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This has been stewing in me for a while, so I have been rereading Warbreaker to look for evidence. Correct me if I have missed something and this is already something confirmed or denied. I believe that the way a Returned dies is by consuming their Divine Breath. You look at that and say "well duh," but I'm not finished. I think that for a Returned to be a Returned, with the dreams, the perfect body, etc, they need the Divine Breath. We know that they can Awaken if they have more Breaths than they need to survive, just as the God King did. So what if they stored their Divine Breath somewhere and moved on? They aren't consuming it, but they still don't hold it. Would they turn back into a normal person again? We know that Peacegiver/Vasher was Returned. The book said it a few times, such as when Siri is asking where the God King's wealth of Breath came from or on Page 99 of the hardcover when Vivenna comments on the D'Denir statues. We also know that he doesn't hold his Divine Breath, as he needs Vahr's Breath when he comes back to Hallandren. Speaking of that scene (page 22 of the hardcover), Vasher comments as such: From the Ars Arcanum, we learn that the Fifth Heightening comes at 2000 Breaths, or one Divine Breath. If Vasher can draw forth that Divine Breath again as implied by the quote, he stored it at some point. Now he is mortal and can die, but he still has lived for a very long time, perhaps due to having other Breath, perhaps something different. My questions are thus: -What happens to a Returned when their Divine Breath is stored away? -Do they still gain any powers from having a Divine Breath? -What "sacrifices" would need to be made for Vasher to take back his Divine Breath? -Did Vasher use his Divine Breath to create Nightblood? -Vivenna notices that Vasher's beard never seems to grow more but he never is seen trimming it. Is this just Vasher being secretive or does it connect to him being a Returned? This may be a bit disjointed, but I hope that my point is seen. If anybody has insight or evidence to contradict or support these questions I would love to hear them.

I was pretty excited when Nightblood showed up at the end of Words of Radiance. I've read almost all of Brandon's books, and this was the first obvious crossover between different series. (The second, if you count Hoid as obvious.) This leads me to wonder how different magic systems of the 'cosmere' are going to interact. The Szeth question in the header is kind of representative of that more general question, but the conversation doesn't need to be restricted to Szeth. The members of this forum seem to have sources of information beyond the books, so please enlighten a fan who doesn't. From Warbreaker, it seems that when Nightblood is unsheathed, it will continuously drain BioChromatic Breaths from its wielder, and kill any wielder who doesn't have Breath. But there doesn't seem to be a steady source of Breaths on Roshar for Szeth to use. Or maybe there is? Can Breath on Roshar be transferred from one person to another by saying the words (My life to yours, ...)? Maybe it's just never been tried? Alternatively, could Nightblood be powered by Stormlight instead? Are Breath and Stormlight (and metals, and whatever powers Aeons, ...) really the same thing? Cheers!

All righty, so I'm creating this thread to be a place to discuss gaseous investiture. This started due to a topic Moogle created regarding the Mists and metals in Allomancy, where he posed the following question: This led me to thinking about gaseous investiture as a whole, as each of the major magic systems in the Cosmere that we've been shown make some mention of it. So let me begin this by discussing what knowledge we currently have. What We Know Spoilered for length. I create this list above knowing full well that I may have made mistakes. I also ask that any observation you wish to be added to this list be accompanied by sources. I cited all of my observations that didn't come directly from the books, I'm pretty sure. I'm hoping this discussion can be mostly focused around textual evidence and WoB's, rather than baseless conjecture. Obviously baseless conjecture is allowed and often appreciated, though. Discussion I do hope this thread will involve discussion of all the forms of gaseous investiture, and not just one two, but Moogle originally wanted such a topic to discuss the Dor, so I will start this discussion there. My observations above all say that Elantrians are "holding" the Dor, but is it holding in the same sense that one can hold the Mists, or how one can hold Stormlight? I do think there is a difference. Such a difference would explain why Raoden feels like his old self upon completing the Shaod, rather than being filled with a torrential energy, such as Szeth and Vin observe. I do not, however, believe there is a way to "hold" more of the Dor than an Elantrian already does. Ignoring the fact that the Dor does not seem to occur naturally in the Physical Realm apart from leaking through Elantris and its denizens, if an Elantrian could intake more of the Dor, why has no one done it? As I noted, the Dor leaks from the city itself. Has no Elantrian taken a deep breath within their city? Or, if intent matters, are we to presume that there has never been an Elantrian to sigh in frustrastion, wishing they were more powerful? In a city such as Elantris, where they are so far advanced to possess a detailed library system, such a thing should have been documented. Of course, it is possible that Raoden's studying in the library never came across such a thing, and as a result we, as readers, have simply never been told about it. It could also be that the system is more selective, like the Mists, rather than not being selective, like Stormlight. We do not know much about such a thing, though that is my current position. As a final note, the description of holding "large" amounts of Breath comes from the prologue, and as such focuses on the abilities granted by the Heightenings. I can't currently search the entirety of the book to find other instances which might be more pertinent to the comparison at hand, but if someone could point me at least to a chapter to save myself time later it would be greatly appreciated.

