ever see the other Radiants, or Radiants in training, have markedly visual examples of their change. Is it just his specific order? Or are Kaladin and Syl different than the other Nahel bonds?Also there's this: This is right before he first is able to lash himself to the wall, so maybe every Radiant will eventually see a part of Shadesmar, but so far only the Radiant orders involved with soulcasting and now Kaladin have done so that we see.Finally, I've mentioned this in other posts, but why is it that Kaladin, a man named for Kalak, is of the order of Jezrien? Shallan is in the order of her namesake, yet Kaladin isn't? Have we seen anyone else named for the Heralds in the series yet? It seems pretty suspect that Kaladin would be named for a Herald and be a superpowered Radiant, yet be of a different order. Mostly just some random musings on all this, but it gets me thinking. Just seeing if any others had some thoughts to add, or maybe contradictions to mull over.
  15. This is something that has been bothering me for a long time, and with Words of Radiance out, my... not concern, but quandary, let's say, has only grown. Specifically, I wonder how exact the Immortal Words, the Radiants' Ideals, have to be. The First Ideal, "Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination." sounds pretty solid, and I can't imagine it morphing into anything, even if it's related. But the others? Considering that at least one Order doesn't have set-in-stone rules (the Lightweavers who must speak Truths, not Ideals), is it wise to treat all of them the same way? Kaladin's Windrunner Ideals and Lift's "I will remember those who have been forgotten." could maybe work for all the members of their Orders, but Dalinar's? Shallan's? Lastly, there is the issue of the Stormfather officially accepting Kaladin's and Dalinar's Second Ideals. Does he get input with the Orders whose spren are closer to Honor than to Cultivation? Does he even have a choice on the matter - can he deny a Radiant's upgrade even if he or she speaks the correct Words? And if so, we loop back around - are there specific Words each (or at least some) Order must speak, or are they tailored individually? So let's take a stab at this. How do you think this will work? Do all of the Ideals offer some flexibility, or are there some that are set-in-stone, and some that are left to the Radiant's personality flaws?
  16. While I was reading something Marianmi posted here,http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6398-wor-chapter-84-code/page-14?hl=melishi#entry108343 It made me think that maybe the secret Taravangian is supposed to hold on to is that the Windrunners took up for the Parshendi when they were trying to break their natural ability to bond with spren. I think this is where morden day Parshendi came from, Windrunners helping some of them escape, maybe in dull form, but I cant see Windrunners being ok with turning a species into slaves. This information could be used to show that it was the Radiant's fault that the new desolation/everstorm was able to come again. So Melishi wanted to destroy all parshendi, but during the night had a better idea: destroy their bonds to the spren. This has something to do with the Bondsmith abilities probably. Pattern, on 10 Mar 2014 - 03:14 AM, said: Kazilah did not agree with this and eliberated the 12th legion of the parshmen. He was executed, because parshmen are an enemy even in peace. Pattern, on 10 Mar 2014 - 03:14 AM, said: A war started between the radiants, and the King of Makabakam took one side, sending (23k?) soldiers. Pattern, on 10 Mar 2014 - 03:14 AM, said: As the windrunners were fighting, probably against the Makabaki (from twok recreance vision: "they should be fighting the devils on the front lines", where devils = dark skinned makabaki) - when a betrayal happens. also note from same vision: "they can't have gotten through our lines, not with the radiants fighting..." - the radiants fighting (as in among themselves)... Pattern, on 10 Mar 2014 - 03:14 AM, said: so while the radiants were fighting, this act of great villainy happened, and was done by a secret society (amarams? ghostbloods?) even if the radiants were fighting among themselves, they all felt betrayed, and some of them withdrew from this fight. then, about 2000 of them attacked the society and (almost) destroy it. then they dropped their blades and severed their bonds, except for the skybreakers. so there were several betrayals, no doubt very well orchestrated. anyway, that;s my take on the events. Its got lots of maybes and holes but that's whats going through my head now.
