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Found 237 results

  1. It seems I forgot various details and because of that I was under impression that for a group of four metals two steal human attributes, one steals Allomantic powers tied to metals in this group and one steals Feruchemical powers tied to metals in this group. It would work like that: tin and iron steal human attributes, while steel/pewter spikes steal Allomantic/Feruchemical powers of iron, steel, tin and pewter. This is clearly not the case. We know that since pewter steal Physical Feruchemical powers, it can also steal Feruchemical gold. (HoA epigraphs number 36 AND a WoB). But... many of the Feruchemical powers are Physical... how does that work? How are Feruchemical metals grouped? Which spikes steal which powers? Metal/Feruchemical power/Spike type Iron: Weight - Physical attribute : Pewter spike (probably) Steel: Physical speed - Physical attribute : Pewter spike (confirmed - Inquisitors had this power) Tin: Senses - Physical attribute : Pewter spike (probably) Pewter: Strength - Physical attribute : Pewter spike (confirmed - Inquisitors had this power) Zinc: Mental speed - Mental attribute : Brass spike (speculation) Brass: Warmth - Physical attribute : Pewter spike (speculation) Copper: Memories - Mental attribute : Brass spike (speculation) Bronze: Wakefulness - no idea. It can be both physical and mental. Probably mental, it'd fit nicely and complete mental attributes. Cadmium: Breath - Physical attribute : Pewter spike (speculation) Bendalloy: Nutrition - Physical attribute : Pewter spike (speculation) Gold: Health - Physical attribute : Pewter spike (confirmed - Inquisitors had this power + epigraphs + WoB) Electrum: Determination - Mental attribute : Brass spike (speculation) Those four are clearly Spiritual powers, so we don't know what spike to use: Chromium: Fortune Nicrosil: Investiture Aluminum: Identity Duraluminum: Connection So it seems that all of base metals Feruchemy is covered by three spikes (Physical powers, Mental powers, Spiritual powers). But going off what we know about Hemalurgy, there is bound to be four spikes of base sixteen stealing Feruchemical powers... EDIT: The question is: can Feruchemical powers even be grouped properly into four even groupings? Especially considering the fact that 'Hybrid' powers are in fact Physical powers and that one of them, Feruchemical gold is stolen by a pewter spike which makes it a Physical power?
  2. Alternate title: Base Metals, Blessings, and the Nature of Hemalurgy, a chart (still poorly constructed, but less so) No spikings or murder were committed in the creation of this chart. This chart assumes that the Adventure Game does not correspond to one of the basics laws Hemalurgy, which is Base Metals steal a human attribute (that anyone has); while alloys steal an Allomantic or Feruchemist attribute. You will notice that the first eight metals follow this pattern, we should assume this is true for ALL metals. In other words, just as we assume that Allomancy and Feruchemy have predictable systems that always follow the same pattern, we should assume that Hemalurgy also follows a similar and predictable pattern. In the end, this chart is meant to help you steal powers and influence people. Originally, I created this chart to predict which Metals should give kandra Blessings and what those possible Blessings might be. The chart itself is based on information provided in the AAs and books (and collected on the coppermind). The purpose of this chart is two fold: to argue that Base Metals always provide Human Attributes and Blessings (making those two things linked), and that one can therefore predict what powers a Spike should steal based on that fact. The charts has been split into four categories (Physical, Cognitive, Temporal, and Spiritual)* and Base Metals have been bolded, while Alloys are italicized and bolded, please follow the directions to read the chart correctly. Reading the chart: First Column: Metal; Second: Allomancy; Third: Feruchemy; Fifth: Hemalurgy; Sixth: Blessing --- Physical Metals Iron | pulls metal | store weight | steals strength | increases strength Steel | pushes metal | stores speed | steals Physical Allomancy | none Tin | improve senses | store/improve senses | steals metal fortitude | increases senses Pewter | improves strength/endurance | stores strength | steals Physical Feruchemy | none --- Cognitive Metals Zinc | riots emotion | stores mental speed | steals emotional fortitude | increases emotional fortitude Brass | sooths emotion | stores heat | Steals Cognitive Feruchemy | none Copper | hides Allomancy | stores memories | steals mental fortitude | increases mental sharpness Bronze | detects Allomancy | stores wakefulness | steals Cognitive Allomancy | none --- A note; it seems that the first two Blessings are to do with the Physical Realm, while the next two are to do with the Cognitive; but still basic human abilities. Nothing especially