(Warning: The hypothetical scenario I'm about to propose relies on the accuracy of my Cosmere theory on Investiture resonance in metal. Given this, complaints like "but there's no evidence that this is possible!" will be ignored.) One of the cool things about Awakening is that almost every single Nalthian is an Awakener. As long as you are Nalthian and you don't give your Breath to someone else, you have within you the power to do magic. You could do it right now, if you wanted. Right this instant. No traumatic Snapping necessary (since the Nalthian equivalent probably happens during childbirth). No need to attract Splinters. Just grab something organic and say a single-Breath Command (since that's all you've got, presumably), and VOILA! Magic! I think that's awesome. Except... we don't really know many single-Breath Commands, do we? We only know of the improved Lifeless Command "Awaken to my Breath, serve my needs, live at my Command and my word. [insert security phrase here]", but that Command makes the one Breath used irretrievable. You'd be a drab afterwards, and that would be a drag. From what we've seen in Warbreaker, access to other less permanent Awakening Commands requires much more than one Breath. So unless you could buy more Breaths from poor, desperate people, then you really can't do much with that bit of magic within you. Well, you could use "My life to yours, my Breath become yours" to transfer your single Breath to a non-living, non-corpse object, then retrieve the Breath using "Your Breath to mine", but that's not much of a party trick, is it? Generic Breath-transfer Commands cause Breath to be transferred without adding a specific Awakening Intent to it, unlike other "real" Awakening Commands. Unless you're a Returned, whose single Divine Breath already contains a healing Intent, generically transferring your one Breath won't do much to a target object. Bummer. Enough of this rambling; what's your point, skaa? The point is it would be much more ideal, certainly much more ethical, if Nalthians can use their single Breath in more useful forms of Awakening instead of relying on getting more Breaths. Normally, this would require Awakener scholars to look for single-Breath versions of multi-Breath Commands, like how the Five Scholars figured out the single-Breath version of the Lifeless Command. I believe there must be many Commands that can be improved this way because, by the Law of Comparability, BioChromatic power is not simply a function of the number of Breaths. Nevertheless, this task of finding more single-Breath Commands will probably prove difficult even for people with the Sixth Heightening's Instinctive Awakening. But what if there was an easier way? What if there was a way for regular Nalthians to somehow shape their one Breath with the Intent of a multi-Breath Command, then use the generic Breath-transfer Command to transfer this Intent-laden Breath to a target? If this can be done, then a Command that would otherwise require multiple Breaths can be used by a person with a single Breath. I got this idea from the concept of the Returned using the generic Breath-transfer Command to heal people; they could do this because the healing Intent is already in the Breath. So how would I theoretically go about doing this? This is where my metal theory comes in. I believe that if an Awakener could somehow pass his Breaths through a piece of metal while Awakening another target using any Awakening Command, the Intent of the Command would become "imprinted" on the piece of metal, such that any raw Investiture that subsequently passes through it would be shaped/filtered by that particular Intent, like how metals filter Preservation's power in Allomancy. Note that the Awakener will NOT be Awakening the metal, but rather just attuning the metal to the Command. Once the piece of metal has been attuned that way, another person with just one Breath could take that metal, then while holding it, use the generic Breath-transfer Command ("My life to yours, my Breath become yours") to transfer his Breath to a target object of his choosing. When this happens, the metal in his hand will resonate with the Intent of the previous Awakening Command and shape the Breath with this Intent, thereby Awakening the target object with just a single Breath. This is similar to the ter'angreal concept in the Wheel of Time, but I guess it's okay to just call these Awakener Wands. Limitations and Disadvantages Each Awakener Wand could only be used for one specific Command. So you'll need multiple Wands to use multiple Commands. This would necessitate the labeling of each Wand so that people would know what each one does, and there's the risk of mislabeled Wands that do dangerous things. It would probably be very easy to overwrite the Command Intent that an Awakener Wand is attuned to, like how Feruchemy and Hemalurgy can easily override the Allomantic attunement of metals. Awakener Wands would still require multi-Breath Awakeners to create the wands in the first place. The reliance on multi-Breath Awakeners will only be lessened slightly. Then again, in the end the important thing is to empower people with only one Breath, so this is just a minor setback. The economy based on the buying and selling of Breath would probably take a direct hit once Wands become widespread, as Breath prices would probably go down. The demand won't disappear entirely, of course (as implied above), but I imagine the poor will have to find other ways to earn a living. Or they could sell their Breath to the Returned. I think you will still need the Ninth Heightening to Awaken metals, so it's probably useless to create a Metal Awakener Wand because it would be very, very stupid for a person with Ninth Heightening (with 20,000+ Breaths) to use the generic Breath transfer Command to Awaken metal (which can normally be Awakened with just 1000 Breaths). Even with the disadvantages taken into account, I still think the widespread use of Awakener Wands would be an improvement over the status quo on Nalthis. What do you guys think?