  17. Hey guys and gals, I recorded last night's signing with Brandon Sanderson in "Los Angeles" aka Huntington Beach =P Along with getting a Shardhunt code, an R.A.F.O card, and the audio of the whole event. I also may have received a new Ideal of the Knights Radiant? A reply from an Oathgate? Who knows! My book is signed: All in all it was a long, but fun night. I had a great time talking with the other fans and even Brandon himself. The audio I've attached is about 45 minutes long. Enjoy! ~sbi WoR_Tour-03052014_Part01.mp3 WoR_Tour-03052014_Part02.mp3 WoR_Tour-03052014_Part03.mp3
  18. According to Dalinar's visions, Shardplates and Shardblades work differently in the "modern" era of Roshar than in the time of the Knights Radiant. Also there are a lot less shards in the world than there should be. Chapter 52 "Highway to the sun" page 730 Where did all the other blades go and why did the plate behave so differently? What if the plates and blades are made like fabrials,and are copies of the knights' equipment. Yes in that same chapter I quoted, people are picking up the Knights' blades and plate and fighting over them, but it doesn't show them using them. What happened to the missing equipment? What if it deteriorated without the Knights and their spren powering it? They could have copied the blades and plate. They copied surgebinder powers. Chapter 72 "Veristitalian" page 979 They didn't have those fabrials in the time of the Radiants. Chapter 62 "Right for Wrong" page 861 So the soulcasting fabrials must have been made later. They are close to making shards now. Maybe they made these copy shards in the past. If the shards are copies, then that could explain why they didn't feel right to Syl or Kaladin. It might also explain why windrunners in the past had shard plate, but Szeth could not use plate with his surgebinding powers. So what do you think?
  19. I'm trying to track how many oaths each Knight Radiant has made, and what the benefits were at each point. In particular, at what point do Knight Radiants acquire shardblades, shardplate, and control of their powers? First, Shallan: To the best of my knowledge, we have never actually SEEN Shallan take the First Oath, ("Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination.") However, we now know that Shallan possessed an active shardblade as a child, and that her spren, Pattern, was apparently present in a limited way when she was a child. I believe this indicates that Shallan must have spoken the First Oath as a child, and that her order, at least, recieves their shardblades after the First Oath. Shallan spoke a 'Truth' at the end of Way of Kings, which i believe counted as the Second Oath. The second oath seems to have granted her access to soulcasting, lightweaving, and absorbing stormlight. Shallan spoke another 'Truth' at the end of Word of Radiance: I THINK that counts as the Third Oath, but we haven't seen any special benefit of progressing that far. I would have thought that Knights Radiant would acquire Shard Plate by the time they speak the third oath, but apparently not. Second, Kaladin: Kaladin speaks the First Oath during Way of Kings. ("Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination.") I'm working from memory, but i believe that speaking that oath seemed to give him more reliable access to stormlight, gravity, and adhesion. Kaladin spoke SOMETHING else during Way of Kings, but I'm not certain that it counted as an oath. "I will protect those who cannot protect themselves". this MIGHT be the second oath, but i don't recall Kaladin gaining any special powers when he spoke it. it's also very similiar to what WAS an oath at the end of Words of Radiance: "I will protect even those I hate, so long as it is right." Either those two sentences together constitute the second oath, or they are the second and third oaths, respectively. Either way, Kaladin recieved HIS shardblade AFTER speaking the oath in WoR. this seems to imply that different orders recieve shardblades at different times. If Kaladin still has a third oath to speak, that would be the logical time for him to recieve shardplate. We don't know how many Oaths Renarin has spoken: so far, we only know that he can heal his eyesight, and can apparently communicate with his Spren. Dalinar has spoken two oaths at the end of WoR: It's implied that he MIGHT be due a shardblade after two oaths, but the Stormfather has refused to become one. Can anyone else comment on what milestones each of the knights radiant have reached at this point, and what benefits they recieved at each point? It's also possible that my notes could be incorrect, since I'm working from memory. Feel free to correct me.