magical. Assuming that all Based metals (like Dirigible suggests) are INDEED stealing human attributes…we need to rewrite the second table (based on the next eight metals) a little bit. Moreover, it seems that the abilities being stolen are appropriately external/internal; almost seeming to switch between something “more” allomantic related then to something more feruchemical. The most obvious example of this is Zinc and Copper. The second chart covers the Temporal and Spiritual Metals; this is where I argue, more or less, that the information provided by the Adventure Game does not live up to canon. Instead, it follows the same Base Metal-Alloy pattern as seen above in the first chart. Predictions for are in parenthesis. (It should be noted that it is possible that Bendalloy/Duralumin steals Feruchemy and Electrum/Aluminum steal Allomancy instead, however, this pattern fits better with the pattern seen in the original eight metals. --- Temporal Metals Cadmium | Slows time | stores breath | steals human attribute (steals breath/temporal) | blessing (breath/energy) Bendalloy | Hastens time | Stores Energy | steals (Temporal Allomancy) | (none) Gold | Shows Past | Stores health | steals human attribute (general health-related; constitution) | blessing (health/healing) Electrum | Shows future | stores determination | steals ("Temporal" Feruchemy)* | (none)** --- Spiritual (Enhancement) Metals Chromium | Removes another’s metals | stores fortune | steals human attribute (fortune) | blessing (fortune) Nicrosil | Flares another’s metals | stores Investiture | Steals ("Enhancement"/Spiritual Feruchemy) | (none} Aluminum | removes one’s metals | stores identity | steals human attribute (identity) | Blessing (identity) Duralumin | Flares one’s metals | stores connection | Steals (“Enhancement”/”Spiritual” Allomancy) | (none) --- In conclusion, this shows that to Bless a kandra, one needs the appropriate metal base. Thus, if a character like Marasi thinks that a Spike meant to provide a Blessing is made of steel, she is wrong and that spike must either be made of some other metal or meant for another purpose. It may be Atium (for experiments to provide Blessings which were unavailable due to lack of appropriate metals in the Final Empire; Atium steals any human attribute, so it presummably provides any Blessing) or a large chuck of Aluminum (stabilizes Identity, makes for resistant kandra, perhaps), but it is likely a metal she is unfamiliar with. Finally, this chart shows that Blessings and Human Attributes are linked, which suggests that part of the process to create a Blessing is abstracting the proper human attribute from the host. The second part, I think, is emphasized by the term itself, the Intent of the Spiker (or perhaps the person from which the Attribute is stolen, but I doubt it) must be to bless the mistwraith with the Attribute, and endow them with consciousness. In making kandra, proper Intent is mandatory. Briefly and alternatively, Hemalurgy might keep "switching". In the Base Eight, the external physical alloy (steel) steals Allomancy, while the internal physical alloy (pewter) steals Feruchemy; and the external cognitive alloy (Brass) steals Feruchemy, while the internal cognitive alloy (bronze) steals steals Allomancy. It is marked on the coppermind that Aluminum steals Enhancement/Spiritual Allomancy, though no source is given. This seems like a rather random fact to pull out of the first three AAs, and the AAs in the Era 2 books do not provide such information, so it seems likely that this is from the Adventure Games as well (which canonically are disputable). If it is the case, though, it's likely that Enhancement/Spiritual Feruchemy is stolen by Chromium, and that Cadmium (Temporal external) steals Allomancy and Gold (Temporal internal) steals Feruchemy. In this case, the alloys would steal human attributes and Blessines. I don't believe this is the case, though, as it isn't support by the evidence provided by the first eight metals or what we know about the patterns seen in both Allomancy and Feruchemy. --- * Given the name temporal metals, but I do not understand how these attributes (Breath, Energy, Health, and Determination) are linked to the temporal existence of a ferring/feruchemist. That's a subject for another topic, though. ** This might be messed up, though, by the fact that Brass and Electrum were accidentally changed, but I am betting it isn't. P.S.: this chart would not exist without Dirigible; whom suggested, some time ago, that Blessings were linked to base metals. P. S.S.: I thought of including which metals are external and internal, and pulling and pushing, but I will only do so if asked. See! No murders, no spikes, indeed! *stuffs corpses with holes into a fridge*
  3. Do we have anything more on this "soul proximity thing"? I mean, is it harder to Push on the spike in person than the sum of how hard is to affect a spike and a normal metal piercing person? (spike in person > spike + in person ?)