So last month, I ordered a signed & personalized copy of Way of Kings off of Brandon's site, and I asked my question I've been wondering since the release of WoR: Q: "What is the ratio of Stormlight to Breath?" I received the book in the mail today and I have an answer! (Or most of one) A: "Much more Stormlight, but most can't be used." So it's nice to know that it requires "much" more Stormlight than breath for the Ratio, and the 'most can't be used' part seems to me like he's referring to spheres. Which also could make sense, as I doubt chips or clearmarks or what have you would be quite sufficient. I'm thinking at least Broams or maybe even Gemhearts! O.o Of course, Broams or other highest-denomination spheres would seem most plausible, for Zahel being able to constantly stay refilled on stormlight. Unless he's just going off slaying chasmfiends during his free time. >.< Edit: And the book is a First Edition! I requested for it, but didn't think they would still have any! Nifty! Edit 2: Added picture!

[Warning: This is a little long, and not as well cited or clearly organized as I'd like it to be. Its about 1000 words long, so each of the major sections is getting it's own spoiler. If you don't feel like reading a short (but rambling) essay, feel free to skip down to the tl;dr section below. I happen to be writing this at 2:00 AM, so when I say rambling and poorly organized, I mean it.] What is an Acceptable Command? I’m going to start this off with a question. Do we have any criteria by which to judge an “acceptable” Command? I’ve been wondering this for a while, personally, and I haven’t been able to find much about it. All Commands we see, (or hear of) in the book deal with motion (standard Awakened objects/Lifeless) or cognition (Lifeless/Nightblood-class objects/Returned/Heightenings/whatever weird Command wipes memory). This strikes me as a little strange. I mean, it seems completely arbitrary. Breaths seem to be able to do two things; provide energy, and affect cognition/the Cognitive Realm in various ways. The question is: What limits these interactions? Why can’t an Awakener tell cloth to combust, or stone to shatter? These things are still both just energy, simply expressed in different ways. Why should Breaths be limited to providing mechanical energy? The most obvious reason is that doing these things would render the Breath unrecoverable. However, we do know that Breath can be consumed in certain circumstances. Returned do it, as do Type IVs. I would also speculate that whatever Command removes memory involves Breath being consumed. It seems to me that BioChromatic expressions* which cause change** are the ones which consume Breath. Why Breath Behaves the Way it Does: The reason for this, I believe, relates to the differing effects of Breath upon sapient and non-sapient entities. In inanimate objects, Breath must be given purpose when it is bestowed upon an object. This Breath then carries out its purpose, and, where it can, reshapes its host to a humanoid form. In sapient entities, Breath seems to be purposeless. It is given, and left undirected. However, while in this dormant state, the Breath is still acting. Its purpose (or intent, if you prefer) seems to be shaped by the Cognitive Aspect of its host. Reduced aging, increased health, lifesense, all related to an expanding and reinforcing of the Cognitive Aspect. By all appearances, Breath seems to be a primarily Cognitive Investiture,*** and holding it forces your Physical and Cognitive Aspects into line with each other. (Similar to how Stormlight forces the Physical and Spiritual Aspects into line.****) Note here, that the Breath seems to be superimposing a human Cognitive Aspect upon non-human objects. The Breath itself appears to hold a definite Cognitive Aspect, and this generates many of the effects we see. Its peculiar “stickiness,” the passive effects of the Heightenings, and the fact that it likes to mimic life wherever possible. Change Verses Augmentation, and the Cognitive Aspect of Breath: Now, back to the question at hand. What decides whether or not a Command can be used? It seems to me that the visualization for Commands is in some way limited by what it can do with a human Cognitive Aspect. Inhabiting mammalian corpses, animating the inanimate, bestowing sentience, removing memories, healing. All things that would make sense for a human Cognitive Aspect to do (with a touch of Endowment’s Investiture, of course). On to the next logical question. Is there any way to work around this? As a primarily Cognitive Investiture (as defined by Chaos) Awakening should be innately flexible. So, I would like to draw attention to the last two things we know of that Awakening can do. Removing memories, and healing. While they do fit under the framework I’ve laid out, they’re a bit of an anomaly. Why should Breath be able to remove memories, or heal, and how does it do so? These are some of BioChroma’s few uses that really input a permanent change in an object (excluding the colour that is used as fuel). The changes which occur in all known BioChromatic constructs are reversible with the transfer of Breath. (With the partial exception of Returned. While giving away their Breath does kill them, they still retain their augmented forms, and seem to hold on to more of their Cognitive Aspect when dead than your average Joe.) We know that Returned healings are permanent, and memory wipes strike me like they would be somewhere along the same vein. As I speculated above, it seems that the consumption of Breath is related to a permanent, powerful change, as opposed to simple augmentation. I think with the right visualization, with the right Commands, it might be possible to derive more expansive and powerful effects from Awakening. Tl;dr: Basically, there should be undiscovered Commands that have more varied and powerful effects in exchange for the consumption of Breath. The primary reason that they have not been discovered is that they are non-intuitive, and require more difficult visualization, as Breaths appear to be somehow tied to human Cognitive/Spiritual Aspects. There also might be an alternate framework for Awakening mechanics in there somewhere. Now, I know my logic is a little sketchy in places, and I ramble on for a bit that I likely could have explained far more concisely and tied in for better, but other than that, what do you think? Any ways I could make this clearer and flesh it out better? Footnotes:

There are multiple, recent discussions floating around this Cosmere Theories board about magic system crossings, which makes me ecstatic. To me, the idea of the various Cosmere magic systems coming into contact and mingling is the most exciting prospect of Brandon's Cosmere works. As such, I've been doing some WoB read throughs focusing on magic systems and realmatics, and I cam upon this: source Emphasis added. Is he actually saying that Awakening can only be powered by Breath? One could not use Stormlight (the most similar investiture in my mind)? Because we know Vasher uses Stormlight instead of Breath for his weekly "meal". I know Brandon has said that some "jury-rigging" would be necessary when crossing "fuel" sources, but his response here is rather definitive... Other questions that I don't expect answers to, but I want to document for myself: If this does in fact mean that Awakening can only be powered by Breath, is Awakening unique in that fact? Could you Surgebind with Breath, or is Surgebinding only able to be fueled by Stormlight? Why can Vasher substitute Stormlight for Breath? As a scholar, how can Vasher ignore these tantalizing questions?

I am re-reading Warbreaker and I just can't get over how amazingly well this world would work for a video game! The vibrancy, or lack, of color could look amazing and be used to create a very neat world. The Breath based magic system is already inherently level based with the heightenings. I picture a world that becomes more diverse and colorful as one gains more Breaths. This could aid in locating hidden doors or detecting items/traps etc.. Also as one gains more Breaths things like lifesense and increased health come into play. To counter it you have Lifeless and Drabs that can not be detected so your enemies can be balanced naturally to your current status. Couple this with Awakening abilities as you learn more commands and gain more Breaths and this could be an awesome game. It would be awesome if all objects in game could be awakened and a limited number of Commands made available. You give up Breaths in order to animate objects which translates into trading internal abilities for an external benefit. If you can get the Breaths back great if not you are stuck at your new Breath level till you can get more. Buy breaths, convince others to give you breaths etc.. and you level up. This world to me was MADE to be a video game. You have to conform other books, even Mistborn, into a video game scenarios with leveling and balancing but they always seem artifically restricted in order to create a working /sequential gameplay. Nalthis and Awakening....it is organic.

Cosmere Spoilers follow but mostly about Stormlight Archives and Warbreaker I had a question involving Zahel/Vasher and his use of Stormlight. It is really a general topic question rather than a specific one. Here is the best way I can phrase what I'm trying to ask: If Vasher is substituting Stormlight for Breath, how much Stormlight can he store? Some Thoughts I've had and others I'm trying to get answers to: Warbreaker places no limit on the amount of Breath you can store. Does his body convert Stormlight to Breath? Does it keep it as Stormlight and run off Stormlight instead of Breath? In either form, can he store it like he stores Breath? Does he glow all the time if it is in Stormlight form? Can he store it for an indefinite amount of time like it is breath? If he can Store an infinite amount and for an indefinite amount of time, is he essentially a giant reserve of Stormlight? I know in WoB he has RFAO'd some of the questions about how different investitures work on different worlds. And in others he said they're Peter questions but might not answer even if he knew. If these questions don't have definitive answers I'm up for some open discussion as well. PS. The closest thing I found in the forums was a discussion on the conversion rate of different investitures. I'm not asking for the ratio, but more of a practical use in how Zahel/Vasher is using Stormlight and the implications of him using Stormlight in a similar way to Breath.