  20. I finally decided to make an account after reading this site for a few months and being thoroughly impressed by the intelligence and politeness on these forums. Here are three questions I asked Brandon today in Seattle as he signed my books (I am shocked he didn't RAFO me): Question 1: Shardblades vs Hoed (Major WoR + Elantris Spoilers): Question 2: Function of the Skybreakers (Minor WoR Spoiler): Question 3: Adolin and the Knights Radiant (Major WoR Spoiler): My thoughts and Interpretations (Major WoR Spoiler): Thanks for Reading! Jerich P.S. It was nice to meet several of the 17th Sharders like Trickonometry and a charming Superfan who gave me her name which I promptly forgot... I will add it here if she posts to this thread:))
  21. I'm not sure if anyone has posted a list of all of the epilogues from Words of Radiance (The in-book book, not the Brandon book), but here they all are, in order not as they are shown, but in the order of the in-book chapter/page organization. Wow... This is really hard to explain... They are out of the order given to us, and put into the proper order. I included the chapter titles, page# and chapter# as included in the U.S. hardcover edition of the book. But as for Ishi’Elin, his was the part most important to their inception; he readily understood the implication of Surges being granted to men, and caused organization to be thrust upon them; as having too great power, he let it be known that he would destroy each and every one, unless they agreed to be bound by precepts and laws. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 2, page 4 “Mere Vapors” pg 479, ch 42 And thus were the disturbances in the Revv toparchy quieted, when, upon their ceasing to prosecute their civil dissentions, Nalan’Elin betook himself to finally accept the Skybreakers who had named him their master, when initially he had spurned their advances and, in his own interests, refused to countenance that which he deemed a pursuit of vanity and annoyance; this was the last of the Heralds to admit to such patronage. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 5, page 17 “The Ghostbloods” pg 486, ch 43 As to the other orders that were inferior in this visiting of the far realm of spren, the Elsecallers were prodigiously benevolent, allowing others as auxiliary to their visits and interactions; though they did never relinquish their place as prime liaisons with the great ones of the spren; the Lightweavers and Willshapers both also had an affinity to the same, though neither were the true masters of that realm. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 6, page 2 “Perfection” pg 617, ch 53 \ And now, if there was an uncut gem among the Radiants, it was the Willshapers; for though enterprising, they were erratic, and Invia wrote of them, ”capricious, frustrating, unreliable,” as taking it for granted that others would agree; this may have been an intolerant view, as often Invia expressed, for this order was said to be most varied, inconsistent in temperament save for a general love of adventure, novelty, or oddity. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 7, page 1 “Uncut Gems” pg 582, ch 50 They also, when they had settled their rulings in the nature of each bond’s placement, called the name of it the Nahel bond, with regard to its effect upon the souls of those caught in its grip; in this description, each was related to the bonds that drive Roshar itself, ten Surges, named in turn and two for each order; in this light, it can be seen that each order would by necessity share one Surge with each of its neighbors. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 8 page 6 “The Multiplied Strain of Simultaneous Infusion” pg 407, ch 35 Now, as the Truthwatchers were esoteric in nature, their order being formed entirely of those who never spoke or wrote what they did, in this lies frustration for those who would see their exceeding secrecy from the outside; they were not naturally inclined to explanation; and in the case of Corberon’s disagreements, their silence was not a sign of an exceeding abundance of disdain, but rather an exceeding abundance of tact. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 11, page 6 “Into the Sky” pg 597, ch 52 Malchin was stymied, for though he was inferior to none in the arts of war, he was not suitable for the Lightweavers; he wished for his oaths to be elementary and straightforward, and yet their spren were liberal, as to our comprehension, in definitions pertaining to this matter; the process included speaking truths as an approach to a threshold of self-awareness that Malchin could never attain. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 12, page 12 “To Kill the Wind” pg 665, ch 57 Now, as each order was thus matched to the nature and temperament of the Herald it named patron, there was none more archetypal of this than the Stonewards, who followed Talenat’Elin, Stonesinew, Herald of War: they thought it a point of virtue to exemplify resolve, strength, and dependability. Alas, they took less care for imprudent practice of their stubbornness, even in the face of proven error. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 13, page 1 “A Matter of Perspective” pg 430, ch 37 But as for the Bondsmiths, they had members only three, which number was not uncommon for them; nor did they seek to increase this by great bounds, for during the times of Madasa, only one of their order was in continual accompaniment of Urithiru and its thrones. Their spren was understood to be specific, and to persuade them to grow to the magnitude of the other orders was seen as seditious. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 16, page 14 “One Form of Justice” pg 499, ch 44 And when they were spoken of by the common folk, the Releasers claimed to be misjudged because of the dreadful nature of their power; and when they dealt with others, always were they firm in their claim that other epithets, notably “Dustbringers,” often heard in the common speech, were unacceptable substitutions, in particular for their similarity to the word “Voidbringers.” They did also exercise anger in great prejudice regarding it, though to many who speak, there was little difference between these two assemblies. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 17, page 11 “A New Woman” pg 418, ch 36 When Simol was informed of the arrival of the Edgedancers, a concealed consternation and terror, as is common in such cases, fell upon him; although they were not the most demanding of orders, their graceful, limber movements hid a deadliness that was, by this time, quite renowned; also, they were the most articulate and refined of the Radiants. -From Words of Radiance, chapter 20, page 12 “Patriots” pg 530, ch 46 Yet, were the orders not disheartened by so great a defeat, for the Lightweavers provided spiritual sustenance; they were enticed by those glorious creations to venture on a second assault. -From Words of Radiance, chapter 21, page 10 “Feminine Wiles” pg 547, ch 47 These Lightweavers, by no coincidence, included many who pursued the arts; namely: writers, artists, musicians, painters, sculptors. Considering the order’s general temperament, the tales of their strange and varied mnemonic abilities may have been embellished. -From Words of Radiance, chapter 21, page 10 “Watching the World Transform” pg 566, ch 49 There came also sixteen of the order of Windrunners, and with them a considerable number of squires, and finding in that place the Skybreakers dividing the innocent from the guilty, there ensued a great debate. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 28, page 3 “Veil’s Lesson” pg 625, ch 54 The considerable abilities of the Skybreakers for making such amounted to an almost divine skill, for which no specific Surge or spren grants capacity, but however the order came to such an aptitude, the fact of it was real and acknowledged even by their rivals. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 28, page 3 “The Rules of the Game” pg 636, ch 55 So Melishi retired to his tent, and resolved to destroy the Voidbringers upon the next day, but that night did present a different stratagem, related to the unique abilities of the Bondsmiths; and being hurried, he could make no specific account of his process; it was related to the very nature of the Heralds and their divine duties, an attribute the Bondsmiths alone could address. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 30, page 18 “Never Again” pg 675, ch 58 In short, if any presume Kazilah to be innocent, you must look at the facts and deny them in their entirety; to say that the Radiants were destitute of integrity for this execution of one of their own, one who had obviously fraternized with unwholesome elements, indicates the most slothful of reasoning; for the enemy’s baleful influence demanded vigilance on all occasions, of war and of peace. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 32, page 17 “Heirs” pg 590, ch 51 Twenty-three cohorts followed behind, that came from the contributions of the King of Makabakam, for though the bond between man and spren was at times inexplicable, the ability for bonded spren to manifest in our world rather than their own grew stronger through the course of the oaths given. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 35, page 9 “Whitespine Uncaged” pg 652, ch 56 Now, as the Windrunners were thus engaged, arose the event which has hitherto been referenced: namely, that discovery of some wicked thing of eminence, though whether it be some rogueries among the Radiants’ adherents or of some external origin, Avena would not suggest. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 6 “The Silent Storm” pg 437, ch 38 That they responded immediately and with great consternation is undeniable, as these were primary among those who would forswear and abandon their oaths. The term Recreance was no then applied, but has since become a popular title by which this event is named. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 6 “Palona” pg 458, ch 40 This act of great villainy went beyond the impudence which had hitherto been ascribed to the orders; as fighting was particularly intense at this time, many attributed this act to a sense of inherent betrayal; and after they withdrew, about two thousand made assault upon them, destroying much of the membership; but this was only nine of the ten, as one said they would not abandon their arms and flee, but instead entertained great subterfuge at the expense of the other nine. - From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 20 “Scars” pg 464 ch 41
  22. I was looking at the Knights Radiant chart and thinking about the two pupils. They represent orders 5 and 10 of the Knights Radiant. I started wondering about why they might be offset the way they are. If the Surges are shared between the Orders circularly, why not just use a circle? My thought was that the spren used by Order 10 had the most Honor while the spren used by Order 5 had the most Cultivation. We know that all spren are composed of some mixture of the two. However, assuming that 5=Renarin=Truthwatcher and 10=Dalinar=Bondsmith, we now potentially have some clues about the orders themseves. Dalinar is bound to a spren who is literally the spren of the Almighty, Honor. Renarin, besides the fact he'd have access to the very Cultivation-like Growth Surge, can to at least some extent see the future, not a talent of Honor: If the theory is correct, a spren would have more or less of one Shard depending on how close their order is to the pupil; Windrunners and Stonewards would be the next nearest to Honor, Lightweavers and Edgedancers the next nearest to Cultivation, and the last four Orders would be more balanced, leaning a little one way or the other. I could be looking too hard at a symbol -- the KR may have appropriated it from existing imagery or may have just created an abstract symbol themselves -- but I don't think so. I tend to feel that symbolism comes from somewhere.