  4. So this is really obvious but I hadn't considered it until now. Harmony, being part Ruin can still talk to people with Hemalurgic spikes and according to a WoB I just read on the coppermind, Hemalurgy is not tied to Scadrial specifically. Apparently Hemalurgy will eventually be important to later cosmere stuff. I just got to thinking about it. Harmony could potentially talk to anyone spiked by a metal on any one of the other worlds. Granted the "Spiker" would have to have knowledge of Hemalurgy as intent plays a crucial part. It makes me wonder how far Harmony can already stretch. It's known that there are Kandra somewhere on Roshar already. Can he use them as his eyes and ears? Is Harmony seeding planets with Kandra in hopes of piecing together the mystery of Adonalsium? Most importantly should we be keeping our eyes peeled for anyone with piercings to pop up on the other worlds?
  5. Hey Sharders! Just something fun to do, and I wanted to see what you could come up with. Basically, you take any superhero, like Hulk for instance, and then translate their powers into the Mistborn magic system. For Hulk, I think it fits that he is a Pewter Compounder. For some heroes, it's okay to break the rules-ish. Take Iron Man--He would need both Allowmantic steel and iron to "fly", and he's Iron Man, so naturally he would use some spikes. Obviously, some powers can't really translate. Feruchemy in Green, Allowmancy in Blue, and Hemalurgy in Red. Examples: Hulk--Pewter, Pewter. Iron Man--Steel, Iron, Tin. You don't have to use this system if you know all the terms and such, like Coinshot. Or you can just say F-Atium ect. Whatever works best for you! Have fun, maybe! Edit: If you don't know Marvel/DC, I guess you can do other things, like anime, but as a last resort.
  6. Why did Inquisitors have spikes driven through their eyes in the first place? I mean, there are so many bindpoints that those spikes could surely be inserted somewhere else, so what's the point in depraving them of one of the most basic senses? Did TLR made this deliberately so they'd have another weak point?
  7. There is a WoB that hemalurgy can work on animals. That makes me belive that if somebody stole human aspect like strength, he could give it to an animal. But how faar can it go? Could it be posssible to stal an aspect from animal and give it to another one,? Maybe someone could even steal it from animals and give it to humans? If it would be possible people could farm animals for their hemalurgic strength of body and senses by creating blessings similar to ones made from kandra. It would be also possible to create incredibly strong hounds or horses, with impresive senses. We could make diffrent animals more loyal with zinc spikes made from dogs (preferably these ones who are so old or sick that should be put to sleep), or improwe their mental capabilities with copper spikes. It would open a whole new ways of changing human body considering how much a kandra can do regardless of what hemalurgical charge is in their spikes. Do you think it is possible? What else could be made with these capabilities?
  8. So I read a WoB that Hemalurgy can be done by someone with right spiritual genes (perhaps there was something about Connection, too). If it's in spiritweb, it can be spiked. So you could spike out out of someone ability to use Hemalurgy or store it in nicrosil... The question is: what would having a stronger ability to do Hemalurgy actually do?
  9. So I went to coppermind and I'm confused. For example, page for Hemalurgy says that duraluminium "steals Spiritual Feruchemical powers" while page for duraluminium says that it's unknown what property it steals What do we have confirmed, either by book or WoB? Iron: human strenght Steel: Allomantic Physical powers Tin: human senses Pewter: Feruchemical Physical powers Zinc: human emotional stability Brass: Feruchemical Hybrid powers Copper: human mental fortitude Bronze: Allomantic mental powers Cadmium: ??? Bendalloy: ??? Gold: ??? Electrum: ??? Chromium: ??? Nicrosil: ??? Aluminium: Allomantic enhancement powers Duraluminium: ??? Is that right or did I get something messed up? Or maybe there are some WoBs I don't know about?