So far, there are 10 Heightening that we know of. However, 10 is not a Cosmere number. It seems much more likely that the Heightening follow the Law of 16. I have no real evidence for this, despite the fact that there is no clear 16 on Nalthis. The Heightenings are achieved using Breath. Breath is Investure. Investure is Cosmere. Cosmere is Andolisium, not sure if I spelled that right. Andolisium is/created the Law of 16. Therefor, Heightenings should follow the Law of 16. However, 10 Heightenings is practically impossible, and so I doubt that the other Heightenings will be found until a long time after Warbreaker is complete. Any words of Brandon?

So. We know that at least part of Nightblood's wonderfully terrifying personality is that it was given a very vague Awakening command ("Destroy evil"), and if I remember correctly another part of it is that it's a sword, and there's really only one thing that you *do* with a sword, so that shaped its mind, too. What sorts of effects might you get out of an Awakened item with a different shape and command? A shield instructed to "Defend the innocent" or a pen told to "share knowledge," for example?

So I found this interesting gem: Note that this is before Szeth has either met Nin or picked up Nightblood. So a)from Adolin's perspective, Szeth is Commanding objects. b)It sounds awfully like Breath - in particular could command inanimate objects, and we all know how careful Brandon is with his wording. (Or at least, how careful we THINK he is. *ahem* Gibletish ) However a)It could have just been the wind, and generally Adolin freaking out about the Assassin in White. b ) Szeth wouldn't have had time to give a verbal command, even if he could use Stormlight to power and Awakening. c) It seems a bit much to me that on top of Vasher and Nightblood, Brandon would then cross over an entire magic system from Nalthis - especially since we're not supposed to need to have read any particular Cosmere book to understand the others. IF however, Szeth can Awaken, the only way I think he could learn it is from Vasher. 99% chance he's not a worldhopper, since we KNOW he's from Shinovar, plus it would make flashbacks very messy. I'm not sure I can see Vasher teaching him anyway, unless he learned Awakening in his past, before or in his early days of being Truthless. Which is doubtful because flashbacks. So I open the question to the rest of you theorisers and obssessors. What doth 17th Shard think?

Spoiler - Zahel is Vasher from Warbreaker. We have Word of Brandon that splinters, such as spren, aeon, skaze, and nightblood can form bonds that act similar to Nahel bonds on Roshar, and are fundamentally the same. It struck me that there is one other splinter unaddressed - the Returned. The splinter is not the Returned, however. The divine breath is. I propose that returned have all formed a bond when dying with the splinter of Divine Breath provided by Endowment. That is why the returned perish when their Divine Breath is consumed, but not when it as merely stored (as demonstrated by Vasher in Warbreaker). Thus, the reason Vasher can survive via Stormlight on Roshar, is because his Divine Breath acts as a Nahel Bond. The Nahel Bond is the requirement for being able to absorb Stormlight - thus solving how Vasher can absorb Stormlight in the first place. He can then consume the investiture of Stormlight to survive instead of Breath. Will provide quotes and details upon request later tonight when I'm at my desktop.

Believe it or not, the spoilers come from a WoB posted in the MAG. I know the usual rule about the canonicity of the MAG, but this comes directly from one of the few quotes Mr. Sanderson has in the book. My question is this. Could a Trueself (an Aluminum Ferring) steal Breath? Per the MAG: ((Upvotes to anyone who can provide additional quotes on the subject)) On Nalthis, you cannot take Breaths from people, you can only retrieve them from Type III Awakened Objects. If you give it to another person, that Breath is now theirs. If you use it to Awaken a Lifeless, a Type II Awakened Object, you cannot get the Breath back. Here is Vasher's explanation, from chapter 46: Yet only a few paragraphs later, he admits: I typically refrain from contradicting an in-world expert, and in my personal estimation, Vasher is in the Top Three experts in his personal Arcanum, alongside Shai and Silence. However, his own admission that there's a lot he doesn't understand leads me to humbly suggest that there might be a more elegant, simpler solution. We've got a few Words of Brandon on the subject. source I know I've also read WoB that Lifeless are a lot less mindless than people suspect, I know it's lightly reference in the annotation to chapter 57. EDIT: There's also this quote, provided by Kurkistan, that provides WoB support that Lifeless are more aware than people realize, from the annotations to chapter 47. Not hard-and-fast, I admit. Still, taken together, I have a theory that I think has some merit. The reason you cannot take a Breath back from a Lifeless is the same reason you cannot take it back from your neighbor; a Lifeless has enough Identity that the Breath becomes his. Mr. Sanderson even says, a Lifeless could give up its own Breath (if it were sentient enough). This leads to feruchemy. An aluminum ferring can adapt their own identity in some way to hack access to the metalminds belonging to someone else. What if this same trick lets them do the same with Breath? Let's say an Awakener Awakens a rope to Grab Things, and it ties up a Trueself. Maybe the Trueself could do a trick with his own Identity, say "Your Breath to mine," and the rope would fall to the ground, while the Trueself would now have the Breath. A further, and disturbing theory; what if he could do this with people? Walk through a crowd, taking the Breath from every shoulder he bumps against? Or what if he could remove the single Breath from Lifeless? Of course, this is all flagrant speculation. As Vasher himself says, there could be something unique in a (quasi)-living human body that truly does "stick" stronger to Breath (this would explain why objects try to take on human form when they are Awakened). I still like the idea of a Returned, with a hemalurgic spike for feruchemical aluminum, roaming the world, stealing the Breath a week he needs to survive. EDIT: Formatting EDIT2: Added an additional quote.