  23. Hi all, first post here despite having lurked for a while. After finishing Words of Radiance and reading some theories being thrown around, I got to thinking of how each Surge "manifests", so to speak, and came up with a couple of ideas. 1) Cognitive and Spiritual effects of Surges From Word of Brian and Ars Arcanums (Arcana? Arcani?) from other Cosmere books, we know that forms of Investiture can be primarily Spiritual, Cognitive or Physical, so this line of thought might not even be valid reasoning. While we don't have direct contradiction, however, I will forge ahead. The more explored Surges so far have been the ones that Windrunners and Lightweavers have access to, namely Adhesion, Gravitation, Illumination and Transformation. We've also seen some Progression, a bit of Abrasion and a glimpse of Transportation. There might have been some unnoticed effects of other Surges being used, but I will exclude those from discussion unless they are explicitly shown. There has also been much speculation as to what effects the other Surges can produce. While all of those seem to have their roots in the Spiritual and/or Cognitive Realms, all of their effects seem to happen in the Physical Realm. An example of this would be a form of the Gravitation Surge, the basic Lashing, which changes the spiritual gravitational connection of an object from the planet to some other direction/location. The root of it is in the Spiritual Realm, but the effect is Physical. Now, if you look at something like the Metallic Arts on Scadrial, you will notice things like Soothing and Rioting, storing Identity, Investiture, determination, and several other effects (and stealing all of those) where the manifestation doesn't seem to relate to the Physical Realm. The AonDor system on Sel can be thought of as similar (several Aons have "abstract" meanings, such as Spirit, Love, etc, which wouldn't at first glance, be Physically inclined). Nalthis seems to be a mix, where Breath can grant Investiture to an object and Commands, convey some Cognitive aspect to whatever has been Awakened, which then affects the Physical Realm. Surges seem to be the odd one out, so far. Granted, it's early in the series, but that also allows some speculation on our part. My line of speculation is that at least some Surges have forms that we haven't seen yet, where they affect the Cognitive or Spiritual Realms. It would make a lot of sense, I think, for the Cohesion Surge to have a form where it would function possibly similar to tapping Feruchemical Duralumin, and possibly the Division Surge granting some function similar to storing Feruchemical Duralumin (or maybe the Cohesion Surge can be "reversed" like the Abrasion Surge, to create a bonding or inimical effect between people). From the Words of Radiance (the in-universe book) epigraphs, it seems like Orders such as the Bondsmiths, Elsecallers and Willshapers had administrative, guiding or ruling roles in society, or at least among the Radiants, while Skybreakers were recognizably good at judging. It would also make sense that the specific Surges of certain Orders could help them in their roles, possibly through these Spiritual or Cognitive effects. 2) Surges manifest differently between Orders This is more from a perspective of what seems to make sense, so to speak. Windrunners are purportedly the masters of the sky, flying around and being all comfortable up high. However, from what we see of Kaladin and Szeth, the only Surge they use while flying individually or fighting in the sky is Gravitation, and then only through the basic Lashing. Skybreakers, theoretically, have access to the exact same thing. Why wouldn't they be just as at home in the skies as Windrunners? Obviously the Adhesion Surge could help (decrease air pressure in front of you to fly faster, be less bothered by the wind, not have your skin flayed off by 500kph winds, etc), but that would require the Surge to work in the way we expect, and for Szeth not to be familiar with the more nuanced uses of the Surges outside of the Three Lashings. I recognize that this theory (if it can be called that) is slim, hanging from very few uses of Surges that we have seen, and one point against it is that both Ym and Lift, though being from different Orders, used Progression in the same way (Regrowth, to heal other people). But that can be explained by having adjacent Orders being able to access certain forms of the same Surges equally, but not others (eg, Skybreakers could maybe use a Reverse Lashing but not a basic Lashing). Having an off-topic comment right in the first post feels weird, but I want to make on anyway: haven't seen it mentioned in the forums yet, but my idea for one of the remaining Ideals for the Windrunners: "I will protect people from themselves, when needed." Comments and thoughts are welcomed, as seems to be the norm in these forums. I apologize for any grammatical or spelling mistakes, or oddly structured sentences and paragraphs, I'm not from an English speaking country. Cheers!