  10. So, this has probably been discussed before, but have we considered the possibility that Hemalurgy is not a Metallic Art? We've only seen Hemalurgy used to steal pieces of Preservation in the form of allomantic abilities and things like strength and emotional fortitude for the blessings, as well as Feruchemy, which would be a blend of the power of Ruin and Preservation. What if we've only seen metal spikes because we've only seen it interact with magic systems which use metal as a focus? Could you use gemstone spikes to steal Surgebinding abilities? Since Feruchemy is part Ruin and is a Metallic Art, it would make sense for the full-Ruin magic system to be one as well, but I wanted to make sure we'd considered the possibility that there was an error in our already fairly limited understanding of Hemalurgy.
  11. Brandon repeatedly stated that TLR used Hemalurgy on himself; that TLR "used Hemalurgy to pull off his most dramatic effects" and that it was the reason he heard Ruin. The thing is, even after BoM and its revelations about the remaining metals, there is no reason for TLR to have spikes. Absolutely zero. There was a WoB that his bracers acted as his spikes, but to act as spikes they had to actually hold a Hemalurgic charge. Are there any WoBs out there which hold more information? Or maybe it was decanonised?
  12. So I finished Secret History and Bands of Mourning recently and I got a super creepy vibe from post-death Kelsier. Despite the fact that he helped the Southern Scadrians, I got the sense that he may be up to no good, with some seriously inscrutiable ulterior motives. In my opinion, he had kind of a negative influence on Spook, since he encouraged Spook to help him experiment with Hemalurgy and Spook later wrote that it might be a good idea to get old or disabled Metalborn to sacrifice themselves to give their power to others. I thought that was pretty creepy for Kell. Plus, the Set has been experimenting with Hemalurgy and they had to learn it somewhere. I dunno, maybe Kell is being influenced by Trell and his "coming back to the Physical Realm" hack has to do with Trellish unknown metals? Something less than savory is going on, and it has me worried. What do you think?
  13. A thing that bothered my mind for a long, long time. How did people of Shardworlds discover the magic in the first place? You see, some are far easier to discover than others. Here's a list. Sel AonDor: Medium before Elantris was built and easy after that. It only requires to wave your hand in the air. At some point someone definitely tried to draw the shape of the country and it went from there. ChayShan: specifical movement. Easy. DakHor: no idea how they discovered it in the first place. Scadrial things get a little complicated when you start to consider the alloys, but there always is some pure base metal around. Feruchemy: easiest of the three - Feruchemist feel a natural draw when they touch the metal, nothing complicated, really. Allomancy: the most unintuitive of all the Shardworlds. How on the tenth name of Damnation would somebody get the idea to swallow metals???? Sure, after Rashek Ascended he easily kicked it off, but we have WoBs on Allomancers being born before. How did they discover their powers? We have a WoB on Alendi being a Seeker. Hemalurgy: even more unintuitive than Allomancy. Not only would somebody had to have the idea to stab somebody and after that get the idea to stab himself with it, but also bindpoints come in play. No idea how it was discovered in the pre-Rashek times (there is a WoB that it was used). Nalthis Breath is noticeable and when somebody said the right words things happened to it. And after that it's just research. Roshar Spren bond people naturally and Stormlight can be inhaled reflexively (as seen many times before Kaladin knew what he was doing) and Surges can be used intuitively. On the easy end of the scope. Discuss.