Hey 17th Sharders! What I would like to discuss today is the compatibility of the magical fuels (Stormlight, Breath, etc.) across the Cosmere. - I just finished rereading Hero of Ages and had this thought as I was reading Vin's fight scene with the Inquisitors, when she draws on the mists to fuel her Allomancy. Could Allomancers use other forms of power to fuel Allomancy? Say... Stormlight? - Here's an explanation on my reasoning: A Shard manifests itself in three ways, solid, liquid, and gaseous. Using Preservation as an example we have Lerasium beads (solid), the Well of Ascension (Liquid), and the Mists (gaseous). We already know that one gaseous form of power (Stormlight) can substitute for another (Breath) in Vasher/Zahel's case. What are your thoughts? What evidence have I missed that says either yea or nay to this theory?

So over the break I read Warbreaker. I read it once a while back, but I was stupid back then and didn't pay attention to half the stuff in it. However, this time around, I picked up on a TON of things that I felt the need to post on here. There will be some theories in here, and I neglect to put this on the Warbreaker Forum because it is much less used. As I went through, I folded the pages when I found something interesting (don`t be mad, it is a paperback). I started doing this about a third of the way through, so forgive me if I missed anything and please point it out if its relevant. NOTE: There are extensive spoilers here, obviously, and this will be a long post. The first thing I noticed while reading a Lightsong POV is that he kept on using instincts to notice and not reveal information. I noticed this when he ... noticed the trapdoor and didn`t tell the priest that were there. Page 293, paragraphs 6 and 7. Paperback edition. I noticed a few more of these throughout the book, but this is the most important. I will find them if you guys ask though. Now, we know later in the story that Lightsong used to be a scribe who sniffed out robberies for nobles etc. This (to me) doesn't account for this instinct, so it makes me wonder if it is another benefit of being returned, having a lot of Breath, having a Divine Breath, or perhaps if Endowment was trying to communicate with him. The next page I folded is when Lightsong is musing about how the Returned look. Page 350, paragraph 2. This I marked because it reminded me of the powers of observation and the way the spren worked. This point is proven later towards the end, when Vasher tells Vivenna about this as well. I folded down page 360 because of a Slumlord named Rira. I seemed to remember a thread somewhere that mentioned a Rira in Words of Radiance or TwoK. It may just be the country that Kaladin mentioned when thinking about Adolin's hair though. I might also be crazy. For the record I thought that if he was somewhere else, then he must be a Worldhopper, and my mind got away from me a bit. I folded down the beginning and end of the Hoid conversation as well. Due to events later in the book and how Hoid has a knack at being places, it seems stretched for me to believe that he wasn't on Nealthis for the Manywar and the events that happened there and I wondered why he didn't tell the whole truth to Lightsong and Siri. Pages 373-384. This next fold is when Vasher kidnaps Vivenna. Now, she mentioned before I started folding that she couldn't sense Jewels because she is a drab. I remembered this and marked the page because she mentioned Vasher approaching her with a lot of Breath. WoR spoiler: I'm too lazy to get the exact quote from the book at the moment, but I triple-checked earlier. I will (maybe tomorrow) make a thread dedicated to a Vasher theory, and I will put the link down here as well. I folded the pages where Vasher explains most of the BioChromatic entities to Vivenna. 507 and 508. I folded 513 because of Lightsong's thoughts at the beginning of the chapter. Can there only be a certain number? This would be a good question for Brandon in my opinion. Does it have something to do with the power of belief/observation that seems to be an important role in the Cosmere? Next worthy point of mine: This seems like WAY to much of a coincidence to the topic of the power of belief, and how an object views itself to not post it. Page 567 Thanks for your time, and sorry if these have been brought to light before

So I was thinking. Because Zahel has enough breath to sense life, can he sense life in Shardblades? Theoretically, the spren are still alive, just, as WoB stated, in a cycle of agony due to their consciousness being ripped out. So does he know the secret of the Shardblades being alive, or maybe even, can he hear the screams? I know there was also a WoB stating that Nighblood's nausea doesn't effect you if you've used him, so maybe that effect carried over and protects him from the screams? It feels like there's something missing here.