  24. So, I know a lot of people aren't going to like this - but here we go. Let's start off with the reasons people think that Dalinar is becoming a Radiant: The back cover implies about a Bondsmith whom many feel is the name of the last unknown order of the KR. He is acting more Honorably something we associate with KR His visions His obvious desire to reform the KR OK, I'm probably missing a few in there, but that's the gist of it. Now take a step back from your bias and your love for Dalinar (he is a bleeping amazing character). While I agree he is the Bondsmith (WoB have confirmed t he 5 PoV characters, and it would make sense if they matched up with the 5 titles on the cover) I personally believe that Bondsmith has a different meaning and is not an order of the KR. I think Dalinar is taking over for his brother and leading the front to reforging the Bond with the spren. What is another for when you forge something? You Smith something. This making me feel he is more playing the roll of Nohadon in the creation of the KR. I believe that he is the Bondsmith for the radiants and his actions are helping unite the world in preperation for the Everstorm. *Caveat* if there is a WoB stating he has a spren, just go ahead and tell me so I know my last 30 minutes looking up stuff was wasted for nothing. Pick it apart ladies and gentlemen!
  25. It seems that Roshar needs to be united in order to survive the impending Desolation. We currently have two separate individuals who are attempting to accomplish this task that we are aware of. Taravangian is the ruler of Kharbranth, a small city-state renowned for it's hospitals and the Palanaeum. He has thus far attempted to achieve the goal of unifying Roshar through assassination and through trying to interpret the future by listening to the death chants of innocent people he murders. To date he has eliminated close to twenty world leaders through assassination and murdered a large number of innocent civilians who were under his care. We have seen no indication that other plans are in motion to stabilize the nations affected as yet, though to be fair those plans have been eluded to. Taravangian appears to only be worried about eliminating any possible rival leaders thus far. Taravangian appears to be aware of the efforts of the second person attempting a unification at a smaller level and chose to order the assassination of Dalinar Kholin rather than make any effort to work with him. Dalinar Kholin is High Prince of War, uncle to King Elhokar of Alethkar. He is attempting to unify one of the most powerful nations on Roshar through politicking and an iron fist. He has prophetic dreams that appear to have been sent to him by a being he believes to be a god called Honor. Honor is dead and Dalinar is aware of this as well. Dalinar began his efforts to unite his fellow High Princes through political maneuvering and encouraging them to work together in concert against the current common foe of the Alethi people. This strategy failed dramatically at the plateau called The Tower when High Prince Sadeas deftly outmaneuvered Dalinar and stranded him along with his heir and a large portion of his men surrounded and cut off from retreat. It was only through the actions and rebellion of bridge four and it's leader Kaladin Stormblessed that Dalinar was capable of retreating and salvaging a quarter of the forces he had brought to battle. Having recognized the futility of trying to coerce his fellow High Princes to work together voluntarily, Dalinar has forcefully bent his nephew to his will with the goal of finally unifying his nation under the rule of the king. It has been postulated that the methods of these men are, for all intents and purposes, little different. That by using the war that Dalinar seeks to end as an excuse for unifying his people, Dalinar is no better than the man who murders the sickly and feeble in their beds and orders world leaders assassinated so he can unite the world under his own banner. I would postulate that the difference between these men is immense. That Dalinar seeks to unite his nation to enable its survival. He doesn't seek power for himself, but takes what power he needs to accomplish his goals. He wants to see his people become more than they are, and he wants this for his people. Taravangian on the other hand seeks to unite the world under his rule, for his own personal glory and to ensure his own survival. He has no compunction about murdering innocent people and removing any obstacle from his path. What do you think?
×
×
  • Create New...