  14. So as I've been listening through the books again and reading through the forums, I've been trying to figure out something. If magic comes from the Shards, then which Shard made Allomancy? According to Sazed, Allomancy is of Preservation, but look at most of what it does. Most of the applications are short term and often destructive. That sounds more like Ruins pervue than Preservation, yet the mists (which is of preservation) react to Allomancers. My theory is thus: Because Ruin and Preservation couldn't do much of anything without the other having a hand in it (read: the constant struggle for either to get anything done at the end of HoA) then all three Metallic Arts carry both within them, but favor one or the other. Feruchemy is the art of preserving, hands down. You store away your attributes for later use, either in a time of need or to supercharge what is already there. It's long term and deliberate, it's of Preservation. But, there is enough of Ruin in it for copperminds to suffer the same corruption as non-metallic recordings. Allomancy is the flip. It's short term, and often only for immediate or near to immediate use. It relies on metal as a catlyst to burn the investiture inside the person. It is closer to Ruin, which is easiest to see in the power Atium gives. Quick bursts of flashing insight in to the immediate world around them, making them better to kill. While we don't know if that notion of Atium helps to kill is a product of Atium itself or the world it lives in, Elends final chapters make the thought ambiguous. Allomancy favors Ruin, but is birthed by Preservation. That Lerasium burns for everyone says something. Hemalurgy is the most directly built by Ruin. It is destructive in nature. However, I find it ironic that it does, albeit not perfectly, preserves the power it stored. It's leaking, but it's holding in the power. This is me just trying to get my thoughts out and seeing how other people see it. I'm not sure if it's been discussed before.
  15. Idea: Use hemalurgic bullets to allow Harmony to control Set members. As an agent of Harmony, it makes a lot of sense to have a dedicated gun for shooting hemalurgic earrings. Of course, Harmony would need to be complicit, and I don't know how he'd feel about that, but he was willing to do it to stop Paalm, so why not for Telsin? Question: Can hemalurgy be used to steal memories? It stands to reason that it could, seeing as you can steal physical strength (Koloss) and such. If so, hemalurgy could be used against captured spies, and becomes all the more terrifying.
  16. This theory is based on the fact that every magic system we have encountered so far can stand on its own. While some magic systems such as the metallic arts interact easily with each other (which can be explained by them being on the same planet) most other systems require various hacks to get them to interact. My theory is that the powers stealing aspect of hemalurgy is actually such a hack. This may sound weird because of the way we have seen hemalurgy so far, where it is mostly used to steal powers. We need to remember however that two of the three hemalurgic creations of TLR we have seen so far didn't have anything to do with allomatic or feruchemical powers. It also would have been weird that a magic system would be created with the only purpose of interacting with other magic systems. My conclusion is that the original purpose of hemalurgy is the transformation of creatures and to give yourself limited boosts, such as a bit more strength or intelligence. The stealing of powers is just a (perhaps intended) side effect.
  17. According to the coppermind, Aluminium acts as an investiture sink, so any investiture which is put into it will just be "soaked up" by the aluminium, but Aluminium can also be used as a hemalurgic spike, which works on the premise of ripping off a chunk of one's spiritweb, and in a sense 'stapling' into onto the recipient, and to my understanding, your spiritweb and investiture are basically the same thing, so wouldn't the aluminium just absorb it? Have I missed something, if so someone point it out please, and also please correct any wrong facts i've stated
  18. So, I recently visited the dark alley, and a thought came to me: what if you spiked someone who only had powers through hemalurgy through the heart and took their powers. Would they lose their powers, or would the hemalurgy simply fail?
  19. Okay not "evil" evil, but I sometimes get that he is potencialy an antogonist but "evil" is so much eisier to type on a touch screen. For a while now I have suspected that Hoid is evil, mostly because if I was an author and was trying to hide a villan I would make them witty and charming and friends with protagonists. Of course he really might be that and I'm more paranoid than Vin but it's something to keep in mind. The closest I have come to a semi coherant theory is the list below which is mostly circumstancial. 1: All of the cosmere books besides maybe Emperor's Soul and some of the ebook only ones have an "ars arcanum" in the back, further more the arcanum seems to be written by someone in world and that they are an outsider as far as I can tell, it is also known that Hoid is a world hopper and would see things by an outsiders view. 2: The entry on hemalurgy describes it as being one of the most potentially usefull arts in the cosmere, WOB has stated that hemalurgy can steal more than just mistborn magic. 3: At the end of the Elantris 10th anniversary (I am taking this on word of mouth since I mavent read it myself... yet.) It has Spiolers++++++++++++++++++ until I figure out how to do it the official way. Hoid talking to a Skaze about a deal he had with it and how that deal fell through since he didn't get what he wanted. To become an elantrian. Also Hoid is wearing bandages. Why would he be wearing bandages? See point 2. End of spiolers+++++++++++++ MINOR POINT 4: Hoids old buddies seem to be at odds with him (the letter) and the seventeenth shard is looking for him, a group which includes demoux and galladon. What are thier reasons? Thays all of the theory that I currently have. I might have more to add at a later time period after some rereading. Also I don't think hoid is really evil, I just wonder if he will be an antagonist at some point.