In Words of Radiance Hoid sings to Kaladin in jail. As he tunes his instrument he says something along the lines of, "Perfect Pitch makes this so much easier." In Warbreaker perfect pitch is a result of reaching a certain heightening. Any guesses or more information on Hoid with breath?

What I want to know is if Vasher could awaken his own Divine breath into a shardblade without dying? I assume conventional thought is if Divine breath leaves the body, the Returned dies. Maybe that only happens if the Divine Breath is consumed like it is when used to give divine healing. But on Roshar, you have a connection to investiture that is maintained spiritually without physical contact. Kaladin does not need to have Syl perched on her shoulder to surgebind. A bonded shardblade can be given to another and be used but still belongs to the Bondholder, and can be called back ten heartbeats later. So knowing something like that is possible, could Vasher use his Divine Breath to Awaken, and still be connected to it to maintain his Heightenings and his life? Could he solidify it into a shardblade he was still bonded to with the right command? Inquiring minds want to know! ALSO! In regards to investing a invested object, at the very least the power of Endowment can do so. When Breaths are given, not stored, or used to attempt to awaken, they always seem to transfer, even if the other side is unwilling. You may not be able to awaken a honorblade/shardblade, in a way that you could retrieve them, but if you used a command closer to the breath giving command than a awakening one, it should work. We know that there is some information stored in the breaths themselves, based on how WoB has said Divine Breath Healing works, where there is a bit of an Ideal contained in the breath itself. WoB is there is something in the "dead" shardblades that was broken and needed to be repaired when the Knights Radiant caused the Recreance. I see three possible ways to repair what was broken. 1. Hardest. The KR had a bond with their spren, So do modern shardbearers. I think it is the same bond, just broken by the KR, and that is why is takes a gem to establish and does not grant much. Also because modern shardholders to not actually offer anything to the bond at all. I think if you could identify the type of spren in the shard, and uncover the concepts behind all five of their oaths, and live a life by those oaths, possibly including saying them out loud, this would repair the damage caused by the previous bearers breaking them. Pros: no magic required. Cons: Living with all the downsides of being a KR, but none of the perks for an extended period. Also without a spren on your shoulder pointing you on the correct path. Finding the ideals you need to follow is hard without an existing five oath KR of the same order. 2. Moderate difficulty. Giving some amount of regular breaths to a "dead" shardblade to fill the gap caused by the broken oaths, either healing the damage completely, or mitigating it enough to allow them to begin to form a mutual bond there they can benefit from their human's "human-ness" and begin to heal themselves, which spren cannot do on their own. Pros: I think this is possible, and it could allow results much sooner and easier than in #1. As number one requires the equivalent of a 5 oath KR to heal the break, but this could begin healing by someone who was only capable of keeping the first oath currently. Cons: While WoB has said Breaths are very versatile, and much more is possible with them than is currently known, The specific command to do this is not known and would need to be researched. Breaths will also be permanently divested during research finding the command procedure, and to revive every dead blade, because you are giving them away as a effect to a living (but brain dead/thought locked) spren. They are alive enough not to be recoverable to you tried an awakening command, and are also investiture, which normally resists conflicting investiture. Which is why you have to use the properties of Endow breath to them to get around this, permanently giving them away. 3. Easiest Have a Returned expend their Divine Breath to instantly heal whatever damage the Recreance caused. Pros: The Divine Breath is a powerful splinter of Endowment, seemingly designed for this sort of thing. Using a Divine Breath defaults to perfectly healing the recipient. Cons: Only a Returned has a Divine Breath, and they are created on another world by a different shard. Choosing to do this kills the Returned. This is not actually giving away the investiture but using it so it returns to endowment, so there may be investiture vs investiture conflict. Since this is a specific specialized function of the divine breath, and is not detrimental to the recipient, I think it will work, but am not sure. edited for tags.

In all fairness, this is not a real theory - because it's kind of been confirmed by Brandon. But when I was searching through the Theoryland database, I found an old WoB I had either missed in the past, or hadn't considered in its due depth: The part about "wounded" spirits being easier to fill with something else sounded pretty much exactly like the description of Words of Radiance from Brandon's site: The reason I am so excited about this is because of the scope of the older WoB. In the Words of Radiance bit, we've been (correctly) assuming it refers to the Knights Radiant - a Surgebinder must have a "broken soul" for a spren to bond with him or her. But considering the other quote and how... free of context it sounds (e.g. Brandon says "it has to do with a person's spiritual makeup," not "it has to do with an Allomancer's spiritual makeup"), I am beginning to think that this applies throughout the cosmere. The good news is, Nalthis might be pretty easy to explain in a way that fits the model. This whole "broken soul" thing is essentially a requirement people must meet before they can start doing magic; and since everyone on Nalthis could do magic, then they must all have broken souls. Which, in a way, they do. With all the Breath being passed around, I get the feeling that the spiritual make, the sDNA, of pretty much everyone is all over the place. Changes to the spiritual aspect of things take time to sink in, the soul needs time to adapt - and if people are constantly trading BioChroma and using it to Awaken things, then their spiritual aspects are constantly shifting and changing. The bad news, Sel might be a little more difficult to explain. The Elantrians and AonDor are easy - the Shaod comes and rewrites a person's spiritual aspect, breaking their soul if you will, and now that person can do magic. The requirement doesn't apply to the Shaod because it's external to the future Invester; It works the same way lerasium does - you don't need to be spiritually wounded to eat and burn a piece of lerasium and become an Allomancer, that's a process you personally don't need magic for. The other magic systems on Sel, though... well, we don't know enough about them. And I can't figure out how they fit the model from the little we do know about them. Forging might be the easiest to explain, because of reasons similar to the ones I provided for Nalthis. If you live in MaiPon, where Forging is pretty common and accepted, then there is a good chance you've been stamped or Resealed at one point or another - which, almost by definition, would have wounded your spirit. From this point on, it would've been easier for Brandon's "something else" to find its way in. Something like the Dor, maybe. TL;DR: A person's soul / spirit / Spiritual Aspect must be modified in a way that would live it "wounded" in order for that person to gain access to magic, the ability to Invest. This spiritual damage could be caused by emotional and / or physical trauma (Surgebinders and Allomancers), the simple passing of (spiritual) DNA from parents to child (Feruchemists), an external force that targets the spirit (Hemalurgically created Mistings & Allomancers, Elantrians, Dakhor monks), or high levels of exposure to Investiture that touches the spirit (anyone who has been Forged or Resealed (or Bloodsealed?), or practically everyone on Nalthis).

There are obviously WoR spoilers, as well as some content from Warbreaker. If you have not read either, GO AND READ THEM NOW. Anyway, I had a theory as to how one might go about reviving a dead spren, assuming their ex-Radiant is dead and decomposing. As I understand it, the spren is dies essentially because when the Radiant breaks his/her oaths, the bond is broken, thus removing whatever part of the spren is granting sentience. So what other magic system is known to have sentience-granting capacity, of which we have a lovely example right in WoR? Awakening. (As a side note, I did consider Hemalurgy, but it does't take long to realize all the problems associated with that particular method). I bet the key to reviving dead spren lies in Breath. We know all it takes to restore a dead human to some semblance of their old life is one Breath, and a thousand can make even an inanimate object sentient. I am completely sold on this idea. The only questions I see are how much Breath would actually be need, and whether the spren would regain its memories. I'm thinking it wouldn't require much, the spren isn't actualy dead, just stuck, and since Syl regained her personality and memories without issue, i don't expect the latter to be a problem either. If you still don't like the idea, just imagine Adolin holding his shardblade, preparing to duel Odium's champion, when he softly says: "Life before death. My life to yours, my breath become yours." Flash! Whoosh! Ta-dah, brand new radiant! Edit: Here is the relevant WoB

Hey guys, my second post, so sorry if this has been said before. Do we have any evidence at all that you could be a savant without using an allomantic power? For example, could one become a Stormlight savant if they depend on it for too long?

A pretty quick question: I understand you have to be a pretty serious heavy hitter to be able to awaken metal and, ostensibly, rock. What about simply storing breath? Much as Vivenna does during her time out in the cold, where her breath is stored in her shawl or scarf or whatever. This isn't an awakening, so no complex commands, no massive amount of breath required to make it do stuff. Just storage, to be recalled later. Could Vivenna, for example, put her Breath in the blade of a thoroughly mundane sword, and recall it later?

I have a question for you all. Suppose a Worldhopper traded the Lord Ruler enough Biochromatic-breath to reach the Fifth heightening, in exchange for some Lerasium (or whatever... the nature of the trade is not important). Sidestepping any issues some of you may have with whether it would work for the Lord Ruler, and just assume that if it isn't a simple matter of giving the breath to the Lord Ruler, that the Worldhopper and Rashek work it out between them how to make it work using Hemalurgy (or whatever... once again, this isn't important. The important bit is that the Lord Ruler reaches the Fifth heightening). The crux of the matter is this: if someone who has lived long beyond his natural lifespan through Atium compounding, and who depends on continually tapping an Atium-mind to remain alive, were to receive the Fifth Heightening (Agelessness, Immortality and so forth), would they be able to stop tapping youth? If they discontinued tapping their Atium-mind, would they die, or would the Biochromatic-breath be sufficient to sustain them? And if it is sufficient to sustain them, would they be immortal, but impossibly aged, or would they remain at whatever age they had tapped to, or would they be fixed in the prime of life? Thoughts?