  20. While trying to get my over caffeinated mind to sleep last night, I found myself pondering the cosmere (as usual). Something occurred to me that I don't remember ever seeing addressed. What would happen if someone tried to swallow and burn a piece of metal that had a hemalurgic charge instead of a feruchemical one? Now, there are obvious reasons why this would be hard to attempt in the first place. Following the rules, an allomancer can't take just any old metalmind and burn it...it is keyed to the feruchemist's identity...so the only people who can compound are people who, for whatever reason, can use the same metal for both feruchemy and allomancy...twinborn, hemalurgist, etc. Assuming that this remains constant with the theoretical situation I'm positing, you would have to either: A: Take a shaving off of a spike already in your body B: Spike yourself, survive, and still have access to the ability to burn the type of metal the spike is made of. Method A sounds a lot easier to pull off...method B...almost impossible... I could easily accept that this is just not something that works...which is why it has never been addressed. But just for fun, what do you guys think would be the result of hemalurgic compounding?
  21. ... and came up with an odd idea. So, hemalurgic spikes allow Ruin to speak to their users, right (in the first era, anyway)? So, say this is before the truth about Ruin and Preservation comes out. There's an obligator along the lines of Yomen who wants to better understand the dichotomy between good and evil, and so he takes a spike he steals from a killed Inquisitor (at great personal risk), uses it himself, and BOOM, you've got the Scadrial version of Jekyll and Hyde. I think I might need to start listening to a different soundtrack at work.
  22. Hemamancer? Hematist? Hemalurgist? Hematologist? Hemalurgian? Hematician?
  23. I think I have an idea for how the SoScads got Metalborn powers. Hemalurgy. Think about it.
  24. Paalm freak = 1 Kandra = 2? Koloss= 5? Inquisitor = 11??? Any good sources pinning down or expanding these?
  25. Honestly, more SoS spoilers, but this just occurred to me. This is somewhat about Trell's influence, but more about his tendency to have (two) villains in these books spiked. It's almost like a pattern, but I think that might be a little far... So, how do we know that he was spiked? Wax mentions it in his POV in chapter 13: Was spiked, Brandon mentioned this in his Chapter 13 Annotations for Alloy of Law. Also: Odd? Well, we do know something about odd spikes that Sazed cannot sense. If Miles got a different metal grafted onto his spikes, then, in theory, he may have a Trellium spike. In other words, Miles was not possessed, but Trell had direct influence over him through his spikes, perhaps whispering words of grandeur (or whatever) into his ears. Driving Miles [more] insane, and upping those psychological qualities Miles presumably had some control over in the Roughs. In other words, much like Paalm, Miles' actions are directly linked to or influenced by Trell. I don't think that it excuses his actions, but one of the themes in all three books so far has been stopping someone you know/care about when they go bad because YOU would've wanted them to do the same thing if you were in their shoes. It's a strange kind of love; a strange kind of idea of mercy, really. First it was Miles, then Paalm, and now Telsin (she is still Wax's sister, so, I believe she fits the theme). It also means that someone else might go bad in the Lost Metal, since it fits the series' authentic. [Perhaps the last book will be stopping someone before they go bad, but that's neither here or there]. So basically, Miles was spiked just like Paalm; he was using Hemalurgy, it seems, and it was probably Trellium. Marasi should go and find his metalminds to make some...interesting connections...